Clinton campaign will do ANYTHING to win- Clinton to voters: "F#(k you!"

[IrishBloodEngHeart]

The Boston globe shows that Hillary thinks her desire to be president is more important than the will of the democratic voters. She really is becoming a desperate pathetic figure.



Hillary Clinton will take the Democratic nomination even if she does not win the popular vote, but persuades enough superdelegates to vote for her at the convention, her campaign advisers say.
The New York senator, who lost three primaries Tuesday night, now lags slightly behind her rival, Illinois Senator Barack Obama, in the delegate count. She is even further behind in "pledged'' delegates, those assigned by virtue of primaries and caucuses.

But Clinton will not concede the race to Obama if he wins a greater number of pledged delegates by the end of the primary season, and will count on the 796 elected officials and party bigwigs to put her over the top, if necessary, said Clinton's communications director, Howard Wolfson.

"I want to be clear about the fact that neither campaign is in a position to win this nomination without the support of the votes of the superdelegates,'' Wolfson told reporters in a conference call.

"We don't make distinctions between delegates chosen by million of voters in a primary and those chosen between tens of thousands in caucuses,'' Wolfson said. "And we don't make distinctions when it comes to elected officials'' who vote as superdelegates at the convention.

"We are interested in acquiring delegates, period,'' he added.

[Johnny__Motown]

1. This surprises you?

[IrishBloodEngHeart]

3. sort of, and it makes me mad

Although I support Obama, I often think Clinton gets unfair criticism, but no more. If she is going to act this way, then she deserves whatever she gets.

[DianeG5385]

16. Well then, I say Obama should give all those nasty delegates to Clinton

since clearly he's so above it all and doesn't need them. Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? Obama is out there as hungry for those delegates as Clinton is. What is SAD is that you've deluded yourself into thinking that Obama is not EXACTLY the same as Clinton, a candidate in search of the margin of victory.

Go drink some kool-aid.

[DianeG5385]

I finally have a heart! Whoever you are, TY!

Love!!!!

[XemaSab]

47. Yeah, but Obama followed the rules in Michigan and Florida

Sure, he'd love to have those delegates, but he went with the same rules that Dodd, Biden, Richardson, Kucinich, Edwards, and Gravel did. Only Hillary didn't get the memo about those two states. And I hate to sound cynical, but I'm feeling like she intended all along to cheat and to game the system. :(

Of course Obama is after delegates, but he's not obviously cheating or trying to bully anyone.

[hogwyld]

65. I am thinking the same thing

that she purposefully left her name on the ballot. I'm sure someone will counter that Kucinich, Gravel, and maybe some one else left theirs on there too, but obviously no big names did. I think she intended to "game" the system from the get go, and oh yeah, making a highly publicized fundraising stop in FL the night before the primary vote, and her announcement that she would be there after the polls closed to thank the little people. She is exactly what is wrong with politics, and one reason I decided to join with Obama.

[saracat]

2. And this is exactly how Democratic nominations are won. You don't get to change the rules just

because you were ignorant about them and don't approve of the rules.This is how we have always (in modern times) done it. Educate yourself. Become a DNC member and change them if you don't like them.This is how the Democratic party works.There is absolutely nothing wrong with Wolfson's statement.

[IrishBloodEngHeart]

5. I'm assuming you will hold that line of thougth with Michigan and Florida

or do you think Clinton is correct to want to change the rules for those two states retroactively?

[saracat]

10. No.

I actually think they should revote but that is up to the DNC.

[JackORoses]

9. your transition to the Dark Side is now complete...

You would support the subversion of millions of votes just for spite.

[Political Heretic]

13. This is actually NOT how democratic nominations are won - EVER.

There's not been a single instance since superdelegates were instituted where superdelegates VETOED the will of the people.

[LisaL]

21. Why then have superdelegates at all?

LOL.

[Political Heretic]

28. EXACTLY.

Keep laughing... you are the one making the argument FOR anti-democratic practice that says YOU ARE TOO STUPID TO CHOOSE YOUR OWN REPRESENTATIVES.

[saracat]

22. What is designed is that the delegates pick the nominee. In a close vote the superdelegates were

always designed to be deal breakers. They are NOT obligated to support any particular candidate.They are nOT elected by the voters of their states but by members of their state committee.They are effectively "free agents". Members of their state Committees are free to lobby them.I lobbied mine to vote for Howard Dean as chair . Lobby them about your presidential choice if you don't like theirs, or if they are undecided. Chelsea, Caroline and Obama are not the only people who can "lobby".

[Political Heretic]

30. They were created because party elite decided that the people are too stupid to deserve free choice

Superdelegates were created because a group of power-brokers and party elite decided that the PEOPLE are too stupid to let an unfettered democratic process go forward. So a bunch of RICH, mostly WHITE, mostly MALE political power elite received the power to undermine popular will if they ever disagreed with US.

It was a bad idea when implemented. But it was largely forgotten about until now since this is the first time when anyone is THREATENING that superdelegates WOULD actually go AGAINST the will of the people. The fact that you're defending the practice now is a joke.

[dionysus]

33. the thing is, you're so angry that Edwards was a failure as a candidate,

so you are focusing your anger against the candidate whose place you thought john should be in, up there challenging hillary.

[saracat]

45. Wow, a personal attack responding to a post not having anything to do with either you

or the subject of your attack. Exactly what candidate am I attacking by explaining the DNC process? I merely suggest lobbying and you attack me for it?

[stillcool]

44. This is how the Clinton party works...

Clinton Surrogate Compares Obama Ad to Nazi March
http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20080201/cm_thenation/45278988_1
Fri Feb 1, 2:23 PM ET

The Nation -- On a media conference call organized by the Hillary Clinton campaign today, Clinton surrogate Len Nichols compared an Obama health care ad to Nazis. The ad features a couple at a kitchen table, which some Clinton supporters said was reminiscent of "the famous insurance-industry-financed 'Harry and Louise' ads against the original Clinton plan," as The Politico reports, and Mr. Nichols said it "personally outraged" him.


Accusing political opponents of Nazism is an outrageous smear. Raising the specter of a Nazi march in response to a health care mailer that evokes the insurance industry is so absurd, it would be hard to take the attack seriously, were it not launched from a high profile national campaign conference call in this crucial stretch of the presidential race. And political observers know, of course, that the Clinton Campaign regularly arranges opportunities for surrogates to launch these kind of smears, which are later followed up with apologies. (See: Bob Johnson, Bill Shaheen, Bob Kerrey, and Francine Torge, to name the most recent offenders.) For his part, Nichols did not immediately return a call requesting further comment.
-------------------------
Len Nichols, Director of New America's Health Policy Program, stated, "For nearly 17 years I have worked tirelessly to reform our nation's struggling health system. Today my passion overwhelmed me. I chose an analogy that was wholly inappropriate. I am deeply sorry for any offense that my unfortunate comments may have caused. I made unfortunate comments that do not accurately reflect my bipartisan conviction, political philosophy, or most importantly, my opinions about Senator Obama and his historic campaign for the United States presidency."

Clinton adviser steps down after drug use comments
Earlier Thursday, Clinton personally apologized to rival Obama for Shaheen's remarks.
Obama accepted her apology, according to David Axelrod, the top political strategist for the Obama campaign.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/12/13/clinton.obama/index.html

January 6, 2008, 5:18 pm
Edwards: No Conscience in Clinton Campaign
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/edwards-no-conscience-in-clinton-campaign/
By Julie Bosman
KEENE, N.H. – John Edwards angrily took on Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton at two news conferences in a row on Sunday, saying that her campaign “doesn’t seem to have a conscience.”

COMPTON, Calif. (AP) — Hillary Rodham Clinton and her campaign tried to mend ties to black voters Thursday when a key supporter apologized to her chief rival, Barack Obama, for comments that hinted at Obama's drug use as a teenager. The candidate herself, meanwhile, praised the Rev. Martin Luther King and promised to assist with the rebirth of this troubled, largely black city.

Bob Johnson, the founder of Black Entertainment Television, apologized for comments he made at a Clinton campaign rally in South Carolina on Sunday that hinted at Obama's use of drugs as a teenager.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-01-17-johnson-apology_N.htm?csp=34

December 10, 2007
Third Clinton Volunteer Knew Of Smear E-Mail

A third volunteer for Hillary Clinton's campaign was aware of a propaganda e-mail alleging that Barack Obama is a Muslim who plans on "destroying the U.S. from the inside out."

"Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential Candidacy," the email reads. "Please forward to everyone you know. The Muslims have said they Plan on destroying the U.S. from the inside out, what better way to start than at The highest level."

Two Clinton volunteers, Linda Olson and Judy Rose, have already been asked to resign from the campaign for their roles in forwarding the e-mail. The AP reported yesterday that Olson, a volunteer coordinator in Iowa County, sent a version of the e-mail to 11 people, including Ben Young, a regional field director for Chris Dodd's campaign. Young passed it on to the AP.
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/hillary_adviser_harold_ickes_t.php

Hillary: Sorry for Any Offense Campaign (Bill) Has Caused
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB65wJ6Rcfs

Bill Clinton Asks for a Second Chance
By Liz Halloran
Posted February 11, 2008

The morning after his wife, Hillary, was routed in three state contests by Sen. Barack Obama in their dead-heat battle for the Democratic nomination, former President Bill Clinton made his case for her before a packed Sunday service at one of the largest black churches in Washington, D.C.
But first he offered an apology of sorts for racially tinged comments he made about Obama and his candidacy that have triggered a backlash in the black community and among many other Democrats.

Clinton invoked his "worship of a God of second chances" in pronouncing himself glad to be at the Temple of Praise, which claims nearly 15,000 members. His invocation of second chances echoed comments he made early last week at black churches in California, where he campaigned for his wife before that state's Super Tuesday primary, which she won.
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/campaign-2008/2008/02/11/bill-clinton-asks-for-a-second-chance.html

Bill Clinton To Apologize At LA Black Churches
Once again, Bill Clinton is ready to repent.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/02/bill-clinton-to-apologize_n_84573.html
On Sunday the former president is scheduled to visit black churches in South Central Los Angeles, where he's expected to offer a mea culpa to those who "dearly loved him" when he was their president, Rep. Diane Watson (D-Calif.) says.

Watson, a member of the Congressional Black Caucus who has endorsed Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.), tells us she'll usher the former president to more than half a dozen churches in her district where she says he needs to "renew his relationship" with congregants who were turned off by his racially tinged comments in the days leading up to and following the South Carolina primary. (Such as when Clinton compared Sen. Barack Obama's landslide victory to Jesse Jackson's wins in 1984 and 1988.)

Source: Hillary Adviser Harold Ickes Tells Surrogates To Refer To Super-Delegates As "Automatic Delegates"
By Greg Sargent - February 12, 2008, 11:43AM

In a sign that the spin war over the significance of super-delegates is underway in earnest, Harold Ickes told assorted Hillary supporters on a private conference call yesterday that the campaign wants them to start referring to super-delegates as "automatic delegates," according to someone on the call.

The person I spoke to paraphrases Ickes, who is spearheading Hillary's super-delegate hunt, this way: "We're no longer using the phrase super delegates. It creates a wrong impression. They're called automatic delegates. Because that's what they are."

The worry appears to be that the phrase "super-delegates" implies that "they have super-powers or super influence when they don't," the source says, describing Ickes' thinking. In other words, the phrase suggests that they have greater than average clout and that they have the power to overrule the democratic process, giving it the taint of back-room power politics
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/hillary_adviser_harold_ickes_t.php

[BeyondGeography]

4. Another dumbass move by the worst campaign money could buy

all Obama has to do is take these statements to the voters and to motivate them to vote against the power-play candidate and for him, the fair-play candidate.

[Cha]

6. We'll see wolfson and hilary..

we'll see if the will of the people prevails or little miss hilary's will gets her in the ge if she doesn't have the most votes.

hilaryland is all about underestimating Obama and the will of the people.

[rodeodance]

7. Ha ha--someone actually used a post to whin?

[LittleClarkie]

12. Didn't you used to be a reasonable human being

Way back, before the primary season?

[rodeodance]

36. Hate-filled OP's such as this really get to me.

[BlackVelvet04]

17. LOL Well, that only leaves them 2. n/t

[Political Heretic]

8. Wow. Just.... wow. Then I get to listen to her talk about how she cares about the people

...and what's best for the country.

Seems to me like the only thing Clinton cares about is Clinton, and is willing to go all scorched earth on the American people and the democratic party in order to win at any cost.

That is really disappointing.

Quite honestly, through the campaign I had come to respect Hillary Clinton... but this kind of trash just reconfirms what I guess I already knew. :(

[niceypoo]

11. Why are Obamites so hateful?

I really dont get it. Is all this negativity a precondition to supporting Obama or does it begin with hearing about 'Hope' and 'change?'

If Obama supporters werent so endlessly, and crudely, negative I probabally would support him

[saracat]

14. I have never seen such nasty posters ever.

[IrishBloodEngHeart]

18. So, do you support Senator Clinton's decision to try to win the nomination

without securing the most votes? Or does this not bother you?

[LisaL]

19. Isn't that how you win? By securing the most votes?

The same people who scream that MI and Florida should not count because of the "rules," all of the sudden are against the rules when it comes to super delegates. What gives?

[LanternWaste]

57. I can only imagine that...

I can only imagine that you've been righteously fighting against the concept of super delegates since the rule was instituted in 1980...

Yet only now do I hear the gnashing of teeth and the rending of linstock.

[WillyT]

20. Sure Ya Would...

:eyes:

[Political Heretic]

25. Generalize much?

Search my post history. You'll see regular defense of Clinton supporters, chastisements of fellow Obama supporters that get overly rude, compliments to Clinton on occasion, and probably most important - corrections of my own mistakes with facts and admissions when I've been wrong about something....

....its not hate. It is deep outrage at the idea that any DEMOCRATIC candidate would be actively announcing their unequivocal intention to support super delegates in DENYING the will of the people.

I want ordinary people across these states to make the decision, and by god if Hillary wins these next primaries and wins the delegate count from states then she's my nominee and I'll vote for her in November! But I DO NOT want some special elite party RULING CLASS undermining the will of the people in the arrogant, elitist, anti-democratic belief that the people are too stupid to be allowed to choose their representatives without the guidance of a "special" cabal.

If the public chooses a candidate, and a private group of people who were never elected to serve in this capacity choose to veto that choice - then I don't have a party anymore.

[JimGinPA]

26. You can't even spell "probably"

So you're probably in the Clinton demographic.

:spank:

[Political Heretic]

27. Knock it off.

I have terrible spelling. I also have a masters degree. Stop taking cheap shots... makes us look like a bunch of schmucks.

[NMMNG]

29. I've wondered the same thing.

I've seen some posters here turn into completely different people after deciding to support him. It's like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.

[Political Heretic]

34. The same thing is true of clinton supporters

...some Clinton supporters. But the person above didn't qualify, so I didn't either.

[NMMNG]

35. niceypoo, I can't see what "Ignored" is saying down below

And I don't care either. Oh, the joys of the Ignore List. :bounce:

[terrya]

51. That's a very good question.

There are quite a few Obama supporters who just plain out and out hateful. It doesn't quite jibe with the "Hope" Hallmark Card stuff. These people aren't doing their candidate any favors with the constant negativity and hate.

[goldcanyonaz]

53. I find that his supporters reflect the way Obama really is, both arrogant and bullying.

[KittyWampus]

15. All MoveOn.org does-show that quote & say "Clintons don't need your vote-they've got superdelegates"

[Skip Intro]

23. The Hillary campaign isn't the ones telling FL voters their votes mean nothing.

She's not telling them she won't fight for them.

Who's zoomin who here?

[DianeG5385]

24. Obama is seeking the same advantage as Clinton

to win. To be Prez You need an outsize ego and he is NO exception. He is definitely his own biggest fan. You are such a silly to think it's ONLY Clinton who wants all those silly delegates. It's enough to make me laugh at your naivete.

[Cha]

31. Nobody is as fucking arrogant as

hilaryland..

<snip>

"Such arrogance led directly to the idea that Clinton could simply project an air of inevitability and be assured her party’s nomination. If she wins—as she very well might—it will be in spite of her original approach. As one former Clinton staffer put it to me last spring: “There was an assumption that if you were a major donor and wanted to be an ambassador, go to state dinners with the queen—unless you were an outright fool, you were going to go with Hillary, whether you liked her or not. The attitude was ‘Where else are they going to go?’”

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4568468

[DianeG5385]

40. Amateur. And foul mouthed too

You are quoting gossip and you are a bully. Hopefully you are not an example of the Obama electorate or we are in deeeep trouble.

[Cha]

62. Yeah, I see slingling insults

is your forte but not paying attention to the candidate of little morals that you support.

Don't bother responding.. you're now on ignore because you have nothing to add.

[nomorewhopper]

32. the clinton campaign is starting to really disgust me....

these are bush/rove tactics, and i am ashamed that she would even think of doing something like this.

i tell you this much, taking these steps as described with michigan, florida, and superdelegates will end her career.

my guess it that the leaking of this message will be picked up by the obama campaign and used to plow hillary into the ground. mark my words.

[calteacherguy]

41. yes, the Obama campaign should use this. It's terrible PR for her campaign. nt

[IndianaGreen]

37. No difference between voters electing the President or the Supreme Court appointing the President

And the morphing of the Clinton campaign into the Bush 2000 campaign continues.

[1awake]

38. This is the only

scenario I can think of where I would actively NOT support the Democratic Nomination, regardless if it was Hillary or Obama. I will not support a candidate who is selected over the one the delegates put forth by the states. And when I say actively.. thats exactly what I mean because I would not view whoever was selected as the rightful Democratic nomination. The ends do not always justify the means... sorry.

[Clinton Crusader]

39. And Obama is all sunshine and roses??

Sen. Barack Obama's presidential campaign has prepared a detailed memo listing various instances in which it perceived Sen. Hillary Clinton's campaign to have deliberately played the race card in the Democratic primary.

The memo, which was obtained by the Huffington Post and has been made public elsewhere, is believed to have been given to an activist and contains mostly excerpts from different media reports. It lists the contact info and name of Obama's South Carolina press secretary, Amaya Smith, and is broken down into five incidents in which either Clinton, her husband Bill, or campaign surrogates made comments that could be interpreted as racially insensitive. The document provides an indication that, in private, the Obama campaign is seeking to capitalize on the view - and push the narrative - that the Clintons are using race-related issues for political leverage. In public, the Obama campaign has denied that they are trying to propagate such a perception, noting that the document never was sent to the press.

But irrespective of the memo, the image of the Clinton campaign sowing racial discord did bubble to the surface following a series of comments made this past week. On Friday, Bill Clinton called into multiple African American radio shows, including one hosted by Al Sharpton, to tamp down backlash against him for calling Obama's candidacy a "fairy tale." In the memo, the Obama campaign highlights these "fairy tale" remarks and notes that Donna Brazile, Al Gore's 2000 campaign manager, "lashed into Bill Clinton" for them. The Clinton campaignhas said that the former president was referring to Obama's position on the Iraq. And indeed, Clinton made his remarks in the context of discussing criticism of the war.

"It is wrong that Senator Obama got to go through 15 debates trumpeting his superior judgment and how he had been against the war in every year," said Clinton, "and never got asked one time, not once, 'Well, how could you say, that when you said in 2004 you didn't know how you would have voted on the resolution? You said in 2004 there was no difference between you and George Bush on the war and you took that speech you're now running on off your website in 2004 and there's no difference in your voting record and Hillary's ever since?' Give me a break. "This whole thing is the biggest fairy tale I've ever seen..."

Other incidents cited in the Obama memo include remarks made by Sen. Clinton, that, in regards to civil rights legislation, "It took a president to get it done"; and comments made by Clinton supporter and New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo that, "you can't shuck and jive at a press conference." In the memo, the Obama campaign says Cuomo was referring to the Illinois senator. Cuomo's spokesperson Jeffrey Lerner has argued that Cuomo was "clearly saying that Iowa and New Hampshire were
important primaries because the candidates could not duck the tough questions."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/12/obama-camps-memo-on-clin_n_81205.html

[nonconformist]

42. Please post the article where Obama says he won't try to win.

Thanks.

[stillcool]

43. No low they will not go...

Source: Hillary Adviser Harold Ickes Tells Surrogates To Refer To Super-Delegates As "Automatic Delegates"
By Greg Sargent - February 12, 2008, 11:43AM

In a sign that the spin war over the significance of super-delegates is underway in earnest, Harold Ickes told assorted Hillary supporters on a private conference call yesterday that the campaign wants them to start referring to super-delegates as "automatic delegates," according to someone on the call.

The person I spoke to paraphrases Ickes, who is spearheading Hillary's super-delegate hunt, this way: "We're no longer using the phrase super delegates. It creates a wrong impression. They're called automatic delegates. Because that's what they are."

The worry appears to be that the phrase "super-delegates" implies that "they have super-powers or super influence when they don't," the source says, describing Ickes' thinking. In other words, the phrase suggests that they have greater than average clout and that they have the power to overrule the democratic process, giving it the taint of back-room power politics
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/hillary_adviser_harold_ickes_t.php

[johnnydrama]

46. how stupid

Yah, those are just 800 normal people who carry the weight of 8 million votes.

There's nothing special about them at all. :sarcasm:

If I heard about a Clinton campaign person saying something extremely smart and intelligent, i'd drop to the floor in disbelief.

[intaglio]

48. If Obama wins because of Superdelegates

Then Hillary's campaign will shout "Unfair," "Undemocratic" and "MI and FL should be seated"

Is she setting up a 3rd Party run?

[Karmadillo]

49. Following the rules to gain delegates? Outrageous! How dare she try to win! Witch!

nt

[Yossariant]

50. Obama meme: "Superdelegates should only be counted if the vote for me."

:rofl:

[DIKB]

52. Taking a move from the repuke playbook

Win by any means possible! The will of the people be damned!

[Independent-Voter]

55. Superdelegates need to be done away with

The whole notion of the Supers make the party look like idiots. Just run a proportional system like you have now and call it a day.

[HeraldSquare212]

54. I've already been told I "don't need a President" by both Bill and Hillary.

The presumptiousness, arrogance and condescension of those remarks are just astounding. I will be reminder her of her comments after her loss.

[backscatter712]

56. I will leave the Democratic Party if the superdelegates overturn the voters.

It's one thing if Clinton or Obama win fair and square - they get the most pledged delegates and the superdelegates follow - that's how it's supposed to work. Of course I'll be unhappy if my candidate doesn't win, but if it's a fair and square fight, I'll suck it up and vote for the winner in the general election.

But there's a reason why this party is called the Democratic Party. And quite frankly, superdelegates going into smoke-filled rooms and voting to overturn the voters is very anti-democratic.

It's unacceptable.

Clinton needs to understand that unless she gets a majority of pledged delegates, she will never be President.

If Obama wins the most pledged delegates, then Clinton turns the superdelegates to her and overturns the popular vote to take the nomination, I will leave the party. Millions of Democrats, including a lot of well-known elected officials will also leave the party. It will be a clusterfuck of monumental proportions, that will make '68 look like a cakewalk.

It will guarantee that McCain will become President.

We chose to hold elections in the Democratic Party, so the members can choose who they want to bring forward as their nominee. That needs to be respected.

[geiger]

58. didn't they already try the "inevitablity factor" f-u arrogance

fool me once.....

wont be fooled again,

esp. since it was a failure first time around.

[BigDDem]

59. But BO is not going after the super delegates?

More fairy tell

[Hill_YesWeWill]

60. Well, yeah, I pretty much agree.

Here's my position:

This whole issue should be treated in a democratic fashion: The leader in the pledged delegates at the end should win the nomination. And, Michigan and Florida, but Especially Michigan, should not effect the number of pledged delegates.

If the democratic party allows the nomination to be stolen by either side, it would be Horrible for the party! And, don't think that republicans wouldn't exploit that!

Then, in the general election, the Republicans would frame themselves as the fair party, the party of the people, that follows the people's vote, blah, blah, blah. There are so many ways they could spin that, it would be bad.

And, I really think, and hope, that democratic party officials know all this, so they won't let that happen. But, if they do, maybe it's a sign that this corruption and old style of politics Obama talks about is even worse than we thought.

[Onlooker]

61. Both candidates will do the same thing

It's a race, and the idea is to win.

[flowomo]

63. you'd think they'd have figured that out by now....

n/t

[GoldieAZ49]

64. I hope she keeps it up, let the whole country see her desperate attempts

to win the nomination at anyone and everyones expense. So that by the time the Super Delegates vote, the only one she gets is Bill Clintons.

POETIC JUSTICE :rofl: