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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 11:59 AM
Original message
David Corn: How Far Will Hillary Clinton Go?
http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/davidcorn/2007/12/how-far-will-hillary-clinton-g.html

How Far Will Hillary Clinton Go?

By David Corn | December 6, 2007 8:34 AM

For the moment, it seems that the question of the Democratic horserace is this: how negative will Hillary Clinton go?

A prominent Clinton campaign adviser tells me that the Hillaryites are worried about the calendar--and worried enough that her attacks on Barack Obama may well get sharper. If--just if--Obama wins in Iowa, this Dem says, the five days between the caucus and the New Hampshire primary might not be enough time for Clinton to derail Obama. Then a nightmare (for Hillary) scenario is possible. Independents and Republicans (who want to hurt Hillary Clinton) turn out to vote for Obama in the New Hampshire open primary. Then the next place truly to stop Obama will be South Carolina on January 26 (a week after the Nevada caucuses). But one word about South Carolina: Oprah. In the Palmetto State, the fight will be for African-American voters. Clinton has done well there so far, according to the polls, and she has racked up critical endorsements from African American leaders in the state. But if the Diva of All Entertainment tours with Obama in South Carolina, she could win the black vote for him. Imagine the impact it might have if she appears at rallies with Obama and simply remarks, "Finally." She wouldn't have to say much more. And if South Carolina falls....

This sort of what-iffing is a sport for the politerati. But it's what campaign planners have to do. "We once thought he had to win Iowa to stay alive," this Clintonite says. "We now think that we might have to win to stay alive." Will the fight get even more nasty as Iowa approaches? "There's still plenty of time for that," this person says. "And that's how things go in politics. There may be no choice."

No doubt, the Obama campaign is gaming out the possibilities and calculating how far to go in slamming Clinton, as is the Edwards camp. Yesterday Edwards, who weeks ago was slashing away at Clinton, disparaged candidate-on-candidate sniping, complaining that such political discourse ignores the problems of real folks. Perhaps he has concluded his best shot is to try to sprint past the carnage created by a Clinton-Obama battle. Given the short space between Iowa and New Hampshire--last time there was eight days in between--there will be no time for any campaign to try a series of different tactics. They will have to be ready to roll on January 4 with whatever strategy they have cooked up for what will likely be the five most intense days in modern political campaigning.

So will Hillary, should she come up short in Iowa, continue to blast away at Obama (or denounce Edwards if he manages a surprise win in Iowa)? A former top Clinton White House official, unaffiliated with any current campaign, points out that one thing that Hillary Clinton does not do well is attack: "She's much better when she's being attacked." This person's advice for Clinton if she happen to lose in Iowa: "She should flirt. She can charm. I've seen her do it. Not like Bill. But she should not get her back up. She should be gracious. She doesn't do sarcasm well. She looked bad when she mocked Obama for saying he had gotten foreign policy experience by being a kid in Indonesia. That's something a surrogate should do, not her. She should resist the urge." Can she? "Well," this former Clintonista says, "that may depend on whether it's a 2-point loss in Iowa or a 5-point loss."
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. "Finally"
Good one.
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. Bingo. Corn has been speaking the truth these last few weeks.
The Clinton camp has been exposed...and it ain't pretty.
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. FOX News pays well.
www.davidcorn.com
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Oh my. Attacking David Corn's credentials now...
Edited on Thu Dec-06-07 12:49 PM by jefferson_dem
You guys are desperate.

EDIT: To remain "hopeful." :toast:
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Nice quick pre-mod-deletion edit.
You're not helping your candidate.
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Defensive, much?
I can't say I blame you. It's gloomy throughout HillaryWorld.

:toast:

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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #2
12. exposed how?
as a politician hoping to win an election?

what are you talking about?
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. For resorting to negative attacks...
Edited on Thu Dec-06-07 01:02 PM by jefferson_dem
...as she desperately hopes to cling onto her supposed front-runner status.

Try reading the article linked to in the OP. That might help.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. she has no right to attack ?
especially when attacked first?

------------------

ps - your comment suggesting I read the article is juvenile.

Grow up.

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Nedsdag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. She's been attacking since July.
Remember "irresponsible" and "naive?"
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
25. I Know I Haven't Followed Corn A Lot Lately, But The Time I Looked
he has always been LIBERAL!! I remember him appearing on C-Span a lot several years back and he never supported Repukes on anything then!

Didn't he just write a book denouncing The Idiot???
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
3. He's right.
Finally... Gobama!
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
4. "the Obama campaign is... calculating how far to go in slamming Clinton, as is the Edwards camp."
"the question of the Democratic horserace is this: how negative will Hillary Clinton go?"
No, David. The question is: "How low will they all go?"
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Hey, you're right on time! Very dependable! nt
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. I always read your finds, B'sister! It's always fun to see if the content matches the headline!
I'm one of those rare DUers who reads past the headline, apparently.
Sorry about that, I'll try to act more like an ObamaHead so I can sit at the cool kid's table!
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. You do? I'm honored, and must point out that
Corn devised this whole piece all by himself. Imagine that! Oh, since it seems you missed Gail Collins' fun this a.m., here tis. Let me know what you think! And p.s., how does an ObamaHead act? Can't be much worse than whatever you call yourself, I'm thinking. :hi:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3800727&mesg_id=3800727
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Waddya mean "Can't be much worse than whatever you call yourself,"??
Just because I'm a Dick... er... RichardsonHead?
:rofl: at being hoisted high on my own petard :rofl:
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Ha!
I didn't even know you were supporting Richardson - my tunnel vision precluded me from reading all the little fun things in your sig line, or whatever the hell it's called. :hide: ;-)
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #18
27. A DickHead hoisted high
Too funny - I never thought of that. :D
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THUNDER HANDS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. the question is what would Edwards do if he loses Iowa
does he drop out then and urge his supporters to back Hillary or Obama?

or does he keep going until his money runs out, which probably won't be much longer than South Carolina.
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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Not "if". He'll lose. Obama's got a lock on the Illinois Causus.
If Obama can bus in enough kids from their homes in Illinois to vote in the Iowa caucus, that is.
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
21. Yep.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
11. Obama's leading in a SC poll today
Edited on Thu Dec-06-07 01:24 PM by WesDem
Oprah didn't even get there yet, right?



Edit:

I was mistaken - Clinton leading by 2 points (but, YAY, anyways).

The latest Rasmussen Democratic poll today from South Carolina has that race in almost a tie: Hillary Clinton leads Barack Obama 36%-34%. But the real import of the poll is the figures it shows on the black vote in South Carolina: In contrast to an earlier Rasmussen poll which had the candidates running roughly evenly in the black community, Obama is now defeating Clinton among black voters there 51%-27%.


http://time-blog.com/real_clear_politics/2007/12/obama_the_black_vote.html




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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
14. More unsourced water carrying for Obama by Corn.
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here_is_to_hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
20. These posts are getting funnier everyday...
These threads with all of the ignores I see, they read like 'mad libs' (no pun intended)....
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The River Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. I See Ignored People
Or not. Like you, I see a lot of "ignored" posts in most threads
which are not pro Hillary. Makes for some interesting (non)reading.
I just figure they still call us haters and how we want to see Rudy elected.
SOS different day.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #20
28. Some threads I see a third file folders
I just keep adding to the list. I don't care anymore. If somebody can't bother to offer more than disruption to the discussion, on the list they go. I don't care who they support. I'll empty it out after the primaries are over.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-06-07 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
24. When she's finally backed in the corner after losing Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina...
...the media will already be writing off her campaign as yet another case of frontrunneritis and she will do horribly on February 5th.

I've been seeing this happen for a month now...

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