Bill Clinton was a Cult Leader and our party still suffers for it.

[JVS]

People loved him, he screwed us all over. The last half of his administration was spent having his loving pawns defend him through his scandals. He left office and we had nothing left. 1993-2001 The Democratic party drank the Koolaide and the effects linger on to the point where his wife wants a turn to mismanage the country. We are like some kind of Soviet Union that didn't even have the XX party congress and destalinize

[JI7]

1. we lost congress and it was mostly gridlock with fighting over scandals

i want to get something done.

[NMMNG]

2. Don't you have some poor people to attack?

:shrug:

[JVS]

3. Don't you have a baby to eat.

[NMMNG]

5. Atheists eat kittens, not babies

But that's beside the point.

It's not nice to wish people on SS might be so destitute they would have to live on cat food, you know.

[JVS]

8. That was targeted at an old person who assumes that just because their ass is wrinkled it makes...

them smart.

Nothing against the poor, just wishing the curse of poverty on someone who sucks.

[NMMNG]

26. Wishing poverty on anyone is vile regardless of the provocation.

And I don't agree that older people are automatically smart but there have been plenty of assumptions being thrown around here by younger people too. I'm sort of caught in the middle myself as I'm not quite a member of either group.

[JVS]

30. It was meant to be vile.

I think we're about the same age actually. And in the exchange where I said the whole 'I hope you have to eat catfood' I was pissed off about several things. A. That this person looks at the avatar and assumes that I am very young
B. That this person assumes that those who are young know less than they've forgotten
C. That young people have no place telling the party their wishes. Especially considering that this is a party that has FAILED so tremendously over the last few decades. Sorry but I really don't think people who nominated Mondale and Dukakis have much business telling others who to pick.

Being taunted for being young, I naturally went after my older adversaries by invoking the danger, especially when one has supported "democrats" who slash funding to such programs as SS, of dire poverty in the near future. Was it a terrible thing to say? Yes. That was the point.

Same thing about eating babies. I just tossed it out as calumny in return for your accusing me of attacking the poor.

[NMMNG]

36. Nobody, young or old, has any business telling others who to pick

I'm as sick of this notion that young people don't know WTF they're doing and are all voting for Obama as I am of the "old people are all voting for Hillary because they're afraid of change". There's been so much bull flying around here (including some perfectly outrageous insinuations that the older people just need to die off so the younger ones can take over) that I just want to scream.

It's not an age thing, an income thing, a gender thing or any other of those stereotypical little notions people are trying to make it. People of all groups are voting for both candidates.


Anyway, enough about that.

[JVS]

37. I think it's time to go back to the lounge

see you there

[NMMNG]

40. I don't visit the lounge

Thanks anyway.

[Yuugal]

38. link?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. They Would Be Attacking Gays But The Chelsea Boys Spend A Lot Of Time In The Gym

~

[The_Casual_Observer]

4. More Obamaesq/freeper rewriting of history

[JVS]

6. Was he not the great triangulator? Third way? None of this rings a bell?

[The_Casual_Observer]

9. Rings a lot of bells on free republic. Not here until Obama came along.

[JVS]

16. Oh right, nobody ever complained about triangulation here until obama

and it is the freepers who were most upset with Clinton's failures to pursue a liberal agenda.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

20. What's The Difference Between Triangulation And Trying To Make "Nice" With The Republicans?

~

[JVS]

24. here is the difference

We have to be able to function with the Republicans because, sadly, there is no way not to. We will never have the power to just say "Fuck you, we're doing X, Y, Z" At some point compromises must be made. Triangulation is when you take a fraction of your party and push the opponent's need for votes over the edge. The goal is to get a few of them to come to your side, so that you still call the shots.

[jackson_dem]

28. So the difference is only in the labeling

Both require giving things up to the rethugs to get bipartisan support.

[JVS]

32. Have you ever negotiated a thing in your life?

[jackson_dem]

33. Yes. I also haven't hid behind labeling to make folks thing I am different than a rival

[jackson_dem]

29. None but Barack won't admit it

[jackson_dem]

27. Barack Obama has said in his book that Clinton's policies were undeniably progressive

(Which means he agrees with the general tenor of them!)

[JVS]

31. I reserve the right to disagree with Obama

[jackson_dem]

34. It shows what kind of president he will be

The fact Obama thinks Clinton was progressive speaks volumes about his political views and what kind of president he will be. You can think Clinton was progressive but you can't seriously think Clinton was a centrist while Obama is a progressive. They are the same. Either Obama is a centrist in the DLC tradition or Bill Clinton was a progressive all along.

[Spider Jerusalem]

35. Gee, that's funny

I remember people on DU calling Bill Clinton 'the best Republican president we've even had' since 2002 (and being very critical of his record on trade, welfare, and the the environment, not to mention the responsibility he bears for the rightward shift of Democratic politics in the past 2 decades). Maybe you weren't paying attention? Or maybe you just have a selective memory?

[Armstead]

10. If it were not so, why did the GOP gain so much?

If Clinton had helped to build a strong Democratic Partry, Gore would have won....Or at least the Democratic Party would have have enough strength and backbone in Congress to keep Bush in a corner.

Not to mention the support Clinton gave to the "free marketeers" who helped hollow out the economy and gave corporations unsurpassed power during and after the 90's.

P.S. Most of the discontent here with the Clintons is from the left. Why not give the Freeper mantra a rest? Disagree if you want, but don;t totally mischaracterize people.

[The_Casual_Observer]

12. The latest "irrefutable" Obama "it's all Clinton's fault bullshit".

buzz off

[Armstead]

15. I assume you don't read liberal and progressive press much

Nor have you been reading them since the early 90's.

[Whisp]

14. clinton was distracted by other bushes in other corners.

what a weak one he was.
Leader of the world, distracted by his prickie.
yah, confidence and all that.

[JVS]

25. That's part of the cult identity talking

The Clinton cult labors under the delusion that all criticism of them is de facto reactionary and couldn't be from the left. Thus complaining about something like nafta, or welfare reform, or waging war in the Balkans becomes freeperish by their sick logic.

[HughMoran]

11. I can't figure out who you are arguing for?

Do you not see the conflicting message in your post?

[JVS]

17. You mean that we can't trust any charismatic leaders?

[HughMoran]

19. No, you made an implication beyond "charismatic" and you can't now back away from it

Your post is self-contradictory :rofl:

[JVS]

21. Explain. Your interpretation only makes sense to me if one assumes both Obama and BC are cult..

leaders.

[HughMoran]

23. Never mind

If you can't see the roll-your-eyes hypocrisy relative to why you indeed posted this topic in the context of what is going on here lately, then there is nothing I can say to you to convince you otherwise. I've yet to see an Obama supporter admit they were wrong :headbang:

[Straight Shooter]

13. I didn't love him. I thought he was okay. Made some mistakes, no doubt.

What were the 3-word chants, though, at his rallies? Do you remember? You have to have chants in a cult, because repetition reinforces loyalty.

Were there people crying at his rallies? I don't remember that.

Believe me, if Bill's supporters had any of the earmarks of a cult, it would have been all over the media like white on rice.

Your post is ridiculous.

[niceypoo]

18. I am sure you were right there with your hero Ken Starr

I am curious how "he screwed us all over"

His, "scandals" were non existant, hense Ken Starr's resorting to peeking into bedroom windows for something to slime him with.

Why dont you admit that the Obama "cult" talk has you pissed off so you feel you have to project it onto Clinton?

So when do you start the 'Unity' and the 'Hope?'

[Guaranteed]

22. Yup- the DLC- the DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP CULT. nt

[Straight Shooter]

39. That's lame.

Barack is sure an inspiring fellow. Look at all the cheerful optimism in his followers.

New York Times had an editorial on Barack, called "Divide and Conquer." With friends like Barack in the Democratic party, who needs enemies?