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Hillary Clinton actually is part of a secretive cult (no joke).

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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:39 PM
Original message
Hillary Clinton actually is part of a secretive cult (no joke).
Edited on Mon Feb-11-08 01:43 PM by Bread and Circus
First off, I find it really weird that some of the most ardent social liberals on DU who have a very hard time with Obama's religious overtones (a case which is dramatically overblown) considering what Clinton is involved in. For the uninitiated, Clinton is part of "The Fellowship" which is a Senatorial group founded by a Methodist back in the 1930's. It's members include the likes of Brownback, Inhofe, and Santorum. It also includes Clinton as an active member. Please read this:

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200611/green-hillary

November 2006 Atlantic Monthly
How Hillary Clinton turned herself into the consummate Washington player

by Joshua Green

Take Two: Hillary's Choice

snip

Of the many realms of power on Capitol Hill, the least understood may be the lawmakers’ prayer group. The tradition of private worship in small, informal gatherings is one that stretches back for generations, as does a genuine tendency within them to transcend partisanship, though as with so much that is religiously oriented in Washington, the chief adherents are the more conservative Republicans.

Most of the prayer groups are informally affiliated with a secretive Christian organization called the Fellowship, established in the 1930s by a Methodist evangelist named Abraham Vereide, whose great hope was to preach the word of Jesus to political and business leaders throughout the world. Vereide believed that the best way to change the powerful was through discreet personal ministry, and over his lifetime he succeeded to a remarkable degree. The first Senate prayer group met over breakfast in 1943; a decade later one of its members, Senator Frank Carlson, persuaded Dwight Eisenhower to host a Presidential Prayer Breakfast, which has become a tradition.

"Everything I do carries political risk because nobody gets the scrutiny that I get," Hillary Clinton told me, finally.

"It's not like I have any margin for error whatsoever. I don't. Everybody else does, and I don't. And that's fine. That's just who I am, and that's what I live with."


Though it still sponsors what is now called the National Prayer Breakfast, the Fellowship scrupulously avoids publicity, as Vereide insisted it must. “If you want to help people, Jesus said, you don’t do your alms in public,” Douglas Coe, the group’s leader since the late 1960s, said in a rare interview several years ago.

Today, on Capitol Hill, as the old avenues of bipartisanship have gradually been blocked off by hardening ideology, the prayer groups have become cherished sanctuaries for their members—providing respite, however brief, from the cacophony of political Washington. Speaking about a group is strongly discouraged, and what transpires at meetings is strictly off the record. As a result, the groups provide an intimate setting in which members can share their faith without fear of being judged. “Once you take off the cloak of politics and look into a person’s soul, you find that you can establish a relationship that is enduring and deep and doesn’t let politics get in the way,” one longtime participant explained to me. “If you’re going to be consistent with the teachings of Jesus, it’s about forgiveness, reconciliation, and peace.” Many who come, he said, are surprised to wind up forming close friendships with colleagues who in any other setting would be considered political enemies.

You’re not supposed to think about lofty spiritual affairs in terms so temporal as their political importance. But among the prayer groups, one holds special status: a tight-knit gathering of about a dozen senators which still meets every Wednesday morning for prayer and discussion, led by Douglas Coe himself. Each week, someone starts the meeting by giving personal testimony, secure in the support of the audience. Once, Senator Dan Coats stood before the group and sang “Jesus Loves Me, This I Know.”

The roster of regular participants has included such notable conservative names as Brownback, Santorum, Nickles, Enzi, and Inhofe. Then, in 2001, just after the new class of senators was sworn in, another name was added to the list: Hillary Rodham Clinton.

One spring Wednesday, a few months into the term, Senator Sam Brownback’s turn came to lead the group, and he rose intending to talk about a recent cancer scare. But as he stood before his colleagues Brownback spotted Clinton, and was overcome with the impulse to change the subject of his testimony. “I came here today prepared to share about this experience in my life that has caused great suffering, the result of which has deepened my faith,” Brownback said, according to someone who watched the scene unfold. “But I’m overcome now with only one thought.” He confessed to having hated Clinton and having said derogatory things about her. Through God, he now recognized his sin. Then he turned to her and asked, “Mrs. Clinton, will you forgive me?” Clinton replied that she would, and that she appreciated the apology.

“It was an extraordinary moment,” the member told me.

This repentance fostered an unlikely relationship that has yielded political bounty. Clinton and Brownback went on to cosponsor one measure protecting refugees fleeing sexual abuse, and another to study the effects on children of violent video games and television shows. “That morning helped make our working relationship,” Brownback told me recently. “It brought me close to someone I did not ever imagine I would become close to.” Since then, Clinton has teamed up on legislation with many members of the prayer group.

end snip (much, much more at link, it's an 11 page article)

____________________________________________________________________

A few things:

1.) Hillary Rodham Clinton is part of a secretive cult, by definition.
2.) This cult includes the likes of Brownback, Inhofe, Santorum - "enemies" of the socially liberal left.
3.) Clinton prays with these types in an intimate religious setting regularly and it seems to influence her political alliances and even her policy efforts.

So, what were you all saying about forming alliances with the Right Wing, not to mention the Fundamentalist Religious Right Wing?

Come on GLBT DU'ers, you should be the most vocal about this.

*Couple this with Clinton's stance on Iraq (meaning she won't set a deadline (read COMMITMENT) to leave Iraq) and it's no wonder why Bush favors her over Obama.

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MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
1. ::yawn::
Isn't there anything new on FreeRepublic to crosspost?
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Consistency matters. Facts are facts. Is this something you would rather not be talked about?
Edited on Mon Feb-11-08 01:47 PM by Bread and Circus
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
18. Where you been--this has been discussed on DU lots of times!--
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. Where you been--this has been discussed on DU lots of times!--
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IndieLeft Donating Member (851 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #19
35. First time I've heard about it.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #35
44. maybe, maybe not. But you transformed it into something dirty!
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. The Alantic Monthly isn't a freep group. Neither is Mother Jones, who did a piece on this also.
Why won't you discuss this article, MethuenP?

Are you disputing the facts or would you just rather not talk about the facts?
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Rageneau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
3. The 'cult' you allude to happens to be Christianity.
The only things Hillary's membership in "The Fellowship" show are that:

Hillary can reach across the aisle and form alliances with conservatives (something Obama CLAIMS he wants to do)

Hillary is a practicing Christian who engages in daily worship (something Obama claims to be),

Hillary is a REAL politician -- able to work and worship with political enemies and eventually win them over to her side, as she did Brownback.

Again, these things that Obama CLAIMS he wants to do, are things that Hillary has already been doing for years.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. So where's the outrage? All the things you listed are things that create complete outrage here on DU
I guess it's only bad if Obama mentions reaching across the isle to build a working majority? I've noticed that double standard around here quite a bit.
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hayu_lol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Hillary's connection with the fellowship has been widely discussed...
right here on DU for months...ever since that article came out. You are, as usual, using the same old freeper talking points to badmouth one of our two candidates.

As one other poster stated..."YAWN."
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Bullshit, the article has been out for years, not months and no it's not...
really discussed.

I do hear a lot of fake outrage toward Obama though.
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UALRBSofL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. The Clinton's have been Methodists for years
And because of that you think she's a member of a "cult"? I suppose the candidates should be athiests that way they wont have any religious affiliation.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. by definition, "The Fellowship" is a cult.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #11
45. my mom goes to Fellowship meetings every month at her Catholic church. Never
would I call it a cult,nor would she.
You are trying to make an argument by grasping at straws--and you have failed.
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. I would prefer atheists myself.
But thats just me. :evilgrin:
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Blue State Bandit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
31. So were the Branch Davidians/Shepard's Rod...
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Beregond2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
5. Cult
Well, I'm gay, and I don't see anything here to be concerned about. Am I supposed to believe that Hillary's support for the war has something to do with her praying with a group that includes Republicans? Please. Her votes for the war have been calculated carefully to disarm people who might think a woman president would be too "soft." Her principles always take a back seat to her ambitions.

What is it with progressives who are so freaked-out by anything that remotely smacks of religion? Do they not understand that fundamentalism is only a small fraction of the religious life of the world, and a very recent one at that? Every progressive movement this country has ever seen has been born of faith, at least until very recently. For every Jerry Falwell there is an Archbishop Tutu.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. So, all I have been hearing all along is just fake outrage?
I wouldn't be suprised if that was the case.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
21. and nothing surprizes me anymore about your clinton hatred!!
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Call me sensible. Is it such a crime to want to know the facts and the particulars?
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #23
33. dupe
Edited on Mon Feb-11-08 02:35 PM by rodeodance
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #23
34. Then sick with facts instead of JUMPING to melicious speculations!
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suston96 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
7. "Secretive"? What do they secrete?
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Alamom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
14. Old BS is just that, Old ........
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. Is it BS because you don't want it to be true? Is there something factually incorrect?
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
15. You should be ashamed of yourself!!--since when is a prayer group a cult!
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Definitions of a "cult"
The Merriam-Webster online dictionary lists five different definitions of the word "cult."

1. Formal religious veneration
2. A system of religious beliefs and ritual; also: its body of adherents;
3. A religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also: its body of adherents;
4. A system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator;
5. Great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book).

The Random House Unabridged Dictionary's eight definitions of "cult" are:

1. A particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies;
2. An instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, esp. as manifested by a body of admirers;
3. The object of such devotion;
4. A group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc;
5. Group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols;
6. A religion or sect considered to be false, unorthodox, or extremist, with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader;
7. The members of such a religion or sect;
8. Any system for treating human sickness that originated by a person usually claiming to have sole insight into the nature of disease, and that employs methods regarded as unorthodox or unscientific.

Webster's New World College Dictionary defines "cult" as:

1a. a system of religious worship or ritual
1b. a quasi-religious group, often living in a colony, with a charismatic leader who indoctrinates members with unorthodox or extremist views, practices or beliefs
2a. devoted attachment to, or extravagant admiration for, a person, principle or lifestyle, especially when regarded as a fad
2b. the object of such attachment
3. a group of followers, sect

For authoritative British usage, the Compact Oxford English Dictionary of Current English definitions of "cult" and "sect" are:

1 a system of religious worship directed towards a particular figure or object.
2 a small religious group regarded as strange or as imposing excessive control over members.
3 something popular or fashionable among a particular section of society.
sect
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. Definition of a sick OP--your's!
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. Definition of a sick OP--your's!
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
30. look up "moron"
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
16. It has been post many times on DU--and now your melicious pea-brain transformed
a prayer meeting into a secretive cult.

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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. it's spelled malicious and it's not just a "prayer meeting"
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hayu_lol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #20
29. It is still old and tired info...
are ye finally running out of new slurs against Hillary? Is that why you decided to sink this harpoon at this time?

The same material has showed up here many times. Thank you for boring us all.
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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #20
38. what is it.??? these guys.. >Link>>
http://www.insider-magazine.com/ChristianMafia.htm

are they still a bunch of nazi's plotting the over throw of the world, or a place for people who dont play golf to meet and broker deals

i was a boy scout, but didn't make me a homophobe, or a christian, i said whatever i had to so i could go camping and get the fuck out of my drunken fathers house 2 evenings a week, plus any special projects we could volunteer for or make up
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
24. And this is for real--your OP is a real sad joke!
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Worried much? You've replied to this post nearly a half dozen times...
which nothing but ad hominem attacks. Is it that you have no logical counter-argument or defense?
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:37 PM
Original message
not worried--just wanted to get my message to you.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #25
36. not worried--just wanted to get my message to you.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
28. Hillary is in a cult
you people know this is moronic and yet you keep posting it and nodding your heads at it like fucking morons.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #28
47. crickets are like that. over and over and over.
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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
32. all christians do strange things for their on purposes, the story of the 3 jars
one jar has a cover, nothing can enter, 1 jar is cracked nothing stays in, 1 jar is poisoned so anything put into it also becomes poison

5 christians sit on a bench, each hearing a different sermon, amen
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
37. I wish Jesus would come back ... and give all these phony followers a major ass beating
Edited on Mon Feb-11-08 02:38 PM by TexasObserver
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Freetospeak Donating Member (105 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
39. Jesus Christ!
:rofl:
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
40. Santorum a Methodist? That dude is more Catholic than the Pope. Or at least that's how he acts...
Edited on Mon Feb-11-08 02:47 PM by JVS
when he's in our (actually his wife's, his own was too wealthy a place for proper cred) neighborhood.
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bridgit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
41. Yea Verily!! How soon they forget, Oh Lord!! 'Obama's "The One," says Oprah'
'"Apathy is the attitude that disappointment is normal." That's a quote that stood out for me, listening to Oprah Winfrey introducing Barack Obama in South Carolina. I'm watching the video at that link and thinking about how well the familiar Oprah style translates into the political setting.

At first, Oprah sounds hoarse and yells too much, but she settles into things by saying "South Carolina" over and over, talking about her own southern roots, thickening her southern accent, and confessing that she's leaving her comfort zone — "stepping out of my pew." That's an image that combines her beloved TV show and her roots in southern religion. She deftly unites modern TV-pop psychology and old-time religion.'

http://althouse.blogspot.com/2007/12/obamas-one-says-oprah.html
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intaglio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
42. Cults can be Christian based
just as easily as they can be based on any other already extant religion or one newly minted in the mind of the founder. the Branch Davidians were christians schismatics from the 7th Day Adventists indeed many religious groups began this way and are now considered in the "mainstream"

Adventists, Christadelphians, Jehovah's Witnesses and Plymouth Bretheren have all been regarded as cults not merely "sectaries" like the Wesleyans or the Quakers. I know of at least one person who regards the Witnesses as still being a cult - they escaped and found themselves being hounded by other JW's.

The Mormons were certainly regarded as a cult early in their history and most people still regard Scientologists as such.

With this in mind is the "Fellowship" a cult? Emphatically not. It is however a freemasonry - NOT Freemason (though I suspect there is a crossover in the male membership) but A Freemasonry - a secretive group where members show favouritism to each other rather than to the groups of which they are nominally members.
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
43. Oh How Stupid. Is That Really The Best You've Got? Bigotry? Pathetic.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #43
46. You notice that few Obama supporters are commenting!--Wise of them.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. I notice you can't leave this thread alone...what does that make you?
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #48
50. a person who is very concerned about all the crap that is being spewed on DU about
anything Clinton related!

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intaglio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #46
49. I think I fall into your definition of Obama Supporter
Or perhaps you are worried because I gave a reasoned response?
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Unbowed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
51. Is this the group that is referred to as "The Family" and is there a full membership list available?
This has me very curious. I've found this Harpers article from 2003. Is this the same organization?

http://www.harpers.org/archive/2003/03/0079525

There is probably nothing sinister about the organization or the members, but it is fascinating and I'd love to learn more.
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