What the hell is going on? How can this be happening in THIS country? Super Delegates to Hillary?

[Nimrod2005]

I am getting the sense that even if Obama wins more states and more delegates from us the people, the Clintons will be able to do private deals with various SD to get them to support her?

The explanation being given is that people owe Bill from the 1990s, party insiders...etc. Hillary can exchange favors...etc.

If my district was won by Obama and I support Obama (even if I didn't), BUT my Congressman gave his delegate to Hillary, would I not vote him out of office?

What is wrong with these people? Will there be lawsuits allover the country? Dems vs. Dems?

I guess if it goes down the way I am hearing, the Democratic party will be finished, right? because 50% of the party voters would have been shit on by so called party loyalists? or insiders?

Am I missing anything here?

[madeline_con]

1. Te repugs are supporting this.

They know Obama can beat them, but too many sexist GOPers will never change their ways and vote for a woman. It's in the bag. There, I said it. :hide:

[GoldieAZ49]

19. you have to be kidding, the republicans have nothing to do with how the

super delegates in the democratic party vote.

Good Grief, buy a clue!

[madeline_con]

37. The repugs are going to win the election.

By hook or crook, it will happen. They're not about to give up the power they've biilt up over the last two cycles.

[neutron]

2. why do you have that giant logo. it's offensive just like these stupid threads

[Nimrod2005]

21. I am a Giants fan!

[maddiejoan]

3. How should Kennedy and Kerry vote?

seeing that their constituents seem to have spoken for Hillary?

[stillcool]

5. maybe you should check out...

the Congressional Districts...mine went for Obama.

[maddiejoan]

10. I'm fairly sure

that Kennedy and Kerry are Senators.

[stillcool]

24. and what does that have to do....

with congressional districts, and delegates?

[maddiejoan]

26. Senators

represent an entire State.

[stillcool]

31. They vote for nothing...

[Nimrod2005]

6. I would think they have to represent the views of their constituents, no?

[maddiejoan]

9. Massachusetts

went for Clinton.

[Nimrod2005]

13. I know silly

[karynnj]

28. Not 100% - from what I heard a lot of the Democratic party establishment

(not the elected politicians) when for HRC. If that is so, shouldn't they follow the percentage split - not all side for HRC. I know some of the Congressmen also went for her.

I actually think the super delegates should not vote period.

In NJ, almost the entire political elite was for Clinton - clearly HRC will get a larger percentage that she got in the state.

[stillcool]

34. maybe this will help you?

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/county/#MADEM

[Zueda]

40. I believe I saw that even if the delegates were evenly divided,

as they most likely would be if each went with their constituents, then neither would have enough to be beyond the required threshold (compounded by the lack of delegates from FL and MI). Also, we need to consider that not all SDs are elected. It seems the only fair way to deal with this is to have all SDs go with the one with the most elected delegates.

[still_one]

14. You are correct, though personally I cannot understand why we have superdelegates /nt

[Windy]

33. well, let see, almost 40% voted for Obama.... out of all the superdelegates some should go to Obama

if they are divided based upon election results!!

[Tennessee Gal]

Yes, you are missing something.

HURRY, HURRY and change your name to DIMrod.

[paulk]

32. not really...

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/nimrod

[Adsos Letter]

4. ...hey...look at the whole "electoral college" thing...

there are ways to spin an election that have nothing to do with voting machines...and I understand, you are not talking about voting machines here...

Representative government is representative until it decides not to be...

[Snarkoleptic]

7. The machine is consolidating power...welcome to Chicago-style politics.

[seafan]

8. Nope, you are right on, Nimrod2005. It's all about these superdelegates overrriding The People.

See this thread.

[CoffeeCat]

11. Contrary to all of the hoopla....

...Here is exactly what is going to happen.

One candidate will definitely get more delegates at the end of this contest.

The Super Delegates will fall in line and their votes will go to the candidate
who garnered the most delegates.

Period.

The rest is just noise. Or wishful thinking. Or mind fucking.

At the end of the day, the Super Delegates are elected officials or other high-level
Dems. They will not usurp the will of the people.

It's just not going to happen.

I think the Clinton camp is generating a lot of buzz---in an attempt to do psy-ops on the delegates.
Not only are they being strong-armed, cajoled and intimidated--they are getting the message, that they
should stand their ground and put personal favors and payola ahead of the will of "We The People".

The Clintons (and Obama doesn't do this) openly counts their Super Delegates and claims they are way
ahead. It's psychological leverage, sending the signal to ALL Super Delegates, "SEE! We're going to win!
The other Super Delegates are committing to us early, and you damn well better fall in line too, or we'll
never for get it when we HOLD THE KEYS TO THE KINGDOM!".

See how that works?

It's utter bullshit.

Don't even worry about this chatter. Whoever gets the most delegates, the Super Delegates will throw their
support to. No way will our party rip itself to shreds, kow towing to the Clintons.

It's just not going to happen.

[Nimrod2005]

16. "mind fucking."

I hope you are right

[CoffeeCat]

25. The Clintons are playing such games...

...with the Super Delegates--distorting democracy if you ask me.

Just let these Super Delegates alone. Quit lobbying them, and asking for
this pre-commitment bullshit, so you can have another "tally" on your
scorecard.

The Super Delegates can change their mind up until the last minute of
voting at the convention.

These people are voting to represent our DEMOCRACY. They are not buying
Amway.

The Clintons act as if they are taking orders for Mary Kay or Tupperware, "Hello, Bob...this
is Bill Clinton. I'm wondering if you'd like to formally commit yourself to an order in
the future, so I can put you down as a "yes" and tell my regional sales director that I have
at least 50 committed sales. I'm trying to win a Pink Cadillac and your pledged support could really
help me with this contest. What do you say Bob...can I put you down as a 'yes'?"

The Super Delegates will go to the candidate with the most delegates.

I imagine that there are a lot of people out there who are really sick and tired
of the Clintons and their intimidation, payola mentality and strong arm tactics.

[GoldieAZ49]

29. one of the super delegates from PA was on the news today

he said he was voting for Clinton regardless of how PA votes. Said that is what he is supposed to do, vote for what he thinks is best for the party, and he thinks Clinton is the best candidate. No wavering, no concern for the best of the party, nada.

Obama was on earlier today as well, saying he didn't have a problem with the super delegates so long as they vote the way their precinct or state voted...as you said. I think everyone could live with that, I suppose.

However the super delegates are not proportionate to the population. Some states have more democrats in elected office than other. Then you have all the DNC members that are super delegates that are not elected by anyone.

Howard Dean said earlier this week, and Harold Ford today, said the candidates will have to work out some kind of deal prior to the convention if their is not a clear winner soon. The primaries end the first week of June.

Now let me ask you, do you think Obama would run on the same ticket with Clinton? I would be interested in what you, cali, and other Obama supporters think of the idea.

I would be disappointed in him if he took the VP slot to her.

[CoffeeCat]

36. I can't imagine anyone being her veep...

I mean, like the Clintons or not--they are a team. As Joe Biden said, "Who in the world would
want to step into that?"

The thought of it makes my stomach hurt. That person would end up being a glorified cabana boy.

No serious person, who was a real leader would take that veep spot. It would have to be a
Clinton kow tower who wouldn't mind being a toothless tiger who was just there to nod their head
in enthusiastic agreement.

I could see a veep, in a HRC administration, playing a more diplomatic, "spokesperson" role--instead
of as a policy crafter or strategizer. There are all ready too many cooks in that kitchen.

And yes, I would be very disappointed in Obama. I can't see him doing that.

Anyway, it's hard for me to think that way, because I believe Obama is on his way to winning every
single state in Feb. That will give him uber momentum going into TX, OH and PA--which Hillary is
counting on. I really think he's going to pull it off.

[Adsos Letter]

38. ...ya' know...

I hadn't thought of it like that...the veep is gonna' have to be able to deal with Bill's position to offer policy "advice"...hmmmm... thanks for opening my eyes to something here.

[laugle]

35. I heard today on the

MSM that Kerry is busy burning up the phone lines calling the super delegate's......must mean something!

They were laughing and saying Kerry was working harder for BO than his own 2004 campaign!

[still_one]

12. There are a lot of issues that could cause the Democratic party to blow out

The MI FL delegates is another

Both issues are actually quite easy to solve

For MI and FL, redo the primaries in those states, give the candidates a week to campaign there, then run the primary

As for the Super Delegates, they should only reflect the people's will, or at the minimum at least their districts

[PFunk]

15. No. But we will be seeing McClain win the presidency in 08...

..If the Dems do use superdelegates to put Hillary in. Count on it. Nothing will piss off the base more.

[Nimrod2005]

18. There will be no base left...People will leave the party!

[John Q. Citizen]

42. I'm not so afraid of the super delegates. My theory is most won't want to return to

a time when the Dem president dampened the Dem turnout so badly that the Repos took over both houses of congress. Nobody wants to lose their job.

The Repo turnout in 1994 was no larger than the Repo turnout in 1990. The reason the so called 1994 Republican Revolution happened was that Dems turned out in much smaller numbers. Blame it on NAFTA, Hillary's failed health care plan, and the systematic dissing of the Dem activist base by their top leadership and the dissing of basic Democratic values held by thier base.

[ShortnFiery]

17. Yes, they are going to dispense with all pretense and allow Democratic Poltical Royals select ...

our Democratic ticket. :crazy:

Welcome to The *well-organized* DLC Clintonian Campaign Machine! :evilgrin:

[Nimrod2005]

20. There will be no more Democratic Party left...

[elixir]

22. Howard Dean/DNC has to square this away ASAP. It shouldn't come down to superdelegates or FL/MI.

[Nimrod2005]

23. Agreed, does Dr Dean have a role to play here, a legitimate role?

[elixir]

30. As chairman of the DNC he should be coordinating an effort.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

41. Howard Dean was a Super Delegate for the debacled 1980 election...he knows better

[MoonRiver]

27. I guess it has to do with getting that magical two thousand something number of delegates.

If neither reaches it apparently the decision goes to the super delegates. :shrug:

[4nic8em]

39. For the same reason

Florida and Michigan delegates don't count...rules.

[RiverStone]

43. This is why I hope Obama gets on a huge roll...

He needs some padding and as soon as the general public gets wind of the MI delegate give back - folks will REALLY be pissed.

Obama can't be tied - he needs a compelling lead going into the convention.