Senator Clinton has, in fact, never had a serious Republican challenger.

[LoZoccolo]

If she has, you are welcome to talk about it here.

As a matter of fact, she could have picked almost any state in which to run for a Senate seat. Why did she pick New York if it wasn't going to be easy for her?

[THUNDER HANDS]

1. I had to look up the name of her last opponent

I still, off the top of my head, couldn't tell you his name. I know he was the mayor of Yonkers, but that's it.

[Smarmie Doofus]

5. John Spencer. *Former * mayor, I do believe, of that unhappy burgh. nt

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

2. I know she won that election against that Bronx Tale kid n/t

[TexasObserver]

4. Didn't he get capped in the Sopranos, then in real life?

Bronx Tale is an awesome little film.

[Smarmie Doofus]

7. The Bronx is an awesome little place. nt

[Smarmie Doofus]

12. I believe he was arrested in real life for *assisting * in....

... a capping. Of a cop, as a matter of fact.

[JCMach1]

3. Lazio was a very serious contender- Don't even try that piece of revisionism

Much more serious than Alan Keyes was for Obama... Hillary was tied in the polls most of the Summer against Lazio in 2000. She ended-up winning handily in 2000, but not without a significant fight.

... Representative Rick A. Lazio may be less well known than his opponent in the New York Senate contest (not to mention the Republican who dropped out), but in terms of fund-raising, he has already entered her league. Mr. Lazio collected $10.7 million in just seven weeks this summer, his aides said yesterday, leaving little doubt that he will have the means to battle for the seat despite his late start.

Mr. Lazio has taken in a total of $19.2 million since jumping into the Senate race in May, nearly as much as Hillary Rodham Clinton, who has been raising money for more than a year and has collected $21.9 million. She raised $3.3 million in the seven-week period this summer: July 1 to Aug. 23.

Mr. Lazio's success with donors suggests that no matter who is on the Republican line -- mayor, congressman, school board member -- the checks will pour in because of hostility among some people across the country to the Democrat, Mrs. Clinton. And Mr. Lazio, a once-obscure congressman from Suffolk County, has readily harnessed that sentiment.

''I'm Rick Lazio,'' he wrote in an unusually short, one-page fund-raising letter this summer. ''It won't take me six pages to convince you to send me an urgently needed contribution for my United States Senate campaign in New York. It will take only six words: I'm running against Hillary Rodham Clinton. Sincerely, Rick Lazio.''

Despite her financial edge so far, Mr. Lazio has more money on hand, an important indicator. Mr. Lazio began the race with $3.5 million left over from his House campaigns, and then collected $15.7 million. After expenditures, largely for television advertisements and direct mailings, he has $10.2 million in the bank. She has $7.1 million... http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B05E5DC1230F932A3575AC0A9669C8B63

Clinton-Lazio Senate Race Locked In Dead Heat, Quinnipiac University Poll Finds; Half Of Lazio Support Is Anti-Clinton
U.S. Rep. Rick Lazio has picked up where New York City Mayor Rudolph Giuliani left off -- locked in a neck and neck race with First Lady Hillary Rodham Clinton in their U.S. Senate campaign, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released today. Rep. Lazio has 44 percent to Mrs. Clinton's 44 percent... http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1318.xml?ReleaseID=610

[Danger Mouse]

6. She ran in 2000...just so you know.

Not 2002.

[JCMach1]

8. typo correcting...

[Smarmie Doofus]

9. U R correct. It was not an easy race. nt

[JCMach1]

13. Exactly, she was seriously tested and managed to pull it off

by wearing out half a dozen black pantsuits in upstate NY.

Since then,however, she has not been seriously tested.

If you want to see joke campaign, please see Obama vs. Alan Keyes:


Obama Still Leads Keyes by 45%

A new poll conducted a month before Election Day shows Democrat Barack Obama with a 45 percentage point lead over Republican Alan Keyes in the U.S. Senate race.

The poll conducted for WEEK-TV and The (Bloomington) Pantagraph found that 69 percent of those polled supported Obama, a state senator from Chicago. Keyes, meanwhile, got the support of 24 percent.

The Research 2000 Illinois poll was a random telephone survey of 600 likely voters. It was conducted Sunday and Monday and has a margin of error of plus or minor 4 percentage points…http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/special_packages/election2004/9850455.htm

Here are just a few of the items I blogged at the time: http://thesyndrome.com/index.php?s=keyes

[NMMatt]

37. It should have been an easy race, but Hillary is such a bad candidate -nt

[THUNDER HANDS]

11. Lazio was not serious....i know, I covered his congressional district for my old newspaper

The guy was the lightest of lightweights.

Alan Keyes was a joke beyond reasoning, but no Republican was beating Obama, that's why Keyes was running, he was the only one who would agree to play the Washington Generals role.

Lazio stepped in for Guliani and was at a severe disadvantage. He wasn't even the strongest Long Island congressional republican, let alone NY state republican who could have challenged her.

[JCMach1]

15. 44-44% does not equal lightweight

Lazio was an idiot, yes... However, when did that ever stop the electorate from putting in a Repug with millions in campaign money.

Sorry, show me the evidence MagicRat...

[THUNDER HANDS]

19. I'm telling you, with my own eyes I saw this race from ground zero

Hillary's win was never in question.

The only place Lazio ran well was in his home area. Hillary won every other part of the state. Polls are meaningless.

I'll grant you that Obama and Hillary both had flimsy challengers to their U.S. senate seats, but at least Obama had to compete hard for his state senate spots.

[JCMach1]

23. I am not doubting what you say about Lazio

just about the dynamics of the race.

It was close in the polls... largely because Hillary was untested electorally.

Also, she (initially) was perceived as a NY outsider. IT is through her campaigning that she was able to turn that around.

If it had been a horrible campaign by her, indeed, she may have squeaked by Lazio. However, she trounced him!

Obama was so far ahead in his race that he was campaigning for candidates in other states. Honestly, Obama could have slept through that race and won. However, that was more a result of the state of the Illinois Repug party at the time and the scandals. A yellow dog could have beaten Keyes by 10%. However, that's not Obama's fault either! I don't hold that against him.

[THUNDER HANDS]

24. you do understand though

that the GOP couldn't field a candidate to run against him because they were all TERRIFIED of running against him.

In NY, the GOP had Guliani, who would have been the best challege to her.

[JCMach1]

27. Repugs were poison in IL after Ryan...

and Giuliani bailed... granted his scandals and health issues

[angie_love]

46. OMG, I was raised in NY, and I saw that race happening with my own eyes

Hillary was losing big to Giuliani until he dropped out, then Lazio stepped in, everyone knew Hillary was going to win. There was no doubt, Lazio was a joke. I voted for Hillary in 2000, I didn't even have a clue about that other dude.

[grantcart]

49. How can you be serious? My god a democrat winning a statewide election in NY

well that is just about a miracle. Only an expert campaigner of the top echelon could imagine winning a senate seat in this red state.

[dsc]

51. Senator D'Amato

does that ring a bell? He won in 1980, he won in 1986, he won in 1992 (in the face of a Bill Clinton landslide). Oh, and the seat he won, had been held by a Republican who won in 1974. The GOP was 50/50 in Senate races coming into Hillary's race from 1974-2000.

[HeraldSquare212]

54. That seat was won by a Dem in 1998, two years before Clinton's run

suggesting that the electorate wasn't interested in Reps anymore - as you point out, D'Amato's seat had been Rep for 24 years.

[dsc]

57. yes it was

in a close race and a strong Clinton inspired, landslide. We kept every incumbent except Mosley-Braun that year and won two seats.

[Danger Mouse]

50. i'm from New York. Lazio was a joke.

I should know. I voted for him.
...
:hide:

[krkaufman]

45. Exactly. The fact that a race was close does not necessarily reflect well on a candidate.

Should Hillary's race have been close at all?

And should Obama defeating two Republicans be held against him? (link)

[jackson_dem]

28. Thanks for the truth. She didn't even put him away until the debate and that was because of a gaffe

The race was still competitive until Lazio made a gaffe at the end of the campaign in a debate. She had to fight the rethug machine and the carpetbagger image.

[krkaufman]

44. You're forgetting that Obama was running against Jack Ryan ...

... who *would* be considered a formidable candidate, but Obama was beating him by 20% in the polls... when Ryan pulled-out of the race due to a bit of a sex scandal. Republicans then couldn't find anyone from Illinois who dared to run against Obama, and resorted to Keyes to get a name on the ballot.

So give me the candidate that the Republicans are afraid of, thank you.

[hfojvt]

47. the candidate the Republicans are afraid of

versus the candidate who inspires their fundraising:

"Mr. Lazio's success with donors suggests that no matter who is on the Republican line -- mayor, congressman, school board member -- the checks will pour in because of hostility among some people across the country to the Democrat, Mrs. Clinton. And Mr. Lazio, a once-obscure congressman from Suffolk County, has readily harnessed that sentiment."

"a once obscure congressman" became a serious challenger only because so many people hated Hillary.

Even Mike Ditka was afraid to run against Obama in Illinois!

[krkaufman]

64. Daaaa BEARS!

Exactly. I wasn't going to mention how creative (and desperate) the Rethugs were getting to find someone stupid enough to put themselves in front of the freight train that was Obama. (My preferred candidate was crushed in the Democratic primary by him.)

[HeraldSquare212]

52. The polls you cite are before Labor Day.

General election political races don't start in NY until after Labor Day, which is when the parties hold their primary elections and, with the summer over, when people start focusing on the races. I'm pretty sure the polls after Labor Day give her a pretty consistent and comfortable lead. Lazio was no pushover - he was ambitious, and if anything he ran statewide a few years too early - but he was not in any sense of the word a serious Republican challenger. She was handed the nomination on the Dem side by a very popular Dem incumbent who was almost an institution in NY politics. And, two years earlier, Chuck Schumer had beat, against long odds, the leader of the Republican party in NY, Al D'Amato. So the Reps were a bit disorganized and the electorate was obviously looking for change. And, don't forget - that was a presidential year, which means there was high turnout by Dems to vote for Gore.

PS When her campaign did its research on Lazio, they realized he had voted on both sides of every issue. They assumed it was a conscious strategy so he could be all things to all people. I suspect they took the lesson.

[Yossariant]

10. Fly in Alan Keyes to run against Obama.

:rofl:

I wonder who leaked the Ryan scandal to the press.

:shrug:

[tammywammy]

14. Obama was ahead of Ryan in the polls when it was leaked

Obama got up to 20 points ahead of him.

[JCMach1]

16. Exactly, see #9

Ryan was going down well before the rest of the garbage fell off the truck...

[spag68]

20. Ryan

And to think, he was married to 7 of 9.

[JCMach1]

33. Exactly, what a dweeb!

[MonkeyFunk]

17. She was tied with Lazio

a couple months before the election. Don't lie.

[JCMach1]

18. Exactly...

While Lazio was a stuffed suit, Hillary had to overcome the ringer/carpetbagger image and win the thing on the ground.

[LoZoccolo]

22. Why did she choose NY for her carpetbagging then? n/t

[JCMach1]

25. Opportunity knocked and she and Bill apparently

'heart' NY. Plus the NY Dem party needed a HEAVY GUN to take on Giuliani.

[MonkeyFunk]

26. New York has generous laws regarding

citizenship and who can run for office there.

Robert Kennedy did the same thing - in fact, she now holds his seat.

Why do you like to start childish flamebait threads like this? You've been here long enough to act like a grownup, haven't you?

[LoZoccolo]

30. Hey now, let's not fight. You agree with my positions much of the time.

I like to cite your posts as taking the words right out of my mouth.

[MonkeyFunk]

32. Thank you

but this is just a silly tit-for-tat thread, isn't it?

You know enough to research who she ran against in 2000, and even what the polling numbers were. This is just an attempt to incite people. I honestly don't understand what jollies people get from doing that.


edit: and why use the right-wing meme "carpetbagger" against her? Can't you fight fairly, or do you have to use derogatory terms from FreeRepublic to describe her?

[JCMach1]

34. I just remember that was the RW perception of her and honestly

that's what she had to overcome in that campaign.

I am actually a Hillary supporter. I also remember that was the only individual Sen. campaign I gave to that year outside of the DSCC and the DNC.


(oops sorry, post wasn't for me :( , stupid allergies have me eyes going KOOKOO this morning).

[MonkeyFunk]

35. hehe... no worries.

But yes, I donated to Clinton that year, too.

I actually knew Rick Lazio in my youth - he was high school buddies with my brother. He was a prick then, too.

And I may as well point out that no, Clinton could NOT have run from almost any state in the country, as the OP claims. New York was one of the few - if not the only one - that would've allowed it.

[JCMach1]

39. You are correct... her residence if you can call it that

was too short and too tenuous for most states.

[JCMach1]

31. Exactly, there is no advantage to this thread

for anyone...

Hillary did have something of a campaign, but mostly she was fighting perceptions of herself rather than the stuffed shirt with $$$.

Obama didn't (for US Sen.), but it wasn't his fault.


Politics is about the art of the possible. Both candidates SEIZED their best opportunity. What does that tell me?: Both are good politicians.

[jackson_dem]

29. The same reason RFK did

[spag68]

21. NY po;itics

Why do so many people think they know more about NY, then those of us that live here?

[villager]

36. I don't think either Obama or McCain has ever run against truly serious opposition, either

Certainly not in a general election...

So this fall should be interesting...

[ErnestoG]

38. Yet, polls have Obama beating McCain. Clinton ties him.

[villager]

40. that has nothing to do with anything -- I'm just saying none of them has ever really faced a tough

opponent from the, ahem, "opposite" party...

[JCMach1]

42. Looks familiar doesn't it?

From 2004, March 5:

Presidential election poll

George Bush 46%
John Kerry 45%
Ralph Nader 6% http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/mar/05/uselections2004.usa

[Evergreen Emerald]

55. those polls are notorious for fluctuating depending on the month

and upstream 44/44 meant nothing as polls don't matter. Which is it?

[book_worm]

41. You're absolutely right--she hasn't.

[Tarheel_Dem]

43. she was the wife of a very popular president...end of story (eom)

[mysteryman2]

48. Either has Obama

He hasn't even completed his first term in his job now.

[in_cog_ni_to]

53. And ALAN KEYES is what? Obama had a cake walk to the Senate. Pick a new stone to throw...

:eyes:

[HeraldSquare212]

59. This is a reply to the Clinton campaign's statement that Obama never had a serious Rep challenger,

suggesting, without saying, that Clinton has. That's just not true.

[mtnsnake]

56. Bullsthit. Hillary has had the entire Republican Army as a serious Republican challenger

her entire political career, and then some, and they have yet to figure out a way to beat her.

[paulk]

58. the race against Lazio was very close until the last week

Lazio was a well known politician in NY.

It was the final debate that put her over the top.

She was seen as a carpetbagger by many NYer's and had an uphill fight to win that race.

She learned the issues pertinent to NY inside out - she did her homework, especially in red upstate. That's why she won.

Her campaign in 2000 and the job she subsequently did as Senator is one of the major reasons I support her.

Don't denigrate her efforts in this area for cheap political gain.


--------------

[SKKY]

60. I always wondered about that...

...why not Arkansas. It would seem a more logical place to me.

[Maribelle]

61. February 6, 2000 - Clinton-Giuliani Senate Race Is Too Close To Call

Sorry, but you are not correct in the least regarding why she picked New York.


New York City Mayor Rudolph Giuliani clings to a narrow 45 - 42 percent lead over First Lady Hillary Rodham Clinton in their too-close-to-call race for the U.S. Senate, according to a Quinnipiac College poll released today. Ten percent are undecided.


By a wider 50 - 31 percent margin, New York State registered voters expect Giuliani to win in November.



http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1318.xml?ReleaseID=600

[Thepricebreaker]

62. In all fairness either did Obama - Keyes was a pushover n/t

[Tennessee Gal]

63. When did Obama have a serious Republican challenger?

Please tell us.