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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:04 PM
Original message
Tell the difference between Clinton foreign policy and Bush foreign policy...
After the Iraq War Resolution Vote, Kyl Lieberman, and voting AGAINST banning cluster bombs that kill and maim children I thought there would be some daylight. However, going down the rabbit hole I found this:

http://www.fpif.org/fpiftxt/4803



Hillary Clinton on International Law

Stephen Zunes | December 11, 2007

Perhaps the most terrible legacy of the administration of President George W. Bush has been its utter disregard for such basic international legal norms as the ban against aggressive war, respect for the UN Charter, and acceptance of international judicial review. Furthermore, under Bush’s leadership, the United States has cultivated a disrespect for basic human rights, a disdain for reputable international human rights monitoring groups, and a lack of concern for international humanitarian law.

...

Ironically, the current front-runner for the Democratic nomination for president shares much of President Bush’s dangerous attitudes toward international law and human rights...

...

For example, Senator Hillary Clinton has opposed restrictions on U.S. arms transfers and police training to governments that engage in gross and systematic human rights abuses. Indeed, she has supported unconditional U.S. arms transfers and police training to such repressive and autocratic governments as Egypt, Morocco, Saudi Arabia, Oman, Pakistan, Equatorial Guinea, Azerbaijan, Cameroon, Kazakhstan, and Chad, just to name a few.

Not only is she willing to support military assistance to repressive regimes, she has little concern about controlling weapons that primarily target innocent civilians. Senator Clinton has refused to support the international treaty to ban land mines, which are responsible for killing and maiming thousands of civilians worldwide, a disproportionate percentage of whom have been children...

...

She was also among a minority of Democratic Senators to side with the Republican majority last year in voting down a Democratic-sponsored resolution restricting U.S. exports of cluster bombs to countries that use them against civilian-populated areas. Each of these cluster bomb contains hundreds of bomblets that are scattered over an area the size of up to four football fields and, with a failure rate of up to 30%, become de facto land mines. As many as 98% of the casualties caused by these weapons are civilians.

...

She opposed UN efforts to investigate alleged war crimes by Israeli occupation forces and criticized President Bush for calling on Israel to pull back from its violent re-conquest of Palestinian cities in violation of UN Security Council resolutions.

...

Similarly, when Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and other reputable human rights groups issued detailed reports regarding Israeli war crimes during that country’s assault on Lebanon in the summer of 2006, Senator Clinton insisted they were wrong and that Israel’s attacks were legal.

...

Senator Clinton has also been one the Senate’s most outspoken critics of the United Nations, even appearing outside the UN headquarters in New York twice during the past four years at right-wing gatherings to denounce the world body. She has falsely accused the UN of not taking a stand against terrorism, even though terrorism has become – largely at the insistence of the United States – a major UN focus in recent years.

...

Senator Clinton’s hostility to international law and the UN system is perhaps best illustrated by her opposition to the International Criminal Court. In 2002, Senator Clinton voted in favor of an amendment by right-wing Senator Jesse Helms that prohibits the United States from cooperating in any way with the International Criminal Court, and its prosecution of individuals responsible for serious crimes against humanity, such as those responsible for the genocide in Darfur. In addition, this vindictive law also restricts U.S. foreign aid to countries that support the ICC.

...

Affronted that an important U.S. ally would be required to abide by its international legal obligations and that the United States should help ensure such compliance, Senator Clinton strongly condemned the decision.

...

A longtime supporter of Israel’s colonization and annexation efforts in the West Bank, Senator Clinton took part in a photo opportunity at the illegal Israeli settlement of Gilo last year, in which she claimed – while gazing over the massive wall bisecting what used to be a Palestinian vineyard – “This is not against the Palestinian people. This is against the terrorists.”

...

Though an overwhelming majority of Americans, according to public opinion polls, believe that human rights should be a cornerstone of American foreign policy, Senator Clinton has repeatedly prioritized the profits of American arms manufacturers and the extension of Washington’s hegemonic reach in parts of the world. Similarly, a Hillary Clinton presidency would simply be a continuation of the efforts by the Bush administration to undermine the UN Charter and the basic international legal framework in place for much of the past century.





http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/clinton-can-boast-wealth-of-earmarks-2007-06-13.html

Clinton can boast wealth of earmarks

By Roxana Tiron and Ilan Wurman

Posted: 06/13/07

Presidential hopeful Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.) has secured more earmarks in the fiscal 2008 defense authorization bill than any other Democrat except for panel Chairman Sen. Carl Levin (D-Mich.).

The bill contains about $5.4 billion in earmarks, or projects not requested by the Pentagon. With their slim majority, the Democrats on the panel claimed two-thirds of that sum. Clinton is among their more junior members.

By contrast, Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.), also a Democratic presidential candidate and Clinton’s rival for the nomination, has only one request in the defense bill.

Obama, who is not a member of the committee, made a request along with several other members for a Department of Education program for children with severe disabilities.


Clinton’s beneficiaries include defense giant Northrop Grumman, which secured $6 million for the AN/SPQ-9B radar; New York-based Telephonics, which won $5 million for a standardized aircraft wireless intercom system for the National Guard Black Hawk helicopter fleet; Plug Power Inc., another New York state company, which got $3 million for fuel cell power technology; and Alliant Tech Systems (ATK), which won $3.5 million for the X-51 B robust scramjet research.



So, can any Hillary support here defend any of this?




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Evergreen Emerald Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:05 PM
Response to Original message
1. If you seriously do not know the difference between Bush and Clinton
you have not been paying attention. I cannot believe you have been on DU and don't fuck*n know the difference between CLINTON AND BUSH. God, I am tired of these STUPID posts.

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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. It's not stupid, read the article. Tell me what you really think. There's
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 09:17 PM by Bread and Circus
a difference between what a candidate says and what they've actually done.

Prove me wrong.
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Evergreen Emerald Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Then, I am amazed you would support Obama, if that is your criteria
He says he has always opposed the war. Well, so have I, but I have done more about my opposition to the war than he has. And he has the POWER to DO something. I protest. I give money to causes that oppose the war. He TALKS about opposing the war AND HIS ACTIONS SHOW WEAKNESS, timidness, a finger in the wind before he acts to see which way the political wind blows.

Obama is all talk. Clinton ACTS.

You are full of BS.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. You haven't even read the source article because it's not about
the IWR or ongoing funding. It's not about Kyl Lieberman either.

It's about a bunch of other disturbing positions, votes, and stances Clinton has taken. There is a pattern.

Please, please read the source article. Tell me if it's bunk.
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neutron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. Krugman says Obama's Health policy is right wing
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #2
17. ok?
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. How is this related to the post? nm
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
3. Look she's not my choice but she's getting half the votes of the Dem Voters...
and we are gonna get stuck with her and we better hope Obama becomes her VP to get some new Policy Advisoes in there.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. So is Obama, that's not the point right now. The point is educating ourselves
about our candidates.
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. If you can get some of those here to listen.
Many of us who've been here know the dirt. Good on you for posting this for folks who don't know...but the reality is that there are those here who support her no matter what they find out...and in most cases they don't want to know... And, others of us who know we are going to have to hold our nose and vote for Clinton II but are hoping there's some way to reign them in.

So, thanks for your post. :thumbsup:
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. thanks... I'm kind of stressed right now. I can't believe we
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 09:26 PM by Bread and Circus
are close to nominating someone who doesn't seem that different from a neo-con. At least from the sound of the article it seems that way. I didn't know any of this stuff before today.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 08:15 AM
Response to Reply #10
18. Here's to hoping.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
4. Neo-con (Bush) vs Neo-lib (Clinton). The difference is about..
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 09:14 PM by Tierra_y_Libertad
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kelligesq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
6. Better yet, tell the difference between Clinton & Barack foreign policy
:rofl:
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Did you even read the article before you made a joke of people dying?
I don't think John Edwards would support Clinton's foreign policy positions. Do you? Do you even know what positions she takes? Do you even care?
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kelligesq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. My reading comprehension is excellent. Edwards said they had the same voting record on the war.....u
revising history?
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. This isn't just about the "Iraq War Resolution" or ongoing funding bills...
That's just one small piece in a string of disturbing positions Clinton has taken.

Please read the source article. Tell me if you think it is bunk.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
14. Clinton would not, on her own, engage in preemptive warfare. Though she might
get caught up in a tide of NeoCon bullshit as ANY Democrat would.

I think she puts on an act of being more hawkish than she is.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Did you read the source article in its entirety? It's not really
about the IWR.

I keep reading people's responses and they act as if the IWR is the only foreign policy issue out there. That's why I want to talk about this. The article goes far, far beyond one vote in 2003.
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
20. How about a Clinton/McCain ticket for the "old" Democratic party
Huckleberry/Paul on the repuke party ticket, and Gore/Obama on the new Democratic Party ticket.
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aint_no_life_nowhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 08:02 PM
Response to Original message
21. These are important things to know about her
I like several of her ideas on domestic issues. But her views concerning foreign affairs are very troubling, as seemingly as far to the right as the neocons. Voting twice on Joseph Lieberman-sponsored resolutions and with Jesse Helms is extremely troubling. Her criticism of the UN, the International Criminal Court, and the investigation of war crimes sounds like the positions of John Bolton. I agree with her support of Israel's right to exist. But she has expressed not one word of compassion for the civilians in the Palestinian territories. She will not be able to foster peace between Israel and Palestine with such a one-side position. While she might bring some change within the US, particularly with healthcare and the economy, I see her position on foreign relations as being simply more of Bush.
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