Hillary will never accept her share in the War that Maimed and Burned those Soldiers

[JackORoses]

Yet she is happy to use them as imagery in her little closing stump.

I hope she knows what the true cost of Iraq has been and will be.

I fear she cannot comprehend it.

[LakeSamish706]

1. What your saying is she is phoney... I think, and I agree... Everything with her is me, me... n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

2. Neither will Obama

funny how that works.

[JackORoses]

11. There is a difference between starting a War and supporting your soldiers once they are there

I hope you realize this.

One is an error of Colossal Proportion, the other is a necessary Evil.

[MichiganVote]

3. Do any of them comprehend what it has meant to FUND the war?

[Beausoir]

33. No. They happily support Obama as he has voted to keep the war going.

[Splinter Cell]

34. The thing is...

As long as Dubya is in office, the troops are going to be there. That's not in question. If they cut funding for the troops, then the troops will just be there without the equipment they need.

A vote to fund the troops is not a vote in support of the war. We have an obligation to our soldiers to give them what they need, even if we're 100% against the war.

[gerrilea]

4. Her share?

Please don't blame HRC for the war or the abuse of our armed forces...she is not "Commander in Chief"

[LakeSamish706]

6. Yeah, but she voted for it and refuses to admit her mistake... n/t

[MichiganVote]

22. You know,, you need to wise up, this tired and worn out argument is useless

John Kerry voted for it too and the Dem party supported him. The repub's will not give a damn that she did and neither will the indep. so long as she is good for her word about pulling out. Its a worthless argument.

[Johnny__Motown]

9. But she did vote for it.. that contributed to the problem

[gerrilea]

19. You know...you are right and wrong

She did not send them there...Bush did...he is responsible...and back then, 911 was held over every thing persons head in Washington...they had no choice, had they voted against it..they would have been destroyed as against the troops...remember the tone in the country then?

[MichiganVote]

23. To say nothing of the billions they have ALL paid out for it.

[liberalmuse]

5. To play devil's advocate here...

Just what in the FUCK has Obama done to get us out of this shit? NOTHING. The same as Hillary. His only redemption is that he was not put in the position that would have him voting with the Senate Herd. I don't doubt that he would have voted for this war. Not for a second.

[LakeSamish706]

8. Duh.. So how is that playing Devils advocate? n/t

[Johnny__Motown]

10. Then why did he publicly oppose it when 70% of America was for it?

[JackORoses]

18. he has run for President to get us out of Iraq

He opposed it from the start all while he was running for office. A time when most Pols lay low.

[jasmine621]

7. She already has accepted her responsibility, so stop.

You accept responsibility by taking the consequesnces and moving forward to do what you can to make up for your actions, not by saying "sorry."

[Johnny__Motown]

13. No, she said "if I knew then what I know now" not " I never should have done that"

there is clearly a difference

[Auntie Bush]

26. Can't someone be sorry without actually verbalizing the word sorry?

Come on! She's sorry and you know it. I'm sick of the fake copycat outrage. Proof of that is she didn't vote to go war. She voted to give bush* the power to have better negotiating ability to get the inspectors back in which would have prevented a war. But evil bush* never tried to get the inspectors back in and never went back to the UN. He deceived, lied and betrayed the American people. It's surly his fault we're in this war. It is NOT Hillary's fault! Why can't you understand that? Maybe it's because you don't want to. :shrug:

[paulk]

12. Iraq belongs to George W. Bush and the Republicans

period.

[Johnny__Motown]

15. And everyone who voted for the IWR

[paulk]

30. that's such bullshit

you stupid fucks go ahead and keep pimping this crap for the Republicans...

[NoodleyAppendage]

14. She has no conscience when it stands between her and the power she seeks.

Hillary will NEVER be President because there are MILLIONS of Repukes who will come out to vote against her and MILLIONS of Democrats who will not stand up for her (because she's a faux DINO/DLC dem with no redeeming value).

J

[patrice]

16. Obama won on this Issue. IWR = bad Judgement.

And he said that without going completely negative on her personally.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[democrattotheend]

20. Not sure that's fair

I strongly disagree with her war vote, but to say that she is to blame for soldiers being maimed is not fair. She didn't get us into war - Bush did.

[meow mix]

21. yup, she needs to apologize

and exit

[apocalypsehow]

24. Excellent OP, and right on point. K & R.

:thumbsup: :kick:

[bigtree]

25. That's because Bush chose to ignore what that Iraq resolution mandated

pulled the inspectors the resolution had enabled back into Iraq, and preemptively invaded. Just because the resolution referenced his assumed authority to commit troops under the War Powers Act, didn't 'authorize' Bush to jump the will of Congress, expressed in the resolution, that he exhaust all 'peaceful means' and return to the UN Security Council before invading. Bush initiated the invasion and completely ignored every expression of Congress which was original to the Iraq resolution. It mandated restraint. Bush pushed past that and mobilized and deployed troops under assumed authority under the War Powers Act which was opportunistically inserted into the resolution as 'authority'.

In fact, the first opportunity the Congress had to ratify (or oppose) his pulling out of the inspectors and his mobilization and invasion was in their first funding vote. That's the actual 'authority' which Congress exerts. Modern presidents will never rely on resolutions from Congress as 'authority' to commit troops. The rely on Congress' timidity in actually asserting their own power to check that assumed ability to commit troops without prior congressional approval, as legislators are always loath to pull the rug out from under a military engagement after it's already initiated by refusing funding.

[JackORoses]

27. you'll stick with that til the bitter end...Hillary can do no wrong in your eyes

[bigtree]

29. I'll stick with the facts of that vote

[AtomicKitten]

28. It is up to us to remind her.

And to all the people if not now appalled still remember being appalled at the Iraq War Resolution and all that it opened up like a horrific Pandora's box: torture, rendition, shock and awe, suspension of habeas corpus, illegal wiretaps, etc., etc., all with zero oversight ...

Now is the time to step up and say HELL NO to the candidate that voted yes on a blank check for war for the very worst of reasons, her own political aspirations and plans. She didn't even bother to read the NIE. And when the neocons tried to tee up Iran, she signed up with another yes vote.

Now is the time to make your voices heard.

[Beausoir]

32. And Obama fed the war machine. He fed it with dollars. That is a fact.

When he knew it was wrong...he still kept it going.

[AtomicKitten]

36. The Goddess of War gave Junior a blank check for this bullshit war.

Obama and Hillary funded the troops because it was the right thing to do. You simply cannot make the connection between actually starting the war and taking care of the soldiers regardless of how hard you try.

Hillary voted YES on war (and more war). That's also a fact. A deadly, hard cold fact. A fact that resonates regardless of how hard you try to muddy it. Conversely Obama opposed this war from the start. That is also a fact.

I think you are feeling guilty for supporting the Goddess of War and are trying to assuage that guilt by your bogus accusations.

You support the Goddess of War. Deal with it.

[Beausoir]

31. Obama kept funding this war. That fact will not go away.

[candice]

35. She can comprehend it. The entire Congress was duped (as were the American people).

Bu$h wasn't given the right to start a preemptive war unless national security was at stake. He and his staff lied to Congress and the American people.

Both Senators from New York had to vote to protect their constituents, who had been ground zero on 9/11.

Obama wasn't even in the Senate. It was nice of him to make a speech, but he should have come to Washington and confronted Congress and the President if he knew more than the U.S. Congress knew.

Read this article for more information.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joe-wilson/the-real-hillary-i-know-_b_77878.html



"A number of us, like then Illinois state senator Obama, opposed the second Gulf War. My own opposition from the beginning has been well documented. I fought the fight in the arena itself, Washington DC, against a ruthless administration and its supporters while the senator's opposition came from a far distance and carried no risk, given that he represented in Springfield, Illinois the district encompassing the University of Chicago. As an obscure but safe provincial political figure, he never was granted access to the distorted intelligence that was used to drive the Congress and the media. When I looked to the left or to the right for support, I never saw the state senator. In fact, I never heard of Barack Obama until he announced his intention to run for the Senate in the 2006 election.

After he came to Washington, Obama's views were thoroughly conventional and even timid. In 2004, he said about the 2002 congressional Authorization for the Use of Military Force: "I'm not privy to Senate intelligence reports. What would I have done? I don't know." On Iraq-related votes in the Senate, Obama's record identically matches Senator Clinton's--with the exception that Senator Clinton voted against the confirmation of General George Casey as Army chief of staff. Obama's vote was typically passive.

In the run up to the war and thereafter, I was in frequent discussions with senior Democrats in Washington, including Senator Clinton, and I was keenly aware of her demand for the full exercise of international diplomacy and allowing the weapons inspectors to complete their mission. Many of the most prominent early opponents of the war, including former General Wes Clark and former ambassador to the United National Richard Holbrooke support Senator Clinton for President, as do I. We do so because we know that she has the experience and the judgment that comes from having been in the arena for her entire adult life--and from close personal participation with her in the conduct of U.S. foreign policy. And we have trust in her to end the war in Iraq in the most responsible way, consistent with our national security interests."