Look, Clinton authorized the war. I can almost forgive that. But she DOES NOT TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.

[mudesi]

That's a deal breaker, people.

Whether or not Obama would have voted the same way (and there is no way of knowing) is utterly irrelevant. THIS IS NOT ABOUT OBAMA.

Hillary Clinton authorized the Iraq war. She, like all of the other "Democrats" who voted for it did so because she was afraid of looking weak, she was afraid that Iraq was going to be a great success and Democracy was going to take hold and they were going to throw roses at the troops and that afterwards the Democrats would look bad.

Let's say I choose to forgive that. Politics is politics, after all. Who cares that people were going to die? :sarcasm: At least she was thinking long term about keeping the Democrats from looking bad. :eyes:

But now, after all that has happened? John Edwards was big enough to admit he made a mistake. HILLARY CLINTON REFUSES TO DO SO.

This is who you want as your next president? Another lying, ego maniacal, politics-above-principle driven corporate shill? (Do you think all those donations from the health insurance lobby are from the goodness of their hearts? That they don't expect a return on such an investment?)

This is not about Obama. This is about Clinton. She can't admit her mistake, and that mistake, together with the other "Democrats", allowed George W. Bush to kill almost 4000 American troops, and over a million Iraqi citizens. That is unacceptable, and I'm discouraged and dismayed at the number of people who support her, not just here on DU (which is vomit inducing in its own right), but in the general population.

Had this woman simply had the courage to admit her role in Iraq, I would not be posting this right now. I may even have been a supporter.

Vote Obama on Super Tuesday.

[Dogmudgeon]

1. She will get jumped on either way. And you are one of the jumpers.

If she does 'fess up, a full 9-day cycle of criticism, guaranteed.

There is no way she will escape being hammered.

So much for solidarity.

--p!

[jasmine621]

27. She Did Take Responsibility for her vote. Where have you been.

When you say "I made the best decision based on the information at that time" you are taking resonsibility for what you did. How else do you take responsibility? By not being there to even vote?

[Proud2BAmurkin]

2. She said if she knew now what she knew then. That's all you're gonna get and you should be glad

weakness doesn't win

[rateyes]

4. Perhaps she would have known then what she knows now

if she had bothered to read the damned NIE before casting that dumbass vote.

[MoJoWorkin]

7. This is all she is going to get from me . I'm voting for Obama.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

9. So she knew a million people would die?

And I'm supposed to vote for that?

[derby378]

14. And the kid wins a cigar...

Bottom line: Hillary trusted Bush. You never trust a failed businessman and Skull and Bones frat boy with delusions of grandeur. It just doesn't work.

[elmerdem]

30. the problem is

she played off her vote as not authorizing the use of force, only inspections. I call BS. She damned well knew that it meant war, but won't admit it. That is called a BIG FAT LIE. Everyone who voted knew it meant war. Revisionist history makes its way to DU!

[derby378]

31. My point exactly

And Hillary trusted Bush. Not the sort of "experience" I want in a President.

[VolcanoJen]

13. Weakness doesn't win?

Nothing could possibly be weaker than handing Bush a blank check to go to war with Iraq.

It took courage and strength to stand up to the Bush/GOP warmongering and steamrolling.

You honestly think those who voted against the IWR are "weak losers"?

[mudesi]

17. Actually I shouldn't be glad

Because I don't want her to win. Not if politics is above principle.

[Arugula Latte]

26. That's funny. We here at DU knew what she SHOULD have known, and probably did know,

but pretended not to know to save her political viability. That has come back to bite her on the ass.

[redqueen]

3. Do you REALLY think this is going to sway anyone who's still undecided?

Seriously?

Cause... what... they just haven't realized this or agreed with you until just now?

*sigh*

[mudesi]

15. If they're still undecided...

...then yes!

[liberalnurse]

5. You would benefit by seeing your Priest.

He can help you find forgiveness. You seem to give this a lot of control over your life. I wish you well.O8)

[AndyA]

6. I did hear Hillary say it was a mistake to believe "this President."

Not an out and out apology or admission of a mistake, but I think Congress should be able to rely on what the President tells them. And when they discover that they can't, they should impeach him, but that's a whole other topic.

[Clintonista2]

8. Maybe her button was stuck...

[Straight Shooter]

10. Yeah, because that worked out real well for John Edwards.

The ones who demanded that he admit the mistake were the first ones to yell that he was pandering when he finally did admit it.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[RaleighNCDUer]

20. Not this one.

I happen to respect people that responsibility for their actions.

Edwards became my #3, after Gore and Kucinich.

Now, I'm wondering if it's worth the shoe leather to walk to the polls.

[LittleClarkie]

11. She takes responsibility. She just doesn't apologize.

Her stance is pretty close to Kerry's in that regard. I respect his decision to apologize and work against the war. And I can pretty much respect Clinton's stance as well.

It was about getting the inspectors back in and giving the president authority. She and he apparently underestimated how crazy Bush was to get this war started.

But I do wish I was in a state that will vote tomorrow. I would indeed vote Obama. But the game will likely be over by then. Still I will vote for him.

Nevertheless, I'd rather talk about what's going on now. The IWR was so 2002.

[RaleighNCDUer]

22. IWR was 2002. The war is NOW.

You can't pretend it is not relevant.

You might also note that Hillary didn't stand up and demand accountabilty from Bush the day after he 'overstepped his authority'. If fact, it took nearly 3 years before she saw in the polls that the public didn't really much like the war before she started talking out against it.

If it really was about inspectors she should have been howling about in in April '03.

[VolcanoJen]

12. It's definitely better to just be right from the beginning.

One of the many reasons I'm supporting Obama.

[Ravy]

16. When are YOU going to apologize for wanting to continue the

sanctions that were killing so many Iraqi children?

[mudesi]

18. Are you saying you were for the Iraq war?

I'm not understanding....

[Ravy]

19. No. I was for putting weapons inspectors in and using troops

if Saddam did not comply with the UN resolutions. The containment sanctions were inhumane.

[TexasObserver]

21. As I have said many times, Kerry and Edwards voted wrong, too

But they got right. Hillary has never gotten right, and never will.

They all did it for presidential ambitions, too, but at least Kerry and Edwards owned up to voting wrong and corrected the path they were on. She hasn't.

[BringBigDogBack]

23. kick

[CoffeeCat]

24. You can forgive her? I sure as hell can't. And never will!

I won't ever forget Hillary's "yes" vote on the Iraq war, because she
absolutely knew the neocons were selling us a disgusting pile of lies.

Look at this letter, to Bill Clinton when he was President. Signed
by Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, Bolton and other assorted neocons. They
demanded war with Iraq in 1998 . Bill Clinton said no.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm

Fast forward to the day Hillary votes yes. She stood on the Senate
floor and parroted the Bush talking points. She never ONCE mentioned
that these same neocons asked her husband for war--just a few
years ago. The same cast of characters had been looking for a way into
the Middle East for years.

Finally, with Bush at the helm--and most of them in power positions in
the Bush Administration--they capitalized on the fear of 9/11, and AGAIN
made their case for war with Iraq.

Hillary damn well knew the neocons had been pedaling this war for years.
She said nothing about the letter they sent her husband.

She could have said, "These same neocons presented this letter to my husband.
They've wanted this war for a long time. I think our country needs to take
a step back and really think about what this means. Let's not rush into war.
Let's talk about what's really going on."

Hillary Clinton said nothing. She did nothing. As a powerful Senator on the
Armed Services Committee, she damn well had the position, the power and the
insider knowledge---to at least make a case that we not go to war.

I will NEVER forgive her for that. I don't give a damn how she parses her vote, or
how she tries to explain it. That's all moot.

She knew. Hillary Clinton knew it was a lie even before it started.

[mudesi]

25. I said "almost"

:evilgrin:

[Deep13]

28. Clinton authorized the war?

Yeah, the Republicans and Bush had nothing to do with that.

If nominated, not flip-flopping on this issue will save our chances in November. On the other hand, someone who says he was against the war but has voted for every war funding bill since then was against it before he was for it. (Sound familiar? Of course not, we have no collective memory. :( )

[mudesi]

32. I'm tired of this

That is not the point and is nothing more than an excuse. And nice try bringing Obama up. Again, this is not about Obama.

She and all the other Democrats who voted for the war make a mistake, period.

And SHE CANNOT ADMIT IT.

[TheDonkey]

35. or vote FOR the war and AGAINST the funding, wtf?? political game much?

Obama didn't want soliders to go hungry and Hillary panders for votes in both cases.

[mudesi]

37. Not to mention the change in subject

Hillary Clinton's inability to admit she made a mistake has nothing to do with Obama. Nothing.

[ErnestoG]

29. Precisely. That's a very Bush-like quality.

[BootinUp]

33. She didn't pull the trigger. nt

[TheDonkey]

34. Take responsibility. Hillary fucked up.

Kerry should have admitted the same. BUSH was a disaster and should have showed remorse for giving him the authority and stop trying to cover with the "well at the time..." bullshit.

[ErnestoG]

36. Damn right. And she has a Bushlike stubbornness in refusing to admit it.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

38. One would have to ask Clinton if she is a hawk?

would she use war as Bush has done to consolidate power? This is the question. It is not just right wongers who are warmongers!