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Gore endorsement did NOT hurt Dean....it shook the DC insiders and they targeted Dean.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 01:48 AM
Original message
Gore endorsement did NOT hurt Dean....it shook the DC insiders and they targeted Dean.
I have seen that talking point so many times. It is a way for the media to diminish both Gore and Dean, which they love to do. The only negative was that it scared them and the DC establishment, and they got better organized against him.

Here is a post by Jamie Wolf at Mother Jones. He was covering Dean's campaign at the time. The article is about Tom Vilsack, but it refers back to this aspect of Dean's campaign.

Lost in Iowa by Jamie Wolfe

You may not care about being accepted by the cool kids, but if you want to be on the cover of a magazine, or the subject of a serious article touting your chances, or if you want to be mentioned positively in serious conversations between the political professionals and the serious potential funders or bundlers, it is these people, consisting of influential media insiders (many of them barely known to the public) along with professional political operatives and big donors, who determine your eligibility. Without their approval, you can't play.

For a while it seemed Howard Dean might break this pattern. The Vermont Democrat, who, to be sure, had gone out of his way not to ingratiate himself with this group, was utterly dismissed by most of them until August 2003. Somehow they just hadn't been able to accommodate themselves to the notion that this outside-the-Beltway upstart had been raising big money independently of their opinion of him, and was actually closing on the front-runner slot. When they finally emerged from denial, the response was one of alarm and resentment, this was a threat to the natural order of things. It's no exaggeration to say that, by December 2003, Dean had the cool kids in a state of near panic.I know this because I was covering the Dean campaign at the time, and you could sense the bewilderment and upset felt by this group of insiders on behalf of another candidate, a candidate they believed was, almost by droit du seigneur, entitled to the 2004 Democratic nomination—a candidate with whom most of them had long-standing ties, the sort of cozy familiarity people get from living in more or less the same neighborhoods and vacationing in more or less in the same places.


There is more. The Gore endorsement instead of "hurting" Dean because Gore was not respected....ended up pitting the insiders against him. They got organized.

By December of '03, a subset of these people had figured out what John Kerry was apparently just coming to realize for himself: that his early support of the Iraq War, rather than being a prudent strategic move, had become a serious liability while Dean's outspoken opposition to it, far from getting him in trouble—a group of former Kerry and Gephardt staffers hoping to stir those embers were running ads in Iowa and South Carolina featuring Osama bin Laden's face morphing into Dean's—had turned out instead to be one of the strongest aspects of his campaign. So, with the Iowa caucuses looming, and—the final straw!—Al Gore having given Dean his endorsement, Kerry asked Al Franken to convene some of the group at Franken's New York apartment, so that Kerry could attempt to justify for them his aye vote on the Iraq War resolution the previous October.
Williams Rivers Pitt, then managing editor of the online newsletter truthout.org and now editorial director of Progressive Democrats of America, described the scene in a Truthout account the following week: "The crowd I joined in Franken's living room was comprised of: Al Franken and his wife Franni; Rick Hertzberg, senior editor for The New Yorker; David Remnick, editor for The New Yorker; Jim Kelly, managing editor for Time magazine; Howard Fineman, chief political correspondent for Newsweek; Jeff Greenfield, senior correspondent and analyst for CNN; Frank Rich, columnist for the New York Times; Eric Alterman, author and columnist for MSNBC and The Nation; Art Spiegelman, Pulitzer Prize winning cartoonist/author of Maus; Richard Cohen, columnist for the Washington Post; Fred Kaplan, columnist for Slate; Jacob Weisberg, editor of Slate and author; Jonathan Alter, senior editor and columnist for Newsweek; Philip Gourevitch, columnist for The New Yorker; Calvin Trillin, freelance writer and author; Edward Jay Epstein, investigative reporter and author; Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., who needs no introduction."


And the final touch, about the scream. Many were in a position to bring the truth out about the directional mic. They did not.

Perhaps most egregious of all, the sophisticated television and Internet people who'd been at Al Franken's lunch could have put the kibosh on the ridiculous Dean Scream business right away, and they didn't. It would have been abundantly clear to them that Dean was holding a crowd-filtering mike, which amplified his lost-in-the-noise shouts into the ravings of a madman—people such as Iowa Senator Tom Harkin standing close to Dean were mouthing words and cheers of which TV viewers could hear not a whisper. Instead the cool kids, who were on air and online at the time, let "the Scream" grow into the catastrophe it became, to the extent that Dean was finished off that night.


I get so angry when I see posts here implying that Al Gore hurt Dean with his endorsement. It is stooping lower than I expected DU to stoop, even as we keep lowering our expectations.

It was an event that shook the establishment. The feisty Vermont governor who came from nowhere was close to being the nominee, and it was an intolerable situation for them.

It did not hurt Dean, and the Gore endorsement if indeed it does come, would be good for Obama as well. Saying otherwise is just plain lying.





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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 01:53 AM
Response to Original message
1. Oh yes, it was the establishment
The establishment that wanted Clark though. Kerry had no help from the establishment, he had to borrow six million of his own money to keep his campaign going. Clark was supposed to take Kerry out in NH. Oops.

But yes, the Gore endorsement was turned against Dean in an orchestrated effort. Dean did stuck his own foot into it too, but at least half of it was dirty tricks politics.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. I am not sure who they wanted, but I know I Gore's endorsement was a coup.
And I have seen stuff here lately putting Gore down, like his endorsement was not important. If I have to revisit old wounds to show that it was an important endorsement, I will.

I agree, I don't know who they were trying to get in, so I left a lot of the article out.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 02:01 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. It's like Teddy endorsing Obama
He's getting a lot of the same establishment attacks that Dean got. I think the difference is that we already saw that act so it won't work anymore.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Let's hope. We are mostly wiser now.
I see some people in a whole new light now than I did several years ago. I see the people who surround them who do hit and run attacks on others with impunity. Can you say James Carville?
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 07:22 AM
Response to Reply #4
15. I would never put Gore down. I said I would defend Gore until I got banned from DU.
Send me a link to people putting him down, I'll put them in their fucking place.
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 01:53 AM
Response to Original message
2. .
Link to William Rivers Pitt post about that meeting, please?

Thanks. Very interesting, all of it.
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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #2
14. I remember reading it here a long time ago. Here it is:
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. Thanks! nt
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lligrd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 01:57 AM
Response to Original message
3. I Am Constantly Amazed At How Some DUers Still Refuse
to acknowledge that it was the Democrats themselves sabotaged Dean and helped lead to another Bush victory. I really hate to see them still making fun of the ridiculously overplayed and taken out of context "scream". It was a shallow attack and it helped lose the election for us.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 02:41 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. We could compare it to the Iraq war....
in a way. The way they are just not talking about. Just like they did not speak up back then.
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lligrd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 05:47 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. True. Another Thing That Gets Me
Edited on Mon Feb-04-08 05:47 AM by lligrd
is how so many talked about Gore's manner and stiffness, like that was important. I now support Obama but it has nothing to do with "change" or "hope" which are far to abstract for me. I must admit my vote for Gore is mostly about his inability to vote for the war resolution and Hillary's inability to say no to it when she could have.

My real choices would be Gore, Dean, Kucinich, in that order.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 02:14 AM
Response to Original message
7. Be sure to read the whole article. It covers how others were treated.
Well worth taking time to read.
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Hill_YesWeWill Donating Member (652 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 02:50 AM
Response to Original message
9. Even if gores endorsement did hurt dean, obviously a Gore endorsement would not hurt anybody now! nt
Edited on Mon Feb-04-08 02:50 AM by Hill_YesWeWill
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 02:52 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Gore was highly respected then as well.
It was his own party that used the endorsement to target Dean.
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Hill_YesWeWill Donating Member (652 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 03:34 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. well that's wrong! nt
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Califooyah Operative Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 04:06 AM
Response to Original message
12. bingo. nt
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ozone_man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
16. I agree with Jamie Wolfe.
It was a great endorsement, but had the effect of galvanizing DC insider efforts to take Dean down.

I think a Gore endorsement would be great, and it is a safe time to do so now, but it should have gone to Edwards, the only one who would have deserved it based on his superior environmental positions.

http://www.grist.org/candidate_chart_08.html

As it is, I could see him making an endorsement, but it would have to be made on other issues not environmental in nature. Both Clinton and Obama are for coal with 20% reduction in CO2 emissions, Obama is pro-nuclear, while Clinton is an "agnostic". I don't think he will endorse anyone based on that. It would send the wrong message at a time when he's trying to gather support for a green movement. An endorsement might make him look like a sell out, even if not made based on environmental positions.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
17. This is a pretty biased account
Kerry was hurt by his VOTE, not his "early support for the war." Two things hurt Kerry in 2003 - one was that he was diagnosed and treated for cancer. In addition to the fact that it took him a while to recover, this meant he missed the DNC take back America where Dean gave an impassioned anti-war speech. Kerry giving a speech there as well could have made it harder to distort his position.
The second was that mid year, the media stopped referring to Kerry as antiwar and started to label him prowar ignoring that he was a leading voice urging not going to war in the summer and fall of 2002 and that he spoke often of not rushing to war in the lead up to war and criticized the invasion ("regime change at home") when the invasion was still at 100% popularity.

This was a fair political tactic of the Dean people. Kerry did vote for the IWR and you look for advantages and use them. But Dean was not as clearly against the IWR as Obama was - he had said he would vote for Biden/Lugar, which was Kerry's preferred resolution. I never have yet to see a link to an October 2002 statement by Dean on whether he would vote yes or no on the actual IWR and he didn't have to vote. The difference between Kerry and Dean was nowhere near the difference between Obama and Clinton on that issue. Kerry was far more antiwar in speeches and in op-eds in 2002 and early 2003 than Clinton and Obama was far more antiwar than Dean was in fall 2002.

Kerry was able to convince many antiwar Democrats that he had not been for the war - I was one of them. I started as Dean or Kerry and ended up Kerry in January 2003. Iowa polls showed that I was not alone.





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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-04-08 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
18. I get angry when people claim Kerry was ESTABLISHMENT candidate when he was MOST ANTI-ESTABLISHMENT
candidate we ever had.

The establishment was totally against Kerry and would NOT DIRECT any money to his campaign at the most crucial final months before Iowa. Or do you people FORGET that Kerry was financing his own campaign the last two months?

The ESTABLISHMENT wouldn't have allowed 'THEIR' candidate's funds to dry up at that juncture.

Just because some writer wrote HIS VERSION of what happened DOESN'T CHANGE THE TRUTH.

Most of the journos convened in that Dec session were strong LEFTIES with only a few MSM who wanted in.

YOU know darn well that Kerry was targeted LONG BEFORE Dean was by the corpmedia - and no bullshit article filled with an asshat opinions is going to change that FACT!
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