Oh God Help Me, Cuz Here I Go: Hillary's Tearing Up.

[David Zephyr]

I admit I felt sorry for Hillary when she teared up. And you know what? I really don't care what anyone thinks about it either.

I just don't have it in me to be a Hillary hater. Maybe it's because I've watched her for a very long time now. She's certainly had every reason to cry.

The reason her tearing up was news is because she is not a cry-baby. That's why it was "news". No one has ever seen it before. Nearly 40 years on the national stage and not one tear.

And Lord knows she has had her share of raw deals in her public life. And, yet she never broke down in front of the world. Nope. Not even once.

I remember when Hillary first tried to outmaneuver the insurance corporations, the big pharmacological conglomerates and the HMO monsters all on her own. She almost succeeded. But then out came the biggest guns in America. The journalists-for-hire began to discredit her plan before they even knew what it was. The "Harry & Louise" television, radio and print advertising blitz hit the airwaves and Hillary was transformed a " socialist monster". "How dare this lady try to extend health-care to every American man, woman and child!" And sadly, when Hillary lost, America lost. And yet, not a whimper of self-pity from this woman. In fact, I hardly remember anyone willing to stand with her. Not even many of her fellow Democrats. Yet, no tears from Hillary. I wonder how lonesome that must have been.

Hillary was falsely accused of having her dear friend Vince Foster murdered. It was the daily menu on television and on right-wing talk radio. Even after Foster's family sucked it in and went public telling the world that Vince had been depressed for a long time and suicidal and that these "murder" charges were outrageous and hurting them as a family, the "Reverend" Jerry Falwell sold videotapes for $39.00 each from his "gospel ministry" asserting that Hillary had murdered Vince. Instead of being able to grieve the loss of a dear friend and professional colleague, Hillary had to deal with that shit day in and day out. She never broke. Not once.

Right-wing zealot and grand hypocrite of the century, Kenneth Starr -- a tobacco lawyer -- stuck his religious-fanatical nose into every aspect of Hillary's life including having his staff rummage through the First Lady's underwear drawer in the White House. Starr invented some of the most novel abuses of prosecutorial power in American legal history in his "witch" hunt against not just the president, but his mate, too. But again, Hillary never showed a tear. She held it all together. Talk about stamina.

And Hillary's husband (yeah, that would be Bill) made a world-class and historical jackass screw-up in the Oval Office -- and worst of all, he betrayed Hillary and made a fool out of her right in front of the whole god-damned world. And yet, somehow throughout it all, she kept her head up and never broke down publicly. She took Bill back and how she found the grace to do it beats the hell out of me.

I'm supporting Barck Obama and proud to say so. But I gotta say this -- and I mean it with every fiber within me -- there is no room for any of us here to get smug about her showing a bit of emotion in New Hampshire. It's unseemly and downright shitty to do so!

I know I am not alone in saying this: Hillary always knew there would be a double standard for women in politics, just as there are in almost every realm they live and work in. She didn't cry...because that would prove all the sexists right. "She cried like a little girl. Boo hoo" would come the taunts as they always do when women try to dare break into any of men's privileged positions.

There are millions of right-wing jackass men (yeah, it's mostly my gender) who have been waiting like vultures for the day to see Hillary break down as they piled it on and piled it on. They've salivated like jackals to see "the little lady cry".

I for one will not be part of that hate-fest. And neither should you.

[xultar]

1. BRA-fuckin-VO! BEAUTIFUL!!!!!! AMEN! YES!!! Thank you! THANK YOU!

[MS Liberal]

11. Thank you. It broke my heart to see her tear up.

She is giving it her all. She knows the country is on the wrong track and wants to help but is getting rejecting at every turn. I wish I was a resident of NH, I'd vote for her.

[DS1]

2. awesome

and I don't support her


btw, HBO monsters? :)

[David Zephyr]

12. Thanks for the correction, DS1.

As I always say, typos are the "hallmark of a David Zephyr" post. I corrected the error thanks to you. :)

[mlevans]

125. btw, HBO monsters?

I think perhaps "HMO" may have been intended.

[redwitch]

3. Wonderful post! Thank you David!

:loveya:

[Birthmark]

4. I'm no Hillary supporter...

...but I couldn't agree with you more.

[Arkansas Granny]

5. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[Bluebear]

6. You said it. And I am an Edwards supporter.

Bravo.

[Mark Twain Girl]

14. Agreed. I'm for Edwards, and I think this Hillary hate is way out of hand. nt

[OneGrassRoot]

21. What you said. n/t

[BurtWorm]

85. I have been leaning strongly toward Edwards. Was almost there.

His reaction to Clinton today really gives me pause.

I don't necessarily think more of Clinton, though I believe her emotion was sincere and I felt for her. (And I was surprised to see how unteary her "crying" was, how unbreaking her voice was. A lot of noise about nothing.)

But I do think a little less of Edwards.

[The_Casual_Observer]

7. It could have been the onions for all we know.

[Uncle Sinister]

8. Incredibly well said!

[TwilightZone]

9. Thank you for reminding us that there are a few progressives left on this site.

:)

[enigmatic]

10. best post of the day

Thank you.

[rodeodance]

13. And sadly, when Hillary lost, America lost. ---YES we did. she tried she tried.

[liberalhistorian]

126. First of all, there is still time in the primaries for her

to pull it off. One or two primaries does not a lock-up make, nor should it as a lot of us in the late primary states are disenfranchised enough as it is. And, even if she doesn't get the nomination, if a Dem is elected she will likely be named to a strategic cabinet post whereby she will be able to give the country the benefit of her intelligence and skills.

Second, I don't consider the loss of someone who's voted for every single war funding bill sent to Congress, and who refuses to even acknowledge that she even may have been the slightest bit wrong, and who's in the pocket of the health insurance companies to the point where she wants to make the foxes a part of the solution to the henhouse, to be a "loss" in any way at all.

She is not a Queen entitled to the nomination, which is the way she's been acting, especially in her campaign's smears against Obama. Crocodile tears aren't going to make any difference.

And no, I don't hate her at all and I wish her no ill; I would love to see her in a cabinet post if she doesn't win the nomination. And I'm tired of being labeled a "Hill Hater" whenever I say anything the slightest bit negative about her.

[Beausoir]

15. Glad to see there are still some adults left here at DU.

[xultar]

90. YOu, me, this OP and I think I can count about 10 more out of the lot.

:rofl:

[IndianaGreen]

16. Too bad you missed seeing Hillary play the Al-Qaeda card shortly after the tears!

Watch Keith Olbermann, which replays on the Eastern Time Zone at midnight, and you will see what I mean.

Luv!

[rodeodance]

22. This is prob. one time I strongly disagree with KO.

[kenfrequed]

132. Hmm

I will save my tears for the families that have been torn apart or maimed by this stupid war in Iraq.

[still_one]

17. It is neither positive or negative, people are people /nt

[no name no slogan]

18. Good post

I won't argue the facts of the healthcare/insurance bits because this isn't that type of thread. This was a great post and nailed everything quite well.

:toast:

[dsc]

19. Great post

but I have to say this. Many Obama supporters on this board are on my last nerve. And he will get my vote and nothing else, no money, no time, no nada, until he apologizes for McClurkin. I know he will be the nominee, thanks in no small measure to the all but free ride he got from the press, and I will vote for the nominee. I just hope the press continues the free ride which means I have to hope for Huckabee or Romney on the GOP side.

[rodeodance]

20. Hil kept her family together while Bill screwed another women. that took strength.

[earthlover]

33. that's one theory....

But others would see this as a form of weakness. How many of us would let our spouses screw around and stay with him/her? Not me.

[TwilightZone]

42. Well, I don't think you have to worry about your spouse cheating on you while you're First Lady...

anytime soon.

[earthlover]

61. So? Many still see it as a form of weakness.

Would you let your spouse screw around? If so, what is his/her phone number?

[TwilightZone]

64. My point is that you have no clue what you're talking about.

Your situation and Hillary's are infinitely different circumstances.

Hillary's relationship issues were front-page news.

When your wife cheats on you and you dump her, the entire world isn't going to know.

See the difference?

[emilyg]

51. Each to his own.

[MollieBradford]

117. I am very sorry to read that

many long wonderful marriages lasted over 50 years because people used to be more willing to forgive and not expect perfection in life. If your grandparents never got divorced I'll bet they had some hard times they had to weather.
Besides who the hell is she going to be with after Bill Clinton? Who would ever be as funny, smart, charming and interesting? She said they started talking 36 years ago and never stopped.
No, she is incredibly strong anyone can see that. She raised a wonderful daughter and remained an extraordinary woman all her life. You can make assumptions about her, but basically it just isn't any of your business.

[Vilis Veritas]

121. That is sheer strength of will.

Strength of will to not knock the living shit out of someone who betrayed you.

Strength of will to not break down and blame yourself.

Strength of will to not seek another and act accordingly.

Strength of will to stay and not let go of everything that has been built.

Strength of will to heal, rather than hate.

Strength of will to understand that YOU do not LET anyone DO anything, they do it themselves.

Strength of will to realize when you are the best answer to a cry for help.

Hillary had the good fortune to have someone who recognized his weaknesses and she had the strength of chracter to help him.

Peace.

[lumberjack_jeff]

88. ... and pragmatism. n/t

[elixir]

108. Did you see the "independent" voters on CSPAN last night re "If Hillary was in the WH, Bill never ..

would have screwed around"? Boy, that was a telling interview. The woman is a single mom and she said she didn't support HRC for several reasons but this was the first one that came out of her - if Hillary was being a good wife, Bill wouldn't have screwed around. Eeeek!

[Tom Rinaldo]

23. Thanks David.

We have to stop eating our own. Clinton is in our Democratic family and she has done some excellent work on behalf of cuases most of us identify with through out her life. That doesn't mean she can't be criticized, or that she has perfect judgement. That is not the standard expected from family; being beyond criticism and perfect.

And the thing is, though I don't think actually Clinton cried, yes it was a display of real emotion. She didn't break down, but she did show real feelings. But it wasn't because of the ways in which some people have attacked her. It was about what it is that is so important to her that she gets up every day and goes through with this in the face of that.

I saw Wesley Clark choke up being interviewd by Dan Rather when they were talking about Albanian children dieing from exposure in the mountains where they fled from Serb militias. I saw John Edwards get pretty emotional in the debate the other night also, talking about why he cared about those who are economically disadvantaged. We don't want automatons for politicians. Hillary has gotten some rough treatment over being too cold and aloof. So I sure help she doesn't get the same type of rough treatment now for being emotional and reactive.

[hedgehog]

60. "we have to stop eating our own" Have you seen the clip? Hillary

says something to the effect that only she is ready to run the country, that the others just haven't thought it through like she has and presumably won't know what to do.



Go to this link, pick out the clip from the column on the right. For someone who was upset, she sure managed to get her digs in a the other cnadidates !

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/video/2008/01/07/VI2008010700846.html

[Tom Rinaldo]

75. Yes I saw it.

And only some Democrats believe in change. Have you seen that also? All of our candidates are in a direct head to head competition right now. They all say they are right about some important things that others are wrong about. They all say there is something about them that better enables them to be the President America needs than anyone else. There were no sharp barbs in those comments you refer to. It essentially was an "I'm better than anyone else for the job" moment. Yes it is possible to construct it into something someone can take offense at. In reality all of our candidates say things that other of our candidates would have good reason to take offense at. They constantly have to walk a tight rope of saying I'm better than they are without it being offensive. Later, when the contest is finally decided, they kiss and make up.

We here however do not have to constantly sell ourselves to voters or anyone else. We here are not in a survivor match with only one of us having our dreams realized with the rest of us going home as losers. But we here say things far far meaner than anything our democratic candidates say to each other while they are fighting for their own political lives.

[ProSense]

24. "They've salivated like jackals," reminds me of something!

KO has been great. I think the problem is Hillary's comments.

[stevedeshazer]

25. Very well said, I agree 100%.

I support Edwards, but I've never thought that Hillary Clinton didn't care.

I think all of our Democratic candidates care deeply.

Crying is as human as it gets. I do, often.

I worry more about those who don't.

[magatte]

26. Great post!

Not a Hilary supporter by even a bit. But I agree that we have to refrain from finding this situation a source of undue merriment.

[Harper_is_Bush]

27. I don't support ANY candidate, just want a Dem....but the Hillary bashing on DU

is equaled in terms of ignorance, dishonestly, and downright nastiness only to what you'd find on FreeRepublic.

I'm a Canadian, but I share many values with DU'ers and am proud to be a member of this forum. The spectacle here lately, thouth, has made me ashamed to be a member.

Just one of MANY examples:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3983818

[sandnsea]

28. Except the media is calling it a "humanizing moment"

And women who know better are the ones calling bullshit.

[ruggerson]

32. I wish I could tell you what I thought of you

but it's over the top, even for DU.

[Harper_is_Bush]

38. So, you think she wasn't genuine? Why?

Because she's not your candidate?

Seriously, tell me how you, as a woman, know that she wasn't being genuine. Can you do that?

I'll hold my breath.

[sandnsea]

48. As the OP said

"No one has ever seen it before. Nearly 40 years on the national stage and not one tear."

Her husband humiliates her in front of the world, time after time, by cheating on her. Not a tear. She travels around the world and witnesses the most horrific of suffering, not a tear. She goes into war zones, not a tear. She visits wounded troops at Walter Reed, not a tear.

But now, the country is going to "slide backwards" - and that's what brings out the vulnerability?? While choking out talking points?

Just ridiculous.

[Horse with no Name]

50. Sadly, the point is missed on many

They are willing to give her a pass because she is a woman and women cry (now tell me who is sexist?)

[Harper_is_Bush]

58. Give her a pass? Are you insane?

I mean, honestly my Dem brother, you need to re-think here.

Anyone, and I mean ANYONE who wants to tear up (or "cry" or whatever suits your purpose better) on the campaign trail gets a pass from me. More honesty is just fine. You know, honesty?

[Harper_is_Bush]

57. That's your answer? Because you haven't seen her tear up before?

That's bloody pathetic.

I'll ask again, and please leave out all the references to the past because they indicate nothing:

What makes you believe this particular situation was not genuine?

Did you see something? What was it?

Are you sure you're not just engaging in candidate bashing?

[sandnsea]

68. Spouting talking points between the sniffles??

How many different personas is she going to put on? Tough war hawk, empathetic, change agent, gauzy beauty, likeable, coy school girl, now the weepy woman. It really can't be more obvious. Even Olbermann saw it.

[Beacool]

110. You may be a woman, but after reading some of your posts

I have come to the conclusion that you're quite mean spirited!!

[leftynyc]

133. And she had a camera on her 24/7??

How do you know she didn't shed a tear for any of that stuff. What a pathetic post.

[Rockholm]

138. How do you know she didn't shed a tear?

[emilyg]

54. Not this woman.

[Horse with no Name]

29. If it has been so hard, she should choose to live a more private life

She has chosen to dance with the devil, and now cries when she is burned.
This is a life she has CHOSEN. I will NOT take pity on someone who CHOOSES to live in the public eye.
I would LOVE to be in politics, but I LOVE my privacy more.
I will save my sympathy for women who are raising their children alone, working 2-3 jobs to make ends meet, or other TRULY sympathetic stories.
Hillary has chosen her path. That you CHOOSE to sympathize with her is YOUR business, but she has made herself into a very wealthy woman. She could have quit at any time and lived a very comfortable, stress free life.

[Beausoir]

31. You would LOVE that, wouldn't you? If she just simply went away.

NOT gonna happen.

[Horse with no Name]

34. I want to see her and her neocon politics run out of town on a rail

and rejected by this country.
I really don't care if she stays or if she goes, but I will say ONE thing about her.
She is probably tougher than Edwards AND Obama put together.
This was a contrived moment to make her appear human because even in her verklempt, she came out swinging against Edwards and Obama.

[Beausoir]

36. Do me a favor? Hold your breath until that happens. M'kay?

And yeah..she IS tougher than Edwards and Obama put together.

How did that moment of temporary sanity get through the trap door?

[Horse with no Name]

39. Because I know strong women

And Hillary is a strong woman.
I despise her politics, but she is strong. Which is why this whole episode is total bullshit.
And tell you what...I'll time YOU while you hold your breath, m'kay?

[Beausoir]

43. You may "know" strong women, but I AM a strong woman and I call bullshit on you and your

ridiculous fucking sexist outlook.

You and your ilk want a fight? You just bought one today.

[Horse with no Name]

46. You and your "ilk" can stay home

Because I am a strong woman and YOUR bullshit doesn't scare me in the least.:popcorn:

[Harper_is_Bush]

59. You have given away your self-respect here over this. n/t

[Horse with no Name]

63. and you never had any...so Touche' n/t

[Beausoir]

67. Nope. Sorry. I will not "stay home". Deal with it.

I will go out and fight against your ilk every step of the way.

You are no feminist and you are no liberal.

Bring it, toots.

[Horse with no Name]

74. You are very silly

And I am very much a liberal and very much a feminist, thank you very much.
You however...seem to be very lost....

[Beausoir]

80. How would you know that? Are you a clairvoyant feminist liberal?

:shrug:


And, I am mildly curious about your earlier statement. When you said you KNEW many strong women.

Why is it that you didn't include yourself in that group? I mean, if you are as strong a feminist as you claim, despite your cheap and tawdry bashing of Hillary Clinton over a moment of genuine emotion, WHY wouldn't you include yourself in that group of "Strong" women? Hmmm? Perhaps some self-doubt?

Actually, you may be right after all. I AM lost. Because I do NOT understand women like you.

Women who bash other women for just being women. You have definitely lost me on that.

Anything else you wanna bounce off me tonight, Simone de Beauvoir?

[Horse with no Name]

81. You do flatter yourself, don't you?

Nothing you say means anything at all to me, so if you are looking for my permission to run along, you have it.

[Beausoir]

86. Well, THAT was a well thought out, substantive feminist response.

Can't you add ANYTHING intelligent?

Like....your own awakening as a feminist?

When you KNEW you were a feminist?

Why you wannabe a feminist but just can't get past that pesky part where you have to support women?

Anything?

[Horse with no Name]

89. IN the same vein that you hate any candidate other than your own

You hate me.
I have no reason to "sell myself" to you or anyone online. Who I am shows in my community, in the organizations that I belong to, my political leanings and how I vote. None of which I can convey to you without leaving myself vulnerable that you might be some kind of freakish stalker.
I don't know who you are--I only have to rely on what you tell me and whether I believe you or not.
Which if you are selling yourself as a liberal feminist, then just as you don't believe me, I don't believe you either. Not one bit.

[Beausoir]

91. "You hate me!" "you might be some kind of freakish stalker." !

If this is really how you really feel then you need to stay off the internet for a long time.

If you honestly feel you are being stalked by me, you need to report it to the DU admins immediately. They, and I, take these kind of statements very seriously.

Although, I find it hard to imagine how I am stalking you when I have not sent you a PM. I have never engaged with you before 2 hours ago and I am just answering your posts in your thread. If you feel threatened by me in any way, please contact the Admins of this site and feel free to copy and paste our entire exchange.


If you honestly feel that I hate you, you need to talk to someone who can help you with that.

[Horse with no Name]

92. Nice try--not what I said, but nice try (A+ for republican cutting and pasting)

What I said was that I wasn't going to divulge my "street creds" to you because the organizations that I belong to are identifiers.
I don't know you. I don't know what--or who--you are. In any event, I'm not going to convince you of anything. You want me to tell you who I am so that you can ridicule. It's what you do best.
You are the one that started spewing the hate when I dissed your candidate. Strange that you took it so personal--maybe you should seek some of that psychiatric help you are asking me to seek.

[Beausoir]

94. OK...here are your words..word for word. Complete with the stalking claim.

You hate me.
I have no reason to "sell myself" to you or anyone online. Who I am shows in my community, in the organizations that I belong to, my political leanings and how I vote. None of which I can convey to you without leaving myself vulnerable that you might be some kind of freakish stalker.


I don't know who you are--I only have to rely on what you tell me and whether I believe you or not.
Which if you are selling yourself as a liberal feminist, then just as you don't believe me, I don't believe you either. Not one bit.

[Harper_is_Bush]

44. So...people who can't guarantee to not become emotional in public should strive to live pivate lives

???

Seriously, I can't fathom the stupidity of the attacks on that woman anymore.

Go live in a cabin in the mountains Hillary, you're human and therefore not fit to be seen or heard.

[Horse with no Name]

53. Coming from the person who railed against Elizabeth Edwards and her lightbulbs

:rofl:

[NoSheep]

70. whaddayagonnado?

[lastliberalintexas]

62. You know, I can't stand Clinton

I don't think I can tell you how much I dislike both her and her husband. But I can also recognize this for what it is- media manipulation aimed at one who is at least slightly progressive. It disturbs me regardless of which Dem is targeted, even if it is Clinton. We must do something about media control.

And yes, I recognize the irony that we are in this boat because of her husband. One of the many reasons I dislike the man.

[earth mom]

101. Bravo!

:applause:

[hertopos]

137. I think you miss the point.

What bothers me is mean spirited attach by young people. People just look for every single reason to put down 'woman leaders' unless they are motherly saint. Other than great star quality, I have not heard any particular details about what Obama believes.

As a 53 year old working mother, I am lately very depressed reflecting myself on Hilary's suffering. How can people equate Hilary with someone like GW. If you look at her life, it has been a constant struggle. And let me tell you one thing. It is still true the basic decency of parents reflects on their kids. If Hillary was such a cold hearted woman, her daughter could have been someone very different from who she is.

Choose Obama if you like. I will vote Democratic no matter what. However, just stop bashing Hillary. It is an insult to working mother who happened to be a great policy maker.

Just leave her alone. I really had it. I am crying myself right now. This entire Hillary bashing is just so mean spirited.

Hertopos

[treestar]

145. Maybe, but why should it be harder for her than it would be for any man

in the same position -

I saw that film and it just wasn't that bad.

Besides didn't that tower of strength :sarcasm:, Chimpester W. Boosh, claim he sheds tears from time to time?

[ronnykmarshall]

30. Thank you David!

:loveya:

[Cha]

35. I don't care that she

teared up, either..that's not my problem with hillary.

[Cameron27]

37. I agree,

and thank you so much for taking the time to write the post.

K&R

[mzmolly]

40. Well said!

:toast: Hillary is a heroic human being with her heart in the right place. She's not running for HER, she's running for us. I support Edwards, but would most heartily cast a vote for her in the GE given an opportunity.

[Dudley_DUright]

41. very well said DZ

I will not join the hate feast either. I am still pissed off on how the media "politically assassinated" Dean with the Dean scream last time around. This is just more of the same.

[DemCam]

45. I'm tearing up now...from relief...

You make my heart sing and restore a bit of my faith in your gender today.

[FlyingSquirrel]

47. THANK YOU.

I am tearing up at the words you've written and I'm a man. I want every Democrat who is currently being gleeful about her moment on the campaign trail ESPECIALLY those who are saying that it was not an authentic show of emotion to back off too.

Edit: Obama supporters better watch it or she's going to overtake him in my signature line.

[emilyg]

49. Thank you.

[Tashca]

52. Thank you

I'm not a Clinton supporter either....but you nailed it!!!!!!!!!!!

[Honeycombe8]

55. I'm an Obama supporter, and I agree. But more than that...it drew me to her, actually.

First...let get things straight. She didn't cry. I saw the clip, and her eyes were a tad moist, her voice just ever so slightly shaky. But no crying, no tears. That's the first thing.

Second...what she was saying was that to her, this race is personal. To her, she has seen the country going astray, and she wants to get it back on track and has some ideas on how to do it. For the first time, I actually believed her.

Up until now, I believed it was all about "the plan" that the Clintons have had for about 8 years now. I still think there's been a plan. But I now think that maybe....maybe....she actually cares about what can be accomplished, about the state of affairs in the country.

It won't make me switch my support. She is, after all, part of the reason the country is in the state that it is in (the IW vote, NAFTA started the jobs going out of the country, the Patriot Act, etc., etc.).

But the scene made her more human. I disagree that this was harmful to her campaign, from a female point of view. There are, after all, matriarchal leaders. They have not all been patriarchal. Think the Queens Elizabeth, the Queen Mother, Golda Meier.....mother figures, all.

Besides, Bush Sr. has out and out blubbered onstage, Bush Jr. has become teary eyed on more than one occasion, some other male politician was blubbering into a microphone during the last couple of years (I forget who it was). It happens. But the media only beefs up the coverage when the politician happens to be female.

[lastliberalintexas]

56. I personally don't like Clinton or much of what she stands for

Yet I abhor what is being done to her right now. If the media were skewering her for her votes, stands on certain issues and the people with whom she has been associating lately, I would say bravo. But they aren't, they are continuing to treat the democratic process, one of the most important things in American life, as though it were the scandal sheets and as though this means nothing more than their latest trashing of whichever Spears child is pregnant this week.

I don't think it can be emphasized enough that, until something is done about media consolidation and ownership of PUBLIC airwaves, this country will continue to drift in whatever direction the republicans desire. And any candidate who is the least bit progressive, left leaning or just not enamored of the right wingers will be treated to such attacks. I had thought we had seen the worst of it with the Dean Scream, but this might be just as bad.

And I say that as a supporter of the good doctor and an opponent of Clinton.

[libbygurl]

65. So well put. Bravo! Thank you for helping to make this place a more decent, liberal board again. nt

[caligirl]

66. They've salivated like jackals to see "the little lady cry". she deserves better

As democrats we should stand up for our candidates, they should have at least our respect and support as they face the press and the way they can act. We didn't like the treatment Dean got, didn't like DK getting ignored, didn't like Edwards Iowa finish completely ignored. So I would say for consistency sake and our party we should never tolerate this just because we support another candidate. Plenty of Obama and Hilary supporters here saw how Edwards was ignored and came out in support of him. i may not be a current Hil supporter but I am a democratic party supporter and so I will stand up and support Hilary for her efforts. (I don't agree with her but I will stand up in the face of unfair press and say she deserves better.)I wish she had allowed herself to show this side before now. I think she was sincere.

[NoSheep]

69. Please. Do not think that everyone who does not support Hillary is a misogynist

While I am not in essence arguing with your post (your feelings and your points are very well taken) the assumption that those who do not like Hillary because they devalue women insults the intelligence of many feminist women (and men I would imagine) on this board.

No offense please. There's enough of that already. I just can't take the suggestion that my opinion is based on misogyny. It is based on fact.

[Skip Intro]

71. K&R. I'd like to see the haters here be pushed out the fricken door.

[NoSheep]

73. That was hateful.

}(

[Skip Intro]

76. Why I oughta....

:D

[NoSheep]

84. Lissen here sistah....

:D

[LittleBlue]

72. Regardless of this, she is damaged goods

She can never be the candidate now. She is a gaffe machine who can't win a primary.

[leftynyc]

135. Since today is the first primary

can I have a glance at your crystal ball?

[MarkInLA]

77. The cynics disgust me

What jaded lives some people must be living to believe that a politician, even Hillary Clinton, can't have a genuine emotional moment in public.

[Rowdyboy]

78. Thank you for speaking for me.....I agree with every word

Proud to know ytou my friend

[ecstatic]

79. good post nt

[Evergreen Emerald]

82. Amen. Great Post.

[Samantha]

83. I don't support Hillary but I don't hate her

I simply don't respect some of her past maneuvers. When she was First Lady, however, I admired the way she handled herself. That all changed when she became a professional politician. But like I said, I don't hate her. I will not vote for her.

That being said, I too felt sorry for her today. And I think the emotion was genuine. I would like to know who told her to hire the Pennster. Every element of this campaign I believe has been unflattering. As a woman, I have terribly resented the proposition women need to vote for her because she is a woman. I also do not think people should vote for Barack because of his mixed racial background. To me, an election is simply about issues. Some candidates are better than others. And that's it in a nutshell. Hillary being an intelligent woman should have known better than to allow her handlers to sell this pitch. Additionally, her decision to sacrifice the votes of liberals is a betrayal.

She has worked hard, so hard, during this campaign and it is obvious the fatigue is hitting them all. I have thought the last two days if Hillary had simply listened to her own good instincts and allowed the personable side of herself to show, she would be doing better in the vote-getting category. However, despite what the pundits say, it's too early to write her off. I believe she will change the angle of her pitch and self-correct. And February 5th will probably help wash some of those tears away.

Looking at the bigger picture, however, I do believe Barack is a phenomenon and Hillary is simply not in that category. The remarks of her husband regarding being unable to make her new, taller and male were enough to gag a political maggot. I truly could not believe those words came from his mouth.

Tomorrow is another day, and so is the day after. We'll see if her fortunes improve. But I still will not vote for her....

[TheDonkey]

87. I think it is ok to cry but not cleverly work in campaign talking points as well

I did feel for her when she made the appeal but then she had to make swipes at Obama through it. Unnecessary and eerily calculated.

[Vektor]

93. Amen, brother.

And thank you for being a voice of reason.

:thumbsup:

[Tom Rinaldo]

95. David, I decided to post this on your thread

It is my open letter to Hillary Clinton that I posted at Clark Community Network at 1:00 AM after the Iowa caucus ended. But this part I am writing now. Often during a Democratic primary there is more than one good person competing for a position. Personally I felt that way in 2004 with Dean and Clark, and I felt that way in 2000 with Gore and Bradly also. But usually I can see the reason why all of our Democratic candidates chose to become Democrats and not Republicans - usually there is a thread that runs through their lives that involves caring about other people. I appreciate that they have fought for things I believe in even if I do not believe they are right in all of their positions.

It truly is exciting to see youth engaged in a passionate effort to elect a Democrat President, and many youth seem drawn to Obama while scoring Clinton. People are quick to talk about her having been a "Goldwater Girl" at age 13, but how many even know that she was extremely active in George McGovern's campaign to become President in 1972 - 35 years ago just like they are active now. I see many activists respond to John Edwards recalling his efforts as a lawyer to defend Americans who suffered injustice and had no voice of their own strong enough to fight powerful special interests. How many also realize that Hillary Clinton worked hard as a lawyer for years to defend the rights of and give a voice to arguably the most defenseless population in America, children? Her accomplishments in those areas were just as real as John Edwards' victories against special interests.

None of that automatically makes her a better candidate for President than her opponents in the 2008 Democratic primaries unless you value her accomplishments and views more than those of her Democratic opponents - but it does show her decades long committment to Democratic ideals in both word and practice. It is shameful how distainfully some here now treat her, and it is doubly shameful when sexism is used as a sword against her. I hope Clinton continues to open up and let people know a little bit more about her past and current convictions - where they spring from and how they animate her now. HEre is the open letter I posted after Iowa:

"An Open Letter to Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton

Veneer failed you. Your script let you down. Your controlled message controlled you instead. It obscured you and it separated you from the very people who you asked to have trust in you. But they don’t know you well enough Senator Clinton. They know you are a national leader of the Democratic Party, that you have been one for nearly a decade. But they don’t automatically trust leaders of the Democratic Party anymore after watching it watch America be raped.

A good and solid Democrat will surely be trusted over the Republicans. But you aren’t running against Republicans now, Senator, you are running against fellow Democrats, and they in turn are running against the national Democratic Party that you have been a major part of.

You chose not to be a high profile oppositional leader during your first term in the Senate. You worked to disprove Republican assertions that you were a “wild eyed liberal” instead. You strengthened your capacity to be a leader for all Americans and downplayed aspects of more partisan leadership, but now it is partisans who are the gate keepers. Citing experience isn’t enough now when experience didn’t protect America yesterday. Competency alone won’t be enough if there’s doubt where competency will take us tomorrow.

We know your leadership will be a blessing compared to America’s current nightmare, Senator, but we could say the same for each Democrat running. That’s not enough to close the deal. You have been attacked by opponents for years and now your guard is up. You are secure behind it and there you operate effectively, but we have trouble finding you there Senator. We can’t see well beyond that guard. It’s not what you haven’t said; it’s what you haven’t shown.

I believe there is greatness in you Senator. I see signs of your compassion, of your skill, of your determination and your intelligence. I see signs of your leadership also, but I haven’t felt enough of it. I know your strength and I know how much strength will be required to turn this nation around. You have what it takes to lead us Senator, you have what it takes to truly inspire us. I know that you can, but I doubt you sufficiently will until your personal story becomes more our own and we are touched by the force motivating your life’s journey.

I believe you can be a great President Senator Clinton; the best America has to offer right now. But a President can only reach greatness when the people reach it also. For that you must reach us first; then bring us with you. Put away the script Senator Clinton. Let the message be the messenger. Look us in the eye and tell us a story; yours. I believe we will be impressed."

Hillary Clinton has a real personal story, just like all of our candidates. It's not just spin when she says she has cared about public service all of her life. I can only hope that most of the people who scorned Hillary Clinton for being arrogant and aloof before when she was a front runner playing out a cautious campaign strategy, won't scorn her now as opportunistic if she steps outside that safe box and confronts questions about herself and her life and values openly and head on.

[autorank]

96. Very well said.

I agree with everything. Saved me a lot of words.

You can object to her rhetorical grotesqueness today when she played the Rudy G card.

Did you know, according to HRC, the terrorists pay more attention to our elections than
we do? Damn. They're probably over there at KOS or one of those intellectual sites
reading the tea leaves, figuring out their take on the big deal here.

But that's also part of the pathos, for her to stoop to those tactics reveals how desperate
she is to make it on her own, to not screw up, to give meaning to all the garbage she's had
to put up with as the object of vicious attack for years and as the partner of the guy who
did what he did in the Oval Office.

I'm sanguine now and feel some real empathy for her.

I'll send you a check for $150.00 and, if you don't mind, bill my insurance company so
I can get some of it back;)

[CyberPieHole]

97. Wonderful post. Kick and recommend. n/t

[PurityOfEssence]

98. Thank you, dear David; we're witnessing some of the sadest truths of the human creature today

I'm happy for the joy that many Obama supporters have, and that's an uplifting thing to see, but much of the rest of what's happening is the dark and ugly side of the human character.

I, too feel very sad for Hillary right now. She's a very lonely person at the moment, forced by the moment into the prying furore of crazed mobs. Sure, that's the price of what she's chosen, but right now, I see the hard-working little girl who always wanted to be loved; it's a sad need both she and her husband share, but she's always gotten the short end of the stick. I see the diligent, tough, good student who wants more than anything else to be believed and embraced, and I see her in a horrible moment of public ambush. People are going to be truly ugly about this; they already are.

Cruelly, for someone who follows politics so seriously, I'm working like a dog right now and will be in production the whole month. As a result, I've only been able to skim the board today, and that, coupled with the high volume of the chatter, doesn't allow me to see all that much. The reason I raise this is that I see references to Muskie, but not to Pat Schroeder.

The right wing has already seized on this and it's deeply, deeply ugly. Much as I don't like her and don't trust her, I don't hate her and I truly feel for her buffeted, public torture at the moment, and I'm very blue about my fellow humans' responses. This is not our finest hour.

There's more, and this is it: much as there's a true groundswell of support for Obama and the true vindication and joy from his core followers, that many people haven't "reassessed" him or suddenly "found" him; it's the faddish mob mentality, and it's dangerous, ugly and deeply, deeply depressing to watch. My point of being a lifelong liberal is out of love for my fellow humans and a sense of duty, since I'm physically fit and successful enough to be honor-bound to give back to those less fortunate and try to be an ambassador for a way of life. Yes, I'm also a nightmare with a lot of rough edges, but at the core, I feel that my moral obligation is to be a net payer into society rather than a payee, and try to be so. Sadly, though, the foundation of love for humanity takes severe hits on days like this: it's hard to like the human being when watching such displays.

I wanted Hillary Clinton to fail, but I wanted it to be on policy, and wanted her to be sent back down into the crowd to be a good member of society and a useful force for populism. I didn't want her to be destroyed, and I didn't want the candidacy to devolve into a vicious, misogynistic wolfpack attack on the wounded straggler. There's no schadenfreude; for all her faults, I don't think she's the kind of person to dance on her rival's grave, and seeing that happen to her in the cold light of public day saps my heart.

One doesn't see a person's worth at his/her birthday party when all's well, but when he/she's offered a moment of reliatory triumph or under extreme duress. She's under the latter, while many of her opponents are dancing the high fandango of the former.

Perhaps it's good that I'm working so much; a bit of disconnection is often a good thing for one who likes to like humanity. As Charles Schultz' Linus said: "I love humanity; it's people I can't stand."

Thank you for this thread, and I hope others with kindred feelings take this all to heart and know they're not alone; loneliness is always hardest in crowds.

[David Zephyr]

115. Thanks for mentioning Pat Schroeder.

Pat Schroeder is one of America's finest. Yeah, she was savaged, too. I'd forgotten that, PurityOfEssence. Thanks for the reminder.

You also wrote: "I didn't want the candidacy to devolve into a vicious, misogynistic wolfpack attack on the wounded straggler. There's no schadenfreude; for all her faults, I don't think she's the kind of person to dance on her rival's grave, and seeing that happen to her in the cold light of public day saps my heart." That's why I love you, dude.

For the record and for all that read here, PurityOfEssence has been a class act of how someone should advocate for a candidate at the DU. He's been one of John Edwards' greatest assets here.

[donheld]

99. Beautiful post

thank you

[earth mom]

100. Hillary could have changed all that as Senator. She didn't. She went along with the rethuglicans

and that's why so many of us can't stand her now.

She fails to get my sympathy vote because she has NOT tried to stop any of the crimes against humanity these long 7 years.

People here on DU need to remember that NO one was forcing her to do anything in Congress. She freely made her decisions in Congress and now she has to lie in the whole stinking mess of her own creation.

Just think how different things would be if Hillary had tried to do the right thing, the humane thing at every opportunity. If she had you would have seen overwhelming support from everyone on DU.

[ProSense]

102. "They've salivated like jackals"

"They've salivated like jackals"

[avrdream]

103. Absolutely brilliant post, David.

And very fair.

Recommended highly.

[MattSh]

104. Nearly 40 years on the national stage??

Let's kill this meme, OK? She was 20 years old in 1968. Exactly what of "national" prominence did she accomplish in 1968? or 1978? or 1988?

[NewYorkerfromMass]

105. She spoke at Wellsley's commencement?

I believe she was a big deal on her campus.

[David Zephyr]

107. 1969 ("nearly 40 years ago") Hillary was featured in Life Magazine ("national stage")

.

[bullwinkle428]

106. About ready to turn off Stephanie Miller's show, and I

usually love her, but it's nothing but a Hillary bash-fest today! I'm not even a Hillary backer!!

I heard some wingnut jackasses on the radio earlier, and of course they were on this like hyenas on a fresh zebra carcass - it's a sad day at DU when I can't seem to differentiate this site from those types...

[Beacool]

109. Beautifully written!!!

If Hillary yesterday made me teary eyed, today you have accomplished the same.

I think that she's an amazing woman for many reasons, one of them is for having the backbone to withstand the vitriolic attacks that she has been subjected to all these years and still be willing to put herself on the line because she truly believes that she can do good for the country. It breaks my heart that we might throw her away for the new kid on the block.

Oh well........

[swimmernsecretsea]

111. I am so grateful for your having said this. Thank you. nt

[4_TN_TITANS]

112. I don't buy it....

I'm no Hillary-Hater, but she's ambitious enough that I believe the prospect of possibly losing the Popularity Contest would get to her.

[Javaman]

113. Can't everyone just leave Hillary alone!!!

ala the youtube britney nutjob rant. ;) LOL

[Tom Joad]

114. i cried when the Iraq War Resolution passed, so now she knows how it feels.

[greyghost]

127. AMEN eom

[Marrah_G]

116. Brilliant post!!!

[redqueen]

118. Wish I'd seen this earlier.

Thanks for adding a little ray of sunshine (reason & empathy, to be precise) to this forum.

[emmadoggy]

119. Excellent post.

I'm not a fan of Hillary or Obama, and have chosen to throw my support to Edwards, but the uproar over this Hillary incident is so out-of-whack. She has proven for years how tough she is and has been called all sorts of nasty names for that, and now she shows a tiny moment of humanity and gets raked over the coals for that too. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

I know a lot of people are crowing about the fact that it was an act and all planned out. Who knows? Maybe it was, maybe I'm not cynical enough, but what I saw looked genuine to me. Given the amount of stress and strain they are all under and considering how exhausted they must all be, it is not hard to understand how the veneer might crack a bit under all the weight. And for those who would then say that she "doesn't have the strength it takes to be President", I say gimme a break. She has already shown she does have that strength and I daresay, I would rather have someone as President who DOES have real human emotions and weaknesses. It's ok with me for someone to get emotional during intense times, as long as the emotion doesn't paralyze or incapacitate the person. Much better that then, oh, say the inhuman monsters who are in the White House right now.:-(

[Tom Rinaldo]

120. Very well stated. Thanks n/t

[Nate_in_Iowa]

122. exactly!

I like Hillary personally. Seeing anybody cry bums me out. But is it smart politics for us to look past the voting record because of our empathy as good people? I don't believe so.

I wonder if, when the voice cracked and the eyes welled up, while she was uttering what a dismal state the country has sunk to, she thought to herself "I voted alongside those who slipped the populace of this country the biggest butt-raping its gotten in a long time."

Had I acted so foolishly, I would prolly cry too.

[fancydancy]

123. Crying will only make

her stronger, Dean screamed, Hillary cried, and the Media makes a circus out of it again.

We need to start going back to thinking for ourselves and not what the media tells us to think.

I don't think Hillary broke down, she had an emotional moment, as a woman I classify a break down as uncontrollable crying for an extended period of time.

I am not voting for Hillary but it did make her look more believable as a candidate, more passionate. I do like Hillary but I am not for her because I think she leans the heaviest toward corporate interests on the democratic side.

If she wins the nomination I will definitely vote for her.

[ray of light]

124. Hip-Hip Hooray. Finally a compassionate post in D.U.

[DeepModem Mom]

128. A great, and brave, post, DZ --

K&R from another Obama supporter, with a salute to Hillary.

[Dangerously Amused]

129. Well said, and imperative for this party to hear. ALL of us.

Thank you so much.

K&R.

[Bitwit1234]

130. That republican whip in the house cried real tears and not just like Hillary

he cried twice...and how many more...didn't Craig ...course he had cause to I think it is human to show emotion. Not smirking and grinning I don't call that emotion. We all know who is the smirk champ...and he has sure been out of the news lately, is he on another vacation.

[D23MIURG23]

131. Agreed.

Its one thing to attack Hillary on policy, it is quite another to resort to pettiness.

[anitar1]

134. Hilary is exhausted. She has been on the trail for a long time.

How can anyone spend so much time traveling around the country making speeches ect and not be exhausted. This means everything to her. that said , I am not a Hilary supporter, but I have empathy for her. She has been through hell for many years.All the money in the world does not make emotional life easy when one has experienced what she has.

[truebrit71]

136. What a bunch of sentimental bollocks....

She cynically worked in an attack on her opponents immediately after "choking up"....

I don't buy it for a second.

I don't bash her because she's a woman, I bash her because she's a cynical, cold and calculating politician...HRC doesn't take a dump on the campaign trail without a plan...and this is the same sort of calculated shit she's been doing all along...I wouldn't be surprised if the questioner wasn't another one of her plants...

[hertopos]

144. No she is not

If she were only cynical,cold and calculating politician, her daughter could have been a very different person. Hate her policy but stop spread hate like that. It is quite offensive to 53 year old working mother, myself.

I cannot stand your type of hatered.

Hertopos

[truebrit71]

146. Couple of things...

1) It's not hatered to dislike someone or their actions.
2) Chelsea and her upbringing have nothing to do with her mother's career.
3) Thanks for assuming so much about me from one post.

[Rockholm]

139. David, thank you for this thoughtful post.

[Stand and Fight]

140. Post like this are the exact reason I joined DU.

Post like this are about the only thing that keeps me here lately. A very strong kick and recommendation!

[shaniqua6392]

141. Great post.....I felt really bad for her too.

She has just been railroaded and criticized and it is shameful. She is a very strong woman and I admire much of what she has accomplished in her life. I don't think we should be so cruel to our Dems. It is like a family that is constantly fighting with each other. Kind of heartbreaking for me and I someone who is leaning more toward Edwards.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

142. Well said, thank you.

It's been sick.

[Nay]

143. I'm with you. I'm no Hillary fan, but jeez louise, can we stop all this

"she cried! she's finished!" crap? Maybe she IS finished for all I know, but it's only because the public is an ass, the newspapers are shit, and the pundits are rightwing fuckwits.

[KoKo]

147. Didn't you say you'd never support Obama because of Donnie McGurkin ?

Did I miss something, here? Didn't you also say you'd NEVER support the Clintons?

Whaa? :shrug:

[David Zephyr]

149. Do all gay people's posts look alike to you? Why would you post such nonsense?

Find one post of mine where I have said I would "never" support Barack Obama.

Find one post of mine where I have said I would "never" support Hillary Clinton.

I have readily criticized all three of the front runners when they did things I disapproved of. I still will continue to do so should that happen.

That said, everyone here knows that I will support our nominee.

How curious that you would weigh in at my thread with this nonsense which is completely out of the spirit of the thread. Is this another attempt by you to hijack a thread of mine after you sat it out?

I feel very sorry for you. I really do. I won't answer any response by you here as that is what you are baiting for.

[KoKo]

151. Wow....Excuse me for asking....sheesh...n/t

[Kajsa]

148. I'm not a Hillary hater, either.

There are many things that I admire about her.

She is a fighter and no stranger to extreme adversity.

K&R.

:kick:

[candymarl]

150. Thank You!

n/t