Ted Kennedy has ulterior motives: Not pure.

[PinkTiger]

On the surface Ted Kennedy's endorsement of Obama looks so nice; but there is something going on here. Kennedy would never endorse a candidate this early unless he:

1. Wants to become a kingmaker and control the delegates in a brokered convention; or
2. Is asking for something in return IF the candidate wins the nomination and the general election.

I don't trust Ted Kennedy.

I posted this earlier and it was removed, probably because I hinted at his motives. I won't say more, but I think we need to look at this with an open mind. Personally, I do not support Obama; but I wouldn't want Kennedy's support this early for ANY candidate. I also don't like the demeanor I saw on TV at the SOTU. It was too patronizing for my taste.

[Kittycat]

1. Grab your Tin-Foil, folks.

It's time to make hats. :rofl:

[AtomicKitten]

52. I'm ready.

[EFerrari]

2. I hope your distrust of one of most effective progressive statemen

doesn't keep you up at night.

[PinkTiger]

5. Please. Kennedy is one of the last of the old-time politicians.

He knows how to curry favor and get what he wants. I don't trust him. You shouldn't either, and if you do, you are a fool.

[saltpoint]

8. You miss the boat if you're calling that DUer a fool, PinkTiger. If it's

fools you crave, may I suggest FOX News, the Republican Party, and Toby Keith?

[EFerrari]

16. I'm a fool then. You bet.

And a lucky one, to have witnessed the amazing public service of Ted Kennedy. He tells a good joke, too. :)

[saltpoint]

19. If you are a fool, sfexpat2000, I aspire to be as good a fool as that.

You stay on my map.

You've got the political vibe. You've got the poetic instinct.

And you're taste in music is merely flawless.

[EFerrari]

27. This thread has three recommendations.

lol

:hi:

[saltpoint]

28. Curly, Larry, and Mo.

:hi:

[countingbluecars]

37. Add Shep now as well.

[saltpoint]

38. help me out, countingbluecars. Shep is ... ?

[countingbluecars]

42. Whoops.

I meant Shemp. He was one of the stooges for a while.

[saltpoint]

44. LOL! Ok -- I just wasn't sure what was going on. For some reason I

had astronaut Alan Shephard in mind and couldn't for the life of me understand why you'd lump him in with the Three Stooges!

[PinkTiger]

6. Please. Kennedy is one of the last of the old-time politicians.

He knows how to curry favor and get what he wants. I don't trust him. You shouldn't either, and if you do, you are a fool.

[saltpoint]

3. O good lord.

[R_M]

4. Of course old Ted is doing just that.

That's what politics is all about.

[gateley]

7. At this point in Kennedy's life and career, I think he's past all that stuff. nt

[PinkTiger]

26. Ha! Don't kid yourself.

He will be politicking until the day he dies.

[aquart]

9. Stop that. Right now.

You have no clue what went on in Ted's mind. None.

And it doesn't matter anyway. It's how it's perceived. And that you will not change with posts like these.

It was a coveted endorsement. Hillary wanted it and didn't get it. Maybe Ted will regret that one day and maybe he won't.

But this does not help anything.

[PinkTiger]

12. Right. You watch.

Obama will be sorry, if he isn't already, for getting in bed with a Kennedy.

[CoffeeCat]

30. Why? What exactly are you saying...

...that Ted Kennedy wants from Obama?

This conversation really is a bit banal. It's like listening to code or something.

Enough, "Dogs barking at the moon. Meet under the lemon tree with wood blinds."

What's up?

[dailykoff]

10. Lots of people don't trust the Kennedys.

About 29% in fact.

[countingbluecars]

11. That's just silly. n/t

[PinkTiger]

14. It's all about Power.

You don't use it to lose it. You use it to gain more. I would like to know what part of his soul Obama had to sell to get the endorsement???

[Mme. Defarge]

13. As a person of honor

you will undoubtedly hold the same opinion of any politician endorsing any candidate at this stage of the game.

[PinkTiger]

17. You are right. I do.

The Kennedy endorsement has extreme weight, though; that is why it should not have happened. You notice that Jimmy Carter hasn't made this error; neither has Al Gore.

[Mme. Defarge]

22. Then, no doubt,

you will also be taking the governer of Oregon and others to task for their candidate endorsements.

[saltpoint]

24. If Randy Johnson is on my bench and the game is close, I want him

on the mound.

[CyberPieHole]

15. I like Ted Kennedy. He is not a perfect man, but his endorsement of Obama is a PLUS...

for Obama. No two ways about it. I have no idea what you think his "motive" might be, but I wouldn't be so paranoid. The endorsement is something Clinton and Edwards would have gladly accepted. Obama got it, I'm sure he is grateful.

[hogwyld]

21. How dare you make sense on GDP!! n/t

[sandnsea]

18. It was removed due to racial slurs

Some of the nastiest stuff I've ever seen.

[tularetom]

20. Out of curiosity just WTF do you think he wants?

I can't think of anything either of these candidates could offer him. Do you know something the rest of us don't?

[PinkTiger]

23. No, but I would also like to know.

And I wasn't making racial slurs. I was just pointing out how it looked to me and to some other people, how demeaning it was to Obama. That is all. I am not a fan of either Obama or Kennedy. I support another candidate. However, I do not like to see OLD STYLE politics used in this election. The stakes are so high, we have so much to lose.
It is important that no candidate is compromised in that fashion.

I also fear for anyone who aligns themselves too closely to Ted Kennedy. He can be poison for national elections.

[saltpoint]

29. I find your concern deeply moving.

[EFerrari]

31. When you say "old style politics", what do you mean? n/t

[HCE SuiGeneris]

39. Undefined terms and vague innuendo not good enough for you? Pffft!

:evilgrin:

[PinkTiger]

40. Years ago, I was involved in local party politics.

I was committee chair, and later a delegate for Jesse Jackson (The Rainbow Coalition)to the state convention. I had a lot of perceived power, but I didn't use it for anything. One old guy, who in years past had been quite an operative, when the central committee had some real clout and could get jobs for folks, went to my mother and complained that "Pinktiger just doesn't know how to use her power," blah, blah, blah. I was offended then but I know that I didn't really understand what I was supposed to do differently. I guess other people in my position would curry favor and get stuff for themselves and for others, and take credit, etc. I looked at it as a pure public relations job. My purpose was to raise interest and support candidates and get the statewide folks down to our county and region and to advance our cause.
But I know that there are people like the old guy, and like Ted Kennedy, and others, who know how to do it. But we should not stand by and allow it to happen to someone as fresh and new as Senator Obama. And by the way, I think Obama will make a great president some day. But NOW IS JUST NOT HIS TIME. I don't care what Kennedy says. And he knows it is not this man's time, and he is using him. It really pisses me off.

[saltpoint]

41. It doesn't seem to take much to piss you off, "It really pisses me off" you write.

My god. What are you like in a real crisis?

Younger people have often been leaders and often they've made very convincing ones.

Alexander was 19 when he became hegemon of Greece. He did just fine.

If you're going to play the agist card, you're going to need to eliminate from history the examples of people whose youth was not an impediment to greatness.

I don't think you can pull that off.

[PinkTiger]

46. You just say that because you are an apologist for Obama.

He isn't the second fucking coming.
He is just an untried Senator from Illinois with broad ambitions. He hasn't earned the right to run for President, in MY OPINION, For What it is WORTH.
I don't really care what you think.

[saltpoint]

48. I'm an Edwards supporter. I'm a Kennedy Democrat. It's ok with me

if you don't care what I think.

I like movies and good poems and enchanted gardens.

And SpiderMan.

[PinkTiger]

50. Ok, well in that case, I love you.

I like spiderman, too. LOL

[saltpoint]

53. LOL!

[PinkTiger]

51. My posts are duplicating.

[murielm99]

60. LOL!!!!

You think Obama survived Illinois politics and lives in Chicago without knowing or having something like that "happen" to him? Do you live under a rock?

Have you followed his career at all? He knows his way around.

I am involved in Illinois grassroots politics. I know how things can be done here.

I am not an Obama supporter either. It does not have much to do with the Obama supporters I see here, some of whom are very troll-like. It has to do with what I have seen of his campaign at the state level from his very early days, and to his votes, lack of votes, his positions and some of the things his campaign has done nationally. If he is the nominee, I will vote for him and work hard for him. That's politics. But Obama is no babe in arms.

If you didn't know how to use your power, you should have asked someone to help you. I see using grassroots power as the ability to raise money, back candidates and get them elected, and get your voice heard at higher levels. I know people in my state who concentrate on getting Democrats elected and appointed as judges. Others try to get Democrats into statewide elected positions, or onto county boards. As for getting jobs for people, why not? Why should all the people working at the courthouse be republicans? Why can't some of the people working at the DMV be Democrats? Certainly you know that the Hatch Act applies as soon as they get hired. They cannot talk about politics or do any advocacy on the job. Judges and other appointed officials cannot do anything political at all.

Is Teddy Kennedy breaking the law? Is there something criminal about him using his power to get people to run for office? Is endorsing Obama indictable? You are not making any sense.

Having political power is not a bad thing. I wish some of our Democrats in Washington were using their power right now to put a few republicans behind bars.

[EFerrari]

62. Welcome to the dirty kitchen of politics.

Politicans are power brokers. That's why people go into politics and that has been true for thousands of years. I'm afraid there is nothing "old" about it in the sense that most politicians are still politicians. They just try to find ways to improve on a very old sport.

That Senator Obama has been able to come this far shows he understands this. If he loses the nomination, he will still be more influential than he was before he ran. If he wins the nomination, he will be our next president. He's taken a good risk. He's an able politician.

Obama is a brilliant man. He'll be fine, with or without the Kennedy endorsement.

[grasswire]

25. he could want cooperation from Republicans...

...in order to get legislation passed. Other than that, I doubt he needs to trade anything for anything. Obama's a Democrat (isn't he?) so Ted doesn't need to leverage anything.

[Big Blue Marble]

32. So now Kennedy is "not pure."

Is there an archive hell for these silly posts?

Your first point: He already is a king maker. A very powerful force in Democratic politics
Your second point: He will be asking for support for a liberal agenda that I hope as a Democrat
you will support.

Next....

[fadedrose]

33. Here's part of a post I wrote the other day:

It's post #186,"You're Right" under the thread, "Hey,You" Mon Jan-28-08 12:32 AM

"One very poor sport was Edward Kennedy who lost the nomination several years ago. I'm old enough to remember Jimmy Carter on TV getting the nomination at the convention. Jimmy happily turned around to shake everyone's hands and when he got to Ted Kennedy, the Senator turned his back and refused to shake hands. I was shocked. I partly blame the poor record of the Carter presidency on Kennedy for not ever supporting President Carter. I haven't like him since.

"The real tragedy is not when some dems don't vote for the nominee, it's when the losing candidates don't ask these folks to throw their support to the winner."


Maybe Ted wants the Vice Presidency for somebody in his family....

[TriMetFan]

57. I'm surprised you are not getting kicked around

for your post. I too blame Ted for the mess he made in trying to challenge President Carter.

[sfam]

34. Wow...just wow...nt

[rodeodance]

35. Ted Kennedy's speech took us back in history-to a time past. A time of

many wonderful events--civil rights movement,a breaking out time for many (of course there was VN, etc). He did not take it forward. seemed to be yearning for that time again. just my thoughts on his speech.


But the whole production was just a bit much for me.

[saltpoint]

36. A toast to the third billy goat!

:toast: :toast: :toast:

[Catherine Vincent]

43. I think he's sincere in choosing Obama.

I respect Ted Kennedy a lot.

[saltpoint]

49. cat_girl25, I think you're right on both points.

[peacetalksforall]

45. I don't get what you're driving at. Though bubbles keep getting

burst for me (changes and leaning of the Clintons to top the list), I think there are some things to consider:

. The words Ted Kennedy and Caroline Kennedy used to compare him to those they knew is valid in their minds. Time will tell.

. Not endorsing Hillary Clinton could make plenty of sense, to him.

. I'm not happy with Kennedy at times, but most of the time he makes my heart soar when he fights for us.

. However, though he doesn't seem to hang out with the DLC the way Bill Clinton does, I feel he is a DLC sympathizer and perhaps a very important adviser.

. Anything DLC makes me feel angry and upset because I don't think there should be any approval of any kind for killing our kids and the people of a sovereign nation or nations in a phony, Republican war supported by Democrats on behalf of corporations and barons.

. I don't track his votes and I've always wished I had, but he fights for the lives of our common citizens while I see him as not being that strong against the war - which is the DLC position.

So again, I'm never getting 100% from anyone for what I believe in - life, peace, opportunity, trading fairly, rights, votes, our original Constitution, zero executive orders. Mostly allowing people to live and thrive and reach their high and lofty potentials. Most of the time I like his votes when I know what they are.

I am thrilled when he embarrasses and exposes the crimes of the Republicans as they attempt to trick the legislation process and the are all about taking away what is ours - their voters, also. They are one evil cross to bear - and their agenda is facilitated and aided by our own and we learn every day how Nader was right .

So, I can't even begin to think of a thing that would be malevolent enough for what you are inferring.

It can't be worse than Republicanism as we know it today.

[PinkTiger]

47. It is as bad as Republicanism, though.

Because now we have a chance, finally, to rise above all that. And I'm afraid we won't get to. Because if Obama does get elected, I will always feel that he has been tainted. He isn't his own man.

[peacetalksforall]

54. Well, I guess we are left with vaguery.

[EFerrari]

63. No one in a political network is "their own man". n/t

[ErnestoG]

55. Whats next? Kennedy as part of the Bilderbergs?

laugh.

[PinkTiger]

56. Well, you said it.

I think something is funny about it. That is all I will say.

[ErnestoG]

58. Funny how Hillarites so easily can turn on an elder Liberal congressman...

I guess they'd turn on their own mothers if it came down to lighting the votives to Hillary. Wow, that's pretty disgusting.

[Catherine Vincent]

59. You're racking up a lot of posts there.

And everyone of them have been insults. Nice.

[PinkTiger]

61. He's a Senator.

And he is far from the driven snow of liberal politics. You should do your homework and then come back to school, dog.

[flordehinojos]

64. i think obama served himself to ted kennedy on a silver platter.

[PinkTiger]

65. Exactly. But I think it was a bad move.

At the end of the day, his alliance with Kennedy will cost him big.
He will slink back to the ranks of the also ran.

[flordehinojos]

67. i hope so.

[Skip Intro]

66. It was a spiteful move toward the Clinton camp for not heeding his advice on how to run her campaign

and it's kinda sad, but you know if the Hillary camp had told Bill to act within certain TK approved constraints, this endorsement would never have happened.

call it what it is, a spiteful jab at the Clintons, not a heartfelt endorsement of Obama

He's really diminished in my eyes somewhat these last few days.


This isn't about endorsing the best candidate, this is about an ego-driven vendetta.


The sad part is, I thought Kennedy above such things.

[PinkTiger]

68. So did I.

But what goes around comes around, Karma and all that. He will be sorry, and unfortunately so will Obama. I think Obama already realizes he has erred in hanging out with the devil. I loved JFK and RFK but Teddy has always been....a disappointment.