The Flap Over Obama's Drug Use - Why it hurts Clinton and helps him.

[jefferson_dem]

The Flap Over Obama's Drug Use
Why it hurts Clinton and helps him.
By John Dickerson
Posted Saturday, Dec. 15, 2007, at 10:23 AM ET

I am not deeply outraged that Hillary Clinton's now resigned New Hampshire co-chairman, Bill Shaheen, talked about Barack Obama's past drug use. I am in the minority in this view. In a Fox News focus group, Democratic voters were asked if bringing up the drug charge amounted to dirty politics and they all threw up their hands so fast it looked like they were under arrest.

<SNIP>

Fairness aside, Shaheen made a huge blunder. Let's count the ways: His remark fired up Obama's supporters and volunteers during the final stretch. It made Clinton look mean on the eve of the caucuses in Iowa, where they penalize mean politicians. It also made her look hypocritical, since she's campaigned against the politics of personal destruction. There will be even less sympathy for Clinton aides who argue that it was actually Obama who was the first one to escalate the personal combat, by telling the New York Times five weeks ago that Clinton was being dishonest with voters. The flap has overshadowed and muddied Clinton's main argument that Obama will be vulnerable in the general election to GOP attacks because his record as a state legislator hasn't been thoroughly scrutinized. It also wasted two days of news coverage that Clinton could use to get out her message.

But wait, won't voters blanch when they think of Obama using drugs? I don't think Democratic voters will much care. Plus, the underlying story about Obama's drug use is one in which he looks candid and thoughtful—both in his book and when he talked about his childhood indiscretions a few weeks ago. That's more contrast to Clinton trouble's with voters on questions of candor and honesty. Rudy Giuliani, no patsy when it comes to breaking the law, praised Obama for speaking so forthrightly. This serves to undermine, for now, Shaheen's case that the GOP will some day savage Obama for his past.

Perhaps the biggest benefit Obama gets from this episode is that he emerges the winner in another big public fight. Combat skills matter because Clinton has been arguing that only she can handle the GOP onslaught in the general election. "Whoever we nominate is going to be subjected to the full force of the Republican attack machine," she said Friday. Democrats want to win and voters I've talked to over the months have asked whether Obama could handle the kind of attacks they saw against John Kerry. In Iowa, Obama precinct captains report they get this question when they walk the streets and knock on doors. How considerate of Shaheen to give Obama the opportunity to land a solid counterpunch.

http://www.slate.com/id/2180066/

[MethuenProgressive]

1. "It's Hillary's fault voters know Obama used cocaine"?

:rofl:

[MNDemNY]

3. Well, of course. HRC is the devil.

[jefferson_dem]

4. No. It's Hillary's fault her supposedly flawless campaign is in desperation mode...

Mark Penn? Is that you?

[aquart]

7. Setting up a straw man to knock it down?

No campaign is flawless. But saying one is, and then pointing out its "flaws," must mean it's coming apart, right?

OR you can see this as a future indication that there will NEVER be an Alberto Gonzales who hangs on and hangs on and can't be budged for over a year despite numerous crimes...in a Clinton administration. Because she moves swiftly to correct problems AND SHE APOLOGIZES PUBLICLY FOR MISTAKES.

Yes, you could see it that way. If you were looking without appalling prejudice.

[jefferson_dem]

12. She set the bar. All this talk of "experience" and "ready on day one" gobbledygook.

Seems she's hardly prepared to manage her own campaign.

Has she publicly apologized for her most egregious mistake? You know which one I mean.

[rufus dog]

35. You seem to be missing the point

Hillary went into attack mode and it was poorly planned. The kindergarten issue was raised as a knee jerk political response to Obama, Team Clinton then throws mud regarding Cocaine use as a teenager. So after attempting to slam him for an action when he was five they follow up with slamming him for actions when he was fifteen to seventeen. Very poor political move. Team Obama didn't need to do much, the talking heads did most of the dirty work and slammed Clinton. If Clinton doesn't have something on Obama from his late twenties on then this was idiotic. (Note: If they had something it should have come out by now, so my guess is that they don't)

So Obama proves that he is better at getting the message out and moving on, while Clinton reinforces that she will be divisive. Very bad strategy.

[MethuenProgressive]

38. Your point is Clinton is so devious she devised a plan that didn't work?

To claim the the first time the MSM ever heard about Obama's cocaine use was from some NH co-chair in a small time interview is preposterous.

[bagrman]

2. Nothing like a good self inflicted implosion.

[aquart]

5. Why then, REJOICE!

Using cocaine is great big plus!

[jefferson_dem]

6. Wrong. Having Hillary's campaign in a tailspin...

is a big plus.

[aquart]

8. Eye of the beholder.

So, you still glory in the cocaine use because it has become the weapon to achieve your victory. BE HAPPY!

Surely you and your former drug "experimenter" will win the White House. Eww. Just like the last one.

[jefferson_dem]

13. Actually, you boy Bill was the first. But...of course..he didn't inhale.

I wonder if you reamed him as a druggie in 1992...if you were of age then.

[dkf]

14. Yeah and he didn't have sex with that woman either

I'm still mad at him for those idiotic words.

[Tesha]

40. Just so you know...

Jus so you know, I find you one of the *LEAST EFFECTIVE*
Hillary supporters on this board. Each time I read one
of your posts, my willingness to deny Hillary my support
and my vote is reinforced.

"By your friends you shall know them."

Tesha

[disndat]

9. Yes,

and Joe Trippi was given the opportunity to show on Chris Matthew's Hard Ball, that HC has hired Mark Penn, a sleaze and an idiot to be her campaign manager.

[mtnsnake]

10. Hey maybe all the Dems can snort a line & then have Hillary help their campagns, too (snicker)

[acmavm]

11. I have no idea about the rest of the country, just the little nest of republican

hell I live in that's called Nebraska. And I cannot tell you how well this cocaine thing is going over. It's like a gift from Heaven for a lot of these people.

Now, they don't like Hillary in the first place. That's because she's a woman and because she's a Clinton. So whoever the messenger is/was that keeps bringing this shit up doesn't matter.

These people revel in this dirt. They are using it like a cudgel in any discussion of why democrats are better than republicans. And the frigging worst part (from my point of view) is these people VOTE! They get their crusty asses out to the polls and vote.

So I don't give a damn about Obama and his early years. I don't care what the guy did in high school. I DO CARE THAT THIS HAS BECOME AN ISSUE becauses these bastards will use these dirty tricks against any candidate that the Democratic Party fields. They will point to this NON-ISSUE and say "see, this is why you can't trust the Democrats".

This shit has to stop yesterday.

[dkf]

16. Why is this a trust issue...didn't Obama tell us the truth?

George Bush is the one who lied about his drug use and look how well he tells the truth about everything else.

To me, Obama looks like he has come clean about his past. Therefore I feel I can trust him.

Hillary's people keep on bringing this stuff up, and she apologizes for it, but it looks to me like a fake apology and it looks like she is the liar.

Do I trust her when she says she is not behind this? I don't think so.

[acmavm]

19. Yeah, HE told the truth. And admitting that he used cocaine in high school

is not an issue to you, me, and most of the people here (I would certainly think).

I dont' know why this is being broadcast far and wide by when you point out that Chimpy has done far worse like branding hid fraternity brothers with a hot coathanger (or whatever), doing cocaine and being a drunk way into his adult years, going AWOL, what the fuck ever, republicans JUST DO NOT HEAR YOU. They're ability to ignore reality while pointing fingers is amazing.

I don't trust Hils. Not at all. I don't know how I will vote for her if she gets the nomination. But I imagine I will. What is the alternative? Huckleberry?

I just want this issue to go away. I want everyone to QUIT GIVING AMMO to people like Leo. A die-hard republican that I work with. Now don't get me wrong, I like the guy. But his politics reside up his ass. He believes every bit of this propaganda. He's just an illustration of what I'm up against, not the only nutcase I have to listen to although he has been very quiet lately to me personally. But I do hear him talking, loudly, when I walk out on the fabrication floor and he hasn't seen me. (Although I sincerely doubt that he's worried about what I think. I imagine he just wants to avoid the inevitable argument that occurs when I hear him.)

And this issue is just up his alley. And my Mom's alley. And all the other left brained political moran that surround me in the state that turned away from the Democratic Party for the basest of reasons: the civil rights and equal rights amendments.

[proudmoddemo]

37. It's no Nebraksa that we have to worry about anyway

It's places like Montgomery County, PA (suburban Philadelphia) or Parma, Oh (suburban Cleveland) that are going to decide the election. And specifically it's going to be 45 year old white women with a couple kids in high school or college--one of whom might have a drug or alcohol problem. It remains to be seen, but I think those people will look at Obama's past drug use--especially if they read his book--and see a pretty good person. It'll give them hope that their work parenting may yet pay off, and that their kids may yet be productive citizens. Among that crowd, it may actually benefit Obama because it humanizes him, and also gives him personally something in common with them. It may not; but it may--especially if the Republican nominee is the plastic Romney.

[acmavm]

42. Nebraska may not be the deal breaker. But it sure is indicative of the

mean-spirited unforgiving natures of a lot of the voters in this country.

[proudmoddemo]

44. What part are you from?

If you're in Lincoln or Omaha central, maybe a slight worry. But the rest of the state, not so worried about it. There are other factors--immigration mainly--that are driving that state to the far-right.

[acmavm]

46. That's the freaking hitch. I AM in Omaha and for the life of me I cannot

understand why I am hearing so much shit about the dems. We (dems) usually play well here and Lincoln. Maybe repubics are more vocal. I know the Democratic Party is pretty strange here. We fielded a candidate (Ben Nelson) who honestly BRAGGED about all the support he give the bush** administration during the 2006 election. It was surreal. And the head of the party is a 4-foot tall suspender wearing corporate lawyer. That's why this state has given away the farm to corporations like ConAgra and UP and has one of the highest tax rates in the nation. Our sales tax in Omaha is 7%.

But the insanity of focusing on high school cocaine use and 400 dollar haircuts is really playing well with these old duffers and duffettes. Omaha's major newspaper is a republican supporting rag. And none of the scandals of the bush** administration are making the 6 o'clock news the way they should. But these wingnuts know about the haircut, Al Gore's huge mansion (but not how environmentally friendly it is), remaining scorn and hatred of everything Clinton, and Obama's cocaine use.

Maybe it's the rise of such lying scheming assholes like Bill O'Reilly and Rush Limbaugh. I don't know what's going on. But its never been this rough. Compared to this election, 2004 was a dream.

[proudmoddemo]

49. Thanks

Still, I think illegal immigration is driving voters--even in places like Omaha to the right in the midwest. On the other hand, Obama beats both Romney and Huckabee in his native Kansas. So things are interesting...

[Tejanocrat]

15. I could see that. I bet the impact is largely generational.

[OHdem10]

17. David Yepsin , reporter, Iowa. Average Voters in IA did not know

of drug use.

Most average Americans have not read Obama's Book.

Yepsen, who has done backflips assisting OBama explains this way.

To be fair, you cannot tell other Democrats they cannot vet one
Democrat and not another. Average Voters have not read Obamas
book. Democratic Voters have a right to know about this and
make up their own minds as to whether it is important or not.
Yepsen is one of most respected Political Reporters in Iowa.

It is beginning to look as if Obama is off limits. This will
hurt him more than the truth.

[Skidmore]

23. You must be from one of the big coast states.

First, Yepsen is as overrated as Russert, Tweety, or any other political guru elsewhere. Second, people in Iowa have a understanding of drug use and abuse, and rural America has struggled with the problem of meth labs and crack and cocaine just as the big cities have. We understand too that even people with substantial problems beyond the scope of recreational use can be rehabilitated and lead very productive lives. Third, Obama's biography has been well circulated in our rural community, as is information about all the candidates. What do you think people talk about at work on break time here? Over meals and cups of coffee? We're such rubes that we can't understand dirty politics when we see it? Now, let's talk about who's being naive.

[loveangelc]

18. imo its pretty much established that it hurts the Clinton's camp

stupid thing for whoever was leaking that info.

[suston96]

20. Who leaked what.....?

Over and over again, people are accusing Hillary, or her campaign of leaking the drugs question, when it was candidate Obama himself who did so, publicly, to a bunch of high school kids in New Hampshire. Does anyone remember that? Of course not.

Immediately after, it was Republican candidate Mitt Romney who questioned Obama's judgment in standing in front of young people and saying: look at me. I am a candidate for President, but when I was your ages, I did drugs and alcohol.

Yeah, Hillary and her campaign "leaked it". In 1995 Obama's book Dreams of My Father related his experience. Obama did his own leaking and if his followers had any sense they would quit accusing other campaigns of malediction when their candidate himself started the whole thing.

[emilyg]

22. DU doesn't want to hear facts.

[Skidmore]

24. You are correct that Obama "leaked" nothing. Rather, he very candidly discussed

his use of alcohol and drugs as a young man in his book "Dreams from my Father," published about twelve years ago. The thing that Hillary's people have done is to imply that somehow there is oh so much more there. That he "dealt." If true, then they need to tell the voters what they know and not just insinuate or circulate unfounded gossip, a very Rovian tactic. In the absence of proof, they should shut up and make a sincere apology for maligning the man's reputation. Yes, I can see Hillary is for change..stamping the brand of negative political discourse in this nation to bear the label of the Democratic Party. An amazing legacy to seek.

[suston96]

26. Rather, he very candidly discussed....

...he very candidly, and foolishly discussed his "youthful indiscretions" with high school students just a few weeks ago. And he was called on that foolish admission to those kids.

Who called him on it? Hillary? Hillary's campaign? No.

Mitt Romney, a Republican candidate he may very well have to face along the way to November. (You hope).

[Skidmore]

27. That does not make one bit of sense.

It is a matter of public record and I don't see anything wrong with tapping one's personal history to make a point with children.

Hillary's guys have been out there making all kinds of insinuations, Shaheen and Penn.

[suston96]

30. Makes no sense? Of course not.

Not to any Obama supporter. But it made lots of sense to Mitt Romney and to anyone else who would be asking: why would he tell kids that he did drugs when he was their ages? Even a teenager could make the connection: uh, he is running for President and he did drugs when he was my age?

Go back and read what this thread is about. Have the honesty to stop accusing the Hillary campaign of revealing something that you just said is a matter of public record and which he used to make a point with children.

Well, the point was made but it also has irreversible splashback in all directions including being a target for media and campaigns that want to make it a subject of interest and further investigation.

[Skidmore]

31. I said that the Clinton campaign people

mixed truth with innuendo. Why would he share his life experiences and the lessons he learned from them with young people? I believe it was to tell them to not make similar mistakes. Like it or not, we live in the real world. People make mistakes when they are young and some learn to live them down and go onto productive lives. How many kids in your local high school have already experimented with drugs or alcohol, without ever heard of Obama or politician? I think you are being unrealistic and very much insulting the intelligence and common sense of many Americans.

[suston96]

32. "People make mistakes when they are young ...."

Yes they do - but you don't stand in front of a bunch of high school kids as a presidential candidate and say: Yo, kids - lookee here - I was a drug and alcohol user when I was your age, and look at me now....!!!!!

You get what I am saying?

[Skidmore]

34. It's called honesty.

A novel idea, eh. Do you get what I'm saying. We are electing a president, not a god or an angel. Perhaps it would be good for the nation to realize that all of our candidates are human. The more important question is what did they learn from their mistakes and how do they apply that knowledge in their lives as public servants. Some can teach with those examples and others just become more sneaky and dishonest.

[bagrman]

36. It's never foolish to be honest with young people.

[BenDavid]

21. Well folks all I can say is HRC has already been investigated

and there is nothing the right can use against her, but with obama there is a darkness that as of yet been uncovered and if there is anything there is will come out by the right. One of the many reasons HRC is the better candidate because there is nothing in her past the right can use against her, and oh I know you obama folks will have what about BILL? Well what about BILL? Don't ya think that HRC and WJC know the right will throw out something against him and you can bet yo butts they have the time and places and who he meant with and when this happens they will bring it forth and embarass the right....

Ben David

[Skidmore]

25. You think? I'm pretty interested in any of the papers related

to her time with Bill in the WH. You know, the ones that the National Archives are vetting for them.

[dkf]

29. I'd be careful using that word if I were you.

I see the "drug dealer" thing as a racial slur. Using the word "darkness" calls that into mind also.

Maybe I'm being a little over-sensitive and PC but until that whole "drug dealer" accusation everything seemed so color-blind.

[sniffa]

33. it's just nuance

and if other people see aiming at the lowest common denominator where none exists, well then that's not the person using code words who is at fault. :crazy:

[Franc_Lee]

28. Actually Hillary was over-rated from the get-go by the M$M & the GOP

how we were informed before things got going that hillary would be our front runner blah-blah-blah...

[ClarkUSA]

39. See video of former Clinton IA precinct captain who quit in disgust over Hillary's attacks on Obama

She says she isn't the only one, either. Now she and others are turning toward HOPE:

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXPnMflGkvI&eurl=http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post_group/ObamaHQ/CBmX

[reggie the dog]

41. too hung up on drugs in the USA

people are far to hung up on drug use in the USA. Generally around half of the population uses illegal drugs at some point in thier lives and something like 98 percent use legal drugs such as alcohol or tobacco at some point in their lives. What the hell difference does it make? Does it make a difference if one person smokes a bowl of grass, another has a glass of wine, or another does a line of cocaine? Does prohibiting these drugs do anything to cut availablity? I am sure you all know people who use drugs, legal or illegal, and who lead successfull lives. Why is this even an issue?

[Lord Helmet]

43. Times have changed.

This might have torpedoed a campaign a while ago but Obama got way out ahead of it so it pretty much makes Clinton look worse for bringing it up in the first place.

[fightindonkey]

45. Obama The Drug Dealing, Heroin User

Yep, shhh, don't bring that up!

[Perry Logan]

47. Wow. Obama people are quite the rationalizers.

[Stop Cornyn]

48. It hurts Hillary among the sizable part of the population who sees this as negative campaigning; it

hurts Obama among the sizable part of the population who are mostly older and freak out when they hear "Obama" and "cocaine" in the same sentence.

I think the wisest course would have been to let it die on its own because as Obama turns around and uses this as a tool to poke Hillary and raise funds, it still causes a repetition of the words "Obama" and "cocaine" in the same sentence which is not a positive association for Americans of a certain generation.

[reggie the dog]

50. come on

cocaine has been an accepted part of coproprate America since the 70's. Old folks didn't give a damn that Bush snorted cocaine. Why should they care if Obama did?