I just saw Charles Barkley speak on CNN

[sueragingroz]

I has just finished watching Magic as well.

I was really happy to hear from both of them and I think that it was commendable for CNN to have both of them on supporting their choices for the democratic nominee (Barkley is supporting Obama and Magic is supporting Hillary).

I got a real kick out of Charles and thought that his comments about "fake christians" on the right were very on point. I was also very impressed to hear that he is unabashedly pro choice and pro gay marriage. I also really liked what he and Magic had to say about voting for either Hillary or Obama in the general election.

But... and there is a but coming. When Charles was questioned on Obama's lack of experience when it comes to foreign policy, he responded with (and I'm paraphrasing) "he will have plenty of advisers".

Doesn't that remind you of something?

Here's an article that may jog your memory:

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9502E7DF1538F936A35750C0A9669C8B63

Here's another one:

http://www.fas.org/news/usa/2000/usa-001109.htm

Please please people remember your history!

[sandnsea]

1. He was right on Iraq

was the correct answer to that question. Sir Charles blew it, not Obama.

[Iris]

4. Didn't Barkley used to lean Republican?

And was it because of the Democrats "weakness" when it comes to foreign affairs?


I may be way off mark here, but that's what I remember about Charles Barkley's politics.

[spooky3]

7. he was an Edwards supporter in 2004

http://www.newsmeat.com/fec/bystate_detail.php?st=AL&last=barkley&first=charles

[Qutzupalotl]

12. He described himself as an independent

a few years ago on Bill Maher. His policy preferences sound more left of center.

[thevoiceofreason]

15. No, he said hewas as rich as republicans

So he didn't want taxes. But on CNN he said that he has never voted republican -- and that he is running for governor of Alabama in 2014.

[BlackVelvet04]

2. n/t

[DURHAM D]

3. Did Charles explain why he was a Republican until recently? n/t

[shenmue]

6. Yeah. Charles Barkley talked about running for governor as a Republican...

but you know Obama supporters don't want to bring that up.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. And now he's talking about running as a democrat

but you know Obama detractors are going to try to ignore that.

[LordJFT]

19. Yes Charles Barkley is an ex-republican LIKE HILLARY UNLIKE OBAMA

[elixir]

26. Oh, that is really clever. Keep up the good work

:sarcasm:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

29. You guys walked right into it.

:rofl:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

27. LOL

[shenmue]

5. It's funny that Charles supports gay marriage...

when he didn't support his own.

[LordJFT]

21. huh?

[OzarkDem]

8. Charles Barkley is a really interesting guy

Has he run for office yet? Might not be a bad idea. He's very smart and educated on political issues, so unusual for pro-sports figures.

[blm]

9. Hillary's top advisor was Tony Blair's top American advisor from 2001-2007.

How did that work out for Blair and his country?

Obama's advisors are FAR more trustworthy than Hillary's.

Obama has progressives strong on national security issues like Gary Hart, John Kerry, Richard Clarke, Gen. Anthony Zinni, Susan Rice.

Hillary's top advisor is Bill who deep-sixed the BCCI report, the very report that would have prevented a Bush2, a 9-11 event and this Iraq war.

Hey - maybe YOU should PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, READ SOME REAL HISTORY before you post.

[sueragingroz]

16. If you want to compare Clinton's and Bush's presidencies

And say that I don't know my history...

go right ahead.

i'd love to watch :)

[blm]

33. There should never have BEEN a Bush2 presidency. Deep-sixing BCCI report LED

directly to the return of BushInc in the WH.

Bill SIDED with Bush2 on his major decisions on terrorism and Iraq war.

Didn't you notice during his 3 week book tour where he defended Bush but couldn't seem to recall ONE thing about Kerry's decades of work tracking and exposing terror networks and their funding?

You really aren't aware of how much Clinton protected Poppy Bush and his cronies when they should have been in jail by the end of 1994 instead of planning their return in 2000.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/06/19/clinton.iraq/


http://consortiumnews.com/2006/111106.html

Clintons protect Bushes. Always have and always will. And our foreign policy has suffered BECAUSE they are handcuffed by all the deceits of the last three decades.

[blm]

34. BTW - for the reading impaired - I didn't compare the two presidencies, I noted HOW we got

Bush in the first place. And THAT is definitely on Clinton's shoulders.

Try READING.....again.

Yeah.....I can take it to the bank you haven't a clue what happened in BCCI.

[stillcool]

28. Foreign Policy in Focus...

did an article about the foreign policy positions and experts behind the two candidates. Pretty interesting.

http://www.fpif.org/fpiftxt/4940
Behind Obama and Clinton
Stephen Zunes | February 4, 2008

www.fpif.org

Voters on the progressive wing of the Democratic Party are rightly disappointed by the similarity of the foreign policy positions of the two remaining Democratic Party presidential candidates, Senator Hillary Clinton and Senator Barack Obama. However, there are still some real discernable differences to be taken into account. Indeed, given the power the United States has in the world, even minimal differences in policies can have a major difference in the lives of millions of people.

[nonconformist]

10. Charles Barkley was an active and outspoken Republican until just recently

Now, suddenly, he's an "Independent" and an Obama supporter.

[Barack_America]

14. Does that make him unclean? Diminish his voting power?

:shrug:

[nonconformist]

17. It makes his words empty, and it makes him partially responsible for this huge mess we're in now.

Fuck the Republicans. Let them fix their own damn party instead of hijacking ours and moving it to the right.

What, do you think all these Republican "converts" had an epiphany and are now behind progressive, liberal, Democratic ideas? Or maybe, just maybe, they see something in Obama that is like themselves.

[sueragingroz]

18. he said that he's never voted republican and has always been an independant

i suppose we could google this...


http://www.rollingstone.com/nationalaffairs/?p=323

Yes he was mistaken tonight... but it looks like he changed his mind and started supporting democrats for decent reasons at least.

[calico1]

11. I am not an Obama supporter...

but I have to say, that if he gets good advisers and LISTENS to them rather than let cronies make decisions, then he should be ok. Being inexperiences isn't necessarily bad if you surround yourself with good advisers and heed them when you know they know more about something than you do. The trouble starts when you don't listen...

[sueragingroz]

22. yes... we have to hope that ego doesn't get in the way

If he can keep himself from believing his own hype, all will be ok because he is an intelligent man. Just an inexperienced one.

Still... I will forevermore cringe when someone who is running for the toughest job in the land has surrogates admitting that he/or she will have to rely on advisors to make up for inexperience...

This is so NOT a popularity contest!!

[jackson_dem]

24. Well then we should ask who his advisers are instead of just "hoping"

As the subprime mortgage debacle drives a recession that threatens financial markets around the world, the Democratic presidential candidates are pushing plans to address the crisis. John Edwards and Hillary Clinton are pledging substantial federal resources to stabilize the mortgage market and intervene on behalf of borrowers. Barack Obama's proposal is tepid by comparison, short on aggressive government involvement and infused with conservative rhetoric about fiscal responsibility. As he has done on domestic issues like healthcare, job creation and energy policy, Obama is staking out a position to the right of not only populist Edwards but Clinton as well.

-snip-

Obama's disappointing foreclosure plan stems from the centrist politics of his three chief economic advisers and his campaign's ties to Wall Street institutions opposed to increased financial regulation. David Cutler and Jeffrey Liebman are both Harvard economists who served in the Clinton Administration, and they work on market-oriented solutions to social welfare issues. Cutler advocates improving healthcare through financial incentives; Liebman, the partial privatization of Social Security.

Austan Goolsbee, an economist at the University of Chicago who calls himself a "centrist market economist," has been most directly involved with crafting Obama's subprime agenda. In a column last March in the New York Times, Goolsbee disputed whether "subprime lending was the leading cause of foreclosure problems," touted its benefits for credit-poor minority borrowers and warned that "regulators should be mindful of the potential downside in tightening too much." In October, no less a conservative luminary than George Will devoted a whole column in the Washington Post to saluting Goolsbee's "nuanced understanding" of traditional Democratic issues like globalization and income inequality and concluded that he "seems to be the sort of fellow--amiable, empirical, and reasonable--you would want at the elbow of a Democratic president, if such there must be."

Robert Pollin, an economist at the University of Massachussets, believes "these three advisers generally reflect Obama's very moderate economic program, similar to Clintonism." Wall Street apparently has come to a similar conclusion. Obama had received nearly $10 million in contributions from the finance, insurance and real estate sector through October, and he's second among presidential candidates of either party in money raised from commercial banks, trailing only Clinton. Goldman Sachs, which made $6 billion from devalued mortgage securities in the first nine months of 2007, is Obama's top contributor. When asked if Obama would hold these financial institutions accountable for losses incurred by homeowners and investors, his campaign refused to comment.

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080211/fraser

[Drunken Irishman]

20. I hope Magic wasn't allowed to talk. Every time he opens his mouth, I cringe.

I have great respect for him as a player, but man he's a moron. I used to watch him on NBC Showtime (I think that's where he was on) and he couldn't string together a coherent sentence to save his life.

[sueragingroz]

25. actually he was pretty articulate

about as articulate as Barkley.

Could it be his support of Hillary that makes him a moron in your eyes?

Anyway... his HIV activism has been huge for the HIV community. It took a lot of courage for him to take it on so publicly when it would have been easier to just hide away in a corner.

[jackson_dem]

31. Not to mention what Magic has done in so many inner cities

[Drunken Irishman]

32. It has nothing to do with him supporting Clinton.

I've thought Magic was a moron for years now. I remember his short-lived TV show on FOX and it was painful to watch.

I respect Magic, but he's as dumb as a post. In fact, Barkeley isn't much smarter, either.

[Araxen]

23. Charles isn't afraid to speak his mind

and doesn't pull any punches and doesn't sugar coat anything. What Charles says is what he means and he isn't going to hide behind anything. He is what he is. You're either going to like him or you are going to hate him. There's really no in between with him. I myself hopes he becomes Alabama Governor in 2014. We need more people like him in office.

[woolldog]

30. The difference

between Obama and Bush is that Bush is an idiot and Obama is a bright guy.

As Democrats we should drop the experience argument, b/c Hillary has no more experience than Obama and McCain trumps them both in the experience department. It's not about experience but intelligence and judgment.