Republicans don't want unity. They never have and they never will.

[Tennessee Gal]

That is why Obama's message is unrealistic.

Do a little research. They have been planning a strategy against unity for years and years. It involves attacking any way they can. It involves "framing" issues. It involves manipulating the vote by "caging" and voter supression. Don't think for a moment that they have any interest in unifying this country.

Think about Newt Gingrich.

Think about The Heritage Foundation.

Think about Rush Limbaugh.

Think about Frank Luntz.

All they think about and plan for is power.


The Integration of Theory and Practice:
A Program for the New Traditionalist Movement

http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/FreeCongressEssay.html

Some quotes from the above link:

"The coming battle for the hearts and minds of Americans is ultimately a battle between civilization and barbarism."

"Making a good-faith effort and being ideologically sound will be less important than advancing the goals of the movement."

"We will maintain a constant barrage of criticism against the Left. We will attack the very legitimacy of the Left. We will not give them a moment's rest."

"We will use guerrilla tactics to undermine the legitimacy of the dominant regime. We will take advantage of every available opportunity to spread the idea that there is something fundamentally wrong with the existing state of affairs."

"The movement must be willing to appear obnoxious."

"We must be feared, so that they will think twice before opening their mouths."

"We must learn to treat leftists as natural disasters or rabid dogs. If we act as if this were in fact true (of course, it is not), we will not needlessly expend our energy on being upset with our opponents."

"This is not to discount the importance of reminding ourselves on a regular basis why we ought to hate leftist ideology, in order to keep ourselves motivated to better fight it."

"We must reframe this struggle as a moral struggle, as a transcendent struggle, as a struggle between good and evil."

"For example, we will go to public lectures given by leftists and ask them "impolite" and highly critical questions. We must, of course, be fully prepared beforehand for these sorts of excursions, and we must also be prepared to embarrass ourselves, especially at first."

"Our people must learn to have contempt and scorn for the wider society, and reject it in all ways."

[fenriswolf]

1. right its an epic battle between good and evil

listen not every one is evil. Most republicans are brought up a certain way, think a certain way and have certain beliefs. These beliefs or misconceptions do not make them evil. Unity is what we should strive for not conflict. just because a few bad apples make them all seem like uneducated hicks doesnt mean they all are.

[Tennessee Gal]

3. You missed the point entirely.

[Horse with no Name]

22. The point is that this isn't really speaking of the average person

It is bigger than that. It is the entrenched corporations and establishment of the republican party. Congress as we know doesn't deal with the average Democrat...nor would they deal with the average republican.
That is entirely the point. The average person of EITHER political stripe has lost their place at the table with people who really do not care about what is important to us collectively.
The entities sitting on the republican side have no desire or no interest to go along to get along. Their idea of bipartisanship is doing it their way. Regardless of who our winner is...they have to eject the special interests from the table before any meaningful dialogue can occur between the two parties. Until that is done...bipartisanship will not and cannot exist. Not because WE won't allow it....it's because they won't. History has told us that.

[Tennessee Gal]

27. Exactly.

You said it better than I.

[fenriswolf]

30. i see that

congress playing to the extremes rather then the majority which is the moderates.

[sandnsea]

2. Which is why we need to be ON A NEW FUCKING TRAJECTORY

He doesn't want to have unity with specific hatemongers - he wants the country to REJECT HATE so we can push these hatemongers into the dustbin of history where they belong.

And I suggest the Democratic Party start with The Clintons.

[robinlynne]

9. ooh sandnsea. We used to disagree about so much. Not now!

[sandnsea]

12. Kerry endorsed Barack Obama

He wanted to put the country on a new trajectory too. He just couldn't get the message through the media and his own tendency towards senatorial speak didn't help. But I always knew he would fight like hell for what everybody here really wanted, and he has. And so will Obama.

[Tennessee Gal]

14. Did Kerry fight in Ohio in 2004? No.

I like Obama's message of unity. I just don't think it will get the job done at this point in time.

[sandnsea]

19. Unity puts us on a New Trajectory

The New Trajectory isn't about unity, it's about the majority of the country believing in progressive values.

And did you have some evidence that Bush stole the election in Ohio and how he did it and who was involved? I still haven't seen any.

[jlake]

34. How the fuck is this unity going to take place?

[Tennessee Gal]

35. "it's about the majority of the country believing in progressive values"

Do you think that will happen with glowing rhetoric? Do you actually think the right is going to buy into this? I have given you evidence that they will not. It will take a fight for progressive values. The right wing is entrenched in elitist values and corporate control of our society. They will not give up without a fight.

[sandnsea]

39. That's the way transformations always happen

Someone comes along with "glowing rhetoric" and taps into the desires of a people and transform the world. That's the whole point. It has to be done sooner or later. We can do it now.

[robinlynne]

15. wait, I'm not agreeing about Obama, although no probem with your support for him.

I'm agreeing that I do not want to unify with the extreme right. I want to see them in jail.

(which is he main reason I'm not voting for obama. nor hillary.)

[sandnsea]

18. He wants to destroy the entire conservative movement

The neocons are a different breed than the right. We could lock them up tomorrow, and we'd still have the Reagan Revolution on our hands. That's what he's talking about. Completely changing the dynamics, the thinking, the belief system, of the country. Not a short term battle, but winning the entire war.

[Tennessee Gal]

21. I wish him well with that.

I just don't beleive this is the year for it. Not after 8 years of the most law-breaking, civil liberties nullifying, coporate elitist, war-mongering administration in our history.

[Horse with no Name]

24. I've never seen him say that

Ever. The only thing I have seen close is his SUPPORTERS saying that is what he intends to do.
I have no problem with YOUR political leanings...you are good people so that is all I am going to say about that.
I don't believe Obama is everything you all crack him up to be, and in the end, I am afraid you are going to be more disappointed than I am.

[sandnsea]

38. Please read

I would be happy to have this conversation. I understand the motivations behind the support of John Edwards. I think we are all on the same page in wanting a Mega Shift in the way this country thinks and operates. I think we tried beating them up in 2004, with MoveOn ads and the like. I don't think it worked. I'm impressed with someone who goes to the evangelical community and tells them he respects women to make their own choice on abortion, even if he adds that they do it "prayerfully". Or that goes to the black church community and encourages HIV testing and confronts homophobia. Or goes to Wall Street and tells them they need to think about the health of main street and not just the greed of the bottom line.

This is the dilemma he describes and wants to change:

Others pursue a more "centrist" approach, figuring that so long as they split the difference with the conservative leadership, they must be acting reasonably -- and failing to notice that with each passing year they are giving up more and more ground. Individually, Democratic legislators and candidates propose a host of sensible if incremental ideas, on energy and education, health care and homeland security, hoping that it all adds up to something resembling a governing philosophy.

(4) p.79: Those on the left saw the situation quite differently. With conservative Republicans making gains in the congressional and presidential elections, many liberals viewed the courts as the only thing standing in the way of a radical effort to roll back civil rights, women's rights, civil liberties, environmental regulation, church/state separation, and the entire legacy of the New Deal.

(5) p.82: Few of the Bush nominees in question fell into the "moderate" category; rather, they showed a pattern of hostility toward civil rights, privacy, and checks on executive power that put them to the right of even most Republican judges (one particularly troubling nominee had derisively called Social Security and other New Deal programs "the triumph of our own socialist revolution").


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=388x1190

We have to rely on the power of our IDEAS, not the power of courts and legislative maneuvers. We have to create a movement as powerful as the Reagan movement, change the trajectory. This is bigger than a 5 pt plan on putting more teachers in the classroom, or giving a health care tax credit. He's talking about tapping into the disgust and failure of Republicanism at a time when people are ripe to hear a message of social accountability. When we all are back on the path of being all in this together, passing the legislation won't take any fights at all.

[Cha]

29. You get it, I got it..I wish some

others around here would..and no one dislikes repukes as much as moi.

[NastyRiffraff]

4. well said!

You can only have unity with people who want it. Not with people who want to dominate at any cost. No matter how much you want everyone to get together, smile on your brother, how do you "unite" with people who say:

"We must be feared, so that they will think twice before opening their mouths."

[babylonsister]

5. Then think about this. Think of all the people who aren't as knowledgeable

as you think you are. Think of all the people who finally 'get' it, and are disenchanted with their party.

What to do with them? Dismiss them or try to impress them with a message that's different than the status quo they've been so receptive to in the past but disgusted by now?

[Tennessee Gal]

8. That is a valid point.

However, I don't think there are very many on the right who are as receptive to unity as you believe there might be. At least I have not come across them. Most of them have bought the right wing propoganda hook line and sinker.

[Bluerthanblue]

16. Oh.... please stop for a second and really

think about what you are saying Tennessee Gal.

How is your clumping a group of individuals together into a 'mass' and discarding them as "unfit" or "un-salvageable" any different than any other kind of bigotry, prejudice or phobia?

We can stand strong against ideals- against individual actions and situations, but when we presume to know what "they" will do- or what "they" really believe, are we really being fair, or honest?

We are individuals- we HAVE to learn to see each others as such.

If we choose to clump ourselves together that is our 'choice'- it is different than when others do that to us.

Can you see what I'm trying to say?

I have met some very unkind people. I have known some wonderful people. The only genuine 'constant' is the "people" part.

The Democratic Party, - Democratic Ideals- are not human beings. We can and do exist outside of political parties- I CHOOSE to embrace the Ideals of the Democratic Party because it matches my belief systems better than any other party- but I believe we really need to learn to seperate human beings from "labels" we as a society have created.

peace~
blu

[Tennessee Gal]

17. What you are saying is what I am trying to tell you that

Republicans do. I have given you some evidence. I am not saying we should emulate them. Far from it. I am simply saying that we have to fight for what we believe in honorably, but forcefully.

[lumberjack_jeff]

6. They're absolutely right.

This is a transcendent struggle between good and evil. I've picked my side.

[PsN2Wind]

7. They don't want to defeat the Democratic Party

they want to destroy it and we ignore that at our peril.

[DBoon]

25. Their republican party is not a party in the tradition of democracy

It is more like a stalinist vanguard party or a fascist elite movement.

Their goal isn't to advance a program or represent a constituency, it is to ensure that they achieve total unopposed control over government and all social institutions.

Their Republican party is a totalitarian party, not a party of democracy

[rodeodance]

10. Pelosi keeps thinking they want UNITY--but it hits her in the face--they are NOT into unity

[angrycarpenter]

11. this thing scorns democracy itself

It comes right out and says that the ends justify the means. It says that unreasoning hate is good. These people would kill half the world just to prove a point and the point is "fear us".

[Tennessee Gal]

13. That is what the Bush administration has been about.

That has been obvious. They will not give up power without a monumental fight. Glowing rhetoric will not get the job done, even though it is extremely attractive.

[dkf]

20. I haven't seen Republicans scoffing at the idea of Unity. Only Dems here on this board.

[Tennessee Gal]

23. Where have you been looking?

Republicans don't post here.

I have given you evidence of the way they think and/or operate. What more evidence do you need than the Bush administration?

Unity is a lofty goal. It is admirable. It is desirable. But it will require a fight that demands more than rhetoric.

[Bluerthanblue]

33. "they" don't post here-

You haven't given evidence of how "all- republicans" think or operate.

You have very clearly pointed out how some individual republican politicans operate- and done a good job of demonstrating their disdain for unity- but Obama's not talking to the republican 'party'- He is talking to the American PEOPLE. People who may wear the label of "republican"- or "independent" or "undecided" or "libertarian" or "democrat" or "socialist" or "anarchist"- He is a Democratic Senator, and Candidate for President, who is speaking to the nation. And there are those, from all walks of life who are responding. Please remember- We CAN change our political affilation- It isn't inborn- we can grow, learn, change.

I completely agree with you that Unity,- genuine Unity- requires much more than rhetoric, or lip service. But we have to start where we are, and build from there. Talking with each other is a good start- Listening- Identifing our common needs, hopes, interests. It won't be easy- it won't be 'comfortable' or quick. But that shouldn't keep us from trying. Should it?


peace~

[Tennessee Gal]

37. I am not saying that he shouldn't try.

It is admirable that he is trying. I just don't think that after 8 years of the most dishonest administration in our history and years and years of Republican brainwashing of their followers, it will take more than glowing speeches to turn things around as fast as this country and the world needs.

[totodeinhere]

26. If that is true...

And I suspect it is, then how are we ever going to accomplish anything legislatively as long as the Repugs have enough votes in the Senate to mount filibusters?

[Tennessee Gal]

31. That is why we need to win more seats in the Senate!

And I do believe this is the year for that.

[Tellurian]

28. Obama winding up the Black Community into a Race War is a recipe for disaster!

And, this is Obama's doing playing the Race Card!

Just think, we have 2 Uniters, Bush and Obama, who with their "dirty" hands will institute Martial Law, suspending elections indefinitely!

[Tennessee Gal]

32. Wait a minute!

Not one word was said here about a "race card" until you posted.

I don't know of any evidence that points to Hillary doing any better at unifying this country than Obama. In fact, Republicans hate her (and Bill) so much, they will fight with all their might to defeat her.

[Tellurian]

40. Oh, wait... it's alive and well in Peoria..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4136024

[LibDemAlways]

36. One of Bill's best buds is old man Bush. All of these

politicians are part of the same DC insiders club that the ordinary person is frozen out of.


It isn't so much Repukes vs. Dems though Dems tend to give in rather than duke it out when it comes to policy. The real battle is the powerful politicians of both party owned by and beholden to corporate interests vs the rest of us - the ordinary people very few in Washington even think about, much less care about.

[Tennessee Gal]

41. Yes, that is it somewhat.

The entrenched versus the forgotten. It will take a powerful force to turn that around, especially since Republicans have practiced for years and years scorched earth politics to get and maintain power.

[Tennessee Gal]

42. Take a look at Newt's GOPAC Memo

http://web.utk.edu/~glenn/GopacMemo.html

Language: A Key Mechanism of Control

[Tennessee Gal]

43. Look into Grover Norquist