Is the word PRESIDENTIAL inherently sexist?

[BuyingThyme]

Poll question: Is the word PRESIDENTIAL inherently sexist?

[Skinner]

1. Would you care to explain?

I have never heard this before.

[BuyingThyme]

6. Being that all U.S. presidents have been men,

is there an expectation that one must be like a man (like those men) in order to be presidential?

[Skinner]

14. I guess I see your point.

I guess it depends on what an individual sees in their mind when they think about what makes one presidential.

All U.S. presidents have also been white. So, perhaps for some people the there is an expectation that one must be white to be presidential.

I suspect that come January 2009, the definition of "presidential" will have broadened a bit.

[BuyingThyme]

21. That's for sure.

Maybe breast feeding will someday be presidential. Like cutting the brush.

ON EDIT AFTERTHOUGHT: Can cutting the brush be presidential for a man (or Chimp) but not so presidential for a woman?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

17. When Kathleen Sebelius Gave The SOTU Response, I Was Amazingly Impressed With How Presidential I

thought she came off. The reason I thought that was because of her intellect, tone, vibe of leadership, and all around presentation. But none of that was due to my thinking she was being like a man somehow. I just thought she came off as extremely presidential. So based on that, I'd have to say the answer to your OP is no. :P

[BuyingThyme]

22. From where does that vibe of leadership originate?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

25. Leaders? Not Sure How To Answer That Question.

Are you implying that leadership is sexist too? Are you implying that you don't know the qualities of what makes one a leader? Have you not been aware of any strong women leaders? Are you trying to now portray a mindset that no matter how someone responds to your poll or questions, that you're going to hold onto your position that it IS inherently sexist?

I know a ton of women leaders and had a female boss who was the best boss I've ever had. There are women leaders all over the place and I find your question to be seriously flawed in intent.

[BuyingThyme]

31. How can a question be flawed in intent?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

36. When A Question Is Asked With A Tone Of Sincerity, But In Fact Is Being Asked With A Tone Of

stubbornness, then the intent is flawed.

Meaning in this case, you aren't really interested in others opinions as it relates to whether or not there is inherent sexism. You're already convinced there is. You're already convinced that any of the qualities that make someone 'presidential' are also inherently sexist, so even using them as defense would be irrelevant to you since you would still hold firm to your flawed ideal.

Now granted, I'm not saying for certain that's what you're doing here. I'm just saying that based on the way you've responded, that I no longer consider your intent to be one of genuine disposition, but instead one of "I don't care what you say, people regard 'presidential' as being inherently male". Well if that's truly the way you feel, I can't stop ya. But you're wrong.

[BuyingThyme]

40. Then we find your responses were flawed in intent because

I truly wonder what people are talking about when they speak in presidential terms.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

41. Who The Fuck Is We?

And you have exposed yourself now as being the originator of an impossible equation. You don't have the slightest bit of sincere intention here, and you only desire to ask a gazillion questions to any response you get until finally the poster gives up and you pat yourself on the shoulder smugly as if to falsely convince yourself that you won somehow, and that it IS in fact inherently sexist. But I have no desire to go down that petty overanalyzed circle jerk with you, because I already see exactly what your true intentions are. No matter how someone responds, no matter what kind of explanation one gives, no matter how many follow up questions of yours they need to answer to go even deeper in detail as to what each quality represents, they will get no where with you. You are convinced in your own little bubble that presidential is inherently sexist and male, and there isn't a part of your mind open to the reality that it could be otherwise, or open to the opinions of others as to why.

You've made that clear to me now, and I have no desire to pretend we could have a sincere or genuine discussion, when it's clear that your only purpose is to try and convince others of a point that truly doesn't exist. Total waste of time. Bye!

[BuyingThyme]

42. Lay off the crazy sauce.

I'm asking questions to find out what people perceive as presidential.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

43. You Ain't Foolin Anybody.

[BuyingThyme]

46. I fooled you without even trying.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

47. Whatever Makes You Feel Self Important!

:hi:

[BuyingThyme]

52. Do me a favor.

Read what you've written in this thread and attempt to explain your motivation.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

54. My Motivation Had Been To Sincerely Answer Your Question, Until It Became Clear That You Had No

interest in a real conversation. I think it's beyond evident that you're firmly standing behind a point that doesn't truly exist except for within your own mind.

You came in asking if the term was inherently sexist. Several have replied with reasons stating know and far more voted no. But none of that is good enough, since I'd wager you still believe 100% that it is.

[BuyingThyme]

55. So, because you drank all that crazy sauce,

you decided that (1) my opinion does not count and (2) that I think that my opinion is the only one that counts and (3) that's what counts the most.

Has it occurred to you that you're just projecting your thought processes on me because you hate yourself and are looking for a way to express how you feel?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

50. Oh. And Speaking Of Crazy Sauce, You Never Answered Who The Fuck 'We' Was.

[BuyingThyme]

56. We are you and me and anybody else who wants to participate.

[REP]

2. Why can't I vote "WTF"?

[Seabiscuit]

39. Same question I'm asking.

[Radical Activist]

3. Unless you think the qualities that make a good President

are inherently male, then no.

[BuyingThyme]

16. Does one have to be a good president to be presidential?

[Orangepeel]

4. No. But if you said Clinton is running to be "presidentess" it would be

It is sexist to feminize words that don't need to be feminized, like calling a female pilot a "pilotess" (or, a "female pilot" for that matter). There is no reason that I know of that "presidential" is sexist.

[Captain Hilts]

51. Aviatrix. Murderess. etc. nt

[uppityperson]

5. Off to dictionary.com... I'm back and laughing at my next thought (about "dictionary")

I don't see what you are getting at, but started to wonder: Is "dictionary" inherently sexist? Why isn't there a clitionary?

[tammywammy]

9. LOL

"clitionary" :rofl:

[BattyDem]

15. ROFL!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

44. ROFL!!!! Well,

:rofl:

I'm thinkin cause a dictionary doesn't mind being touched by anyone, whereas the clitionary would demand dinner first?

[XemaSab]

7. Can't spell presidential without "Penis."

That and "rat deli." :hide:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

48. Can't Spell It Without Dental Either. Teeth: We All Have Them, Except For Freepers.

Therefore, the word isn't sexist, it just means that freepers shouldn't be President.

[panader0]

8. I lay bricks. In my 35 years in the trade, I have never seen a female

bricklayer. Is that sexist? Some jobs are better suited for some sexes. Still, I believe the woman to be the stronger sex.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

13. Are You Saying Being President Is Better Suited For Males?

Yeah, that's pretty sexist. In fact, so is saying that some jobs are better suited for some sexes. Depending on different factors, anyone from either sex can be capable of doing any job.

[ErnestoG]

10. I am offended that you even brought it up!

[BuyingThyme]

12. Are you the president of something?

[ErnestoG]

26. Yes. The President of being offended. Now stop it!

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

18. You?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Yeah... Who you kiddin...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=4732371

[DrFunkenstein]

11. No, But It Is Definitely Racist

The times they are a'changin'. Only the GOP has an old white man running.

[JI7]

19. no, i think Hillary looks Presidential

as do many other women such as Barbara Boxer, Sebelius, Napolitano, etc. so no, i dno't view the word as sexist.

[Occam Bandage]

20. Only if you believe that presidential qualities are exclusively male.

[BuyingThyme]

23. To this point, they are.

[Occam Bandage]

24. There's a difference between "all presidents have been male" and "all qualities that make

a good president have been exclusive to males." Think of any quality that you believe makes a good President, and I guarantee you can think of five women who possess that quality as quickly as you can five men.

[BuyingThyme]

28. I don't think the word s connotes good or effective qualities

as much as stereotypical posturing.

[Occam Bandage]

30. Then this poll is begging the question.

[BuyingThyme]

33. No, just asking the question.

[Occam Bandage]

34. I'd say it's been answered.

[Lautremont]

27. No, but this post is pretty Ameri-centric.

Just because you guys have never had a female president doesn't make that true of the rest of us. (Not that Canada has a president at all, but you know what I mean.)

Anyway, President doesn't just refer to national leaders. There are plenty of female presidents - gardening clubs, knitting bees and whatnot must have them, I'm sure.


(That last bit is a joke, btw!)

[BuyingThyme]

29. This is a U.S. presidential primary forum.

[Lautremont]

32. Doesn't mean it can be used to ascribe nonexistant meanings to widely-used words.

[BuyingThyme]

35. For instance?

[Lautremont]

38. Well, the word "presidential," for instance, doesn't have a gender bias

inherent to it.

[BuyingThyme]

45. Then you should vote "NO."

[Lautremont]

53. Consider it done.

[npincus]

37. List of Female Presidents here:

http://www.guide2womenleaders.com/Presidents.htm

No offense, kind of a silly question. Don't see gender bias in the word.

[Captain Hilts]

49. Even though JFK said women didn't have what it takes to be prez, he did admit Eleanor R had 'it'.