Alas, i think we have now or soon will be a nation of one political party.

[jasmine621]

Unless the Dems come together within the next four years to change their election and campaign rules, the Republicans will be allowed to continue to select our primary nominees under the radar.
I saw it happening in my precinct. There are many people that I know who were Republicans who were asking for provisional ballots and many friends and former co-workers (including my own daughter) who have changed registration to Independent prior to this primary season. These folks overwhelmingly voted for Obama in my precinct yesterday. The Rovian strategy across the US is revealing as you look at the demographics of the electorate, where they are located and how they voted. Add to that the media's power to set in frenzy either the African American vote or the Hispanic vote by simply distorting the statements of candidates, inferring motives without basis, and creating icons by assigning powers and prowess beyond what is factually ascertainable and presenting a candidate as racist, anti-Hispanic, or anti-black and you have a "democracy" in less than name only. I see this happening for the foreseeable future unless the Dems understand and change their system soon.

The beginning was obvious to me. (1) Get Hillary at all costs because her ideas and solutions will sway many people to her side. Make her and Bill out to be racists by hook or by crook and you will pull the black vote from her, smear his legacy and they will never be able to claim black loyalties ever again. (2) Set up and exaggerate a schism between Hispanics and blacks and make it impossible for any Dem to garner the majority from both at the same time. (3) Get ultra-RW Republicans, actual bigoted Dems (Dixicrats), and politically unwashed young to register as Independents so as to be able to vote in open primaries for the opponent you are most likely to beat in a GE. (4) Have the RW-controlled media build up an icon that you can easily tear down when the time comes, and (5) push lies, distortions, half-truths about a sacred issue of the Dems (Hillary's IWR vote for example) and built it into a betrayal of the sacred trust (no matter who supported the idea at first) and BINGO!
You have a one-party system that no one can beat.

At this point, I feel the momentum is with Obama and that he will win the nomination. So I will readily support him in the GE, feeling that he is not the best we have to offer. And I will laugh my ass off if he actually wins the GE (which I do not believe is possible, knowing what I know) because it will mean that the Rovians overplayed their hand and this thing snowballed into something out of their control. Here's to HOPE!

[Skinner]

1. So, you think Republicans are responsible for Obama's success.

So, who do you think Democrats prefer?

Do the results of Democratic primaries and caucuses give us any indication about which candidate Democrats prefer? Or can we dismiss all of them out of hand, and substitute our own views in place of the preferences of Democratic primary voters?

[Bucky]

2. Oooo, facts! You can prove *anything* with facts.

Homer is always quotable

[MethuenProgressive]

3. I'd be interested in seeing the vote totals of the closed primaries.

I have a feeling, that when Democrats vote for the Democratic nominee, they've voted for Clinton.
Sure, in the general we want non-Dems to support our candidate. But is it healthy for the Democratic Party to field a candidate selected in part (and perhaps that part being the deciding factor) by people who were not Democrats?

[jasmine621]

5. This is what I mean. Anecdotal evidence is all I can use at this point.

But anecdotal evidence is real. I don't believe that I am alone in this feeling or observation.

[jasmine621]

6. There are also some semi-closed primaries

In these only Dems AND previously registered Independents can vote. Some are totally closed. No matter what you think about this primary season, I still believe that only registered Dems should be allowed to vote for Dem candidates across the board.

[mohc]

8. If you take a look at the exit polls

Even the closed primaries have independents and Republicans voting in them. All an open primary amounts to is same day party registration. If one really wants to sabotage the opposing party's primary, all they need to do is register for that party ahead of time in a closed party state or register as independent in modified-open primaries. Party registration is almost without consequence other than the open/closed contest impact. To be certain, there has been less independent and Republican participation in the closed primaries than in open contests, but some amount of the difference has to come from genuine excitement for our candidates (and I say our because Clinton is receiving support from independents and Republicans too).

As for how the closed primaries have lined up so far.

Obama has won CT, DE, DC, LA, and MD (4 Blue 1 Red)
Clinton has won AZ, NY, and OK (1 Blue 2 Red)
Clinton has about 100,000 more popular votes in these contests, helped greatly by her 300,000+ victory in NY.
KY, OR, PA, and SD are the only closed contests left, most likely the winner of PA will end up with more closed primary votes.

[calico1]

21. Exactly..

In closed primaries only Democrats vote so of course you know people are going to vote for the person they want to win in Nov.

But open primaries? Who knows a person's motives? Sure some of them vote for the candidate they want as President. But every one of them? I doubt it. I wish there were no open primaries allowed anywhere. It allows for a lot of potential messing around with candidates.

[DaLittle Kitty]

4. Actually I Agree In Your Basic Premise, However The One Party Concept Is Defined As "The Money Party

The Top Level Insiders of BOTH the Republican and Democratic Parties ... SERVE ONE MASTER and that MASTER IS.. C O R P O R A T E America!

Both Major Party's "CONTENDERS" are underwritten by the same BASE OF BENEFACTORS...

The "Scam" is well contrived and perpetrated on US, the general public for our exclusive consumption that there is some actual difference between the two parties when in reality the differences are only rhetorical and the governing is essentially identical...

WE ARE THE SUCKERS... in this game!and until everyone recognizes that fact and ... REBELS against it WE the people will ... CONTINUE TO LOSE...

Edwards tried to set the table for US, however WE errrr, the great mass of unthinking followers drank the media koolaid and here we are.

The Point about driving people to register as Independents that you make definitely IS a component of the Lever of control mechanism that we have observed to play out in this process.

WE ARE FUCKED!

[femrap]

31. Corporations are the root of the

demise of Democracy. Until they no longer can give money to politicians/candidates, I agree, we are fucked.

And of course the only thing that the Corporation feels if GREED.

[RestoreGore]

7. Recommended because you are not alone in these thoughts

I had the same thoughts after a couple of primaries, like South Carolina which is open, and also Virginia. I just don't believe Obama has started some sort of "epiphany" by just giving a couple of speeches. I think it is a concerted effort by Republicans to go to open primaries and caucuses and fill out provisional ballots and reregister just for the goal of placing Obama there either because they think he can be beat by McCain, or because they hate Hillary Clinton. Now, I am not really a supporter of hers either, but I can see a pattern here and I find it disturbing in as much that in Democratic primaries you would have Republicans who are not well meaning more then likely picking the nominee for Democrats. I find that to be totally wrong, and I agree that the primary rules in many of these states need to be changed. If it is a Democratic primary then only Democrats should be allowed to vote in them.

[KoKo]

9. It's an interesting point...even though folks would want to think questioning

whether there are cross-over voters who have an "agenda" is heresy when we know that Obama has so energized the youth vote that they are coming out in overwhelming numbers seeing him as their only hope for the future.

Have we all forgotten the RW Evangelical youth that the Repugs have so carefully courted all these years? The Regent Graduates who fill the Bush Administration with their doctrinaire views? The mobilization that the RW was able to do in getting them to vote for whichever candidate their pastor wanted them to?

It's hard to believe that those folks couldn't be swayed to vote for someone who has a wonderful evangelical speech delivery. But, if Caroline Kennedy's kids are inspired by him...how do we know that others aren't also?

I would like to see the breakdown of the figures, also. Because knowing how many long time Democrats who vote in every election break out compared to the newly registered Dems and Indies would be very interesting to gauge whether there's a movement in place or a phenomenon that will pass.

[RestoreGore]

14. yes, well, November will then be the proof...

should they all go back to McCain or not vote at all... Oh, I am sure there are those who are swayed, but again, I doubt it is truly as the media depicts it.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

17. OMG a massive conspiracy - its all too clear now!!!

:rofl:

Maybe thats why people's blackberries weren't working for a few hours the other day.

Rove was re-programming the American Public's brain waves!

[AlertLurker]

10. The USA ia already "a nation of one political party."

It just has a left (sorta) and right wing.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

18. and Ralph Nader works for that one party!

thats why he helped Bush get (s)elected in 2000.

He said that Al Gore and GW were all just the same.

Political parties are just that - political parties, and regardless of what pretty
label you put on them - Green, Blue, Orange, Workers, Old Navy -
they ACT like parties.

It hasn't been as noticable with the Green Party (funded by republicans by the way) because
this party has not been able to coordinate enough to gain any clout.

Political parties are - political parties.

[Faryn Balyncd]

11. Has it ever occured to you that Republicans & Independents may be voting Democratic DESPISE Rove &..

...today's Republican Party?

That they may now be voting Democratic because the Rovian Repepublican Party has ABANDONED our fundamental American democratic values?

That they may now be voting Democratic because they are OPPONENTS OF, rather than tools of, Rovian politics?

[RestoreGore]

13. Then why did they re-elect Bush in 2004?

all of a sudden they are fed up?

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

19. because they weren't sick (enough) of them in 2004 but this is 2008

and now those who voted for Bush in 2004 are paying for it with their health or economic situation.

People change their minds, especially when their lives are impacted by their decisions.

[femrap]

26. Not those Evangelical bible-thumpers...

they're still as crazy as ever. They would never vote for a Dem....No, let me rethink that. If God told them to vote for a Dem in the primary, they'd do it. Geez...trying to figure out the mind of the sick Rovians and religious wing nuts is beyond my capacity.

I'm sure there are academics out there going over this voting data...I would love to see their analysis and conclusions.

The same thoughts that the OP discusses have entered my mind as well. Especially given the small number of repugnants who are voting. And they have a bible-thumping crazy to vote for!

[RaleighNCDUer]

23. Because they found out that everything we'd been telling them for

two years about the reasons for the war and the reality of torture and secret prisons, which they scoffed at in 04, turned out to be true.

They may be easily deluded by authoritarians, but they are still Americans with a strong foundation in the values of fair play. They are PISSED; and doubly pissed for being fooled. That's why their leading candidate is an OLD style republican - they are turning on the neocons.

Also, the generation of Democrats that abandonded the party under Nixon's southern strategy is dying off. Their children are returning to the fold, so to speak.

[Faryn Balyncd]

25. Some supported Kerry in 2004........Millions of FORMER Republican votes went Democratic in 2006....

:kick:

[Faryn Balyncd]

28. "cannot support...perpetual war...it's un-American, un-Constitutional, IMMORAL, & not Republican."

Maybe a few of these Republicans agree with Ron Paul's recent comments (Re: McCain):

"I can not support anybody with the foreign policy he advocates, you know, perpetual war. That is just so disturbing to me," Paul said.
"I think it's un-American, un-Constitutional, immoral, and not Republican."

http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/ron_paul_will_not_support_a_jo.html

:kick:

[jasmine621]

34. Yes, it occurred to me. Still does with a lot of hope.

But my inner self keeps telling me otherwise. And the things I have witnessed for myself.

[endarkenment]

12. Total bullshit. nt.

[TheDoorbellRang]

15. Did your friends, coworkers, and daughter

all tell you they were voting for Obama to mess with the democrats? Or did they tell you they were voting for Obama and you're assuming they had no other reason than that they had all turned into mini-Roves? I know your info is anecdotal but I'd like to hear more details.

[jasmine621]

16. Daughter voted precisely because Obama is black.

Friends told me they would never vote for him in the GE, they just don't like Hillary.

[TheDoorbellRang]

24. So they would never have voted for Hillary in November regardless

Thus it remains to be seen if they'll vote for McCain in the fall, which they may or may not -- but there's a whole lot of the Republican party "faithful" who will not vote for for McCain in November, and polls this far out do indicate Obama would win over McCain, for what that's worth at this point.

Even so, I doubt we'll see a one party system anytime soon. We've gotten so beaten down with the venomous acrimony between the parties these past few decades that's it's hard to remember it wasn't always so vicious. I'm one of those hopemongers who sees Obama with the ability to pull Americans past the divisiveness toward something that can benefit all of us: not into a one party system, but into fellow Americans.

I don't doubt the neocon Republicans will regroup in the future and come back in some new incarnation. Like the poor, they will always be with us.

[femrap]

29. What if McCain select Huckabee as VP?

This will get the wing nuts out...especially given McCain's age of 72. Hell, one of the crazies in the flock will assassinate McCain cuz God told him to do it....to save the fetuses!

Our country is devolving.

[TheDoorbellRang]

32. That does scare me, but not as much as

if McCain picks Jeb Bush. :scared:

I don't know that TPTB in the Publican party would allow Huckleberry that much power.

[Umbram]

20. Wow.

"And I will laugh my ass off if he actually wins the GE (which I do not believe is possible, knowing what I know) because it will mean that the Rovians overplayed their hand and this thing snowballed into something out of their control."

So, you go from mere speculation to knowledge of a vast conspiracy that stretches from Rove, the media and hundreds of thousands of Republicans and independents.

Denial is the first stage of grief. It will pass.

[blm]

22. HILLARY would HAVE stronger base of Dems if she SUPPORTED US instead of Bush

the last 7 years.


Clintons would HAVE a stronger base of Dems if they hadn't USED their time in office PROTECTING BUshes throughout the 90s.

Clintons would HAVE a stronger Dem base if they had DEFENDED other Democratic lawmakers being attacked by BushInc and the media the last 7 years.


But they didn't act FOR us, did they?

[dionysus]

27. huffing household cleaners will produce thoughts like this.

[ORDem]

30. Troll n/t

:freak:

[Neo-wobbly]

33. What makes you think...

...that the Republicans like Obama better than Clinton? Both of them are more conservative than McCain! No, if there was a candidate they were "out to get", it was Edwards for stirring up the dreaded issue of "class", and that scares the bejeezus out of them.