The Clintons will now throw the kitchen sink at Obama

[cali]

They sent out misleading email about Obama's position on abortion. They've hinted that Al-Qaeda will attack if he's president. They'll keep it up, and I'm not entirely sorry that they will. We'll have the opportunity to see how Obama reacts to dirty tricks- and yes Clinton supporters, sending out emails that mislead on choice is misleading and playing the terror card is something NO dem should do. But if Obama does end up with the nomination he'll be stronger for having countered the Clinton machine's onslaught.

[Jersey Devil]

1. Pathetic

As an Edwards supporter I think I can say that these kind of baseless accusations against Hillary are probably what cost Obama the primary in NH.

[niceypoo]

5. Thats exactly my first thought when I heard she won

That Obama supporters and the media overplayed their vindictiveness. Perhaps the headline today should be, "Obama supporters, freepers, and the medias, hatred of Hillary Clinton pisses NH voters off and blows up in their faces"

Encore! Encore!

[Jersey Devil]

11. It's making me more likely to support Hillary if Edwards drops out

If anything at all, maybe the Hillary win in NH will stop the Obamagasms long enough for the smoke to clear so that people can take an objective look at the substance of the candidates' positions rather than the glitz. If the Obama supporters keep up these ridiculous assertions the backlash might be more than they can handle.

[ellacott]

6. How can you call these accusations baseless?

It's been prominently documented in the media.

[Jersey Devil]

14. Demonstrate to me where it has been "prominently documented"

You can't because it is all rumor and innuendo. These "accusations" against Obama are the result of anonymous emailings that Obama supporters accuse Clinton of starting without one scintilla of evidence.

Links please

[ellacott]

26. You honest;y don't know, wow

I find that hard to believe.

HRC's camp sent out a mailer saying that Obama was weak on reproductive rights and pointed to his "present" votes as their justification. Planned Parenthood responded with a letter refuting this distortion and supporting Obama.

HRC mentioned the attacks in London when Gordon Brown took over. She used this as an example of Al Queda testing the new man.

There is much more than a scintilla of evidence. I've given you enough information to do your own google search. You can even do a search on this board and get this information.

[cali]

8. Sorry little devil

but it's a FACT that the Clinton campaign threw out that email. It's a FACT they played the terror card. Perhaps you need remedial education on what constitutes factual information.

[Jersey Devil]

16. Links please?

Show me the beef

[EV_Ares]

21. Here is the beef: Kieth Obermann

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BB4Vvgn_4k

Part 2: Keith O**Hillary Plays Al Qaeda-Fear Card!** Part 2 - 1/7/08

ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZcqwA4-jes

[Jersey Devil]

23. sorry, but sour apples don't equal oranges

Your initial accusation and those of other Obama supporters I've read accuse Hillary of sending email suggesting that Obama was some kind of Manchurian Candidate for al qaeda and perhaps even a secret al qaeda member.

That is a far cry from Hillary suggesting she would be better prepared in the event of an attack by al qaeda.

Try third gear. Maybe that will work.

[EV_Ares]

28. No, you explained yourself which is what i would expect from you. In

other words it is ok for her to play that game but you would as all of us were upset every time the republicans would play the card.

No need for third gear with your attitude about it. You wanted the beef you got it and then you did the pathetic thing I expected.

[cali]

29. Excuse me? Mischaracterize a lot, don't you?

I said she sent out an email attacking his abortion position- despite the FACT that he has a 100% rating from NARAL and every other abortion rights organization. In fact, NARAL NH sent a letter to Clinton asking that her campaign cease and desist from falsely attacking him. I included a link in another post to back it up. And she certainly did play the terra card.

[chascarrillo]

34. I encourage you to read the OP again, Or sign up for some GED classes.

Because the original post said nothing of the sort.

[Jersey Devil]

35. How old are you? 12?

Take your personal insults and shove them

[chascarrillo]

40. Read the OP again. Diagram the sentences.

Explain to me where the original poster said anything close to what you claimed.

[cali]

27. no problem.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2008/01/06/obama_calls_rap_clinton_in_nh/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/06/obama-calls-in-nh-accuse-_n_80102.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20080105/clinton-obama-abortion/

http://www.mywire.com/pubs/HuffingtonPost/2008/01/06/5334811?&pbl=15

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/01/08/558650.aspx

There's your beef and lots of it. Now when are you gonna cop to being flat out wrong?

[Jersey Devil]

30. Another bait and switch manuever

The intitial post suggested Hillary was responsible for the "Obama is al qaeda" emails, which is, of course, pure rubbish.

He threw in the part about abortion for good measure, but I believed he was also alluding to other anonymous emails that supposedly said Obama was anti-choice, which has lately been another favorite accusation of Obama supporters.

The Hillary calls are just politics the way politics is always played and there are some fair points in the statements in them as well as some exaggerations and some that may indeed be misleading. But it is a far cry from Cali's rather thinly veiled accusations that Hillary is conducting the disgusting emails that have been sent about Obama.

[cali]

31. You are a

bald faced L**r. Despicably dishonest. You represent Edwardians here very poorly.

Disgusting. I expect that from YOU, however.

[Jersey Devil]

33. LOL, like you know me at all?

I have had discussions with you in a grand total of two strings today. Otherwise you don't know me better than any other poster here.

Hoever, it took you less than a half dozen responses to me in those strings before you start calling me names and attacking me personally despite the fact that I did no such thing to you.

That tells me a lot about you.

[EV_Ares]

15. You didn't see the replay which was several of Hillary pulling out the terrorist

attack card. I don't know how many times they showed it.

[jasmine621]

41. This is the kind of thinking that ensures that Republicans will take the WH

You folks have your heads burried in the sand. Hillary has a position not much unlike Obama and Edwards: there is a real threat out there against the US thanks much to the Bush administration. It is not fear-mongering to state truth. Any candidate, and I do mean any candidate who fails to let the public know that he or she understands this truth is not worthy of taking office. Remember, at least half the nation sees these realities. The issue is NOT whether or not there are real threats facing the US but how to deal with these threats. It should not be lost on anyone that all the perps behing the first World Trade Center bombing have been caught, tried, and convicted, and are now in prison. The world was not destablized behind their capture trial.

[asthmaticeog]

2. I wonder if South Carolina will get a push-poll about his black children. nt

[EV_Ares]

10. So, what do you mean by that "black children"? eom.

[ellisonz]

20. McCain's black baby.

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/articles/2004/03/21/the_anatomy_of_a_smear_campaign/

[asthmaticeog]

22. Seriously? You didn't get it?

Were you alive in 2004?

[Name removed]

25. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[goldcanyonaz]

3. Clinton wins debates. Obama doesn't. He gives good speeches.

[niceypoo]

4. Apparently you missed the last week...

...when the snarling snapping media and Obama crowd threw the kitchen sink at Hillary

[EV_Ares]

12. I saw some of the media crap but apparently missed the Obama

crap you are referring to.

[ellisonz]

24. We're barely restraining ourselves...

You should be glad we're such strong willed people. Because if my man wasn't into positive campaigning I would be going for the jugulars of both Bill and Hillary.

:think:

[cali]

36. I have ALWAYS defended Clinton against bullshit

from people here and from the media. Furthermore, you know that.
I've said over and over and over again that the press treatment of Clinton is disgusting, more often than not. And the way she's been treated by many DUers is disgraceful. My OP is simply factual, however. And despite the way they campaign, I still have a lot of respect for Senator Clinton. That doesn't mean I'm going to ignore facts.

[EV_Ares]

7. Agree with that Cali. I was surprised about her pulling out the Al-Qaeda

attack card but he may as well face that now against her rather than the general election. Disappointed here and then not so much, it was so close and I would rather the two (appears they will be the final two) go through this race having to prove themselves which will make them better prepared for the general election.

I feel really good about the Democrat candidates. When you look at the comparison of the republicans, it is nice to know that whoever wins our nomination is far superior to any of the republican candidates and I just hope whoever that is they can sell themselves to the general population.

[oasis]

9. You've gotten over the initial shock of your "suspended schadenfreude" but

throwing wild accusations around won't do much for your credibility.:hi:

[hayu_lol]

17. As a Hillary supporter, I haven't seen any real links as to where that stuff...

came from. Hopefully, it was sent out by the Repugnant Hate Machine. Like most of you, I deplore such stuff. But, it was typical of the elections where Bush was running for pretzeldent.

Somehow, I can't see Hillary, or Obama, or even Edwards condoning the trickery. You can expect verbal attacks about facts...and there are plenty of unflattering facts about all our candidates.

I expect that I could probably make a point if I said that Obama goaded Axelrod to make the statements that he made. But, that would probably be wrong. Personally, I'd like to think so.

For some reason, volunteer workers frequently get above their paygrades in initiating scurrilous stuff.

Did Hillary sign, personally sign these crappy mailouts?

[ellacott]

39. This is an article about the mailer

It says Clinton has a record of fighting "far-right Republicans" to defend abortion rights, while Obama has been "unwilling to take a stand on choice."

"Seven times he had the opportunity to stand up against Republican anti-choice legislation in the Illinois state Senate," it says. "Seven times he voted present — not yes or no, but present. Being there is not enough to protect choice.

"On January 8 you have a choice," it closes. "Vote for Hillary Clinton in the Democratic primary, Tuesday, Jan. 8."

The mailer says "Paid for by Hillary Clinton for President" and has a return address of her office in Manchester. Clinton spokesman Phil Singer said the campaign decided to send the piece because "as Senator Obama has said, `voting records matter.' This is a critical issue for New Hampshire voters and they deserve a straightforward presentation of the facts about both candidates."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5ip2G-tP8Bkle1aHygW4mJQOT5FrQD8U01RF83

[Jersey Devil]

19. LOL, I love that one - "suspended schadenfreude"

kudos!

[cali]

37. I've posted links that substantiate

every word I said. And I've always defended Clinton here against false bullshit.

Throwing lies around won't do much for your cred.

[Perry Logan]

13. I guess this could be called "preemptive accusation"?

You're beating the Clinton camp up for something you made up in your head. This is passing strange.

Evil to him who thinks evil, my friend.

[cali]

38. No. I provided links to the accusations I made about the aboriton

attack and the terra card business.

You? More bullshit. That's evil.

[Perry Logan]

42. Links, shminks. You predicted the future...then beat up Hillary's people for what you just made up.

[Samantha]

18. I agree

The only hopeful statement I have heard this morning was Obama's extremely low-keyed statement in the midst of gracious "I lost" words was the crumb that he came out of Illinois and is familiar with Chicago-type election results. Perhaps the man is not as naive as the Clintons have painted him; for the sake of the reputation of the Democratic party, I hope not. There is a lot more to this story than we now know. I don't know what it is, so I am not going to pretend I do. But I have been a political spectator for a long time and this is what my gut is telling me. When it comes down to obtaining a must-have political miracle at the lost moment or making a mechanical adjustment, mechanical adjustments are a lot closer to a sure thing than winning an election through a mere prayer.

I have said on this site for years the 2008 election is "fixed", and what I saw happen last night only cements in my mind that certainty. Stay tuned.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

32. I think the Clinton campaign were 'resting on their laurels'

they didn't anticipate the strength of Obama and Obama isn't going to go away.