Do you believe presidential candidates pay people to post on DU?

[RandomKoolzip]

Poll question: Do you believe presidential candidates pay people to post on DU?

I'm seeing the accusations flying here. "You're one of Hillary's paid minions!" Shit like that. It's usually a way of deflecting unpleasant information; just accuse someone of being a "shill" and you've delegitimized that person's claims.

What I wonder is: why would a political campaign spend money to plant anonymous users to post inane musings on this rather obscure message board, knowing only other users will read it? Seems like a waste of resources. No one's mind has been changed because of a particularly partisan pro-Obama or pro-Clinton thread.

Also: if they ARE paying people to post pro-candidate stuff, why would they allow it to be of such low quality?

[MNDemNY]

1. Turnip.

[enigmatic]

2. No

There are many, many unhinged supporters of both remaining candidates that will gladly act like shills for free on political message boards like this. It's throwing away money.

[eleny]

3. True believers

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. I don't know.

It seems like a dumb idea to me. But then so does telemarketing, and I get a half dozen of those calls a day, and I assume somebody's paying them.

There are businesses out there that offer this kind of promotional service. So simply just based on cynicism, it wouldn't write the idea off.

[terrya]

5. Hell no.

I don't believe EITHER campaign pays people to post stuff on DU. These accusations are just very silly. They make no sense whatsoever.

[RandomKoolzip]

9. Hey terry!

:hi:

Ah, Chicago in February....iddn't it beautiful? ("Uh...no.")

Whenever I see anyone accuse another DUer of being a paid shill, I automatically know not to pay the accuser's posts any credence.

[terrya]

11. Hey RKZ!

Ah yes...Chicago in February. This is...some weather we're having. :-(

Not to denigrate this wonderful website full of fun and delight and magic and stimulating conversation and all, but you have to wonder if the powers that be at the Clinton and Obama campaigns knows that DU EXISTS, much less pays people to post here.

[John Q. Citizen]

6. No they don't, or they would hire me because I kick me some Hill butt! Jk Jk as my kids would say.

[billyoc]

7. No, it would be a total waste of money. nt

[FormerDittoHead]

47. ...and that's something new? :-) n/t

[fascisthunter]

8. Nice Work If You Can Get It: A Closer Look at Campaign Blogger Remunerations

http://www.blogpi.net/nice-work-if-you-can-get-it-a-closer-look-at-campaign-blogger-remunerations


This suggests they do.... nobody should be too surprised. I know somebody who was paid by a campaign to do just that.

[RandomKoolzip]

12. Yeah, but those are bloggers.

DU's not a blog.

[fascisthunter]

14. semantics my friend

Here's an article in Boston Globe. Companies do it too:

For a fee, some blogs boost firms
http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2005/06/26/for_a_fee_some_blogs_boost_firms/

[RandomKoolzip]

35. Actaully, there's a difference between website discussion forums and blogs.

A blog is most often the product of a single author (or sometimes a few other collaborators), with an alloted space for comments. the discussion is usually found in the comments section.

Every post on DU is not a product of Skinner's, Elad's or EarlG's brain. This forum is anarchy and sprawl compared to the average blog.

[fascisthunter]

41. Your Using a Semantical Argument to.... forget it

really. You aren't worth it.

[HereSince1628]

10. LOL. Paying people to write vitriole is STUPID. DUers do it for FREE!!!!!!!!!

Come on. :eyes:

[okasha]

13. No. If they did, I think they'd at least check

to make sure the bots knew which end of the sentence requires the capital letter and which end needs the period.

[Danger Mouse]

15. nope.if they were, it'd be a terrible waste of money...

i think it's far more likely that the trolls are either
A.) immature idiots with nothing better to do.
B.) undercover freepers.

or some combination of the two.

[RaleighNCDUer]

16. No, and yes.

I don't think any campaign pays to have full time posters.

I do think that paid campaign workers frequent this, and other, boards - and not always on their own time.

They may not be paid to do it, but they are being paid, and doing it.

[Bad Thoughts]

17. No

Paid staff are on the phones, tending to the press, getting key locals involved. Volunteers probably spam the web.

[nomorewhopper]

18. i've worked on campaigns before

you absolutely, under no circumstances are allowed to post crap on the internet


same goes with any company i've ever worked for.


it's a bread and butter policy for any organization, and it's simply not done.


the negatives so far outweigh the positives it's not even funny for this kind of crap. and you better believe that NOBODY's changing anybody's mind at a place like this. the posts i've seen today are despicable.

[fascisthunter]

19. Really? According to This You Would Be Wrong:

http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2005/06/26/for_a_fee_some_blogs_boost_firms/

[nomorewhopper]

24. if you think campaigns pay ppl to post crap on these boards you're out of your mind

no offense, but it's easy to prove, and the negatives are huge.

if anybody's posting, it's a rogue, and its not legit.

and comparing "Dot Flowers" (whoever they are) or some crap ass motel chain to a US Presidential organization is not proving a point.

[fascisthunter]

25. OK... I'm Out Of my Mind Because You Say So, and Then Say No Offense?

whatever.

I posted links backing myself up. Buh bye...

[MonkeyFunk]

36. But your link had nothing to do with

campaign operatives posting on political discussion boards.

[fascisthunter]

40. The Dishonesty Here is Amazing

MonkeyFunk

[nomorewhopper]

45. look, the campaigns simply don't allow it...

...and if they went around paying bloggers, it would be blockbuster news. and we'd hear about it. secrets are very hard to keep

campaigns are not stupid. they have to watch out for this stuff.

if Dot flowers gets caught, honestly who knows? if hillary gets caught, its a major scandal.

[tigereye]

nicely said

I have always thought that campaign workers (some relatives of mine have worked for a few) have no time for this, and are probably not allowed to....

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jakem]

20. yes, but saying so will get your thread locked.

[MonkeyFunk]

21. Some people here like to think

this forum is important enough for the candidates to care about.

I guarantee you, they do not.

[Blue-Jay]

23. I've been saying that for years.

[MonkeyFunk]

26. Are you accusing me of plagiarism?!?!?!?

fucker

[RandomKoolzip]

30. Blue Jay's campaign must be getting desperate.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

34. He thought it would be wrapped up by his 20,000th post.

[Blue-Jay]

32. LOL!

:rofl:

[backscatter712]

27. There's probably over 100,000 who read this forum.

DU is probably one of the biggest forums on the net, or at least in the top ten.

That does make it a target for astroturfers.

And given the vitriol and the coordinated smears, I'm pretty convinced that there indeed is astroturfing from the Clinton camp here.

I think it may be time for Skinner and co. to investigate, see if there are people doing this, and if it can be traced to particular campaigns, bring out the ban-hammer and maybe even have a lawyer send some cease-and-desist letters.

The astroturfing is just poisoning these forums, and needs to be stopped.

[terrya]

33. Oh, come on.

I'm trying to picture it: scores of people at offices of the Clinton for President campaign nationwide...logged into Democratic Underground. With the sole intent of smearing the Obama campaign.

I would never believe that of the Obama campaign. Nor do I believe it of the Clinton campaign.

We don't matter to the campaigns. We're just another website.

Again...it does sound more than a bit silly.

[JackRiddler]

70. Maybe you shouldn't picture such a cartoon...

It wouldn't take "scores" either.

Please see Post 54.

[tigereye]

63. I guess I don't think those kinds of posts would change anyone's mind here

people here are pretty well informed and I would think most of em have already made up their minds, and would be unlikely to be affected by those negative posts....

[RandomKoolzip]

28. DU is a cold hostile room full of outstretched index fingers.

Outsiders hear the insanity, the shouting and the accusations and wonder why anyone would want to come inside. I'm guessing that for many of us, like myself, GDP is reminiscent of a sibling relationship turned abusive and noncommunicative.

Presidential candidates would have better luck pitching Coppertone to the Inuits.

[Blue-Jay]

22. Quoted for truth:

"Also: if they ARE paying people to post pro-candidate stuff, why would they allow it to be of such low quality?"

Hi, RKZ! :thumbsup:

[RandomKoolzip]

31. Aw, you're just getting paid to say hi to me.

:hi:

[Fovea]

29. And where's my check from them.

They are both deadbeats.
I snipe and shill for them both under different ID's, ya know.

And I ask, with all this turmoil and blood in the gutter, where's the dough?

Attack shill- it's a mug's game.

[jackson_dem]

37. No but there are staffers here in their free time

One is very obvious. This person never posts replies and always seems to "hear" first about endorsements Obama gets, whether from an elected official or an obscure newspaper. There are many others but this person is the most transparent. I have no problem with staffers posting here but they should identify themselves as such.

[RoadRage]

38. No.. why would they pay people, when they can see that there are enough R A B I D

supporters on both sides who will happily do it for free? What a waste of campaign dollars if they actually do it.

[mtnsnake]

39. I doubt there is a candidate out there who would pay anyone, but

I wouldn't be surprised if they might have someone on their staff who takes a subjective view of what the pundits on political message boards are saying in general, but nothing much more than that, and they would probably only devote a small part of their overall duties to that chore alone.

Now I wouldn't put it past someone who works for Karl Rove or one of the Republican think tanks to put the suggestion out there that a bunch of people with Right Wing roots should infiltrate boards such as this and group themselves behind one particular candidate in an attempt to belittle the other candidate with arrogant words and to spread the seeds of misinformation about her. That would certainly explain a lot of things going on here.

[RandomKoolzip]

44. Your use of pronouns is very telling.

[mtnsnake]

46. No sense in beating around the bush

[RandomKoolzip]

51. So all the invective, requested from on high, flows in one direction?

I hadn't caught that.

[Quixote1818]

42. Of course not. What a waste of time that would be.

Not enough people come here for it to pay off.

[andym]

43. Maybe, but most here are amateurs

Most attack posts here are clearly written by amateurs who somehow fancy themselves the next Lee Atwater. The vengeful tone is a clear indication that they are not professional.

[fascisthunter]

48. Yeah... it never happens

Write posts and link for cash!

http://bloggertizer.com/bloggers.asp?gclid=CNW10pDDzpECFQUYlwodVGSD3g

http://payperpost.com/

for politics:
Blogging for Dollars: Giving Rise to the Professional Blogger
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/javascript/2002/08/12/megnut.html

Political bloggers fear publicists will infiltrate sites
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2007/02/23/political_bloggers_fear_publicists_will_infiltrate_sites/


yeah... move along folks... it just doesn't exist. Politicians never do what they aren't supposed to do....lololololol.



Google is your friend.

[nolabels]

55. Well it only figures there would be every kind type of person or job out there.......

From the payperpost it says "we're hiring!

Are you a genius? Do you eat, sleep, and breathe the Internet and social media? If so you may be the right person for a rewarding career with the most creative group of disrupters out there"
(snip)

Kind of bet they don't really want the general public to know about the service. Yet grain of salt also tells me they are probably limited in number and really not all that effective, but who knows :shrug:

[truedelphi]

49. Neither Kucinich or Edwards paid me enough

But Obama's wallet has been flush lately, and of course, I reap those benefits!

[Political Heretic]

50. It's humorous how important some people stupidly think DU is.

We are not a big deal.

See my sig? Can't even get people to get off there asses to do the simplest action. This is a place were people like to sit around on fat-asses and flap their ignorant mouths about politics with no accountability and no responsibility to do anything. It's a place where everyone can post like an arrogant prick, and everyone can act like they're a genius, expert, gods gift to politics, without having to have a resume, or qualifications or credentials.

When asked to lift a finger - nothing happens.

Poster Richardo said it best: "Internet message boards are the General Stores of the 21st century, where disaffected non-participants can go and sit around the cracker barrel and grouse about politics."

Thinking that campaigns even bother to put paid plants here is just the height of arrogance and stupidity.

[Zorra]

52. I believe the DLC pays people to post here in an attempt to suppress

anti-corporatism.

Don't know about candidates.

[RandomKoolzip]

53. Really?

And what independent, non-corporate company made our computers?

[fascisthunter]

57. oh yes

[JackRiddler]

54. You're putting it in an oversimplified way.

DU may not seem very important, but what is written here is read by a politically active audience, in fact a politically addicted one! This is also true of many other less-heavily visited sites on the Web. People who post here tend to be vocal elsewhere and act as potential multipliers. What campaign wouldn't want to harness them if possible?

I think, without a doubt, that campaigns coordinate occasional posting offensives to get out certain matters of spin or talking points, whether this is paid or unpaid. I would think they'd want to organize it informally when possible (which also helps to create a multiplicity of voices) and I'd think they'd certainly not want to spend money if they can avoid that and they'd prefer not to create trails to the official campaign! For the most part, there are people who automatically cut and paste campaign press releases without being part of the campaign.

If everyone is upfront about it, I'd have no problems with it. Sometimes people go ahead and tell you they're with a campaign, that's fine. I wish DU had a full disclosure rule on one's involvement with political or PR campaigns, even if it's impossible to enforce. (I suppose the Obama, Clinton and even an occasional "DNC" or "DLC" avatar indicate something of the kind. It's also no secret I'm active as a 9/11 skeptic, as my sig line says.)

I can imagine campaigns scope many boards on a daily basis to see what's out there, and make an occasional intervention to spin it more their way. Republicans and Democrats alike. If the fan-base already fulfills the function of delivering the campaign's spin, then they don't bother to add any themselves (and thus avoid exposure).

And they do it not just at DU but at many, sometimes far smaller forums. Just as PR firms have been documented doing on behalf of corporate sponsors as one of the well-known techniques of "astroturfing."

In the past there have been some obvious cases of talking point dispensation by a number of defunct campaigns. DU was discovered in the early stages of the 2004 season by several campaigns. I won't name them because that will inspire howls of protest -- probably mostly howls from people who were part of the fan-bases, not from those who were coordinated.

[LostinVA]

56. I know at least one person is

[JVS]

58. Pay, no. Could a volunteer be told to go work a place where he/she has been anyway, yes.

[tigereye]

59. hey Koolzip!

good to see you!

[TheDonkey]

60. I think the HC campaign just has a robo-smearer that automatically posts smears from drudge on DU

new age robo-calling software to pollute the internet with crap.

[WinkyDink]

62. No. I find the idea paranoiac.

[Yurovsky]

64. I'm making a pretty good living at it ...

just gotta hope the checks keep clearing. This elongated primary season is going to test the limits of how much $$$ the Left can put into an election year.

[L. Coyote]

65. People paid by presidential candidates post on DU? SURE! But hey, DU is not that critical!

:rofl: Throw good money at GD-P! :rofl: Why would any candidate want to sway what happens in GD-P?

:rofl: That's just hilarious! :rofl: Throw good money at GD-P! :rofl: ROFLMAO :rofl:

[asthmaticeog]

66. I dis GBV in Lounge music threads because Tobin Sprout pays me to.

But hey, free drugs is free drugs. :shrug:

[Debi]

67. I think campaigns pay staffers to support the campaign in any way they can

and staffers may find the time to post on the internets.

I don't think campaigns pay staffers JUST to post on DU.

I do think posting on blogs is something paid campaign staffers end up doing.

:crazy:

[Recursion]

68. Some sites, maybe. But not here.

I know lots of people at DNC; the consensus seems to be we're about as relevant as FR.

[wellstone dem]

69. Barak, Hillary, I'm available,please pm me

Just name the price!

:-)