I think it's funny and maybe GENIUS that the Clintons aren't seen as liberals anymore

[Proud2BAmurkin]

They were rePUKES worst liberal hippie nightmares in 1992 and really didn't do anything different from what they did before then in their presidential or senate offices. I still think they're hippie liberals with a liberal agenda packaged nicely for Dumb America. And that's alright with me.

[Zynx]

1. I think Bill and Hillary are instinctively quite liberal.

Al Gore proved as soon as he was out of office that he is hard core left. I think the same thing applies.

[thereismore]

2. They just aren't liberals. nt

[YOY]

3. I think they're competent right-leaning moderates in a country that expects incompetence

Because last time I checked there is still a NAFTA and we don't have universal health care.

There is no "left" in this country anywhere near the reigns of power.

[HeraldSquare212]

4. Many Dems didn't consider Bill a liberal in 1992

the Repugs were just being Repugs, painting another Dem as a liberal.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

5. A hippy liberal who voted for the war?

Talk about Dumb America.

[Alexander]

6. Democratic voters don't think so, and they matter the most.

For the 20th time, nobody cares what you think. Go take a ride in one of these:

[niceypoo]

11. "Nobody cares what you think"?

http://www.honan.net/thegift.html">Isn't that a George Bush quote?

A little lesson in LOGIC for ya:

Fallacy: Ad Hominem


Person A makes claim X.
Person B makes an attack on person A.
Therefore A's claim is false.

The reason why an Ad Hominem (of any kind) is a fallacy is that the character, circumstances, or actions of a person do not (in most cases) have a bearing on the truth or falsity of the claim being made (or the quality of the argument being made).

Still waiting for the rational discourse to start...

[Alexander]

17. Aww, a ham-handed attempt at attacking me! How cute.

"Isn't that a George Bush quote?"

He's not the first person ever to say it and he won't be the last. Get over it, because nobody cares what you think either.

"Fallacy: Ad Hominem


Person A makes claim X.
Person B makes an attack on person A.
Therefore A's claim is false.

The reason why an Ad Hominem (of any kind) is a fallacy is that the character, circumstances, or actions of a person do not (in most cases) have a bearing on the truth or falsity of the claim being made (or the quality of the argument being made)."

Try this on for size:

Alexander tells a Hillbot "nobody cares what you think".
Niceypoo points out that George W. Bush once said the same thing.
Therefore Alexander must be just like George W. Bush.

Yep, your last post was indeed a fallacy. Thanks for playing!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[dionysus]

18. you owe me a new keyboard, it's full of pepsi now...

[Fed_Up_Grammy]

16. Nastiness on DU? Whatever happened to tolerance of

all opinion?That's what originally attracted me to this forum.

[no name no slogan]

7. Bill Clinton was the best Republican president since Eisenhower

NAFTA, "Welfare Reform", etc.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

22. you're right, Bush Sr and Dole would have raised taxes on the wealthy without one RePUKE vote too

my mistake.

:rofl:

[Skidmore]

8. I think they are right leaning moderates with more than a tad of

ambition that overwhelms good sense.

[THUNDER HANDS]

9. it's impossible to know

how liberal Bill Clinton would have been. He had a Republican congress for 6 years.

I think he did the best he could and ended up more like a Rockefeller Republican than a liberal democrat.

[JVS]

13. He had a Democratic congress for the first 2 years and frittered it away

[TechBear_Seattle]

10. Then or now: which is the lie?

Were they actually neo-cons back then masquerading as liberals, or are they actually liberals who now are masquerading as neo-cons? And is it better to support a candidate who hides her true self behind a mask for the sake of getting elected or a candidate who is open and honest about what she actually believes?

[Proud2BAmurkin]

12. You ask if it's better to support a masked candidate. "Yes."

That's how Clinton got elected and Dukakis didn't. I like winning better than losing.

[TechBear_Seattle]

15. So a winning lie is better than a non-winning truth?

This is just a rhetorical question, no need to answer. :hi:

[Proud2BAmurkin]

21. If uninformed voters conclude from your speeches you're not a liberal but your policies

and activism for 35 years have shown you to be liberal, it's not your fault if the "not a liberal" image translates into votes. I know the Clintons are more or less liberal hippies because I pay attention. Every other voter who pays attention will know it too. If someone is duped by not paying attention, and the duped make up a margin of victory, HELL YES that's better than losing by wearing love beads and tie dyes.

[Quixote1818]

14. Polls say Republicans think she is the most liberal and Liberals think she is the least

liberal. That is the worst possible scenario for her.

[stillcool]

19. I am certainly a dumb American...

I had no idea about the truth of Bill Clinton's policies and how they affected people all over the world.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/cgi-bin/htsearc

[ellenfl]

20. interesting site but your link does not work. try this one . . .

3rd World Traveler

i'm going to check it out more thoroughly after work tonight.

oh, and i don't consider hill and bill liberals, not after nafta, the communications act, welfare reform, etc. how often did bill use HIS veto pen? i think they are about power, money and influence.

ellen fl

[stillcool]

23. Not the link I was trying to provide...

but if you use the search function for Bill Clinton at Third World Traveler there is lots to read.
Don't know why that link didn't work ...so I'll try again.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Economics/ThreeYears_NAFTA.html

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/International_War_Crimes/ClintonWarCriminal_Herman.html
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/American_Empire/Clinton_Yugoslavia_LFE.html
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Yugoslavia/BillClintonsWar_Yugo.html
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Norman_Solomon/Clinton_Priorities_TTMLG.html

This is the link to the search page...so you can just type in whatever...It is a Great Site!!

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/cgi-bin/htsearch

[damntexdem]

24. They never were liberals.

They were DLC, move-to-right-of-center types. Two of Bill's big 'successes': NAFTA and ending-welfare-as-we-know-it.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

25. Why don't you count balancing the budget as a success, gays in military, Supreme court justices

?

[Kucinich4America]

26. They never were Liberals

And they're considerably further to the right than they were in 1992.