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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:07 AM
Original message
Bill Clinton Ignites Ruckus Inside Casino Caucus
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/19/bill-clinton-ignites-ruck_n_82327.html#postComment

This incident by a senior statesman and former President of the most powerful nation on earth is for me the final straw. Howard Dean needs to step in and attempt to stop the former President from further disrupting democratic primary campaigning. Kennedy and other top democratic leaders(Rahm Emanuel and others) have already spoken to Bill Clinton about his behavior, he intends to ignore them. Apparently this is going to be more like a bar room brawl than a dignified democratic primary democrats want.


"As caucusers lined up outside the Mirage ballroom, Clinton mingled with the crowd hugging whomever was in reach and avidly urging those present to support Hillary Clinton. He told The HuffPost that his wife's campaign staff had been "flooded" with complaints from hotel workers throughout the city that they have been "rescheduled" and "reassigned and told they could not vote until November."

In dialog with the HuffPost, Clinton charged at least three times that the Culinary Workers Union, which endorsed Obama, was deliberately trying to suppress votes of pro-Clinton union members. "We hope there won't be so much of this that she won't be competitive," he said, referring to his wife's chances of winning today's Democratic caucus.

Immediately after he made his charges of voter intimidation, the ex-president then stationed himself inside the door of the caucus room and began to individually lobby voters on behalf of his wife.

Democratic Party officials had taken pains to make sure that no partisan signage or literature would be allowed inside caucus sites and that once the complicated voting process got underway no outsiders could have contact with the caucusers.

Clinton broke none of the ground rules but came up right up to the line as he lingered until the last minute and continued to whip up support for his wife's campaign. A Democratic official on site told the Huffington Post that if Mr. Clinton was still inside when the caucus gets underway, he would be required to be "properly credentialed or he would have to be removed."

Clinton's presence inside the room ignited an noisy ruckus of cheers and counter-cheers that divided the attendees. White T-shirted supporters of Ms. Clinton loudly chanted "Hil-la-ry! Hil-la-ry!" while Obama supporters in red T-shirts, raised their fists in the air and chanted back "O-ba-ma! O-ba-ma!"

Obama supporters were outraged by Clinton's presence in the caucus room. "This is a dirty trick," Mirage resort cook Maria Cortez told The HuffPost in Spanish. "He's the one who is trying to intimidate us," she said angrily. "No other candidates are in here? What's he doing here ? Just trying to pressure us."

Another Culinary Union member, Amelia Morland, also speaking in Spanish, said: "Everything's changed about Clinton. He's not the man he used to be."

Clinton was accompanied into the caucus room by long-time supporter and fundraiser Terry McAuliffe. "We were told that any of us could come to talk to voters," he told The Huffington Post. "We're encouraging people to vote. There is no intimidation," he said though there was no reference to intimidation in the reporter's question."
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MercerForPrez Donating Member (61 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
1. Clinton bullied his way into the caucus
and intimidated voters. A pyrrhic victory today for the hillbots (journal this, Rinaldo!)
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I will be calling and emailing Howard Dean Monday and demand he act .
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niceypoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 03:50 AM
Response to Reply #1
57. LMAO
OMGGG! The Hysterics, I cant stand it anymore! :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: Bill Clinton the evil bully!

Waaaaa! Obama lost, Waaaaa! :rofl::rofl: Man my side aches :rofl::rofl:

Gawd you are thin skinned.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 03:59 AM
Response to Reply #57
58. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
SoxFan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #57
66. Well, if Your Gal is the nominee
I think I can find a football game to occupy my time on October weekends next fall.

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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
2. "while Obama supporters in red T-shirts, raised their fists in the air ..."
It's the little details that reveal the bias in this piece
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. Sounds like a "Rage against the Machine" song
You know, I wish we would "Wake Up!"

WAKE UP
Come on!
Uggh!

Come on, although ya try to discredit
Ya still never edit
The needle, I'll thread it
Radically poetic
Standin' with the fury that they had in '66
And like E-Double I'm mad
Still knee-deep in the system's shit
Hoover, he was a body remover
I'll give ya a dose
But it'll never come close
To the rage built up inside of me
Fist in the air, in the land of hypocrisy

Movements come and movements go
Leaders speak, movements cease
When their heads are flown
'Cause all these punks
Got bullets in their heads
Departments of police, the judges, the feds
Networks at work, keepin' people calm
You know they went after King
When he spoke out on Vietnam
He turned the power to the have-nots
And then came the shot

Yeah!
Yeah, back in this...
Wit' poetry, my mind I flex
Flip like Wilson, vocals never lackin' dat finesse
Whadda I got to, whadda I got to do to wake ya up
To shake ya up, to break the structure up
'Cause blood still flows in the gutter
I'm like takin' photos
Mad boy kicks open the shutter
Set the groove
Then stick and move like I was Cassius
Rep the stutter step
Then bomb a left upon the fascists
Yea, the several federal men
Who pulled schemes on the dream
And put it to an end
Ya better beware
Of retribution with mind war
20/20 visions and murals with metaphors
Networks at work, keepin' people calm
Ya know they murdered X
And tried to blame it on Islam
He turned the power to the have-nots
And then came the shot

Uggh!
What was the price on his head?
What was the price on his head!


I think I heard a shot
I think I heard a shot
I think I heard a shot
I think I heard a shot
I think I heard a shot
I think I heard, I think I heard a shot

'He may be a real contender for this position should he
abandon his supposed obediance to white liberal doctrine
of non-violence...and embrace black nationalism'
'Through counter-intelligence it should be possible to
pinpoint potential trouble-makers...And neutralize them,
neutralize them, neutralize them'

Wake up! Wake up! Wake up! Wake up!
Wake up! Wake up! Wake up! Wake up!

How long? Not long, cause what you reap is what you sow
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #9
31. fun to read.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #31
43. That song reminds me why I'll always be a liberal/progressive
It gets my blood flowing...
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:12 AM
Response to Original message
4. Keep em on their toes Bill.
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Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
5. Wow, he broke no rules, and it pissed off some Obama supporters.
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:14 AM by Skip Intro
So we have yet another thread of cheap attacks based on nothing, with an overflow of fake outrage and whining.

And again, and again, and again...
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MercerForPrez Donating Member (61 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:14 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Cheap attacks on cheapening the presidency
but then Klinton is already guilty of that.
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Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Hey now, Clinton with a K. Happy first day on DU!
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:18 AM by Skip Intro
you'be been busy, eh?
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #6
15. touche!
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:33 AM by Tarheel_Dem
There is nothing "presidential" about him these days. Throwing about accusations of misconduct on the part of other campaigns to blunt the impact should anyone else win. He has sadly become a caricature on the campaign trail.

I heard a replay of his interview with Jackie Reed on Tom Joyner's Morning Show, and he wouldn't address her questions, but steamrolled over her through the entire interview. Everytime I see him on TV these days he's in a tizzy, and looks completely unhinged. Why is it so important for him to be back in the WH? Hmmmmm.....
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #15
22. He' just intent on dragging his image into the dirt.
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #22
34. Put that Bad Bill Clinton out of site. Our wittle baby cannot
simply cannot compete.

Clinton did nothing wrong---or illegal. Obama is having a hard
time in the learning curve---Politics aint bean ball.

There were several reports of the Culinary Union deliberately
not scheduling workers for caucus if they said they were for
Hilary. Yes Union Bosses are politcal also.





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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:16 AM
Response to Reply #34
44. They didn't threaten their jobs which is illegal, And for a guy
who wanted to suppress the CWU through his support of the lawsuit he sure enjoyed their company didn't he.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
67. Clinton accuses others of the very misconduct he is engaging in.
It's an olde tyme Rove bullyboy tactic of accusing an opponent of what you are doing so that by the time the truth is revealed, the outrage has been blunted and they've move on to their next performance of stomping feet and complaining and slickly gaming the system. So very Rove. I would think the Clintons were smart enough to have learned from the abuse the GOP heaped up on them the last two decades. Sadly, they have chosen to emulate it.
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 03:37 AM
Response to Reply #6
56. Can't spell?
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Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #6
68. Damn, tombstoned on your first day.
awwww
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #5
16.  I for one think if Hillary wants this she should earn it,
he undercuts her so called new found voice, I guess we now know she meant Bill when she said she found her voice in NH.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/96385

Prominent Democrats are upset with the aggressive role that Bill Clinton is playing in the 2008 campaign, a role they believe is inappropriate for a former president and the titular head of the Democratic Party. In recent weeks, Sen. Edward Kennedy and Rep. Rahm Emanuel, both currently neutral in the Democratic contest, have told their old friend heatedly on the phone that he needs to change his tone and stop attacking Sen. Barack Obama, according to two sources familiar with the conversations who asked for anonymity because of their sensitive nature. Clinton, Kennedy and Emanuel all declined to comment.

On balance, aides to both Bill and Hillary still see Bill as a huge net plus in fund-raising, attracting large crowds and providing a megaphone to raise doubts about Obama—even if some of those doubts are distortions. But there's concern that in hatcheting the Illinois senator and losing his temper with the news media (last week he thrashed a San Francisco TV reporter for asking about a lawsuit filed by Clinton-backing teachers union members to limit the number of Nevada caucuses), Clinton is drawing down his political capital and harming his role as a global statesman. "This is excruciating," says a member of the Clintons' circle, who asked for anonymity. "But the stakes couldn't be higher. It's worth it to tarnish himself a bit now to win the presidency."

During a December taping with PBS's Charlie Rose, a frustrated Clinton called Obama "a roll of the dice," as aides tried to end the interview. Then, in New Hampshire, he argued angrily that the story of Obama's principled position on the Iraq War was a "fairy tale," a charge few reporters bought. Rep. James Clyburn of South Carolina, the top-ranking African-American in Congress and officially neutral, found Clinton's tone insulting and said so publicly.

When the former president called Kennedy, the Massachusetts Democrat gave Clinton an earful, telling him that he bore some blame for the injection of race into the contest. In any event, both Hillary and Obama made peace on the race issue at the Las Vegas debate. The Clinton camp now fears that Kennedy is leaning toward Obama, according to the Clinton source, though Kennedy's office says he is making no endorsement "at this time."

Clinton aides admit the boss sometimes goes off script. Obama officials say this itself should be a campaign issue. Greg Craig, who coordinated Clinton's impeachment defense in 1998 and is now a senior Obama adviser, argues that "recent events raise the question: if Hillary's campaign can't control Bill, whether Hillary's White House could."

There is little precedent for a former president's engaging in intra-party attacks. In 1960, Harry Truman criticized the idea of a Roman Catholic president and tried briefly to stop John F. Kennedy's nomination. "I urge you to be patient," he told JFK publicly. But in 2000, former president George Bush declined to attack his son's GOP primary opponent, John McCain.

Clinton is undeterred by the criticism and will likely keep hammering Obama if he thinks it helps Hillary. "History will judge the impact on the Clinton legacy, not daily or weekly political reporters," says Matt McKenna, Bill Clinton's press secretary.
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #16
28. Thanks for that article Cali, and I couldn't agree more.....n/t
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creeksneakers2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #16
63. I'm curious about Rahm Emanuel
Because not that long ago Rahm and Howard Dean had a falling out. The net was abuzz with how Rahm was a Clinton surrogate doing a hit job on Dean. Now I'm reading that Rahm went after Bill in a very public way over something that has very little to do with electing Democrats to the House. Clinton haters need to be more consistent.
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:17 AM
Response to Original message
8. He is supporting his wife
That is all.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. He is carrying her. Big difference.
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Maybe
Regardless, he is doing what most spouses of candidates do; the most they can to help get their spouse elected.
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #14
23. Right. I love seing that. A lot.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #14
27. the inescapable fact for him is he is a former President, they aren't.
It is very different. He of course is entitled to support Hillary as his wife. But his version has gone beyond what spouses have usually done because he gets so much attention and has used it to push less than stellar tactics. http://www.newsweek.com/id/96385
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #14
40. It is not what most Former Presidents do......
hence, it is not "what most" spouse of candidates do.
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:10 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. This is unique territory
I doubt you will see such a dynamic again in yours or my lifetime. There are no rules with regards to the actions of a former Executive in this instance, written or unwritten.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #41
47. Well I consider it an insult ....that Hillary would, on the one hand, claim
to be running on her own merrits to become the first Women President, while on the other hand, running on her husbands record. I don't consider this as progress, as it only teaches my daughters that in order to get to where you are going, make sure that a man takes you there. I don't find this liberating, at all.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:23 AM
Response to Reply #47
49. Thats kind of what I think. Its so obvious. And I don't think everyone else is oblivious to this
watch it come back later. If things get more combative maybe this is something that should be brought up.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:28 AM
Response to Reply #49
51. Well you know that the GOP will bring it up, over and over and over again.....
That's why they are just sitting and waiting.

So yes, she probably needs some vetting on that issue. Waiving her hand at it ain't gonna quite get it. You know how the media will turn for the GE.
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:30 AM
Response to Reply #47
52. I am not sure she is completely running on her own merits.
When she claims 35 years of experience, I imagine that she is including her time as First Lady.

As for the issue of liberation, there is only one bachelor president in our history and he was arguably the worst so making it to that office alone is rare. Tell your daughters (and I have daughters too) that a marraige has two involved and each are just as capable as the other in ability to provide support and solidarity.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:32 AM
Response to Reply #52
53. yes,executive experience by osmosis.
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Hoof Hearted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 04:10 AM
Response to Reply #10
59. If bill was MIA we'd have even more inane posts about their "sham" marriage, if he sat there like a
potted plant there would be cracks about how she was using him as a prop - and so on and so on.

wHaT eVEr.

Pointing your finger and shouting "no fair" shows novice and naiveté. Obama is going to do everything he can to win the nomination and if he gets it he will have earned it fair and square. I doubt if we will see him pouting in the corner about Bill Clinton if he does not.
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Tulkas Donating Member (592 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #8
18. EXACTLY!!!
He is supporting his wife, that is all.

He is not acting like a former president, he is not doing what is best for the party, he is not doing what is best for the country.

He is supporting his wife, that is all.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #8
19. Even former President Bush stayed out of the sniping between his son and McCain
during his son's run. And we have all seen the father son relationship. In the role of senior statesman and former President of the 'free world' he has more than influence and presence when standing with citizens in a caucus room. it is beyond the pale that he thinks this is not inappropriate. Support his wife is one thing, he is usurping a primary for her with his past presidential persona and his title.


http://www.newsweek.com/id/96385
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #19
24. Everyone brings their own history to the table
Don't you think it is unreasonable to ask him to distance himself from his wife's political campaign simply because his history has more weight than others'?
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #24
29. I don't think he should NOT support her. I think he has gone way
beyond what spouses should do. He of course should support his spouse. His support has been something quite different. So much so that other democratic leaders are stepping in and asking him to cut it out.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/96385
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:47 AM
Response to Reply #29
32. Thank you for the article
Two things struck me about it the most. First, this: "But the stakes couldn't be higher. It's worth it to tarnish himself a bit now to win the presidency."

I agree with that assessment. He will naturally care more about his wife's campaign than tarnishing his own legacy and reputation. Not to mention the fact that if she succeeds, he secures his reputation and is part of a political "dynasty."

Second, if this were a real problem for the Democratic leaders mentioned, there would not be anonomous statements to reporters. If Kennedy or any of the others are that upset, and truly think they can stop it, they should come out and say so.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. I hope they will, but Bill knows they have and feels differently. your welcome.
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:50 AM by caligirl
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #33
36. Then if this is real, it is a game of chicken
And who risks a divided Democratic Party? Which side stares down the other? Will Kennedy openly challenge Bill Clinton? I don't think so. The former Executive will not be reigned in and it will just have to be another part of Obama's fight for the nomination.

The only thing I see that could cause intervention is a fear of a Hillary Clinton impact down ballot in November.
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Tulkas Donating Member (592 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #24
45. Yes
I think he should give speeches and hold rallies for her.


I don't think he should go door to door, or into a caucus room.

He also should not be attacking the other candidates, if Hillary loses and he has attacked Obama/Edwards that will be in Republician TV adds for 6 months.
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jbnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:56 AM
Response to Reply #8
35. "He is supporting his son". Is that what you'd
have said if bush sr had done the same things in his son's campaign?

Really. I have asked some people that who think Bill is doing this just fine but no one tells me.

I have mixed feelings about ex-presidents being involved in a primary campaign but I really assumed Bill would speak FOR Hillary and not against the other Democratic candidate.
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Bok_Tukalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #35
37. Yes. Absolutely, had GHW done so.
I would not have blamed him a bit.

But I think the dynamic of a father helping his son would have more of a negative impact than a husband helping his wife. And that leaves out the success of each ex-president.
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jbnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #37
55. The father son dynamic would be
sort of odd in a campaign...though this has turned odd too.

As noted I had mixed feelings about his role but was just shocked when I heard him a couple times in NH. He sounded bitter and angry. Bill Clinton not charming? But I defended him then, it can be harder to see a loved one in a bad position then to be there yourself.
But it made me think...no spouse should be ripping the other candidate or blaming the state for their schedule and no ex-president should and especially in a primary.

OK so he lost it a little, thinking dreams were about to shatter. I thought that would be the end of it. It wasn't. Now it makes me queasy.

I heard about his infamous temper but we never saw it in public. We never should in this way.

His charming persuasion is one thing...the rest of it is another.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #35
46. Former Presidents have a unique postion to respect. Bush Sr did, Bill isn't.
There are so many ways and so many avenues for these powerful people to 'support ' their family member. Using the platform of the presidency in this manner is damaging to the office.
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BenDavid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:19 AM
Response to Original message
11. obama still looking OjOfor those 60,000 culinary workers OjO
:hi: I just saw one!:hide:
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:20 AM
Response to Original message
12. Watch the video. That's just good, old-fashioned cheering your candidate on.
It was a noisy ruckus, but good-spirited.
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Tulkas Donating Member (592 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #12
20. I hope that is all over the cable channels for a week
Although I am not crazy about the orange T-shirts.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:20 AM
Response to Original message
13. I'm certainly no Hillary fan...
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:46 AM by TwoSparkles
...but the candidate themselves, and their surrogates can make appearances
at the caucus sites and do a bit of lobbying for their campaign.

I know this sounds underhanded, but it's actually not. It's not like voting precincts,
which are somber, serious situations where no politicking is allowed within 500 feet of
the premises.

Caucuses are loud, crowded, lively events. Even though everyone understands how serious
their caucusing responsibilities are--it is a fun, spirited event.

At my precinct, Obama was in the hallway greeting people. In 04, Kerry's brother
showed up to do a last-minute campaigning for his brother.

This really is not a big deal and it's not illegal or intimidation.

As long as the person isn't inside the caucus room when the doors shut--then
it's totally fine.

Please don't email Howard Dean about this. It will look like sour grapes.

Again, I'm an Obama supporter, and Hillary is my last choice--but what Bill Clinton did was fine.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. thank you for your well reasoned response. You make this make more sense to those
who aren't there. After reading all the other stuff and seeing many video's it would be easy and was easy to take this as an affront to the process. I'll take your word for this.
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:35 AM
Response to Reply #13
26. Thank you!
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jbnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #13
38. Thanks. Report I read said he was in there until
12:15 when doors were suppose to close at 12 but they delayed the start of the caucus. So if there was fault in that it would be just whoever was running the room allowing him to stay in that late?

I'm glad it wasn't against the rules...but I would have been upset if bush sr had done that in the general elections his son had run in.
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Hobarticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
17. From HuffPost? You don't say!
Garsh, I should probably take it at face value, then.
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fenriswolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:35 AM
Response to Original message
25. this has all the air's of a soap opera
our once sacred duty to elect our respected leaders in a calm, intelligent dignified manner has eroded so far. From the Republicans I can understand degenerative tactics. But from a former president to degrade himself to the roll of cheerleader? To purposefully divide the democratic party? to fulfill the ultimate "if your not with my candidate your against my candidate" that's right remember a time when we could calmly disagree with each others preference but could see each others point of views? to be gone so low as to reject anything for ultimate obedience. This is coming from either side as far as I can see.
The divide is no longer between the republicans and the democrats. the divide has gone even further. It gets worse and worse each election cycle and now we have former leaders furthering the divide in a cheap circus stunt to pander to voters and get votes. I'm staying home if hill is elected, I can't stand whats happening.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:43 AM
Response to Reply #25
30. Here 's the thing, if a spouse can legally be at a caucus to cheer on
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:44 AM by caligirl
their husband/wife/brother etc. And its just part of the fun for everyone thats o'kay. The problem is that Bill has caused some problems before the caucus with his aggressive actions and words toward others, he has made statements and false accusations unbecoming a former President that stories like the caucus story just come off sounding like another affront to the Office of the President.
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democrat2thecore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #25
48. You think THIS is a soap opera, let's elect Hillary and the Bill & Hillary soap opera really begins
Four years of gossip sheet crap that will destroy any hope for a successful Democratic presidency. We need to put the Bill & Hillary soap opera to bed. Make it history and look FORWARD!
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ShaneGR Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:05 AM
Response to Original message
39. You wanted the vote inside crazy casinos, you got it
Deal with it
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #39
42. Well, no, that was the NV Dem Party
who thought the CWU endorsement would go to Hillary and give her a massive victory over rural NV.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:26 AM
Response to Reply #42
50. well said.
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hayu_lol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:48 AM
Response to Reply #50
54. Its a matter of record that Huffington hates Hillary and Bill...
she has been pounding them for several years now. If you are a regular bartcop reader(humor helps), this has been pointed out time and time again.

That aside, as many on this thread have pointed out, this is a unique situation for which there is no precedent.

Daddy Bush may not have actively and publically backed little George in 2000, but he sure made sure that the money rolled in for him.

I doubt that Bill broke any rules...and that Obama came as close to the line. Also no doubt that Hillary and Obama both want to win.

There is also no doubt in my mind that the caucus format cost Edwards much of his support.
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #54
60. Arianna learned the Clinton hate at the foot of newt Gingrich - never let go
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 09:10 AM by robbedvoter
And Bartcop is good perspective - especially after this place
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
61. i got a note from someone i worked the Iowa caucus with ..she worked at Caesar's Caucus ..
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 10:58 AM by flyarm
for Edwards..this was is her highly disgusted note to me this morning..( understand this lady and i worked caucus's in Iowa..

from her note:

..................................

This state should NEVER have been a caucus state. Our “precinct” was Caesar's palace and the Caesar's. (Misspelled both of them!). Chaos. Screaming culinary workers for barack, a smaller group for clinton(the Vegas strip employs 17,000). It felt like a southern “march” and rally cry. It was totally race oriented.

...................................

She left her note off that it was a disgrace.

So Why did the dem party turn Nevada into a cacus state..let me tell you..it was and is to disenfranchise voters..it is so the party has more say in who we nominate than we the people do!

wake up people...you have been duped..duped big time..by the DLC!

fly

p.s ..i am leaving for South Carolina in less than an Hour...i will write here if i get time.
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Jai4WKC08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #61
65. NV was a caucus state anyway, and the Dem Party had nothing to do with it
The party can't demand that a state hold a primary. That's up to the state legislature, who has to pay for a primary but not a caucus.

I don't know if NV has always been a caucus state, but it was last year. The only thing the Party did was move the date up (altho again, with the concurrence of the legislature), to give a western state with a large Latino population a chance to participate early in the nomination process.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
62. Bill Clinton, what happened to you?
From this:


To this:
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
64. I liked Bill a lot more....
before he started running for his 3rd Term.

I heard his wife is helping him.
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itsrobert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
69. Doesn't look like he broke any rules
So what's all the fake outrage about?
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