Super Tuesday was a referendum on Obama's Swiftboating of the Clintons on race,

[MethuenProgressive]

They knew Kerry's strongpoint was his military service and record of supporting the military and vets, and they knew they had to overcome that, so they Swiftboated him on that issue.
Obama knew the Clintons had a long and strong relationship with the African American community, and he needed to overcome that, so he Swiftboated the Clintons on race.
It worked like a charm in South Carolina.
On Super Tuesday voters had a chance to either reject the argument that the Clintons are racists, or to endorse Swiftboating as a Democratic tactic.

It's a shame more voters didn't reject Obama's argument.

[stray cat]

1. or vote for the candidate they supported

[rodeodance]

12. Th Gobama drinking the Kool-aid icon in the IP is great. Says it all.

[mckeown1128]

2. What exactly did Obama do to swiftboat the Clintons?

Do you have a quote or a link to something or are you just making this up?

[Botany]

8. Barack Obama crept into Bill Clinton's hotel room and drugged him ......

.... which made Bill Clinton bring up Jessie Jackson ( a black man ) so as
to demean Obama's win in South Carolina.

The poster has an agenda.

[mckeown1128]

11. lol......nt

[rodeodance]

14. moking the post does not make it any less truthful.

[mckeown1128]

36. I didn't mock the post.

I am asking for facts instead of opinions. No facts = No assumption of truth

[rodeodance]

46. post LOL is enough for me.

mckeown1128 (1000+ posts) Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list Thu Feb-07-08 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. lol......nt

[MethuenProgressive]

24. Tell us, how is using the term "Fairy Tale" proof that Clintons are racists?

:shrug:

[Dawgs]

35. When did Obama say that the Clinton's were racists?

:shrug:

[berni_mccoy]

3. Time to Use the Ignore Button again...

The OP has crossed the line of reason...
:crazy: :eyes: :crazy:

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[rodeodance]

6. Why not address IP argument?--instead of trying to brush it under the rug?

[Nederland]

41. Because the IP has no argument

The IP merely asserted that the Clinton's were swift boated. No proof was offered, so there is no argument to address.

[rodeodance]

5. I think there is some truth to your post.

It's a shame more voters didn't reject Obama's argument.

[John Q. Citizen]

53. Yes, it's a shame all the political futures markets are now predicting an Obama win.

It's a shame that the American public is rejecting Clinton.

It's a shame that even though she started with all the money, all the name recognition, and got the lions share of every single debate leading up to Iawa, that people just don't much like or want her to be the nominee, or the president.

Cry me a river baby. Do you want me to call you a waaaambulance?

[islandmkl]

7. 'swiftboated' (v.): (orig.) to take a fact and turn it completely opposite its basis.

(designed by Karl Rove, propagandist, 2004). Example: "John Kerry had a strong record of military service, but was swiftboated by opponents to make him appear weak on military matters." Erroneous usage: "After injecting race into a political contest against a minority opponent, the white candidate claims she was 'swiftboated' when the minority opponent defended himself against her attacks."

[Bluerthanblue]

9. oh, Yes- there was 'swiftboating' going on- but it FAILED- and

that is why those who tried to minimize the reality that Obama IS African American, and manipulate his popularity -
LOST- in their plan to doom Obama.

It's a shame, that those who attack, and fail, cry 'victim' and expect people to fall for it.


peace~

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[rodeodance]

13. Try engaging IP argument --

[lakercub]

62. that's the fourth time I've seen you say this

and you've sounded more ridiculous each time. The OP said that Obama swiftboated the Clintons...but offered no evidence, examples, or anything else with which to debate the point. So stop asking people to address the opening post. It is unaddressable because it is devoid of content. If you want so desperately to fight it out, then you tell us what the hell the OP is talking about...no one else can seem to figure it out.

[bigtree]

15. you, yourself, used the 'kool-aid' analogy to attack someone for their views

here (for one. I stopped looking when I found this) http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3724463&mesg_id=3724951

[MethuenProgressive]

16. "If I do it, it's OK, but if you do it, you're out of line."

:shrug:

[Bluerthanblue]

30. if you think that someone is doing something wrong-

and use their action as an excuse to do the same wrong-

that still makes YOU




WRONG



or is this just not something you can understand?

If something is wrong- don't do it. period.


peace~

[MethuenProgressive]

18. This is the fourth or fifth time this DUer has told me I'm on ignore

:rofl:

[zabet]

50. Jim Jones' cult used Flavor Aid.

So the logo does not make fun
nor link Obama to Jim Jones and
the death of the people involved.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Jones

"Jones' instructions to commit "revolutionary suicide" by drinking cyanide-laced grape flavored Flavor Aid<6><7> (often misidentified as Kool-aid) along with a sedative. Children are given the drink first and families are told to lie down together. The mass suicide was practiced in simulated events called "White Nights" on a regular basis. Others died by forced cyanide injection or by shooting. A total of 167 escaped."

[xmas74]

80. That's because Flavor Aid is cheaper.

I only had Kool Aid as a treat. For day to day drinking I had Flavor Aid, heavy on the water and light on the sugar.

[MethuenProgressive]

83. Obama's charging for his. Jones gave his away...

So don't anyone ever say I said Obama was like Jones.

[BeyondGeography]

17. You've lost it

RIP, MP's brain.

[MethuenProgressive]

19. Tell us, how is some Clinton guy in NH mentioning coke proof the Clintons are racists?

:shrug:

[Dawgs]

37. I don't know. When did Obama or his campaign call the Clintons racists?

And please provide links.

[Atman]

20. "It's a shame more voters didn't reject Obama's argument."

It's a shame you posted such unsubstantiated, subjective, 100% crap just for the sake of starting message board fights.

:eyes:

.

[MethuenProgressive]

21. Tell us, how is HRC's mentioning of MLK and LBJ proof the Clintons are racists?

:shrug:

[BeyondGeography]

22. Show us your link of Obama saying that

"Unfortunate and ill-advised" is what he said after many days of not even commenting. And the next day he complimented both Clintons for their lifelong commitment to equal rights and civil rights, to make sure that the campaign did not become all about race.

That equals "swiftboating on race" in your book?

Get a grip.

[MethuenProgressive]

28. Here is a link to "Obama's Camp's Memo on Clintons' Politicizing Race"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/12/obama-camps-memo-on-clin_n_81205.html

[BeyondGeography]

32. A factual recitation of their own words and those of their surrogates

Still waiting for anything resembling swiftboating on race.

[MethuenProgressive]

34. ""Folks are beginning to wonder..."

The Obama camp did not return repeated requests for comment. But campaign spokesperson Candice Tolliver told Politico that, in regards to the race-based comment: "Folks are beginning to wonder: Is this really an isolated situation or is there something bigger behind all of this?"

Sorry to use this stooge's words against her, but an isolated incident or three of crying Racism! over words like "youth" or "cocaine" is one thing. But to cry it all the time, over almost anything, just before the SC primary? There is something bigger behind all that.

[Dawgs]

40. So you have zero proof that Obama or his campaign ever called the Clintons racists.

Go away, you're embarrassing yourself.

[Bluerthanblue]

43. you've hit the problem with the IP right on the head- It is

impossible to prove, because it didn't happen.

peace~

[Dawgs]

38. Again, show us where Obama or his campaign said that the Clintons are racists.

[Occam Bandage]

23. If you keep saying it, it will become true.

[MethuenProgressive]

25. Tell us, how is Andrew Cuomo's use of "shuck and jive" proof the Clintons are racists?

:shrug:

[Occam Bandage]

26. Tell us, how is Jesse Jackson Jr's mention of Hurricane Katrina proof that Obama called

the Clintons racist?

[Bluerthanblue]

27. can you imagine

Cuomo using the "shuck and jive" phrase when refering to Chris Dodd? or John Edwards?

[Bluerthanblue]

31. hello??- ....

can you hear me?

1...2....3.... testing-


can you?

[MethuenProgressive]

33. That's your proof that the Clintons are racists?

:shrug:

[Bluerthanblue]

39. no- that is my question to you

to illustrate how it is not too difficult to see the racial undertone in this supposedly "innocuous" comment.

Do you deny it?

[NorthernSpy]

63. the point is that their strategy was to define Obama to whites as "The Black Candidate"...

... thus taking a leaf from the GOP's so-called Southern Strategy for tapping into racial fears among the subset of white voters who might be susceptible to such appeals.


Whether or not the Clintons are or are not racists "at heart" is not really the issue, because the state of their souls in none of my concern. My focus is on what they do -- and what they did was to use race-baiting to gain an advantage in an election.

[madrchsod]

29. what arguement?

[Bluerthanblue]

42. Challenge to you MP-

prove to ME that the Obama Campaign has called the Clintons "Racist".

[MethuenProgressive]

44. OK...

"BARACK OBAMA CAMPAIGN CALLS BILL CLINTON A RACIST"

[BeyondGeography]

48. Wille Geist and Donna Brazile, neither of whom are associated with Obama

And, BTW, way to use a Youtube title to back up your non-point.

[Bluerthanblue]

49. since when

has Donna Brazille become "Obama's Campaign"?

Can you address this comment from a Hillary campaign worker?:

"If you have a social need, you're with Hillary. If you want Obama to be your imaginary hip black friend and you're young and you have no social needs, then he's cool."

[Thrill]

45. I call BS. He had huge gains in every voting block

Nothing to do with race.

[flyinzamboni]

47. I think you missed the point

Super Tuesday was about the Democratic party having impressive turnout as people supported their candidates. Our party dwarved the opposition in terms of who attracted more people to the polls. This was not a referendum on one point between false choices that you frame, but a chance to vote for the person you believe will be the best next president of the United States. I strongly reject your framing of Super Tuesday.

You do a disservice to Democrats and their message by just implying the Obama supporters are just "drinking the koolaid" with your repeated Obama graphics. You are effectively attacking people within your own party for the decisions they make. They likely have very similar views with you on many issues but have slightly different priorities and make a different decision on who to vote for in the primary.

I voted. As did millions of others.

I think an inspirational candidate is a good thing. I think it is great that people in both the Clinton camp and the Obama camp are passionate about their candidiates.

You may not like Obama. You may not like his stance on the issues. You may support a different candidate. And that is fine.

I supported Obama in the primary and will happily support either Obama or Clinton in the general election. The supposed "race" issue had nothing to do with my vote either way.

Attacking others for their beliefs in an immature way is, quite simply, immature and really only works to make you look like a jerk with whom no one except other trolls want to deal. If you would like to have a substantive discussion on this beyond just a few talking points or phrases, I would be willing to do so.

[workinclasszero]

51. Bill and Hill shot themselves in the foot...

Oh you mean when Bill Clinton said a black man as President was a "fairy tale"?

Or was it when Hillary said LBJ was greater than Martin Luther King?

Or was it when Bill said it was no big deal that Obama won SC, after all so did Jesse Jackson??


Yup the Clinton's swift boated themselves!!:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

[MethuenProgressive]

54. BINGO! A victim of Swiftboating just posted!!

Oh you mean when Bill Clinton said a black man as President was a "fairy tale"?

Or was it when Hillary said LBJ was greater than Martin Luther King?

Or was it when Bill said it was no big deal that Obama won SC, after all so did Jesse Jackson??

There you have it. False statements, believed to be true, and repeated to smear the opposition.
That there folks, defines "Swiftboating".
Thank you, zero.
Don't blame yourself, for you've been had by people much, much, much, smarter than you.

[Bluerthanblue]

56. no false statements here at all- what is posted is

one INDIVIDUAL's opinion.

Pure and simple-

YOU MP are using this entire post to smear Obama with false statements that are repeated in order to smear your opposition-

YOU are a SWIFTBOATER-

when asked for FACTS that back up your claims, you offer none.

Stop and do some self-inventory ok? you may not like what you discover.


peace~

[Cameron27]

57. Those comments definitely are smears,

but who knows whether the poster's been had, or whether he's just in the habit of posting distortions.

[MethuenProgressive]

59. I give the poster the benefit of the doubt,

never blame the victim of a scam for being scammed.

[Blue-Jay]

52. Swiftboated! Swiftboated! Swiftboated! Swiftboated!

[Kolesar]

74. Methuen should quit sniffing airplane glue for 30 minutes before posting...eom

[MethuenProgressive]

78. That's a drug reference, right? So, you're a racist for using it... according to you.

:shrug:

[Kolesar]

79. lame...eom

[MethuenProgressive]

81. "lame" isn't very politically correct, Bore.

n/t

[in_cog_ni_to]

84. ZING!!!!!!! Man, that one couldn't have played out any better than it did!

:rofl:

I didn't know ONLY black people sold drugs. Maybe someone should tell that to the WHITE guy down the street that sells pot.

[Abacus]

55. Can you provide a quote

of Obama accusing or implying the Clintons of racism? This is my fifth time asking, so far, no response.

[MethuenProgressive]

68. "This is my fifth time asking," Under what other names?

:shrug:

[Abacus]

69. This one, save once on another site. Keep deflecting, though. /nt

[MethuenProgressive]

71. Welcome to DU.

Google.

[Abacus]

72. I have "Googled". I researched the issue before supporting Obama.

But deflect some more. And thanks for the welcome.

[NorthernSpy]

58. In other words, the Clintons tried to use Obama's race against him, and it backfired.

Which makes Bill and Hillary victims, somehow -- at least in your mind.


:eyes:

[MethuenProgressive]

60. Tell us, was Billy Shaheen Right, Wrong, or Racist?

:shrug:

[NorthernSpy]

64. Tell us, are you being disingenuous, very disingenuous, or off-the-charts disingenuous?

:shrug:

[MethuenProgressive]

65. He was Right, not Wrong, and most certainly not Racist.

But it was framed as racism, and used to Swiftboat the Clintons on race.

[stillcool]

67. Billy Shaheen?

This guy?

Billy Shaheen Apologizes
12 Dec 2007 08:32 pm
The Clinton campaign has released this statement from NH co-chair Billy Shaheen:
“I deeply regret the comments I made today and they were not authorized by the campaign in any way."
http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/cgi-bin/mt/mt-tb.cgi/18093

http://www.samefacts.com/archives/hrc_/2007/12/a_liar_needs_a_good_memory.php

[MethuenProgressive]

70. Yeah.

This guy:

He resigned from the campaign in December 2007 after stating that Clinton opponent Barack Obama might be less electable because the press might wonder if Obama, who is black, had sold drugs in college. (Obama had acknowledged using drugs when he was younger, describing it as a mistake.) "It'll be, 'When was the last time? Did you ever give drugs to anyone? Did you sell them to anyone?'", he said.

That's not a racist comment.

[stillcool]

73. I am certain that you find...

none of the comments the Clintons or their campaign has had to retract as being 'racist', or in any way derogatory. Unfortunately there is a large part of the population that does not share your observation, nor your own use of language to prove your point. You are obviously familiar with how words are used to distort and create division. Why would anyone attempt to explain to you, how much this campaign has brought up some very ugly memories of horrid intolerance, when you yourself indulge in hammering home the racist commentary on a daily basis?

[MethuenProgressive]

75. Anyone else think Billy Shaheen's comment was racist?

:shrug:

[ieoeja]

61. So you're saying the Republics did NOT use a southern strategy?

You keep asking how "insert quote" proves Clinton was appealing to racism. That is the exact same argument the rightwing has tried making the last four decades. Perfect example:

Q. How does Ronald Reagan announcing the start of his campaign in Philadelphia, MS make Reagan racist?

A. Philadelphia, MS is famous for exactly one thing: the murder of three civil rights activists, an all white juries refusal to convict in defiance of overwhelming evidence, and the murderer subsequently bragging about the killing.

But, but, but, how do we KNOW that is why Reagan opened up his campaign there? We don't. You are just claiming to read Reagan's mind if you claim you do know that.

Everyone knows that is a boatload of shit. Everyone understood the symbolism perfectly well. But because Reagan wasn't going around referring to African-Americans as "niggers", he and his supporters could pretend otherwise.

Which is exactly what you are doing right now. Clinton used symbols and code words to appeal to racists. And you know it. But you are going to pretend you do not. You know it. I know it. Probably every single person reading the IP knows it.

Which is why I K&R this thread. I am ieoeja. And I approve of this message. Because it makes your side look bad.

[MethuenProgressive]

66. Quoting ieoeja's post above - "Clinton used symbols and code words to appeal to racists."

"Clinton used symbols and code words to appeal to racists."

Nice Obama avatar in your post, ieoeja.

[Obamaniac]

76. Hate to break this to ya...

It was the Clinton's who played the race card and it was the Clinton's who played the sex card.

[MethuenProgressive]

77. Welcome to DU.

Who told you that?

[in_cog_ni_to]

82. Ever read a newpaper? No?

I didn't think so. That was all designed and fabricated by Obama.