Why do some people feel the need to insult my generation at every turn? I'm SICK of it.

[Danger Mouse]

    I've seen an awful lot of nasty attacks against my generation by people on this forum lately. Whether it's snarky references to us being 'Obamababies' 'I-pod kids' 'Kool aid drinkers' or 'cult members'...or even better, the new, even sleazier attack 'the worst generation,' it seems that some of the most hostile and bitter posters can't help but smear us at every turn.
     I'm 26 years old, relatively new to the poltical process, but a passionate supporter of the obligation of every American to dissent and to make their voice heard through the vote. It's no secret that there's been a lot of apathy among my peers about the political process. It's been tough...my first time voting in a presidential election was in 2000, and we all know how THAT turned out.
     It's discouraging, and even more discouraging when i see people my age who just don't seem to care, who don't seem to feel like it matters if they get involved or not.
     Now we have someone who is tapping into the passions of the youthful voters, and giving them something to BELIEVE in. Agree with what he stands for or not, he is getting out the youth vote by bringing them hope and telling them that THEY, TOO can have a voice, that THEY, TOO can be a part of change. Normally, all we ever hear is shut up and sit down and do as we're told. I guess you don't matter till you hit a certain age.
     Recent posts on DU have confirmed that. I'm AMAZED at the hostility towards young voters. AMAZED AND SICKENED by it. We are the future of this country, and the generation coming up now, the next group of future voters. You'd think we'd want to include them, to educate them, to welcome them into the process. We get mocked for our enthusiasm, spit on for our embracing of hope, laughed at for our ideals. It's only a small minority of posters from an otherwise good group of people. But it still stings.
     I want to believe that America can be better, that we can be passionate again, that we can move our country forward, and make something happen. I DON'T want to be mocked, spit on, laughed at for it...by my fellow Democrats. I get enough of that from the pukes.
     The most bitter pill of all is that now Hillary Clinton herself has joined in the mocking. That burns me up, and it wounds me. Behavior like this does NOT tell me that she wants the younth vote...it tells me quite the opposite. I'm sick of being marganalized, again and again, because of my age. We are not children to be ridiculed...we are citizens of this country, we are voters, and we MATTER, dammit.
     I may be young, but I COUNT, I will be HEARD, and I will NOT shut up, sit down, and do as I am told!

[FrenchieCat]

1. Of course you count! For more than you know.......

which is why you are being discounted. They, who practice the politics of Cynicism want you to be a cynic too....because misery loves company.

Just remember what Obama said about the cynics; that they will get louder and louder in the upcoming weeks and months. Don't let them get you down! They ain't worth it!

Remember this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fZHou18Cdk

[Danger Mouse]

93. thank you for your support and understanding.

:hug:

[Skidmore]

244. Joining Frenchiecat in supporting you,

I'm an old lady who thinks young people are really needed now.

[progdog]

324. Me too! n/t

[aasleka]

334. Ignore the "me" generation, become the "we" generation!

[Kittycat]

2. Jealousy?

Because they don't have your youth

Because you aren't old enough to be hardened by politics (cynic)

Because your Vote DOES count

Because they didn't do what you're doing now, and it's a smacking reminder for them how they sat on their ass.

Okay, that's just a few. It doesn't apply to everyone, and can certainly apply to supporters on either side - although admittedly, more one side than the other. I'm a bit older than you, but I'm glad to see you engaged. Keep up the good work :)

[Hippo_Tron]

82. You know I'm 21 and I'm pretty damn cynical

I don't think Obama is the saviour and I don't think he can work miracles. I think he can move the country in the right direction just a bit more than Hillary can. I guess that makes me a crazy hopemonger.

[Kittycat]

108. I agree with you - and I'm 33.

The point is to open the dialogue. Which isn't something HRC is presenting. I have no doubt it will be a long road, but at least it's one Obama is willing to travel on.

[Danger Mouse]

110. thank you...

and glad to work with you.
:hug: :pals:

[tabatha]

3. Good for you.

It is the younger generation that is going to have to pay for the mistakes of older generations - and I am glad to see that youngsters are taking this responsibility by being involved.

And that is why Obama's campaign is so extraordinary - it is working extremely hard to get new voters involved not only in the voting process, but if he wins, involved in this country to get things back on the right track.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

4. Well said.

:thumbsup:

[Danger Mouse]

26. thanks.

:pals:

[KhaOZ]

69. As a 28 year old in the Military who normally goes for the Republican

I second this post. Stop hating on our generation. And stop acting like those of us who normally vote republican, are only voting Obama to get rid of Hillary. It's not always about her. It occur to anyone that maybe we just like Obama? I think the man will be incredible for our nation.

[RainDog]

273. I've seen it go both ways

here. And the people who make some big distinction between generations, in big generalities, are assholes in other ways too. Obama is from my generation, yet I would be labeled as one of those who doesn't get it because I'm not 25? Surely not. Who are boomers anyway? I've always been called someone on the "tail end" of boomers, but their experiences were nothing like mine. When they were in college, I was in elementary school, so I really don't get these age-based stereotypes.

I'm so happy to see people who want to change the way things are and I want to smack down all the Cokie Roberts, etc. who talk about a "cult" or say that younger voters won't show up... that's just bullshit political putdowns because she's rich, she's got hers, so everyone else can fuck off.

I am soooo excited to think that we will have the first African-American president in U.S. history! I'm so happy I get to be a part of this momentous time, and I've talked to my kids about this too, both of whom will be able to vote by the tiime of elections (tho not now for one.)

I want to believe things can be better. I know there are some extremists assholes on the right who will frantically try to stop anything good here, anything progressive, because their lives are hate-based. But please don't assume that most ppl here are like that, b/c I'm sure they're not.

[JimGinPA]

5. Take A Cue From Barack...

Stay calm, take the high road. That doesn't mean ignore the bullshit though.

:headbang:

[Danger Mouse]

9. it's tough to remain calm right now...

considering have to drop two alerts for us being comapred to supporters of hitler, hitler youth, and 'the worst generation'...
but i am trying.

[anonymous171]

6. I hear ya!

They cannot keep us out like they did with Generation X. We will not be shut out of the system.

[angie_love]

12. Welcome to DU! The more the merrier

:hi:

[lastliberalintexas]

396. As a member of Gen X, I must say that

Gen X was not *kept* out of the system- it opted out voluntarily. Hopefully your generation's turnout rates will be higher than mine.

[Lautremont]

7. Hmm - you come of age, and presto, Bush is elected! Coincidence? I think not!

No wonder we hate you.



Sarcasm, in case you thought otherwise.

[Danger Mouse]

28. very little would surprise me at this point.

thanks, though.
:hi:

[angie_love]

8. They're just bitter, don't pay attention to them.

I'm 27 and have been involved in politics since I was 18. Don't let the haters take away your voice. You count, I count, and the millions of other "young" voters count. We are voting at 2:1 over RETHUGS. Alot of that has to do with the young folks. We are passionate and will be there for Obama in November, no matter what the bitter cynical pundits on TV say. They underestimate us at their peril. Lets show them in November!:grouphug:

[Danger Mouse]

11. Damn right on that.

:grouphug: :pals: :toast:
They ignore us at their own peril.

[casus belli]

10. We'll have the last laugh when Social Security runs out of $.

And yes, I'm joking. :)

It is the nature of some older people to demand respect simply because they feel age has awarded them that. While I agree that elders should be respected, the point they seem to be missing is that respecting them doesn't mean they are always correct.

[ContinentalOp]

122. Not likely.

It will stay afloat just long enough to pay all of the boomers and then they'll kill it before we can retire.

[casus belli]

131. We'll all just have to quit our jobs then.

That'll teach 'em. ;)

[ContinentalOp]

182. I can get behind that.

}(

[Arkana]

355. Don't forget that massive pile of debt they're going to leave us with.

[blonndee]

13. The goal of some is precisely for you to "shut up, sit down, and do as you are told."

For others, well, they're just bitter. Ignore them and keep your eyes on the prize. We have work to do, and I and many others are ready to get to work with you! :)

[Danger Mouse]

22. i'm glad to hear that.

i have no intention of giving up, and i hope my fellow younger voters feel the same.

[Voice for Peace]

14. You ARE the future of this country.

" I want to believe that America can be better, that we can be passionate again, that we can move our country forward, and make something happen."

The people who are bugging you are like the dogs that howl at the moon.
Be like the moon; it doesn't bother about the dogs.

[blogslut]

15. Because they got nuthin'

All they can do is try to divide us, confuse us and make an effort to instill fear. Old against young, black against white, woman against man, latte liberals against dunkin donut Dems. Fear, fear fear. Rinse. Repeat.

Be prepared for more. This won't let up until we win the White House.

[Danger Mouse]

16. all they are doing is galvanizing us.

[blogslut]

24. shhh

;)

[Bread and Circus]

17. Have you ever heard the tune American Pie?

A lot of the oldsters were around when guys like Bobby Kennedy got shot. For them, the music died. They've lost contact with the sort of feeling that anything is possible. In a word, they've become cynical. For a good 30 to 40+ years they really haven't had anyone worth getting excited bout. As the 2 headed hydra known as the US government has devolved into jingoism and jaded ploys, it's hard to blame them.

In essence, they lost their dreams and their ability to dream. And when they see the next generation filled with all that hope again, it causes an internal dissonance because it reminds them of what they used to have but can never get back.

[Danger Mouse]

19. I'm cynical too, but 7 years of bush...

have made me hungry for change, and something to hope for.
I'm sick of being bitter.
edit: i have, and it's a great song.

[0007]

106. Here's some food for thought o'buddy.

Bye, bye Miss American Pie drove my Chevy to the levy but the levy was dry an them good ol' boys were drinkin whiskey and rye singin this will be the day that I die, this will be the day that I die.

Did you write the book of love and do you have faith in God above, if the bible tells you so, and do you believe in rock n' roll, can music save your mortal soul and can you teach me how to dance real slow? Well I know that you're in love with him cuz I saw you dancin in the gym you both kicked off your shoes and I dig those rhythm and blues. I was a lonely teenage bronkin buck with a pink carnation and a pick up truck but I knew I was out of luck, the day, the music, died. I started singin...

Chorus

Now for ten years we've been on our own and moss grows fat on a rollin stone but that's not how it used to be, when the jester sang for the king and queen in a coat he borrowed from James Dean and a voice that came from you and me, oh and while the king was looking down, the jester stole his thorny crown the courtroom was adjourned, no verdict was returned, and while Lenin read a book on Marx, the quartet practiced in the park and we sang dirges in the dark, the day, the music, died. We were singin...

Chorus

Helter Skelter in a summer swelter the birds flew off with a fallout shelter, eight miles high and fallin fast, its the land that falled on the grass the players tried for a forward pass with the jester on the sidelines in a cast, now the half-time air was sweet perfume while the sergeants played a marching tune we all got up to dance oh but we never got the chance oh as the players tried to take the field the marching band refused to yield do you recall what was revealed, the day, the music, died. We started singin...

Chorus

Oh and there we were all in one place, a generation lost in space with no time left to start again, so come on, Jack be nimble, Jack be quick, Jack Flash sat on a candle stick because fire is the devils only friend, oh and as I watched him on the stage, my hands were clinched in fists of rage, no angel born in hell could break that satan's spell and as the planes climbed high into the night to light the sacrificial right I saw satan laughing with delight, the day, the music, died. He was singin...

Chorus

I met a girl who sang the blues and I asked her for some happy news but she just smiled and turned away, I went down to the sacred store where I'd heard the music years before but the man there said the music wouldn't play and in the streets the children screamed, the lovers cried, and the poets dreamed but not a word was spoken, the church bells all were broken and the three men I admire most, the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost, they caught the last train for the coast, the day, the music, died, and they were singin...

Chorus

They were singin... Bye, bye Miss American Pie drove my Chevy to the levy but the levy was dry an them good ol' boys were drinkin whiskey and rye singin this will be the day that I die.

- Do you know what American Pie is about?

- Read about the death of The Beatles' Paul McCartney

- Learn about the Eagles' Hotel California
http://www.rareexception.com/Garden/AmLyrics.php

[0007]

116. Here ya go!

Bye, bye Miss American Pie drove my Chevy to the levy but the levy was dry an them good ol' boys were drinkin whiskey and rye singin this will be the day that I die, this will be the day that I die.

Did you write the book of love and do you have faith in God above, if the bible tells you so, and do you believe in rock n' roll, can music save your mortal soul and can you teach me how to dance real slow? Well I know that you're in love with him cuz I saw you dancin in the gym you both kicked off your shoes and I dig those rhythm and blues. I was a lonely teenage bronkin buck with a pink carnation and a pick up truck but I knew I was out of luck, the day, the music, died. I started singin...

Chorus

Now for ten years we've been on our own and moss grows fat on a rollin stone but that's not how it used to be, when the jester sang for the king and queen in a coat he borrowed from James Dean and a voice that came from you and me, oh and while the king was looking down, the jester stole his thorny crown the courtroom was adjourned, no verdict was returned, and while Lenin read a book on Marx, the quartet practiced in the park and we sang dirges in the dark, the day, the music, died. We were singin...

Chorus

Helter Skelter in a summer swelter the birds flew off with a fallout shelter, eight miles high and fallin fast, its the land that falled on the grass the players tried for a forward pass with the jester on the sidelines in a cast, now the half-time air was sweet perfume while the sergeants played a marching tune we all got up to dance oh but we never got the chance oh as the players tried to take the field the marching band refused to yield do you recall what was revealed, the day, the music, died. We started singin...

Chorus

Oh and there we were all in one place, a generation lost in space with no time left to start again, so come on, Jack be nimble, Jack be quick, Jack Flash sat on a candle stick because fire is the devils only friend, oh and as I watched him on the stage, my hands were clinched in fists of rage, no angel born in hell could break that satan's spell and as the planes climbed high into the night to light the sacrificial right I saw satan laughing with delight, the day, the music, died. He was singin...

Chorus

I met a girl who sang the blues and I asked her for some happy news but she just smiled and turned away, I went down to the sacred store where I'd heard the music years before but the man there said the music wouldn't play and in the streets the children screamed, the lovers cried, and the poets dreamed but not a word was spoken, the church bells all were broken and the three men I admire most, the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost, they caught the last train for the coast, the day, the music, died, and they were singin...

Chorus

They were singin... Bye, bye Miss American Pie drove my Chevy to the levy but the levy was dry an them good ol' boys were drinkin whiskey and rye singin this will be the day that I die.

[cascadiance]

319. As a young'un from the 60's...

I was always partial to the timelessness today of Earth Opera's "Great American Eagle Tragedy"...

From this backward looking web page (and also listening to it now...)
http://www.lynnertic.com/friday-protest-songs/earth-opera-the-great-american-eagle-tragedy/

Earth Opera: The Great American Eagle Tragedy

And call out the border guard,
The kingdom is crumbling!
The king is in the counting house,
Laughing and stumbling.
His armies are extended
Way beyond the shore.
As he sends our lovely boys to die
In a foreign jungle war.

Huh, huh, huh, huh…

The queen is in the garden,
Moaning and weeping.
She spied the executioner’s face
While he lay sleeping.
The king’s own judge and jester
leaped together from the tower.
Lie still as fallen statues
In the cultivated bower, bower.

And call out the border guard,
The kingdom is crumbling!
The king is in the counting house,
Laughing and stumbling.
His armies are extended,
Way beyond the shore.
As he sends our lovely boys to die
In a foreign jungle war.

Huh, huh, huh, huh…

The orchestra assembles,
And tries in vain to tune.
While outside in the stableyard,
The hounds are howling at the moon.
A blind man in the far off jungle,
His bramble hut in flames,
Sits and whispers to his flute
All the unremembered names.

And call out the border guard.
The kingdom is crumbling.
The king is in the counting house,
Laughing and stumbling.
His armies are extended,
Way beyond the shore.
As he sends our lovely boys to die
In a foreign jungle war.

Huh, huh, huh, huh… My god!

The scarlet cloaked and white horsed huntsman
Rides upon the meadow green.
His silver arrow scars the sky,
and I can hear the eagle scream.
The peasants watch in dumb-struck wonder!
The gay procession passed them by.
The victory silence is consuming me!
And we’ve killed at last the eagle’s cry!

And call out the border guard.
The kingdom is crumbling.
The king is in the pouting house,
Laughing and stumbling.
His armies are extended,
Way beyond the shore.
As he sends our lovely boys to die,
As we send our lovely boys to die,
As you send our lovely boys to die
In a foreign jungle war.

Ah, huh, huh, huh…

Why people, I can’t stand it any more!
I, I, I can’t stand it any more!

I god!
Oh God! Oh God! Oh God! Oh God!
Where is that place!

Bye, bye, bye, bye!
Die, die, die, die!
Bye, bye, bye, bye!
Die, die, die, die!
Oh no! oh no! OH NO!

STOP THE WAR! STOP THE WAR!
Oh PLEASE!

[tammywammy]

18. The reference to Hilter Youth tonight was just too much

Because why? I'm under 30. It's pathetic and disgusting.

I've worked hard. I have a decent job. I own a home. But yet, I'm not supposed to count. Oh, and I'm not some fucking latte liberal, I made a whopping $26,000 last year.

Fuck that. And fuck those that keep saying people under 30 don't matter, we sure as hell do.


edited to add: And recommended!

[Danger Mouse]

20. yeah, a latte liberal, when i make as much as a gas station clerk...

to have kids scream 'fuck you!' at me all day. :P

[jgraz]

96. Whaa?? Hitler Youth?

Are you fucking kidding me?

[Danger Mouse]

101. yup...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4752919&mesg_id=4753372
right above this post...it was deleted.
there are other references to hitler in the thread as well.

[jgraz]

112. Ah, smalll. One of our brightest lights.

Did I say "brightest lights"? Sorry, I meant "biggest losers".

[Danger Mouse]

114. just keep telling ourselves....

march 5th...only till march 5th...

[Alexander]

210. It can't come soon enough. 9 days until these idiots get the tombstones they deserve.

[tammywammy]

109. It was deleted

But you can tell where it was

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4752919


And the same poster is telling all us younger voters to "Please leave politics to us."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4753960&mesg_id=4754198

[ContinentalOp]

133. And you probably bought your home from someone older who made a fortune off of it.

The worst is here in California where Proposition 13 means that property taxes never go up and so young homeowners who have bought during this housing bubble are subsidizing everyone else. We end up paying way higher property taxes than our parents whose houses are worth more money.

[tammywammy]

138. Actually no I didn't

:)

It was a foreclosure that sat on the market for 6 months. Needs some updating inside, but overall in good condition. I got it for under market value, hence why I could afford it. :)

[ContinentalOp]

183. Aw, but that ruins the point I was trying to make.

Can't I be allowed my little inter-generational stereotype? :P

[rodeodance]

21. Yawn

[Colobo]

92. What the heck is wrong with you, rodeo?

Seriously, why are you so bitter lately?

[Danger Mouse]

95. i saw only 'ignored'

:D

[Kahuna]

222. I'm a 53 year old grandma, and I have a very high regard for the young

people today. They play hard but they work hard too. And their hearts are in the right place. And oh yeah, they're very very smart. I think you're wonderful.

[skooooo]

261. me too! ignore is great!

[MadBadger]

100. Cuz Rodeo went all out with the Wisconsin Propaganda, and we smoked her.

[rodeodance]

170. I tire of all the whining Obamafolk. simple as that.

[RandomKoolzip]

300. Why do you narrow this down to "obamafolk?" It's a legitimate topic.

I see far too much bashing of younger voters than I can be comfortable with - and I'm only 33.




Fuck, why bother? I bet I'll get a mere subject line response - or nothing at all, though. :eyes:

[Danger Mouse]

302. he could fart in your face...

and that would be about the maturity level of his response to you.

[RandomKoolzip]

303. Yeah, but he USED to be cool. I'm wondering what happened.

It kinda makes me sad.

[Danger Mouse]

309. i don't know...the partisan divisions are passionate.

it's caused some people to act in ways they wouldn't normally act.

[smalll]

23. Well as the coiner of "the worst generation" let me try to answer sincerely (but briefly) --

Yes, a lot of us older people ARE saying "get offa my political process" to you youngsters. But one reason, at least for me, is that in just about EVERY other facet of contemporary society, you young people (and your panderers/enablers in the entertainment/advertising industrial complex) rule EVERYTHING. You guys are the reason there's basically nothing to see at the local cineplex. You guys are the reason why women have a hard time buying clothes that aren't just way too small, way too childish and/or way too slutty for grown-ups. You guys rule everything BUT politics.

Please leave politics to us.

[Danger Mouse]

25. you make me want to puke, quite literally.

it must suck to be so very, very bitter.

[EmilyAnne]

41. We are the worst generation because you're pissed about buying clothes? Are you serious?

And I love your use of the word slutty. Nice display of sexism there.

[KhaOZ]

86. small: It was left to you, you elected Bush...Twice. Time for the New Generation to take over.

[juno jones]

335. And Reagan, don't forget Reagan!

We are too young to have that albatross to nailed to our heads, thank Gods!

Reagan won by carrying the vote of 25% of the eligible voters at the time. Where was all the activism then?

Maybe they were too busy wearing qiana and watching Saturday Night Fever at the cineplex while their experienced elders were voting. :rofl:

[Bongo Prophet]

107. Count me as one 50 year old who welcomes each and every dem with open arms.

That "generation gap" bullshit was played on me too, when i was still a kid. Bullshit then, bullshit now.
It is done to split us up.
By age, gender, race, etc etc.

That is the only way the right can win - and why they do the caging and other vote suppression tactics.


Some fall for it, most don't.
Please, never forget that, and know that we stand strongest when we stand together.:thumbsup:

[KhaOZ]

111. thank you, though i'm still more independant than dem, but thank you anyway :)

[Bongo Prophet]

154. Well, then i should expand that to say all involved to fight racists and other crypto fascists.

The coalition against hard right often includes those outside of party, and in my history, I am often on the leftward fringe. But since we are on DU, it seemed best to use that term. As a practical matter, in my opinion, strategic moves have to be made to climb a little, set up basecamp and then move a little more. Reach too far, allowing the right to do their reactionary fear thing, and we have setbacks.

The principle of mutual respect always should be a constant, however.
The class/education thing pops up here often as well, and too many fall for the trap and begin looking down on people.
Exploiting human weakness and tribal identity is one of those tricks that just keep on giving.

Glad to have you here, KhaOZ. :hi:

[KhaOZ]

173. Much agreed, and thanks again. It was my support for Obama, and a link someone sent me, that

brought me to DU. I am however now a registered Democrat, since it was required before they'd let me caucus for Obama in my state.

Here's the thread that brought me here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4573084

Someone linked me that in a political chatroom, and I found it to be a great read.

[tammywammy]

27. "Please leave politics to us."

Get over yourself.

[Danger Mouse]

30. let's leave politics to the big boys and girls..

since smalll's obvious wisdom and maturity puts us young punks to shame.

[scheming daemons]

76. This attitude is EXACTLY why Hillary is tanking... and the poster and their ilk just don't get it...

....

[Egnever]

34. Dont know how old you are but thats a pretty pathetic life you are living

[anonymous171]

37. With all respect to my elder,

No. We've had enough of rule by the aged elite. It's time America was ruled by the all the people, old and young.

[angie_love]

38. Sheesh, thats the reason you call us the "worst generation"

Wow I've never disrespected my elders, EVER, not once, and this is the kind of crap thats spewed upon us. No wonder we're upset and not going to take it anymore! Its not our fault that all these companies pander to the youth, why not blame the companies, why blame us?

"You guys are the reason why women have a hard time buying clothes that aren't just way too small"

How ridiculous!!! This is such an obnoxious statement. Fashion designers who put size zero models on the covers are the reason girls want to be thin. DOn't blame it on youth, blame it on the fucking designers who do this shit. The real world isn't made of stick thin girls who want to dress skanky. How utterly obnoxious of you.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

42. It's people *your age* marketing that bullshit.

Don't blame us or put us in some stereotypical box. We are not all apathetic, mindless, shallow zombies that fit your narrow worldview, no matter how badly you want that to be true.

If you want to blame somebody for the dumbing down of our culture, blame the greedy fuckheads of your age group for pushing those things.

[Danger Mouse]

47. speaking logic and reason to that so-and-so...

is a wasted effort.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

49. I have too much free time.

:P

[mitchum]

390. Exactly! I've always said that it's just boomers pimping their kids to each other

sick stuff

[MR. ELECTABLE]

51. "Please leave politics to us."

Because you all have been doing such a good job at it.

[fizzgig]

68. we rule everything?

this is news to me and really, what does this have to do with politics and your desire to shut out anyone who is under a certain age?

tell me, who are my enablers in big oil? who are my enablers at the big telecoms? who are my enablers in hollywood and what the hell exactly are the enabling me to do? and why do you think it is only people my age who consume the crap out there?

people have been out to make money and have pandered to the masses long before we were even born.

and who are you to tell me that i am not able to exercise my right in the political process? people your age sure have made a mess out of things, what makes you think they can fix it?

[RaleighNCDUer]

75. You're living up to your name, Smalll --

THIS old boomer is more than ready to pass the torch to anyone who has the energy and the will to take on the fascists.

BTW, did you see the Academy Awards tonite? A HELL of a line up - films worthy of any I've seen in 50 years. Don't say there's nothing happening at the cineplex.

As for the 'worst generation', you might want to remember what generation put Reagan, Bush, Clinton, and Bush in power, all to the detriment of our democracy (yes, I did include Clinton - even though I voted for him twice, he bears responsibility for not standing up to the repuke machine, giving us NAFTA, et al - you know the drill).

I'll tell you, if I grew up under the circumstances the new generation faced, I can't concieve how I could not be bitter and cynical about government - instead, it is a generation that is still willing and able to fight. This generation will be the one to give us single-payer healthcare. This generation will be the one to finally put the cold war to rest. This generation will be the one to say 'No!' to American hegemony, and close those 700 military bases across the world, rejecting empire.

If our generation doesn't fuck it up for them first.

[angie_love]

115. Wow...speechless, amazing post.

:yourock:

[RaleighNCDUer]

139. Aww,

shucks.:hug:

[Danger Mouse]

147. beautiful post...thank you.

:pals:

[KhaOZ]

78. It was left to you, you elected Bush...Twice. Time for the New Generation to take over.

[DemBones DemBones]

387. OK, New Generation, step right up and watch the GOP

steal the election again. Obama is exactly who they want to run against.

[Colobo]

99. I'm 24, and I feel... insulted by your post.

This is our country too, and you have no right to tell us not to be involved in its political process. Who the hell do you think you are?

[Danger Mouse]

103. he's done a lot of insulting tonight.

he's done a lot of insulting in general.
i, for one, have had it with him.

[Forkboy]

130. Quit acting like a dank tuft of rectal pubic hair.

You're on a roll tonight...all downhill.

[MagickMuffin]

155. As an older woman I find your post disturbing and disgusting, perhaps you need a time out

I for one welcome their input and their vote.

I don't know what you're babbling about with your reasons for blaming the youth of today.:shrug:

smalll, that says it ALL.

[Danger Mouse]

162. thank you very much for being supportive.

:pals:

[MagickMuffin]

205. Well, Elrond not all of us are blind to the political atmosphere

:hug:...I sincerely welcome younger voters. I was once young myself, and I remember my generation was also crapped upon. I never quite figured it out, and don't understand why some people would want to continue along that same path. It really is bizarre.

As far as the last (S)election and the media making their false claims that the youth didn't come out to vote was bullshit. C-SPAN aired a precinct at a college. There were a lot of young adults there to vote, however, they were pissed off because there weren't very many machines to vote on. Some of these "kids" were waiting in line for hours for the chance to cast their very first vote ever, for the president of the United States. Some of them were forced to miss class just so they could exercise the right to vote.
I also witnessed several young black "kids" as well as older people that were waiting in line in the rain and cold to cast a ballot. Ken Blackwell the SOS and the Chairman of Bush/Cheney's re(S)election of Ohio knew to limit machines in the districts that were democratic. My heart broke into several pieces over that horrible day.

I was so full of hope after watching every Kerry/Edwards rallies covered by C-SPAN. I knew Kerry would win after seeing how many people were showing up for them. Of course I knew that the MACHINE was in place to steal it once again.

I faced the same kind of false claims growing up. I cast my first ballot for Jimmy Carter, and I was excited about it. I registered as soon as I become of age. However, I don't ever recall my parents generation telling me to stay out of the voting process.

I'm sorry such smalll minded people are calling you those hateful names/terms. It just shows them as being smalll minded and not very bright.

Thank you for caring enough about Democracy to be involved in the process. Please don't let these older farts discourage you.

YOU MATTER TO ME.:pals:

[MrRobotsHolyOrders]

213. Old and in the way

You and those like you have done nothing but fuck it up with self-righteous bitching and political cowardice. Two boomer presidents, two abject embarrassments. Thankfully, Obama will spare us a third.

[JVS]

242. McCain isn't a boomer. He's too old for that.

[Raejeanowl]

409. Pssst....He's A Boomer n/t

[Political Heretic]

219. Uh... when you stop fucking up the country we'll start "leaving politics" to you.

I'm probably not young enough, but I'm siding with inclusiveness here against the grumpy asshole wing of the party. :(

[WritingIsMyReligion]

224. Why should we "leave politics to [you]" when you've already fucked it up so badly?

:shrug:

[Recursion]

233. Yeah, because you've done *such* a great job at it so far

:sarcasm:

[all.of.me]

246. Got kids? Are they in that age range? nt

[SoxFan]

267. Right. The Boomers NEVER dominated pop culture

:eyes:

[mrreowwr_kittty]

269. Ever hear of Chico's? nt

[rockymountaindem]

284. First of all, no, we won't leave politics to you

Secondly, who's marketing all those things you talk about to the youth of today? Baby-boomer marketers and execs in suits that we'll never see, that's who. It's a two way street.

[Chulanowa]

317. That's a joke, right?

I'm going to assume you're joking, 'cause I can't fathom that being a serious statement.

We're the reason there's nothing to see at the cineplex? Well, hate to break it to you, we're not the ones making the movies. We'll buy tickets because it beats sitting at home watching a sitcom. Sorry. Hey, maybe you've reached that age where you don't want to look at anything different than you had while growing up? My mom's that way. I don't know if she's ever seen a movie made after 1985 that doesn't involve asteroids smacking earth or something.

We're the reason women have a... Okay, you know what? That's the stupidest thing I've ever read on DU, and you're facing stiff competition lately.

[Not Sure]

340. Jeezus Christ...

not only are you proud of coining a term designed to discount the young people who see a light in the darkness, who saw through the bullshit our Republican AND Democratic parents were spouting years ago and are now taking advantage of the fact that we can vote, you come here and try to justify it with nothing to see at the movies? Your body doesn't fit into clothes from the GAP? Astounding...

You get nothing at the cineplex or on the radio or on the TV because your generation "deregulated" it! Get the fuck over it and do what WE told you to do when we were in high school - KILL YOUR TELEVISION! Go make your own fucking movie and learn to sew your own clothes. Don't stuff your face full of supersized meals and bitch about the taste. You people were the ones who were too checked out of parenthood that you let Ronald McDonald babysit us. What the hell did you think would happen?

Now you're going to complain that we want to change things? No, it's your turn to sit back and shut up.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

341. You're A Bigot, And You Are Making Yourself Look Quite Ignorant Here.

Don't be so resistant to change. Things change. Either bend in the wind, or break.

[Arkana]

357. No.

Get over it.

[Hayduke Lives]

362. As someone in my late 30s

I've lived under the shadow of the boomers. My generation was the post-boomer bust. We are negligible demographic and have had little influence over the cultural marketplace.

But while I share your skepticism about the current state of culture, I wouldn't be so quick to blame the victims. I sure as hell wouldn't want to be in my 20s today. People my age are about the last to really remember life in America before Reagan - an advantage that the younger generation doesn't have.

There are things that SERIOUSLY worry me about the younger generation. Take an issue like the environment. They've been raised on electronic media and have dangerously little relationship to the non-manufactured world...and look how issues like wilderness conservation have fallen off the map. Moreover on civic and community issues, I don't know how you can be invested in the well being of your community when you don't interact with your neighbors. I really fear the long term impact of the internet. How will all this disconnectedness impact their political impulses? The deafening quiet about the Iraq War is probably a good indication, sadly.

That said, they are NOT a "bad generation". I think that individuals will persevere and rise out of the quagmire of the current culture. It is individuals that make the difference - not "generations".

Somewhere - I have to believe - there is a 22 year old that doesn't listen to crappy hip-hop music. Somewhere, a young person is reading a newspaper, learning history, talking to a neighbor, making their own beer, sleeping under stars on some mesa contemplating how to instigate revolution, end the war, fuck the Man and change the world. Somewhere, right now, some young black woman is being shaped by subtle forces, discovering Miles Davis, and changing the rules in her neighborhood. She'll be the butterfly's wing that starts the hurricane.

It's always been thus. If you look at the shite state of the current youth culture and get disgusted at young people, the you are forgetting that it's almost always been shite.

[Hekate]

374. My gods, is that asinine. May I sincerely inquire if you a troll, what with all that divisiveness?

And I mean that sincerely.

Hekate

[mitchum]

382. But if you are from the boomer generation, you also had your turn...

where EVERYTHING revolved around you. Absolutely freakin' everything. Don't deny it; you know it's true.
Me? I have no dog in this fight; I belong to the blank generation.

[Warren DeMontague]

402. That's gotta be one of the most idiotic arguments I think I've ever seen put forth here.

Do yourself a favor and look into Buddhism or a similar philosophical framework that will, hopefully, allow you to accept the inevitable.


the wheel is turning and it can't slow down.
You can't let go, and you can't hold on.
Can't go back and you can't stand still.

If the thunder don't get you, then the lightning will.

[D23MIURG23]

414. "Please leave politics to us. "

Bite me. You need us as allies whether or not you are smart enough to realize it.


P.S. - The actions of the "entertainment/advertising industrial complex" have little to do with the wishes of many of us. I boycott television and almost all movies to avoid that crap myself.

[knight_of_the_star]

419. And as something to add

Leaving politics to you guys gave us Bush for 8 years, NAFTA, Triangulation, and all those other joys of political life. I think you need to hand over the keys.

[knight_of_the_star]

418. And I bet once upon a time

You were with the people shouting out, "Don't Trust Anyone Over 30!"

Just to mention it, it is people YOUR age who control the entertainment industry and the fashion industry and all that stuff, so if you want to blame us you should first get a mirror.

[Heywood J]

435. Go Cheney yourself,

you evidently deserve it after all that pent-up frustration. Boo-hoo-hoo. Young people are the reason the world sucks, the reason for all its ills. Do you even have one single, solitary clue as to what you sound like?


The only reason there's no alert on you is because you forgot to mention Hitler this time. Just an oversight on your part, I suppose. You'll get 'em next time, slugger.

[CarbonDate]

439. You did not coin that term.

It was originally applied to... ahem... the baby boomers.

Why don't you just call us "you people" and get it done with?

[CarbonDate]

441. Oh, and we don't wear bell-bottoms.

You want to talk about fashion atrocities? Yeesh.

[cbayer]

29. Back it up, please. That part about recent posts insulting your generation.

The attacks you experience are not due to your age or your passion for your candidate. It's about your hostility towards those that share your beliefs but do not share you conviction that there is only one solution.

I could not be more enthralled at the enthusiasm (finally) of your generation. You have sat back way too long and I not only welcome but encourage your involvement and enthusiasm. You can make or break this election. And, frankly, it's about time you took a stand.

If you are mocked, spat upon or laughed at, I think it has a lot more to do with your method and much less with your age.

Hillary Clinton is not your mom and not your enemy. You may prefer Obama, but Clinton is not your enemy and would be a much better alternative than what we have now. Attacking her and her supporters is really equivalent to everything you complain of in your OP. Think about it.

So I applaud you for not shutting up, sitting up and doing what you are told. But I encourage you to look closely at who is your friend and who is your enemy.

[Danger Mouse]

33. read this thread and then try to tell me that people don't hate young voters on this forum.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4752919&mesg_id=4752919

note the references to hitler, hitler youth, and the term 'the worst generation'

[cbayer]

45. Whatever.

I recognize your power.

I just challenge you to use it wisely.

Did you read my post?

[Danger Mouse]

52. i don't spend my time on here attacking hillary..

though of late, i have disliked her more.
i spend most of my time defending against mean-spirited supporters of the other side.

[cbayer]

79. Yeah you do.

And I just want to re-iterate that I totally respect your involvement and enthusiasm. I WANT you to take the reins. And I really like your candidate and will be there with you if that's how it goes.

But i strongly disagree that you are being attacked because of your age. If you experience attacks, it is about your method not your motive.

This is a we vs. they fight. We just need to be very thoughtful about who we and they are.

And I am not your enemy.

[Danger Mouse]

81. excuse me?

you shat on my thread on the lounge last night, when it seriously was NOT needed, incidentally.
so i'm calling you on it.
provide some fucking evidence.

[cbayer]

124. I like you Elrond. I respect you.

And I am not trying to shit on your threads.

I just respect you enough to challenge you.

And if you want a piece of why I challenge you, I will give you this:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=post&forum=132&topic_id=4717410&mesg_id=4718123

I find that offensive and unwise. And I think it is attacking one of our candidates.

I want to be on the team you are on and want you on my team. That's all.

edited because I can't type.

[Danger Mouse]

152. i said 'it seems'...which is how i saw it.

i would rather be proved wrong.
i used the :puke: because the idea sickened me.
if that's the best you could come up with, then keep reaching...i've seen a hell of a lot worse.

[cbayer]

164. As I said last night, I mean no offense.

You are worth challenging because you have substance. I recognize that.

I hope you do not really believe that Hillary Clinton is trying to take down the democratic party. And I truly hope that you do not see me as your enemy.

The mom in me comes out when I see someone like you. I see what you got and I want you to question, question, question.

And I do not want to be your enemy.

So I will back off once again.

Peace and good night.

[Danger Mouse]

169. you're not my enemy.

my enemy is people like smalll.
i personally hope that hillary would not do something so rash...do i think she would? i can't say. i'm just worried about her actions.

[tammywammy]

36. Look over this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4752919

Nothing warranted the reply with a picture of the Hilter Youth (It's been deleted, but you can see where it was).

[fizzgig]

87. back it up, please

show me links where he has attacked clinton. i don't mean criticized, i mean attacked.

[Danger Mouse]

89. thank you.

:hug:

[cbayer]

128. We may disagree on what constitutes an attack vs. a criticism

but I think the link I posted above is an attack.

And I think that posts with vomiting emoticons could hardly be considered anything else.

[fizzgig]

137. that's all you've got?

seriously?

[parasim]

31. I don't know why...

But many people from my generation (I'm 50), seem to be genuinely threatened by you younger folk. I have no clue way many people my age have such a hard time remembering how they felt about the state of things when we were your age.

Why is there such hostility towards young voters? I don't know, maybe we should ask our own parents why they were so afraid of us back then...

All I know is, your generation gives me hope that what I fought for in the 70's is still worth fighting for today. Keep it up! :thumbsup:

[Danger Mouse]

43. that means a lot to hear that.

this is a fight for ALL of us...our future. not just those who think they 'matter' more than others.
ALL OF US.
:hi:

[angie_love]

44. I love your post, its so full of wisdom and courage!

I admire people like you and it gives me hope.

[tammywammy]

50. Thank you

:hug:

[jlake]

32. meh

[Arkana]

358. What the hell does 'meh' mean?

[jlake]

408. Faux outrage & the response the age group will *generally* give during the GE.

[Arkana]

448. So it's not conceivable to you at all

that the younger crowd might just get a little pissed that you boomers think your shit doesn't stink?

[Heywood J]

436. I know what it means, and it still makes no sense.

It's like saying "Whatever."

"Yeah, there's a problem. But whatever. Too lazy to do anything or even say anything about it."

[Breeze54]

35. I don't know who said what but of course you all matter. Every citizen in the USA matters.

I hope all the idiotic stuff will stop soon too because not only is it dividing people who need each other because we all need each other but come November, no matter who is the nominee... we need everyone from age 18 to 105 to vote the rethug bastards out
of the house and the senate and the White House! Everyone should put down their weapons and hopefully they all will soon and we can all join together kicking the GOP's ass! Hang in there. November isn't that far away really.... it's only 7 months from now!! (February is almost over and Nov. 11th is at the beginning of the month.)
;) And it's almost Spring!! Bad moods will lift, birds will sing... smiles will return.

:woohoo: :woohoo:

[Danger Mouse]

39. THANK you. And i know it's not the majority of Hillary supporters...

and not even a large minority. just a few exceedingly nasty and bitter people.

[Breeze54]

73. To be honest...

I've seen some pretty nasty responses from both sides in the last few weeks.

I have some of them in probation/time out right now. Try it for the worst offenders.

It works! ;) And it is so much more peaceful too! :P

[housewolf]

40. Remember what John Edwards kept saying about entrenched power

Those in power tend to want to hold on to it for dear life (well, we're seeing a different example now with Fidel Castro giving up his position in Cuba, but that's real rare).

Here's an thought that might give you some insight. Some of the baby boomers feel threated and potentially cheated right now. They saw their parents' generation be in power from 1960 until 1992, 32 years and 7 presidents. In 1992, Bill Clinton became the first baby boomer president, then follwed by the 2nd baby boomer president, GWB. Hillary, if elected, would be the third.

Barak Obama is "officially" a baby boomer, born in 1962, I think (baby boomer years are officially 1946 - 1964), which puts him sort of as a more transitional figure between the baby boomers and the Gen X'ers. Baby boomers have a sense of entitlement and think that they should out-do their parents generation in every way, but here they see their era of holding the reins of power as potentially being fore-shortened by Barak Obama. Many are not ready to pass the torch.

Power does strange things to people, it tends to push reason and civility out the door.

Keep up your good work. It's difficult but necessary. The baby boomers and their parents have messed things up royally. It's going to take folks your age and younger to fix it, because you need to, and I don't think the baby boomers can.

Keep your sense of humor and good will. Good luck to you.

[Breeze54]

53. I'm sorry but you attacking boomers isn't the way to peace.

You are using a huge paintbrush to attack boomers and I think you're wrong... a lot wrong.

Please try to broaden your horizons more. You'll look and sound a whole lot smarter! ;)

[housewolf]

85. I am one of the early baby boomers

I call it as I see it.

I lost faith in my generation when the hippies partied through the "Me Decade", turned into yuppies and took to heart Gecko's creed: "Greed is good". Sorry to say, I don't think we (the baby boomers) can fix the mess we're in. I think it's gonna take some other folks with different generational experiences to do it.

[Breeze54]

119. Well, one 47 yr old can't do it without all the people involved

younger and older. He's not walking on water and you'd be wise to not keep grouping
all the older boomers under that BS greed meme. Not ALL the boomers went that way
and you know it, so get off your stump. There have also been good things boomers started.

[ContinentalOp]

156. I think you're right on target.

I don't mean this as an attack on a whole generation or any specific individuals, but I think it's pretty clear that the "Me Generation" does have a sense of entitlement that plays a factor in this generation gap. The boomers were always told that they were the "most." Theirs was the biggest generation. The 60s had the "best music ever." They fought for civil rights, stopped the vietnam war (yeah right). They are used to being the center of attention. They were basically the first generation where the "teenager" was recognized as a distinct age group. As the first real TV generation they have basically spent their whole lives in the marketing limelight.

The boomers are used to being the center of the universe because the entire world of marketing has always been after their dollars. Generation X was easy to ignore because our numbers were so small. So we never had that kind of power and always lived in the shadows of the boomers. But now that the Y generation rivals them in size there is a challenge to their supremacy that might be tough for some to handle.

I know it's wrong to engage in this kind of generational warfare on a thread that's supposed to be decrying that sort of thing. I just can't help but see this dynamic at work though.

[fizzgig]

46. didn't you get the memo?

we don't know shit about shit. past generations have never hoped, they have never held lofty ideals, they have never stood up to those who have told them to sit down and shut up, they have never been passionate about change.

we are too young, too stupid and too distracted by the trappings of our everyday lives to know anything or be of any worth in this process and we are the first generation to ever be that way.

never mind our generation is helping revitalize the party, that young voters are coming out in droves for dem candidates, never mind we are eager to fight for what we believe.

one of the things that is most disheartening is that there is so much outcry (and rightfully so) when every vote is not counted. MY vote is no less valuable than that of anyone else simply based on my age.

it reeks of sour grapes so much, but they will never see it that way

[Danger Mouse]

58. don't you just LOVE being treated like you don't matter?

:hug:

[fizzgig]

77. i'm sick of the double-speak

all votes matter...unless...

there is no unless in this process.

could you imagine the self-righteous indignation that would ensue if we were to suggest that people over 35 shouldn't be involved in the process because of the gods awful mess we have found ourselves in? it sure as hell hasn't been people our age voting for fisa...or kyl/lieberman...or to continue to fund the war...or to authorize the irw

but hey, the broad brush only works in our direction, right?

[Danger Mouse]

88. haha...good point.

you're on fire tonight. :P

[ContinentalOp]

167. But people over 35 SHOULDN'T be involved.

Haven't you seen Wild in the Streets?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_in_the_Streets

;)

[Breeze54]

178. I think older voters are very worried that

the younger voters will disappear like they have before, come voting time. That's one reason for the anger, imho. They didn't show up like expected in '00 & '04 and that's a big reason why we have Bush, Kyl and Lieberman and many others still in office that we were desperately trying to get rid of! You should try to see it from our point of view too and take ownership and get out the vote this time in November! I was registering voters in 2003 for the elections of '04 and when I approached young people (25 and under) they were not interested and told me so!!! But the gray haired's were so happy I was there and they were all willing to listen. But that was just my experience in my neck of the woods. The largest turnout of young voters in 2004 (if I remember correctly) was women in their early twenties only. All the rest were missing in action and we older voters are worried it will happen again.

[fizzgig]

181. but that doesn't mean those of us who do care should be dumped on

i am extremely disheartened by the low turnout of young voters, but i feel like we're being dismissed because our peers don't care.

[Breeze54]

186. Of course YOU shouldn't be dumped on or blamed for what a lot of some did.

Just like a lot of boomers shouldn't be blamed either. It's a two way street.

But whomever is running their mouths with stupid comments like that, then put them on iggy.

I also check the mental health groups to see if the people spouting are members there.

Sometimes they are... just saying. ;)

[ContinentalOp]

187. We didn't have a candidate to vote for!

I mean, what a shock that young people didn't get all fired up to campaign for John Kerry. :eyes:

If young people are voting for Obama in the primaries and he wins the nomination, they sure as hell aren't going to forget to vote for him in November! I agree though that things would have been dire if Hillary had been the nominee. And for a good reason too.

[Breeze54]

191. You had a Dem to vote for but they didn't care about voting at all. Voting wasn't on their radar!

They told me after I knocked on their door; "we just don't bother with that stuff." :eyes:
And then they giggling, took off walking in the rain and left me standing there. Imho, they didn't connect their vote with their economic situation or their school tuition or student loans or job opportunities or what have you. They just weren't connecting,
with the exception of younger women, and they didn't care.

[ContinentalOp]

203. I wonder why though.

Of course young people can be apathetic. We need candidates who can give them a reason to get out there to vote. And when that finally happens, the party shouldn't ridicule the young voters and smear the candidate who is getting them involved.

I mean, let's face it. The boomers who get all riled up about this only got politically active in the 60s because of the draft! Their asses were on the line! And now they only give a shit about Social Security. If you don't give young people a reason to vote for you then...BIG SHOCK... they're not going to vote for you!

Yes, it's stupid and short sighted for young people to not understand the importance of social security and health care but it's pretty understandable. And every other generation does the same, not just when they're young but in every election. Many elderly voters respond primarily to medicare or whatever issue affects them personally. My grandparents aren't going to respond to things like Obama's "google for government." But you know what, it's not for them.

[Breeze54]

212. When I was a young voter, I knew my vote was very important

and I got a lot of my friends to vote in that 1972 vote to stop the war in Vietnam
and the young voters came out in droves that year to also lower the drinking age. :P

Maybe we need to add incentives to vote for... not just great candidates? ;)

I thought this might interest you. It did me!

National Voter Turnout in Federal Elections: 1960–2006

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0781453.html

Turnout of voting-age population (percent)


2006 --- 43.6%

2004 --- 55.3%

2000 --- 51.3%

1998 --- 36.4% <--- :(

1972 --- 55.2%

1968 --- 60.8%

------------------------

Youth Vote Coalition

http://www.youthvote.org/voter/facts.cfm

26th Amendment

In 1971, the 26th amendment experienced the fastest ratification in history and
granted the right to vote in all elections to 11 and a half million 18-20 year olds.

1972 Election & Young Voters

The 1972 Election was the first Presidential election in which 18 year olds could vote
and 55% of 18-24 year old eligible voters cast ballots.

---> 42% of 18-24 year olds cast a ballot in 2000 :(

30.2% of 18-19 year olds voted. 43.4% registered to vote.

3 out of 5 (59%) report that they will "definitely be voting" in the 2004 general election for president.

--------


Youth voter turnout highest since 1972

By Amy Kwolek, Daily Staff Reporter on 11/4/04

http://media.www.michigandaily.com/media/storage/paper851/news/2004/11/04/News/Youth.Voter.Turnout.Highest.Since.1972-1426471.shtml

Not since the 1972 presidential election have more young people voted. Twenty-one million people ages 18 to 29 voted in Tuesday’s elections, not including absentee ballots, according to Holly Teresi of the Youth Vote Coalition. According to unofficial election results from seven main polling locations on campus, nearly 9,000 University students voted. Overall, 120 million people voted in the election.

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Since the 2000 election, the number of youth voters at the polls increased by 4.6 million. The turnout rate rose from about 42 percent to 52 percent.

“I think a lot of students were concerned about who was going to be the next president, which is unique. In years past it hasn’t mattered so much which actual candidate won, so much as which party was elected,” said Engineering freshman Sean Murphy, who voted absentee in Massachusetts.

In some states, youth voters turned out just as much as older voters in proportion to their population. In the 10 most contested “battleground” states, youth turnout was 64 percent, up 13 percentage points from the 2000 election.

“Young people are definitely more interested than they were four years ago. They’re more invested in their community,” Teresi said.

She said young people have more concerns tied into the election, for example the war in Iraq and how they plan to pay for college.

The economy and the possibility of a draft were issues that motivated LSA freshman George Thomas to vote.

“The issues that most concerned me were jobs, the war in Iraq, tax cuts for the rich and a possible draft,” Thomas said.

More than 100 organizations in the Youth Vote Coalition devoted their efforts to raising youth participation in the election. Partners in the Coalition include MTV’s “Choose or Lose,” Project Vote Smart, Speak Out, and World Wrestling Entertainment’s “Smackdown Your Vote!” The organizations had a goal of bringing 20 million youths out to the polls.

[dicknbush]

255. How old are you and who did you vote for in 2004?

[fizzgig]

343. the 2000 race was my first presidential election

but what does the other question have to do with this discussion?

[Egnever]

48. Old is in your head

Don't let the cranky ones get to you. We all will have to work to get these things done. The younger people just saw the hope a little faster is all. The older ones are catching on give em some time.

[Danger Mouse]

54. i'm happy to work with my older brothers and sisters to bring down the repiglicans...

and paint the white house BLUE.
:pals:

[Breeze54]

63. Many boomers have also been trying to do that for years...

We did succeed with Bill but then it went to shit with the stolen elections but we all
also voted to turn the senate and the house blue just two years ago. We're all trying.... :hug:

[AGirl]

55. I am 24 and i am sick of young and uninformed sheeps!

[Danger Mouse]

61. sheeps? that's productive.

[angie_love]

64. Please, I've read your posts, they are among the nastiest I've ever seen

The post where you tried to link Obama and tie him to a male sex scandal. I won't even repeat what you said, b/c it was so nasty.

[scheming daemons]

80. Wow... your posts have been among the LEAST informed (and informing) of all....

....

[Colobo]

104. Yeah, I'm also 24 and I'm tired of the crap young sheep like you post all the time.

[Hekate]

433. Wow...a super-newby with lots of posts & a way of lashing out...What can it mean? nt

[provis99]

56. only certain older people hate the younger generation: the baby boomers

I get tons of grief about being a slacker Gen-Xer from them, but the people of the Silent Generation of the 1950s, or the Greatest Generation, have been nice and encouraging. I'm beginning to understand why the old folks didn't like the baby boomers during the 60s. The older folks were right.

[Cha]

57. Mellow out with Andres Useche singing

Si Se Puede Cambiar
Lots of yoots singing and waving signs around..getting all crazy fired up and ready for change!

Thanks to tabatha!..
http://www.andresuseche.blogspot.com/

[boppers]

59. I believe in your generation like none before.

Every generation, we get a little bit less racist, a little bit less sexist, we hate each other less.

It takes time.

Sure, we still have sexist voters who would vote for Hillary because she's a woman, but that's because you're living in a society that did really ugly things to women in the past. Same with people who throw their racist stereotypes at Obama.

However, looking at today's youth fills me with pride.

I'm glad to pass the torch.

[Danger Mouse]

65. i had my sunday school students last week, wondering why people hate gays...

why they won't let them marry.
THIS is the generation we are bringing up...more loving and accepting even than we ever were.

[Fredda Weinberg]

60. My partners are all in their 20's. Wanna know what they say?

"We're young and ready to follow."

Now, where is your humility? I knew it when I consulted my elders before starting my first projects.

[Danger Mouse]

62. humility? i have plenty.

i'm just sick of getting dumped on because of my age.

[Fredda Weinberg]

71. Fortunately, it's a condition you can inevitably outgrow. Along the way

I wish you many kind mentors. I've been blessed to find many, but I went the extra mile.

[Radical Activist]

72. That made me throw up a little in my mouth.

If young people always allowed the old to lead we would never have had the 50's civil rights movement or most of the feminist movement or a lot of other movements that did lot of good.. All the young folks in those movements were discouraged from using more aggressive tactics by their elders.

[Fredda Weinberg]

84. And I was a child in the 60's ... good thing those elders kept things

in check. Violence in American streets? We don't need to see those times again.

[Radical Activist]

97. No, they didn't keep the young people in check.

First, I find it pretty disgusting that you're equating street riots with the civil rights and womens movements. Either that's what you're doing or you're just using a very weak tactic to avoid responding to my point. But maybe that's your idea of the "excesses of the 60's" that so many boomers here got worked up about when Obama referred to it.

No, Martin Luther King and John Lewis did not listen to the older civil rights leaders in charge who urged more caution and patience. MLK and other young people did what they did because they got sick of their elders always telling them to wait longer for the right time. The elders of the movement adamantly tried to dissuade SNCC from doing the freedom rides, as with many other aggressive parts of the movement. So, thank God no old folks kept them in check. Young people lead that movement as they lead most movements of real change.

[Fredda Weinberg]

105. You find history disgusting? What a shame.

But I lived through turbulent times and you don't. So your abuse is simply an echo of the simplistic voices I remember from the past ... Abby Hoffman comes to mind.

[Radical Activist]

121. For someone alive in the 60's you sure seem clueless about what happened.

You're really going to claim that street riots were an organized part of the 50's civil rights movement? Do you blame King and other young civil rights leaders for the riots? Yes, I do find you making that false connection disgusting. Don't call your lies history. Did you volunteer for Goldwater in the 60's? You sound like you did.

Thinking that only your generation lived through turbulent times is typical of the arrogance of the boomer generation. I guess there's nothing turbulent about the past 8 years of 9/11, two wars and random shootings by maniacs happening so often that its routine. Right. :eyes:

[Fredda Weinberg]

236. You have a vivid imagination, but history speaks for itself Being Black

History month, it shouldn't be hard to familiarize yourself on the rise of radicalism in the US - and the years of repression that suppresses it.

[Radical Activist]

266. You're a fan of COINTELPRO huh?

You liked the violations of constitutional freedoms to supress dissent? Is that what you mean by keeping the kids in line? Yeah, you do sound like a Goldwater supporter. Or Nixon. I guess there's no point trying to discuss this with you since you fail to defend any of your arguments.

[Fredda Weinberg]

316. Now you're just being insulting n/t

[Lautremont]

125. No, these times aren't turbulent at all.

[Fredda Weinberg]

234. Without the draft we don't have mass student uprisings, but the

causes haven't changed. I don't want a repeat of the Weather Underground or the Red Brigades, where the public supported domestic terrorism as long as the victims were unsympathetic. That has happened here.

[Forkboy]

134. Jesus Jumping Christ on a pogo stick.

Yeah, we're living in fucking utopian times right now. Could you be just a tad more full of yourself? :eyes:

[CatnHat]

415. It's not like

the younger generation hasn't been inspired; I just think your method is out of sync.

To paint boomers as bitter, and jealous is just reverting to the same tactics used on this board to divide people. I couldn't care a rats ass what age people are.

While you're on the subject of "boomers" they should be admired. They were "involved" and cared deeply about our country; didn't matter if the president was democrat or republican. College campuses were filled with hundreds of thousands to end a illegal war (yeah, a hell of alot more than the Obama crowds)

If your "generation" can get so excited over one man; why is it then your "generation" did not get excited when Bush led us into war? Where were the marches, where was the political activists that claim care so deeply. Didn't happen. Now, its all about "pep rallies" and smoke and mirrors.

My dad came from the "greatest generation". He earned it; and to this day is proud of our country. Pride does not go away at any age. Your trumped up claims that the "boomers" and the "greatest generation" have nothing more to offer, think again. There are millions of people my age, and remain active politically, as does my dad! I have friends young and old, and truthfully, none of them act like what I see on this board. To the original poster: Nobody is picking on this generation. Get over it. Vote for whomever. No one cares. Really. Just quit whining nobody likes me because I'm voting for Obama.

[Breeze54]

123. Well said and I agree...those young boomers from back then

are still fighting to make change now and I'm glad you stated what you did. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Radical Activist]

146. The boomers I know who are still involved activists

all work hard to encourage more young people to get involved and take leadership. They know that's how the movement grew in their youth and that's how it will grow today. I suspect the people who feel threatened by the younger generation taking leadership roles are mostly armchair activists anyway.

[boppers]

144. You missed the 60's.

It wasn't just firehoses turned on people wanting civil rights.

It was the military shooting people down in cold blood at their colleges.

It was open street beatings, union vs. war protestors.

It was bombs going off in random locations.

It was millionaire heiresses robbing banks.... for the poor.

It was "civil rights" groups stockpiling bombs and weapons to overthrow the government.

It wasn't all good. Some of it was pretty ugly.

[Radical Activist]

150. I realize those things happened

but to bring up the riots in this context, in the way the poster did, was ridiculous and offensive. Good change happened because young people said they weren't going to sit down and shut up.

[Breeze54]

126. How do you figure that? The elders back then

didn't have a handle on anything and had no control on the outpouring for drastic change in the USA.

The boomers won!

[Fredda Weinberg]

254. And promptly sold out. Hence the lyric ... here's to the new boss

Same as the old boss. We won't be fooled again.

[fizzgig]

94. consulted your elders?

do i have to get your approval before i vote in november?

i am young and i am not ready to follow if it's going to be same stuff, different day

[Fredda Weinberg]

117. Before approaching the cops to start free computer classes for

underprivileged kids, you bet I consulted my elders ... in this case,

http://www.browardpalmbeach.com/1998-01-15/news/conspiracy-she-wrote/

Now, if you're not ready to follow - get ready to fail.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

127. Do you ever NOT post your resume?

[Fredda Weinberg]

231. Isn't Virginia Snyder something? A great inspiration to generations of

females to come.

[fizzgig]

135. if i follow, it will be a failure if nothing changes

i am not going to sit around and wait for approval. as it has been pointed out to you previously, breaking from the 'elders' has brought about change.

leadership is not simply about age, being 'right' is not simply about age, bringing about change is not simply about age

the mentality of "i'm older, so i know better" is what is so frustrating about this

[Fredda Weinberg]

232. Not older ... better educated and sometimes, in the school of hard knocks

Youth is a treatable condition, but no one should want the cure. Explore what has been done before so you can leverage the advantage. That's why we study basic subjects ... to expand upon them, not just regurgitate the right response on an exam.

It sounds like you haven't found many inspirational teachers. I've sought them out and listened patiently, distilled the lessons and applied them to great success.

Now, you want to argue with that? (Warning, that's a classic trick question)

[Cabcere]

262. "Now, if you're not ready to follow - get ready to fail."

Excuse me? Look, I think I see where you're coming from on this, and I do understand the value of listening to older generations and learning from their triumphs as well as their mistakes. However, that does NOT mean that people of my generation are going to just fall into lockstep and automatically do exactly what we're told by you or anyone else, regardless of age. I understand your point about mentors, and it is a good one - a wise mentor is an incredibly valuable asset. But I also believe that a wise mentor does not pass on that wisdom by threatening his or her students with failure if they don't obey his or her every word. (Yes, I realize that's not what you said, but it's certainly how it came across.)

Simply put, there is a difference between respecting one's elders and appreciating their wisdom, knowledge, and life experience, and blindly following them simply because they are older and what they say is always right. We can and will listen to what you have to say, but we are individuals in our own right, capable of making our own decisions, and most of us don't appreciate being talked down to and told that we must "follow or fail." That's all I'm trying to say. Peace.

[dmac]

209. Are you kidding me?!

I think "ready to follow" belongs to another party all together, doesn't it? Can this really be a fellow Dem suggesting to young voters to walk in lock-step? I have been away from DU for a very long time and when I came out here last night to read how people were feeling through this tough primary season, I had quite a shock. The animosity between the two camps was shocking. I scanned as many threads as I could, and what I saw most was contention between the boomers and the younger generation, as well as between the Hillary/Obama camps. I kept reading about these young people who were being disrespectful, rude, and unrealistic, and I soon figured out that these "young people" were Obama supporters - and they were being characterized in just terribly uncomplimentary terms. I was so confused because I have been so proud of all of the young people I know for getting involved and for finally joining us in our battle to take our country back. As I started following links to see this for myself, I got another shock - and EMBARRASSMENT! It's not the young who are being disrespectful! I am just stunned at what I have read here! Granted I have not been able to read everything out here but of what I have read, I am very disappointed in post like this one. Thankfully, some from my generation have shown up to offer support and assure you new voters that not everyone over 30 behaves this way. I would like to add my own kudos to you all for getting involved, for choosing a candidate you believe in, and for the passionate support you are bringing with you. We need you and we are happy to have you taking part in the election process. Most importantly, we appreciate your intelligence and your independence in deciding how you will cast your vote! And the fact that you have not said, "we are young, we're ready to follow" gives me hope that you will be lifetime Democrats in spite of how some here have treated you.

[Fredda Weinberg]

238. The difference is intelligence. You need some to appreciate our party

Let's face it ... if you're born rich, you're a natural Republican. But they're a natural minority.

The problem came about when social conditions allowed a Ronnie Raygun to be "re-elected king". In case you haven't noticed, our party has been working for decades to reverse that damage.

You can't dismiss it and be taken seriously. Disagree if you will, but you're nothing new.

[fascisthunter]

330. Ja, Javul, Meinen Kindern! (nt)

[fascisthunter]

329. "We're young and ready to follow."

You gotta be kidding me?! You do realize "Leave It To Beaver" was just a show?

[democrattotheend]

391. So we should ask our elders how to vote?

Correct me if I am wrong, but does the constitution not give us equal voting rights along with our elders? Do we have less of a right to volunteer for the candidate of our choice? Should we be consulting the party establishment and asking their permission to get involved with a campaign?

[Warren DeMontague]

404. If age is the sole indicator of wisdom, I guess you must be voting for McCain.

Here's an elder who is actually worth consulting:

Come mothers and fathers
Throughout the land
And don't criticize
What you can't understand
Your sons and your daughters
Are beyond your command
Your old road is
Rapidly agin'.
Please get out of the new one
If you can't lend your hand
For the times they are a-changin'.

[Radical Activist]

66. The Democratic Party mostly ignored young people during the Clinton years.

We're seeing a lot the attitudes that motivated that popping up now.
In 2000 I saw stronger Green Party chapters on most college campuses than College Democrat chapters. Young people don't matter in the game of identity politics because they vote at a low rate. A short term decision was made to ignore them which was killing off the future of the Democratic Party. Backlash against Bush is the only thing that saved Democrats. Otherwise, Bill Clinton would have left the Democratic Party dying without ideals as an entire generation was being lost to the Republicans.

[Breeze54]

102. President Clinton ordered the largest dollar increase in Pell Grant history

How is that ignoring young people? I was a lot younger then (obviously!) than I am now and some
of the things he did helped me and my young kids. (I suspect kids like you are now!)

He kept most of our servicemen and women out of a war and none were killed on his watch.

Clinton reported a surplus of $559 billion at the end of his presidency!

Some Major legislation he signed

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Clinton#Legislation_and_programs

1993-02-05 - Family and Medical Leave Act of 1993

1996-08-20 - Minimum wage Increase Act

1997-08-05 - Taxpayer Relief Act of 1997

And he also funded daycare and after school programs and training for displaced workers and extended unemployment etc.

He also increased the HUD budget and got thousands of homeless people off the streets!!
(He cleaned up after what raygun did to the poor...) :grr:

He did some things I didn't agree with, that's for sure, but he also did some good. Like EIC!
That helped a lot and we don't have it anymore, thanks to that fucktard in the WH! :grr:

But my life did improve when he was in office.
I know I had more money then and more opportunities and jobs available!

[angie_love]

129. Yes, it is undeniable, Bill Clinton did some great things

You have made your choice and I have made my choice. I respect Hillary and have voted for her before, but I want Obama to be president. I don't hate Hillary and for me its not Her vs Him b/c both are part of the democratic party. Its just that he is my choice. And if she won the nomination, I would vote for her. Thats all there is to it.

[Breeze54]

141. What choice have I made, prey tell? -- Do you mean my

having voted for the most liberal senator that was running to be president? You're right.

I did make my choice to vote for the only candidate not in any corporations pocket!

It's sad many didn't vote in their own best interests... yet again. *sigh*

My post was in response to a statement made by 'radical'.... I was not promoting HRC.

[angie_love]

145. sorry, I assumed you voting for HRC, my bad. apologies.

[Breeze54]

163. I figured that! LOL but I can't make my sig pic any bigger!!

:P

[angie_love]

188. Yeah Dennis rules! Its all good.

[Radical Activist]

136. I'm looking at your list

and other than the Pell Grants nothing there is directed at young people specifically. I was in college during the Clinton years and his funding increases were minor. Small, incremental change like most of what he did. He didn't expand Pell Grants enough to make them available to the middle class, who mostly graduated with student loan debt the size of a mortgage.

Clinton would talk about issues that effect young people occasionally when he visited a college campus. But issues young people care about were never a focus for him and organizationally the Party did next to nothing to mobilize young voters while he was President.

Gore was guilty of buying into that mindset too during his 2000 campaign. Didn't you ever get sick of hearing Clinton and Gore talking about health care and prescription drugs only for SENIORS as if young people don't get sick and don't need health care? I know I did. It was insulting. That was practically the only thing the party talked about along with protecting social security for a good 8 years from 94-02.

What about the fact that neither Gore or Clinton made the environment a major issue during their campaigns? Gore easily could have but the party at that time thought talking about issues young people care about was a waste of time.

[Breeze54]

157. I hear you and yes I did get sick of some of the rhetoric.

I was in school also, retraining yet again for a new job but I had grants. I didn't take out any student loans but there were also jobs a plenty at that time and I was making ends meet but I was pretty busy with work, school and a kid and a two sick parents. I think I did state above that I didn't agree with everything he did but he did help myself and my kids out a great deal back then from what it had been like under raygun. But I also protested the passing of NAFTA and Welfare Reform vehemently. I also demonstrated in the streets to get more funding for HUD and we succeeded at that. ;) None of our leaders are perfect and I'm sure Mr. Obama will be making some decisions we all will not agree with... that's just the way it goes, I think.

[ContinentalOp]

Meanwhile the internet bubble burst, hurting one of the only new sources for jobs for the young.

And the historically low interest rates created a huge housing bubble that means all of us young, first-time homebuyers were completely shafted.

Yay Clinton economy! Hurray for stagnant wages, increasing personal debt, and totally unaffordable housing! But I guess we deserved it since we were such a bunch of "slackers."

[Breeze54]

184. Good points!

I forgot about the Dot Com burst (how the hell could I forget that?) :wtf:

I knew there was a reason I was PO'D in the late 90's! Thanks for jogging my addled brain! :P

[jackson_dem]

67. I am 24 and apalled by the ageism that has come out in the open during the primaries

Both the ageism toward young people and toward seniors.

[Danger Mouse]

70. insulting older people is also sickening.

[Breeze54]

166. Thank You, Elrond Hubbard !

:yourock:

;)

[tammywammy]

74. Agreed jackson_dem

[quakerboy]

193. I think

That may just be the first time I've read a Jackson_dem post and thought "I agree unreservedly"

[emilyg]

413. !!!!

[opihimoimoi]

83. At a riot, much screaming/posturing/ yelling/scamming/ distorting/

etc goes on...same here..

Its time to install the Age Cops.....

[napi21]

90. I wouldn't get so emotional about it! I'm a child of the 60's and

I sure haven't heard any compliments about MY generation lately!

[K8-EEE]

91. Not me!! I'm a boomer (DOB: 1960) and counting on you....

to fix what my crap generation did -- my daughters and their friends are what give me hope that all is not lost.

PS: I voted for Obama too (Edwards was my first choice but he was out by the time CA voted.)

[Danger Mouse]

98. that's a lot of pressure...

i hope we're able to live up to it.
fuck ronald reagan...he started all of this shit.

[unapatriciated]

113. I don't discount you...

I registered many young voters outside of F911 last election and encourage all youth to get involved. What I don't care for is the rude comments if we don't share the same point of view or vicious attacks on ANY of our candidates. You can have passion for your candidate without yelling insults (that goes for both Obama and Clinton supporters). Both Clinton and Obama have been guilty of RW type politics. Can you honestly say that you are not guilty of throwing stones on this board?

Obama and Clinton are very much alike so I think it is time for everyone to stop the bashing.

"The simple fact is, Clinton and Obama champion similar policies and have nearly identical voting records. There are real differences between the two, but by accusing each other of crypto-Republicanism, Clinton and Obama are writing scripts for The Theater of the Absurd"

http://www.newsweek.com/id/103203/output/print

edited for grammar and It's still probably wrong.

[OnionPatch]

118. Well, this oldie admires your generation.

I'm really excited that so many young people are inspired and getting involved. It's a great thing. I've been more inspired myself because of it. Don't let those negative, critical people bring you down. They're just stewing because things aren't going their way right now.

Here's to you "kids": :toast:

[Starbucks Anarchist]

120. Thanks, OnionPatch.

:toast:

[casus belli]

132. Sweet post. Thanks! :)

:hug:

[Skittles]

140. grow a thicker skin

every generation puts up with it

[tammywammy]

142. I've put up with a lot on here

But the reference to younger voters as Hilter Youth was way across the line.

[Skittles]

143. who the f*** said THAT?

has to be a troll, no?

[Danger Mouse]

148. smalll

[Skittles]

160. someone like that needs a righteous ass-kicking

I love seeing young folk involved in politics - absolutely

[tammywammy]

149. It's someone that's been here awhile

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4752919#4753128

It's been deleted, but you can see where it was.

And he's in this thread telling all us younger voters to "Please leave politics to us."

[Skittles]

158. OK, that's just an ass-carrot who represents NO ONE but themselves

I mean, come on. I LOVE SEEING YOUNG PEOPLE INTERESTED IN POLITCS because it gives me hope for the future!!! :thumbsup:

[fizzgig]

165. ass-carrot

i am going to appropriate that one for my own use :D

[Skittles]

168. I picked that up from another DUer

yes INDEED

[fizzgig]

153. you would think

but either way, i think he needs an ass kicking

[Skittles]

159. heck YES

that's just nasty and, well, IGNORANT

[rodeodance]

161. and the post saying Hillary supporters were like Hitler supporters was just as bad.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

185. ohh but, they have drank deeply and can neither see nor hear anymore

[Danger Mouse]

196. this is EXACTLY the kind of post i'm talking about.

i chose to support Obama ON MY OWN.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

201. CHILL this post was NOT directed towards you...it was in relpy to post #161

[Danger Mouse]

308. ah, admittedly...it was from an 'ignored' so i didn't see its content.

[tammywammy]

260. I didn't see that post

But yeah it's just as bad and uncalled for.

[hfojvt]

151. don't talk back to your elders, sonny

:P

At least not unless you've got hair like Jesus wore it.

[quakerboy]

198. Sweet

Im golden then. I even wear sandals... And I was named after the big J.

That means I get to sass anyone I want now, right?

[hfojvt]

292. stay golden ponyboy

but don't let it goto your head.

My original line was meant as a spoof on the musical Hair, where the dad asks "What do you have 1968 that makes you so doggone superior?" and the kid answers, "I'll tell you 1948 ... I've got my hair."

[quakerboy]

313. Ya

I figured there was some reference there that passed over my head. But for as often as I get dinged for my hair, I had to take the oportunity to take it at face value.

[rodeodance]

171. Toughen up--

[Eurobabe]

172. I have two daughters your age, I wouldn't insult you

If you are anything like them (and truthfully I think you are alot more politically active than they are, although they are Obama supporters too) I know you are good for it.

Don't let the old curmudgeons get you down. They just can't stand the fact that someone my age will run the country, and that your generation will help deliver the White House in November, I tell them to suck an egg and go make some bad wine with their sour grapes.

:grouphug:

[dorktv]

174. You really want annoying? How about people who claim that only

Senator Obama has gotten youth involved. That slaps the face of all my friends, the YDA who spent years working their arses off trying to get people out to vote, the fact there were nearly double digit increases starting in 2004 and well over that in 2006 and that they trend Democratic!

I mean honestly!

[rodeodance]

199. hey--I have that complaint from several. serious.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

175. aww you're a cute puppy even if you are running with the wrong pack!

[ButterflyBlood]

176. I'm 24 and I agree completely

I remember a rather disgusting comment about how it's a good thing those older voters are out there to protect us young voters from the way we vote for people like Obama...

Hey factcheck, it was your generation that gave us Bush for another 4 years, not our's who voted against him overwhelmingly. Shut up.

[RamboLiberal]

177. This 55 year old Boomer loves that young people

are so passionate, out there working for their candidate and getting involved. To tell you the truth I'm getting sick of my generation (and older) running everything and I'm glad we have a non-Boomer candidate and so many younger than myself are taking a stand and getting involved.

And it is so nice to see so many young Democrats - I was getting sick of the keyboard commando young Repukes!

[Straight Shooter]

179. "Every generation blames the one before ..."

Bitterness at any age towards any other generation is a curse handed down since the beginning of time. There has been no song ever written that so clearly illuminates what we're dealing with, day after day, year after year ....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NqQM-HoFeEk

Every generation
Blames the one before
And all of their frustrations
Come beating on your door

I know that I'm a prisoner
To all my father held so dear
I know that I'm a hostage
To all his hopes and fears
I just wish I could have told him
In the living years

Crumpled bits of paper
Filled with imperfect thought
Stilted conversations
I'm afraid that's all we've got

You say you just don't see it
He says it's perfect sense
You just can't get agreement
In this present tense
We all talk a different language
Talking in defence

Say it loud, say it clear
You can listen as well as you hear
It's too late when we die
To admit we don't see eye to eye

[ContinentalOp]

180. Yeah and leave it to the Me Generation to write a SONG about it...

as an attempt to insure that they're the last generation who gets the privilege! Hey kids, I know you're mad at your parents but I've been there, done that, and I wrote a song about it to insure that you can't criticize my generation the way I criticized my parents' generation. :hippie:

[Straight Shooter]

189. Darling, I never criticized my parents' generation.

I always knew, good Lord willing and the creek don't rise, I would one day walk in their shoes.

And I can look behind me, and not criticize those who are younger, having been in their shoes before. If anything, I am sad for what they are facing. I'm a lot more worried about ice sheets sliding into the ocean than I am about any election.

A better vid of this song:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=hNS5fQlJn9o&feature=related

[ContinentalOp]

206. You're pretty good at being condescending toward younger generations though,

darling. ;)

[Straight Shooter]

264. You don't know what "condescending" means, then.

And "darling" is a term of affection I've used for many years, having lived in the South for my young adult life. If I wanted to be condescending, I would have said "cupcake" or some other ridiculous form of address.

It's a shame that even if someone is being nice to you, you're on the defensive.

[Kitty Herder]

190. I've don't get the antipathy between the generations.

We're on the same side here. And in a forum like this, you can't usually tell who is 18 and who's 65. And it doesn't make any difference.

We owe a lot to the generations that came before us. They're our parents and grandparents. They made the advantages we enjoy possible.

The boomers changed the world and we are reaping the benefits of their hard work.

And we, gen X, and gen Y, want to continue their work and continue to change and improve the world.

Ultimately, we're working toward the same goal. We are one people working together. Age shouldn't be used to separate us.

[NMMNG]

192. What is your opinion of the way Obama and many of his supporters

have essentially demonized Baby Boomers and older voters in general (which, in some cases, has included age 30 and up)?

[Danger Mouse]

197. i'm against that.

[NMMNG]

204. Thank you.

:thumbsup:

And likewise I don't approve of those who are denigrating others for their youth.

[angie_love]

202. Obama hasn't demonized boomers come on.

I have no demonized boomers either.

[ContinentalOp]

208. I'm for it.

Wait, 30 and up? No, I'm against it then. :P

Seriously though, how has Obama demonized Baby Boomers? I see it the other way around. The Clinton campaign's primary base is the baby boomer demographic and they've been engaged in an attempt to marginalize Obama and downplay his grassroots support as some kind of superficial fad driven by a bunch of infatuated kiddies.

[NMMNG]

211. Obama made a snarky comment against the BB generation

"I think there's no doubt we represent the kind of change that Senator Clinton can't deliver on and part of it is generational. Senator Clinton and other's, they've been fighting since the sixties, and it makes it very difficult for them to bring the country together to get things done."

http://centerface.blog-city.com/obama_campaign_ease_off_on_the_triangulation.htm

And there have been statements here on DU by some Obama supporters (not all of them, of course) who have stated they want the older people to "get out of the way" so the younger generation can take over because it is "their turn". (I notice that when fools claimed that it was "Hillary's turn" people got justifiably incensed) Some have hinted that they're just waiting for us to die off, and one said, more than once that if we didn't get out of the way we'd be shoved. Thankfully that one is gone now.



I went to an HRC rally and saw every demographic there. All races, all ages, gender identities and sexual orientations. It was a very diverse crowd. Some make it seem as if her base is a nothing but a bunch of elderly white women--and ignorant ones at that.

[ContinentalOp]

217. You're right.

I hadn't heard him talk about this before. Here's another quote I found.

"SEN. OBAMA: I think, I think the categories we've been using were forged in the `60s. You know, I think the arguments about big government vs. small government, the arguments about, you know, the sexual revolution, military vs. nonmilitary solutions to problems. I think, in each and every instance, a lot of what we think about is shaped by the `60s, and partly, you know, the baby boomers is--are a big demographic. I write about the fact that, whether it's the market for Viagra or how many cup holders are going to be in, in a car, a lot of it's determined by what the baby boomers want. Our politics isn't that different, and my suggestion is that--take the example of big government vs. small government. My instinct is is that the current generation is more interested in smart government. Let's have enough government to get the job done. If, if we're looking at problems, if the market solution works, let's go with the market solution. If a solution requires government intervention, let's do that. But let's look at what are the practical outcomes. And I think that kind of politics is what the country's hungry for right now."

I heartily approve of the boomer baiting :P I'm not crazy about this "market solution" bs talk though. :(

[NMMNG]

221. While I'm no Boomer

I don't approve of the Booomer-baiting, or baiting of any age group. Obama seems (or wants) to forget that he's a Boomer himself. Most of his supporters do the same.

[suziedemocrat]

352. He's a Boomer too though. His birthday 8/4/1961. Boomers were born 1946-1964.

He's more of a boomer than I am. He might have a point, but I'm just saying....

[fight4my3sons]

251. I don't get this from Obama at all...

When I saw Obama there was a VERY diverse crowd and this was in Maine. I was up front next to elderly people in wheelchairs. I stood on line with people who had children with infants in strollers. I met high school students and college students. I spoke to a couple in their 50's, yes we did talk about age because we were discussing the vast differences we saw in the crowd around us. I spoke to a man who was in his 70's who said he was raised to by a father who was very prejudiced against blacks and women and he had seen Hillary that morning and now was in line waiting to see Obama and could not believe that one would probably be the next president. I am 35 and have never felt like Obama has insulted me. When I caucused for Obama in my small village, my husband (33) and I were the youngest in the group of 50 something people.

[boppers]

424. The 60's tactics are part of what brought us to a solution.

Since the 60's, we've been involved in a never-ending battle of culture, of race, debates about drugs, religion, sexual preference... you name it.

But somewhere along the way, fighting the battles became more important than ending the wars.

Hilary has chosen the path of relentless battle as her metaphor.

Obama has chosen the path of ending the wars as his metaphor.

I have no doubt that Hillary would keep fighting.

That's part of the problem, not part of the solution.

[yellowcanine]

438. What a crock. I am a boomer and I haven't felt "demonized" once.

Not by Obama, not by his campaign, and not by any of his supporters. Where are you getting this crap?

[Beregond2]

194. Hope.

I am angered and saddened by your post, Elrond. I haven't seen the attitude you say is here, but I don't doubt you have.

I am 53, and I deal with young people all the time at my job, and I think they are TERRIFIC! They give me hope, and I don't think it is any accident that they are responding so strongly to Obama's invocation of that. I think they are fed-up with all the doom-and-gloom hopelessness and cynicism they have been fed, and are saying: "Enough! We have the right to make this world what we want it to be, or at least try!" And I applaud them for it. It is the attitude my own generation had when we were young, and that I haven't seen in much too long.

I was so moved and excited when I went to the caucases here in Washington State. There were so many excited (and exciting) young people there, anxious to learn about the process, sitting side-by-side with people old enough to be their grandparents, while their parents generation mostly sat at home. It seemed like a passing-of-the-torch. I felt so proud of my country.

So don't let those who have become cynical quench your fire. YOU are in the right. Nothing ever happened for the better that didn't begin with hope.

I honor your generation, and I want to work with you in every way I can to help this country and the world.

[cali]

195. Don't let it get to you

just don't. You are being heard. I'm thrilled you're involved. I'm thrilled my 21 year old son is involved. The derision comes from fear and jealousy.

[mattclearing]

200. It's just media noise and the people that believe it. Don't let it bother you.

There are stupid people of all ages, after all.

[Johnny__Motown]

207. Because they didn't vote when they were young they now want the young not to vote, a power thing

[Breeze54]

214. Only 42% of 18-24 year olds cast a ballot in 2000. The youth beat them in 1972!

http://www.statemaster.com/graph/gov_197_ele_you_vot_tur-1972-election-youth-voter-turnout">1972 Election > Youth voter turnout (most recent) by state

http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:pPgqzEUmv2AJ:www.youngvoterstrategies.org/index.php%3Ftg%3Dfileman%26idx%3Dget%26id%3D1%26gr%3DY%26path%3DResearch%26file%3DVoter%2BTurnout%2B1972%2Bto%2B2004%2BCensus%2BData.pdf+1972+voter+turnout+USA&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&client=firefox-a">Young Voter Turnout, 1972 to 2004

Presidential Election Years

18‐24 Citizen

1972 -- 52.1%

2000 -- 36.1% :(

[ContinentalOp]

218. Come on

In 1972 the draft had just ended but the war was far from over. If that issue hadn't existed the youth vote never would have been as strong. What issue did Al Gore use in 2000 to get young people to the polls? Yes, young people are self centered, as are most voters. A good candidate has to find a way to appeal to this and give voters a reason to get out there and vote.

[JVS]

243. Wasn't Gore's VP selection all about firing up the kids and getting them to the polls?

[Breeze54]

265. Fear of a draft brought out youth voters in 2004 and the war!

So, I don't see a difference between the two groups, except that in '72 we didn't have a draft any longer but we still had Vietnam to deal with. Just as the youth in '04 had Iraq and Afghanistan to deal with but in 2000, the youth vote was a dismal 36%. So, it seems to me the youth were apathetic in '00. But I'm sure that this year everyone young and old be be voting, judging from the turnout at the primaries this year. We're all learning a hard lesson and are taking action... together!

That's a good thing!! :D

[ContinentalOp]

279. You were referring to 2000 though.

From your own link "In sheer numbers, more 18‐24 year olds voted in 2004 than in any election since 18‐20 year olds won the right to vote in 1972 and turnout of 18‐24 year olds jumped 11 percentage points over 2000 levels."

My point is that young people will vote if they see a reason to. 1972 was the highest youth turnout because of the war and because it was the first time they were allowed to vote. It was a novelty so of course turnout was high. Some people would have us believe that baby boomers were inherently more informed and politically aware than today's youth who are inherently lazy and apathetic. In my opinion that just shows a total lack of understanding of young voters. A candidate can't just automatically get the youth vote without doing anything to deserve it.

[Breeze54]

283. Exactly and they diidn't turn out in 2000.

My point, I was attempting to make, was that in both 1972 and 2004; they did have something to vote for...

[ContinentalOp]

289. Sorry,

I'm a bit slow today.

[polichick]

215. The generational arrows have been going both ways here...

But when you meet up in real life for Obama events and get out the vote efforts, the generations are working together and celebrating together ~ the positive energy shared is great stuff!

[Sherman A1]

216. Of course you count

I count, you count, Dems count, Republicans count, everyone counts. It makes no difference what someone else says about you or your generation. It only matters that you take some time to be informed, draw your own conclusions (whatever they happen to be) and go vote. I have spent time talking about this year's race with both young and old, Democrat and Republican, I won't try to change anyone's beliefs about a candidate, only discuss issues or the race itself and hope they go vote. It's not up to me to change their beliefs (not that I could), just to encourage them to learn more about the issues and encourage them to vote.

[Cronus Protagonist]

220. I like "Obambis" myself

I think that's the most funny reference, IMHO.

[MadHound]

223. Oh don't worry, all of us old folks are being attacked also

Apparently anybody over forty is responsible for the how crappy the economy is, how crappy the government is, global warming, etc. etc. I think it's just a case a bunch of assholes trying to pit one generation against the other. Ignore it.

[glowing]

225. I'm 28 and the first year I voted was in 2000 as well and, yes, we all know

how that turned out.

I wouldn't actually call you an Ipod baby or a newbie or whatever.. You grew up as computers entered the classroom, and probably remember the 5 1/2 disks, and playing a lame version of the Oregon Trail, and thinking it was the coolest thing in the world. You grew up when critical thinking skills and analytical thought processing was still an important teaching technique. You grew up when wearing helmets for your bike were around, but not too many parents bothered actually buying them for you to wear.

Some of these newbies have been under the Bush tutelage, and that means a, b, c, or d... that means fads and American Idol... that means cell phones, Ipods, Computers in their homes (not just at school), individual t.v.s in each of their rooms, and less parental supervision due to 2 parents running crazy--- or the single-parent divorce craze that has left many children in single parent homes.... It is the older generation that realizes these kinds of things have left young voters entirely unprepared for understanding that their choices will have huge impacts on the entire world.. They don't understand that the things that they bitch about are things that are controlled by the asshats that end up becoming elected.

On the other hand, it is the older generation that had the 60's and forgot the love and peace meme for the suburban lifestyle and supplementing their children with all the crap they have to subdue them into complacency. It is these older generational people's that have, time and time again, showed up to the polls and voted for people like Reagan, Bush I, Clinton, and Bush II. They have also allowed for horrible politicians to head to Washington D.C., and allowed horrible politicians to head to their state capitols, state legislature, and cities/ towns/ counties.. and it is these people who have made it possible for the creation of the M$M conglomerates that have selected the "hold your nose" and vote people. AND this has been going on since the founding days of this country... This is why the Govt wants to control what is put into the public schools history books because if people in this country learned the real history of this country and this world, perhaps we wouldn't allow for history keep repeating this endless, disgusting cycle.

Keep voting.. and really, you aren't exactly an 18 yr old... It amazes me how badly Bush has managed to fuck up so much, especially with NCLB, this war, and the economy...

[TexasObserver]

226. I respect the younger generation, maybe because I've got several as adult children.

They're all great kids, very active politically, very charitable and solid citizens.

I suspect those of my generations who are such grouches about your generation haven't aged well and haven't done a great job of rearing their own children. They're projecting their unhappiness over the mess they've made onto your generation.

People my age who have done a good job of raising their kids, who are optimistic about your generation, who see all the good things you young folks do - we're all good with your generation.

I am inspired by you. I've got a university professor, a vegan chef, and a macrobiotic store owner as my adult children, all of your generation. Two of them went to Florida and worked full time in the Kerry-Edwards campaign from August until after the election in November, 2004. They slept in sleeping bags on someone's floor, and went out and worked 12 hours a day, 7 days a week. What's not to like? They're my heroes.

People who are grumpy in middle age were grumpy when they were your age. That's your answer, right there.

[Onlooker]

227. We see in this forum agism and sexism ....

... There is certainly agism directed against Clinton and McCain, and there is some directed against young people. One of the reasons for the latter is that some of the Obama supporters seem to worship him. Any criticism of him is met with outrage. I support Obama, but certainly don't see him as a saint. He's not a better person than Clinton, but he's running a better campaign. To take umbrage at any criticism of him is an act of immaturity.

It's good your sensitive to the attacks on your age, but it would nicer to see equal sensitivity by Obama supporters to attacks on Clinton (or McCain) based on their age or on Clinton based on her gender.

[Danger Mouse]

228. kick for the morning crowds...

:hi:

[rox63]

229. I'm an old fart (nearly 45), and I love seeing young people getting involved in politics

You and your peers are the future of this nation. So many who came before your generation were apathetic about politics. I'm glad to see that is changing.

[Perry Logan]

230. On behalf of all the fogies, I apologize to the young folks here for our lapses. Y'all are cool.

[Nickster]

235. Because it's been an insiders club for a long time now. We The People have been left out and haven't

really made that much of a fuss about it. You represent a change in that insiders network. People get scared when something or someone comes along to upset the status quo. They throw hatred at you to break your spirit and maintain their network. You'll need to put on your armour and keep fighting, but I'm sure that you'll win.

[NC_Nurse]

237. The hostility has been thick around here for sure. Any excuse to beat up on

the other candidates supporters is used. Don't let it get you down. It's bullshit.
I am so happy to see more young people involved. My children, all in their 20's
have grown up on politics and are involved for Obama just like me. Good for them,
good for you, and good for our country!!!:hi:

Gobama!!!

[Marrah_G]

239. I haven't seen the hostility that you are talking about.

[JVS]

240. Yeah and when they treat you like shit and you let them know that you look forward to their...

old-age cat food diet, suddenly they get even huffier. Those cry-baby douchebags.

[babylonsister]

241. Great post, Elrond Hubbard! Thank you for writing it! nt

[yourguide]

245. BRAVO!!!

[BeyondGeography]

247. Hang in there, Elrond

Most of these posters aren't anti-youth, they're anti-the-guy-my-candidate-is-losing-to, so they lash out at his core supporters.

They're the ones in pain, don't let'em drag you down.

Stay optimistic; it's healthy. And, while we're at it, this 48-year-old thanks you and your generation for getting behind this candidacy with your time and effort. It's a big reason why Obama has a chance to change this country for the better.

[raccoon]

248. I feel your pain. I'm sick of people insulting my generation.

I Personally don't insult your generation. I know many of them who are hard-working, nice people.

Some people like to paint an entire generation with a broad brush: "they're slackers," "they're the most self-centered, self-absorbed generation," etc.

What say we start alerting the mods when people start this crap? If the poster has a personal problem with their parents/adult children, whatever, they can take it somewhere else!

[Arugula Latte]

249. I like your generation a hell of a lot better than I like mine (I'm early 40s)

We came of age under that fuckhead Reagan and too many drank the Kool-Aid and decided their goal in life would be to be as greedy and selfish as possible, vote Republican, buy a gi-normous gas-sucking SUV, and drive it to the golf course whenever possible.

[rug]

250. I'll have fries with that.

:P

[totodeinhere]

252. A lot of the same people who decry sexism practice agesim themselves.

One "ism" is as bad as the other.

[dicknbush]

253. Awwwww poor wittle baby.....is your feely wheelies hurt...Hey where were all thes Obamanbles in 2004

They seem to be coming out of the wood work like roaches..If you had gotten off you asses in 2004 we would not have the mess we are in today and you can be sure things would be different in IRaq and on the supreme court...so maybe you are into it but all these johnny come latelies had a chance to get rid of the war criminal bush four years ago....why didn't they get excited then...Oh John Kerrey wasn't cute enough?????John kerry didn't give good speeches....John kerry was smeared and denigrated by the Bush Slime Machine and YOUR generation bought it and stayed home in droves or else we would all be looking at a second term for an honourable man. Instead you buy into this "American Idol Campaign" of a person who is going to be a failure and in the end will play the game just like all the others....

[Starbucks Anarchist]

258. I was 24 when I voted for John Kerry.

So you can take your bitterness and stereotypes and shove them up your ass.

[rockymountaindem]

287. Agreed

I was just a few months shy of voting age and I would have loved to vote Kerry. In fact, given the situation we're in now, I'd still like to vote for him this time around.

[juno jones]

344. Wow, I've just added three peole to the ignore list in this post alone.

That's a record!

edit: referring to trollish grumpy oldfolk.

[Cabcere]

274. All right, a couple of things.

First of all, I DID vote for John Kerry back in 2004, and so did many of my friends and classmates. I was eighteen, it was my first ever vote, and even though I wasn't overly enthused about Kerry (Edwards was my first choice, then and now), I damn well did get off my ass, as you say, and cast my vote for him, because even then I knew that four more years of Bush would be disastrous. People of my generation DID get off their asses in 2004 and DID vote for Kerry, but it wasn't enough. Part of the blame lies with my generation, for sure, but we're not the only ones.

I am 22 years old now. Young, yes, but not ignorant. You want to talk about youth? A friend of mine was fifteen years old when the Iraq war started - not even old enough to drive, let alone vote. He's dead now, killed in action last Valentine's Day at age nineteen. He wasn't even old enough to vote in the 2004 election, nor were most of the people who stood on the muddy, windy hill of his church's cemetery that day and watched the Marines present his mother with the American flag. We didn't vote for this president and this war, and yet we are still paying the price. We are not the only ones hurting, to be sure, but don't you dare try to tell me that my generation is solely made up of stupid, vacuous fame groupies who are too ignorant to understand the issues. Many of us do understand what's at stake here, and for you to assume that we do not is not only insulting to us, but detrimental to the party and the future of America.

:rant:

[Danger Mouse]

298. You are among the most offensive and idiotic posters on this forum.

You contribute nothing but bile and insults.
Idiots like you do not help Hillary's cause one bit.

[ButterflyBlood]

342. I did vote for John Kerry

SO FUCKING SHOVE IT

[angie_love]

363. I was 24 when I voted for Kerry too. I love and respect Kerry. It broke my heart that he lost.

So Eff OFF. ASS.

[democrattotheend]

394. How old are you?

You sound like you're about 10.

And by the way, I voted for Kerry in 2004, and volunteered.

[MyNameGoesHere]

256. Well since this "phenomenon" of bashing youth

hes been around for a brazillion years you really aren't that special. It was done to my generation, the one before me and so on and so on.

[Cabcere]

275. Does that make it right?

:shrug: Not being snarky here, just wondering. :hi: Peace.

[MyNameGoesHere]

277. Don't know if it is right or wrong

but that's the way it has been for eons. Go back and see what the ancients had to say about the "youth" movements in history. Everyone of them said the world would end because of the youth. Rock and roll, the 60's in my generations were no exception. It may not be right but it isn't going to kill anybody either.

I figure that just like me, it is the youths of today that must prove the old fucks wrong.

[Cabcere]

280. Fair enough.

:toast: Peace. :hi:

[democrattotheend]

400. I love how we get criticized for not turning out

and then when we do turn out, we get criticized for that. Which is it?

I live in the newly-competitive state of Virginia. Would you rather me sit on my ass in November?

[MyNameGoesHere]

444. It is your choice i really do not give a shit what the youth

think or do. I did my time as one and i moved on.

[txaslftist]

257. We're the "clean up the mess" generation.

Whether you call us generation x or y or zero or whatever. Our job will be to clean up the messes left by the baby-boomers. Of course they don't like us. It's like a senile old man in a nursing home bitching at the young nurses because he used to be "in charge" and "important" and now he's just dependent.

Get used to it. The generation that preceded us was the most selfish and self-centered in this nation's history. They find it so hard to imagine passing the torch on that in massive numbers they've subscribed to a cult that says the world must end and Christ return sometime during their lifetime, and they are willing to sacrifice any number of our generation in pointless wars for Israel to make sure they get raptured up while the rest of us get left behind. They demanded every possible benefit during their lifetimes, whether it was the right to vote, burn bras and draft cards when they were kids to the right to tax free investing when they became the investor class or the right to own homes and have the value ever increase until they were ready to move into condos and nursing homes.

When they finally lose their grasp on our nation's polity it will be up to us to clean up after them, as they've had other people cleaning up after them their whole lives.

So naturally they despise us.

[BadgerKid]

259. K&R....I find it's people outside myself

who teach me the most. That would be precluded if I refused to be observant, understanding, open minded. Yeah, I have my negative moments, but generally I am willing to learn from others.

[Infinite Hope]

263. Amen! n/t

[CitizenRob]

268. Yeah let's not forget what the Baby boomers brought us...

The war on drugs
The war on terror
Lower quality of life for their children (us)
Reagonomics
the end of unions

and on...
... and on...
... and on...

[SammyWinstonJack]

315. Quit whining! Actually it was the greatest generation that brought those things about.

Reagan wasn't a boomer and neither is bush sr or cheney and on and on and on. Oh and Nader isn't a boomer either!

[Blue_Roses]

270. first of all,

:bounce: awesome post!

Second, I think your generation is on to something--something the older generations keep missing because they love nostalgia. My kids are very young and I hope that they have leaders like you who are passionate enough to see when change is needed rather than follow the same old mantra.

You are needed and appreciated by this "other generationer":D

[RainDog]

271. Well, the only thing I have to say about men of your generation is...

[Danger Mouse]

311. oh dear...

:hide: :scared: :spank:

[rontun]

272. Amazed and Heartened

I'm amazed and heartened by the involvement of young people in this year's primaries.

As a baby boomer, first inspired by JFK, I can relate to the enthusiasm young people are feeling, and not only welcome it, but encourage it.

Elrond Hubbard's frustration is similar to that which my generation felt in 1968 and in 1972, and his challenge is similar to that which we faced - how to overcome the status quo.

Unfortunately, many of my generation represent the status quo, and are most concerned about protecting their positions and legacies. My own personal belief is that while baby boomers have had a tremendous impact on our nation and its culture, our influence is rightfully beginning to wane. While the past may belong to us, the future must be claimed by Elrond Hubbard's generation.

[Cabcere]

276. Amen to that!

:toast: The gratuitous bashing of a generation as a whole has got to stop; all the broad-brushing going on is driving me nuts. I'm not even a strong supporter of either of the candidates, but some of the bullshit going on here is just ridiculous. Well said. :thumbsup:

[blues90]

278. I'll tell you what I see being old , and I will be honest .

I see the division and the gap where people of your age group may get bashed is whether you want to believe it of not , partly Obama's fault .

The reason I say this is because of his bringing Reagan up with statements like the excess of the 60's and 70's which were in reality social programs for the most part . Also another factor is Obama focuses on the youth with this grand ideal of hope .

The other part is the crying and fainting which has never been something seen in politics , rock groups and religious cult groups like the jesus camp kids and their parents are know for this sort of action .

Finally due to the fact that there is this sudden interest in politics by many youth when in fact this Iraq occupation and all the bush admin's destruction on this country is not new it's 7 years old so with that it is difficult if not impossible for older people not to question the sudden devotion the youth has in politics , I am not speaking of one of 26 so much as those of 18 and children of 6 to 10 telling their parents they like Obama .

By any view of an open and skeptical mind this looks and smells and has all the elements of what is called a cult .

This is the best I can explain this from where I stand , it is not meant to insult anyone but you have to step back just a bit and look at things from a different perspective .

Look at it this way , if Hillary has older people like me wearing hippy clothes and carrying flowers and peace signs with an american flag patch on their faded jeans and swooned and fainted and sang give peace a chance and showed up in great numbers what would your impression be ?

[ContinentalOp]

281. Your post doesn't make any sense.

To begin with if you read the Obama quote about Reagan he's clearly referring to the spirit of the times. You don't think that Reagan successfully rode a backlash against perceived excesses of the 60s and 70s? Obama is not personally attacking the social programs of the era. He's merely describing an overall feeling of the times that many americans bought into.

Your complaint about the "sudden interest" of young people is nonsensical. You are surprised that 18 year olds are only recently interested in presidential politics? :crazy: As mentioned above, young voter turnout in 2004 was the highest since 18 year olds were given the vote in '72! And that's the only presidential election we've had since the war started.

As for fainting in politics: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyxb3_8gIxU

[blues90]

285. words mean one thing and what he said was insane

You can read into it what ever you want . If Obama meant something different then he should have stated it in the beginning and not try to alter it later on . This indicate he did not put much thought before he opened his mouth .

what are you saying , it takes a bomb under the 18 year olds ass to get them interested enough to vote they don't have the mind to do it themselves .

My post may not make sense to someone who has their head in the clouds where the oxygen is thin .

[ContinentalOp]

288. Yes, young voters ARE somewhat apathetic.

And it's always been that way. Even when the boomers were young. That's precisely my point. It's not just a problem with "the kids today" or some BS like that.

In fact, let me revise that: everyone is apathetic to some degree. A lot of older voters would probably stay home if politicians didn't constantly pander to their interests on issues like health care and social security.

But if a candidate finds a way to engage young voters and addresses issues young people care about then -- surprise -- young people will come out to vote! Saying that young people "don't have the mind to do it themselves" or have "their head in the clouds where the oxygen is thin" is just the kind of offensive bs that is designed to turn young people off of the political process so that they don't upset the status quo.

[blues90]

293. If any voter is determined to get involved and vote

then no one can discourage them . Not me or anyone else . If they are not really dedicated then they won't vote .

All I'm suggesting is that people step back a bit and take a good look at what is going on .

You can't depend on the media or rallies and numbers to be an honest representation of reality . This includes polls and the issues of how big a primary turnout is .

This is how bush got in . He used fear and others use whatever works for them but it does not mean it's the best way to do things .

[Breeze54]

282. I'm dedicating this thread below to you, Elrond Hubbard

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4759320

:grouphug:

[mimitabby]

286. i'm 56 and i love you guys!

never ever would i bash you! you have what i've lost after all these years of reagans and bushes.

I support you (literally, hehe, my sons are your age) and hope you get your heart's desire.

[elixir]

290. You are the future. We must take our jobs seriously. Research, read and investigate - don't reflex

ively slam your opponent at every turn. Today's brouhaha was thanks to Drudge and here come the Obama supporters calling Hillary names and swearing. It's embarassing for all democrats when we act like this.

I don't use Obamites, Obama babies ...or any of the other monikers and I don't swear (except once today, sorry) because it weakens your position and your argument as well as your candidate.

Respect for each other goes a long way, let's show it.

[Midlodemocrat]

291. Of course you count, Elrond. But, so do I. My age and experience

doesn't make me irrelevant or a has been. We are ALL important to the party. Everyone of us.

[Danger Mouse]

304. I agree with you.

Everyone counts, everyone matters.

[SammyWinstonJack]

294. Plenty of Boomer bashing right here on DU and Obama who is a Boomer has engaged in it as well.

:shrug:

[BlackVelvet04]

295. Remember what was said about the boomers?

Probably not.

Now stomp your feet some more.

[Danger Mouse]

301. Just because some people from my generation acted like assholes...

doesn't make it okay to spit on all of us.
Stomp my feet? Give me a break.
Condescending assholeish posts like this just prove my point.

[BlackVelvet04]

305. then you should be grateful. n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

306. Obama, a Boomer, has dissed us and DU loves to engage in Boomer bashing as well.

[yardwork]

296. Oh. I thought you were talking about my generation.

Baby boomers get slammed a lot in here, so I just assumed that you were "talkin bout my generation."

[Danger Mouse]

312. they do, and that is also unfair.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

297. I'm glad we are finally digging out of the mess MY generation made

and I humbly apologize.

I didn't vote for Bush, but I guess that wasnt' enough.

I've been working hard since Sept 2003 to see that people's votes do count in my state.

[dana_b]

299. Not sure which generation you're in..

but I do know that my generation (Gen X) has not responded like we should. There are exceptions, of course, but generally we have gone along with the flow. Truthfully, the current generation seems more knowledgeable and willing to take things on then we have.

[krabigirl]

307. I dunno, I think it's elderly people who are pretty much crapped on by everyone. And I'm in my 30s.

But I have no issue with any age group. I just don't like how society treats the elderly.

[Danger Mouse]

310. that's another issue, though, too.

[RiverStone]

314. Your generation teaches us as much as we teach you!

Ya know we need you and believe you and value you - I know I do!

And have shared that with you before....:pals:

Hang in there and ignore the naysayers that discount you!


peace~:)

[cascadiance]

332. The more of us that join together instead of discounting each other...

... because we are from different generations, the more powerful our voice will be resonating with everyone else that still hasn't come on board.

As some have pointed out here, welcome aboard, and be aware that you'll need steel skin at times for those doubters that question you. I think you're seeing some frustration from those left over from the 60's that have seen many of their friends who weren't truly a part of the movement then (but there to be "in the crowd") leave and become part of the so-called "Reagan revolution" that has f'd us up so much over the years. They feel so isolated when others call them "aging hippies", and it may be a lot of defensive behavior you see sometimes if they don't accept you right away.

I know many of us who've gotten jaded over the years over so many politicians and others that have made promises to us over the years that were false and hollow, or who didn't say anything substantive and just expected us to fall in line for them only for us to discover later that their ambivalence was by design so that they didn't have any commitments towards us.

That's why so many like me had been on Edwards' bandwagon a lot earlier, since he came out and called a spade a spade in so many issues facing us. I appreciated someone trying to take on the growing corporatist political machine head on for a change. Many of us are still hoping that someone like Obama will pick up where he left off, and are trying not to hold our breath again.

But I do so VERY MUCH find it gratifying to see the younger generation mobilized now. That's half the battle, just like it was back in the 60's, when even though a lot of folks weren't truly there for the long count, you had a large enough part of the younger generation engaged that you could make a difference. Hoping that we can make a difference with a motivated newer generation this time around too, and that we focus our energies on making changes where it will count and make a difference (like tearing down the corporatocracy that's dominating us in such a damaging way now).

[Thickasabrick]

318. Luke.....I am your father

[jillan]

320. Unfortunately - this goes both ways.

The Obama crowd has been going after the over 50 yr olds.

Hey- I voted for Hillary, my daughter voted for Obama.... and we
respect each others decision.

[anonymous171]

321. Good thing your family is more respectful than DU. nt

[Danger Mouse]

338. i know it has. that saddens me, too.

why can't we all just respect one another?

[slackmaster]

322. Take it from this Boomer - the insults get worse as you get older

:hi:

[ladywnch]

323. you do count and instead of people being happy/excited that

'your generation' is finally engaged in the process after years/generations of apathy they attack the fact that you don't hold their views/opinions.

I apologize for those people who don't seem to have the manners to do so.

Welcome to the good fight and to DU

[robbedvoter]

325. I remember being young and old ladies pinching my cheek and envying my skin

It wasn't pleasant, but it was hardly offensive or infuriating.
I have been wearing my age quite graciously and had little qualms with how old I was. Until the baby boomers attacks - and the whole "you're irrelevant" BS I've been reading here lately. The "torch has been passed" and other short sighted comments like these.

[Danger Mouse]

337. those are idiotic comments that make no sense.

'the torch has been passed,' wtf? i thought everyone was supposed to count. :shrug:

[robbedvoter]

407. It was the title of a thread - kentuk posted it? It meant we oldies don't count

anymore - and I posted there pretty much what you said as well. No Dem candidate can afford to write out a large chunk of the electorate like this.

[boppers]

426. It's a relay race.

We all pass our torches. That's part of the race.

As we age, we don't all have the time to to phone bank all day.

We don't have the legs to knock on a hundred doors a day.

We can't caucus because we need the OT at work.

Sometimes, however, we pass the torch from a new mother to an empty nester, sometimes from a rich guy who just lost his job to a mother formerly on welfare who just got a job.

We pass the torch, and if we find somebody else who needs our fire to light another torch, we share it.

Passing the torch is not about young vs. old, it's about keeping the fire lit.

I hope you keep yours lit, robbedvoter, and I hope you share it, and pass it when you want/need to, and accept a new torch to have, or additional one to share, whenever you can.

Keep the fire lit.

[TheDonkey]

326. I am 24 and am not new to this process. I have been very active since I was 18.

Those that have a problem with it can deal with it.

Go Obama!

[tpsbmam]

327. Well said!

As someone who is old enough to be your mother (big huge groan here!!), I can't agree with you more. Don't let 'em get to you -- politics is ugly, and what you're seeing here is a good example of it. But politics can also be...dare I say it....hopeful and inspiring.

I'm delighted to see you involved, as well as my 18-year old neighbor. Let me tell you, I literally had tears in my eyes after I talked to him the other day. This is his first election and he's a huge Obama supporter. He's well aware of all of the issues, where each candidate stands on various issues, what their records are, etc etc. He was BEAMING when we were talking about the election and he was so bloody excited (he wasn't aware that Dems abroad had chosen Obama) it was palpable. This serious bordering on somber college freshman was smiling from ear to ear -- I was so damn touched and so happy for him.

It's been a long, long time since I've seen that kind of enthusiasm about a candidate. It warms my heart and it's fabulous that many young have a candidate they actually believe in.

So don't let the few here get to you -- know that there are some old(ish) farts out there who are like me and who are invigorated and touched by your generation's enthusiasm and involvement.

[Tarc]

328. Hey, look! iPods half-price!

[Danger Mouse]

336. i don't even own an ipod Tard.

[Tarc]

420. That's a "c" there, not a "d"

Easy mistake, I know.

[Bicoastal]

384. Self-delete--this is a positive thread, and I don't want to contaminate it.

[Tarc]

421. this was a "positive" thread? That's funny, looks pretty whiny and petulant

Well, it is good to know that the younger generation still likes to get high, at least.

[Bicoastal]

423. That younger generation stopped smoking weed long enough to sneak into the political

process and eat Hillary's lunch.

Any way you look at it, the joke's on you. Maybe in 2 years, when Democrats are running against chiefly against Republicans, not each other, you can hope the young people won't show up at the polls. Would that make you happy?

'Cuz it ain't happening this year. We're committed--just not to your candidate.

[Danger Mouse]

450. don't do drugs. never tried them, never will.

[juno jones]

331. I don't know what to say.

I'm 44, born in what I've called the 'blank' generation, the short gap just post-Kennedy, neither boomer or genX.

Quite a few of them were this way 20 years ago too.

IMO, Many really don't want anyone else holding the 'Youthquake' title and now make fun of people who were the same age as when they had their accomplishments in the 60's and 70's. Or not; I'm sure a lot are riding the coattails of their more active bretheren, just check out those who'll say, "Well I never did any of that (marching, sit-ins, LSD), but I was THERE, man."

Many have adopted a veneer of 'pragmatism' and 'cynicism', quashing new ideas and energies and disillusioning all young people who come to learn from them. A lot of potential future activists dropped out because of the know-it-all world weariness that invalidated all views and experience but their own.

Then, after robbing us of any youthful idealism, they label us 'slackers' and whine about how we won't play their reindeer games.

These succeeding generations are all about DIY/ grassroots. We've learned that strength can come from the bottom up, and not nescessarily dictated from a moribund chain of command more interested in their salaries and perks than effective leadership.


They should heed a great poet of their generation:

"And these children that you spit on
As they try to change their world
Are immune to your counsultations,
They're quite aware of what they're going through.
Turn and face the strange changes,
Don't tell them to grow up and out of it...."

Keep your chin up. We're in it for the long haul. We will sit down and shut up no longer.

edit to add: I have many friends older than me, but they do not condescend to my relative youth now or ever. I thank the older people who have been supportive here.

[bjnumb9]

333. 24 year old here

who will be voting for Obama as long as the party is smart enough to make him the nominee as I did Kerry in 2004 and Harold Ford in 2006 (TN). Sure is frustrating that my state has been for "the other guy/girl" everytime I have voted! Well, I guess I'm not counting Bredesen, but still... frustrating. And I have also seen the anger towards young people in these forums. Doesn't seem very productive to try and turn young people off of their own party, does it?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

339. Personally, I Think You're The Up And Coming Generation That Will Finally Save Us.

Don't give credibility to those harping against your entire generation by getting annoyed by it. Just ignore them. Calling out any generation based on their age is always generally ignorant.

Personally, I absolutely think there are some youngins here who are politically naive and though well meaning, have acted amazingly immature and shown their childishness. But that's an individual basis thing, not an entire generation thing. At the end of the day, even the ones too immature to engage accurately right now, will someday be those that hopefully save us all.

[martymar64]

345. I agree with your premise

But on a nerdish correction, the term "koolaid drinkers" isn't about young people, it's about people that will swallow anything their leaders say to, even if it will kill them. It traces back to the Jonestown death orgy perpetrated by Jim Jones and his followers in the People's Temple down in Guyana back around 1978. All of his followers there drank koolaid spiked with cyanide. Read up on Jim Jones and it will become clearer as to the implications of the phrase.

[Danger Mouse]

383. i know about jim jones and the origins of kool aid drinkers.

it just goes hand in hand with the 'cult' remarks...which are often directed at younger voters.
but i do know where it came from.
thanks :hi:

[boppers]

427. Pedantic Note:

It was Flavor Aid, not Kool-Aid, that did Jonestown in.

[populistdriven]

346. Hillary: RIAA enabler & Video Game Censorista

She should expect the younger generation's scorn.

[Danger Mouse]

392. blech. i had forgotten her crusading against video games.

as a gamer, i strongly dislike it. >_<

[caseycoon]

347. ELROND! We of the older generation need to remember

that everything wrong in this country happened on OUR WATCH! Whether we fought it or were apathetic IT HAPPENED. I am so very grateful & happy to see so many young people taking such strong & serious interest in politics & who & how the country should be run. I hope you all will do a better job of holding our nation to the great standards it was meant to have than WE did! Fight hard for her & for your dreams. It's your world to build!
Here's to the younger generation!
:toast:

[Danger Mouse]

386. i don't want your generation taking any blame for what the neocons did.

evil people will always be there, and some people will fight, and some people will lie down.
we can just hope that with each generation we get just a bit better.

[caseycoon]

434. That's kind of what I'm saying,

and you do have better tools than we did to keep tabs on them. I have a lot of hope that you CAN and WILL make it better. It sure won't happen all at once, but I see a great start. :hi:

[RetroLounge]

348. Quit your whining, kid.

and get off my lawn!

:hi:

RL

[Danger Mouse]

381. sorry about hitting the baseball through your window, mr. wilson.

:P

[RetroLounge]

412. ...

:rofl:

RL

[RememberWellstone]

349. Grow up.

Quit thinking the election is like your cellphone bill, you don't just pay your money and forget that there is work involved. Your generation has a lot to learn.

[Danger Mouse]

388. excuse me?

i'm talking about insulting comments directed towards voters of my generation.

[nookiemonster]

350. This 39 year old thinks

that you're a magnificent bastard!!!! You give me reason to hope.

:pals:

Stay charged!

:thumbsup:

[Danger Mouse]

398. i don't mind being a magnificent bastard! thanks!

:D

[suziedemocrat]

351. Hey...at least you're not a baby-boomer. They REALLY suck!

(And I am technically a baby-boomer.)

[kma3346]

353. Ignore the idiots!!

I look at your generation with such hope and admiration. We should be thrilled that 20-somethings are so involved in the political process. This is everyone's FUTURE we're talking about folks! And the younger you are, the more you will be affected by everything that is happening in the world today. I've often thought about how lucky I was to have grown up in the 60s as opposed to growing up in this era of cynicism, corruption, powerlessness, the list goes on and on and on.

Take heart and know that these snarky and downright hostile comments are made by a small subset of people. Don't lose hope and keep the faith! We're counting on you guys to help pull us out of this mess!!

[Arkana]

354. I know. It's always "those damn lazy college kids

who be corruptin' the democratic process"!

I'm 22, and I'm the only Obama guy in my house--sis, mom, and Dad are all for Hillary because of her "experience", and they just patronizingly put me down whenever I talk up my candidate.

[Danger Mouse]

397. just think...one more week, and you can serve them a nice warm dish...

of crow to feast on.

[Arkana]

446. I hope so, man...I really, really hope so.

[zulchzulu]

356. Don't worry...it will be over soon...

Consider those that insult you...nothing but scum.

[Patchuli]

359. I both understand and agree

I'm getting tired of babyboomers getting blamed for everything.

[OnionPatch]

371. I get tired of that too.

The "boomers dropped the ball" meme especially. The fact is that a large percentage of boomers were and always have been RWers, even back in the 60s, and when Reagan ushered in the me-me-me generation, we liberal boomers were outnumbered, plain and simple. We didn't all sell-out become Republicans contrary to what some claim.

[boppers]

428. Know any boomer "Goldwater Republicans" running for office this year?

I know at least one.

[Patchuli]

449. My sister and I are a good example of that

She took to my RW dad's ways and I stayed a Dem since registering at 18 (except for a very short stint in the Green Party). My sis likes to play hippie once in a while at a concert but it's all about money, things and tsk-tsking others because they are not as (fill in the blank) as she is!
She also unfortunately took after my dad's somewhat bigoted ways as well. What is sad is she started out a Dem and even worked on the McGovern Campaign back in the day...sigh.

I wish there were more liberal freaks like us...

[Danger Mouse]

379. i don't blame boomers for anything.

reagan was reagan's own fault.
hell, he wasn't even all that bad till the neocons started to influence him...

[RBInMaine]

360. You DO matter to me, many, and certainly to Obama.

Sadly, too many talking heads continue to say such things as, "Even if they're active now, that will probably wear off and the young voters may not come out in November, they never do." - Cokie Roberts on THIS WEEK Sunday show. ---- These talking heads should close their cynical pieholes. This cynicism and outright insulting young voters and Obama supporters is sad and pathetic. Is this what we have become? We're going to mock and attempt to marginalyze people for being excited about a campaign for a change? For being engaged in politics? My God, what are these people thinking? So sad. So cynical. So insulting. I'm 40 and have been very politically active for a long time now, and I'm with you 100%. What you should do is GET EVEN MORE INVOLVED. Do ANYTHING you can to be engaged: volunteer, canvass, phone bank, donate.
Don't let these pathetic cynics get you down. We have a chance to do something wonderful and phenominal here with the Obama candidacy. LET'S MAKE IT HAPPEN, AND THANK YOU !!

PS: Yes, Hillary herself out there being so juvenile as to mock Sen. Obama in Rhode Island.
Frustrated and desperate is all I see.

[bridgit]

361. Yes dear, of course, now go sit at the children's table...

AND DON'T GET ANY PUDDING ON MY CARPET, DAMMIT!! :rant: :hi:

[Danger Mouse]

377. i can has cookay?

pleeze?

[bridgit]

380. Yes! You *may* have a coo-kay, but don't chew with your mouth open...

You were not raised to conduct yourself as do republicans ;)

[cooolandrew]

364. Just turn any upset into action and that will make the difference really.

[Barrymores Ghost]

365. As someone who stands 20 years your senior.....

....I applaud you for your post, and I ask the same questions that you do.

I also wonder why, as an Edwards-supporter-turned-delegate for Barack Obama, that I am being dismissed as some sort of Gen-Y Know-Nothing -- especially when I am a 45-year-old veteran, a higher education professional, a parent, and a former rural conservative Reagan Republican and George H.W. Bush supporter (once only) who believes that Hillary Clinton has done more to divide Democrats and progressives and shore-up right-wing talking points than anyone has given her credit for...

Please explain this to me. Then, explain why Hillary has completely lost track of her message in favor of this unbridled, sophomoric and clearly desperate attack on Obama's candidacy.

I suppose, once someone has run out of ideas and solutions, that attacks are all that one has left in one's quiver.

[bpeale]

366. thanks for your lack of comprehension of basic english. off to ignore with you

[Danger Mouse]

393. aww...what a loss!

i comprehend basic english just fine.
like, for instance, you're an asshat.
that much is clear.
off to ignore with you as well.
asshat.

[GrimReefa]

367. Hillary has been trashing 20somethings for months

Remember the Chamber of Commerce speech, where she said that we think "work is a four-letter word"?

That we are the generation burying her is poetic justice.

[kotsu]

368. I can't say much

about your generation, considering my generation gave us Bush. There is a hope that your generation can do better but it won't by making the same mistakes as all the others. Passion is fine...but keep your eyes open. There is a good song by the Who from the days of dinosaurs that bears listening to by you young people.

[Danger Mouse]

376. i love the who, personally...

and pink floyd, the beatles, electric light orchestra, lou reed/the velvet underground, the zombies, and many others! :hi:

[H8fascistcons]

369. HEY ELROND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What scares me about your generation is that I fear you have not learned from our mistakes. Almost thirty years ago a republican Fascist named Ronald Regan told us it is good for America to ship our jobs to Japan and China. My generation could not buy cheap junk from overseas fast enough. Your generation has not bought one thing made in America, you drive japanese cars, buy computers made in china, your I-phone and I-pod are made in China, all of your clothes are made in some third world prision labor camp. If you have figured out that not maufacturing anything in America is not in the best interest of this country or for democracy then good on you, my generation can't die fast enough for me but if you think that buying cheap junk from overseas is a good thing then I do fear your generation for you have learned nothing and our democracy is doomed and America will continue be a Fascist country. The ball's in your court...

[Major Hogwash]

370. "Talking about my generation" - hang in there, we've been here before.

Old people resist change like a mofo, bro.

They like the status quo, because that's all they know.

Now it's time for them to go.

[Hekate]

372. DU is currently awash with Trollish behavior. Wish I had a $ for every slur against the Boomers...

...I could retire in style.

For whatever it's worth, I'm sorry that you've been caught in this unpleasantness too. I don't know what motivates so much of the intergenerational trashing here, but it's a Rovian dream of divisiveness and a fool's game.

I did a lot of tabling and voter registration before and during the 2004 election cycle, and the number of youngsters who professed to be "anarchists" who "didn't believe in feeding the beast" just about broke my ol' heart. During the first wave of protests against the invasion of Iraq, all the old peace-warriors showed up -- and I do mean old. It took quite awhile for the younger generation to show up in any numbers.

I am THRILLED that Barack Obama is bringing out the youth vote and inspiring the younger generation. It's been a long, long time since we had a leader of this inspirational caliber. You're absolutely right that you are the wave of the future. I hope you can do what we tried so hard to do.

The man brings tears to my eyes with his eloquence, and while I was really moved by the Teddy and Caroline Kennedy endorsement (they all but pulled the sword out of the stone and knighted him with it) that actually spoke much more to the older generations than to yours.

Go to it Young Elrond! Go to it! :pals:

Hekate

[Danger Mouse]

378. anarchists make me chuckle.

thank you for your support, i agree that DU is lately awash with pure venom. :pals:

[Divine Discontent]

373. nice rant!

hey, not speaking about you, as I've never noticed a bad thing about your posts, but I think what some people are feeling and seeing, and therefore responding to with the comments you said they've called you, is the direct result of many people who say they back Obama or have his face as an avatar. They are crass, mean, uncaring, and downright hostile. Again, your rant is great, but it's broad because you're referring to many different comments and situations that no one could fully vet. However, I agree, calling people those things is deplorable. I would hope that people who may side with Obama, would call out other people who side with Obama when they're nasty.

GOBAMA!

[Danger Mouse]

375. i try to call out obama supporters when i feel they are being over the top...

and have alerted on many posts and threads from my fellow obama supporters when i felt they were damaging to the dialogue.

[Divine Discontent]

432. then you're one of the best on DU! take care eom

[PITBOS]

385. its all about you isn't it.*

*

[Danger Mouse]

389. it's not about me, it's about US.

there are plenty of younger voters on du.
welcome to du...i guess.

[Bicoastal]

395. Remember me, Elrond?--I was trying to get a "Young DU" forum started a while back...

...guess it wasn't a popular-enough idea. :(

[Danger Mouse]

399. if you remember, i'm pretty sure i supported the idea, too!

:hi:
i still think it's a good idea.

[Bicoastal]

401. I love how some people think this is a very recent phenomenon on DU...

....in truth, it started right after Iowa, and has only been growing as the other candidates dropped out.

[DemBones DemBones]

403. Boomers have been insulted for decades, and ageism

and sexism are rampant in the attacks on Hillary Clinton that are posted here.

I look through this thread and people are whining about how my generation messed up.

Newsflash: There are still a lot of people living today who are older than Boomers, and I refuse to take the blame for how *they* have voted over the years. Neither will I nor my generation be blamed for people who drink GOP Kool-Aid.

You've voted in two presidential elections and you're disgusted.

I've voted in TEN and November will be #11, if I vote, and I can tell you that you're going to be a lot more disgusted in forty years. Welcome to the reality of being an adult in a pseudo-democracy.

Sig lines are turned off right now but part of mine is "If voting changed anything, it would be illegal." - Emma Goldman

[cloud75]

405. It's because you guys don't vote...when the masses feel like

you do then we will listen. Those 65 and older vote...and i'm not AMERICAN IDOL vote. That's why you don't touch Medicare or Social Security if you are an elected official. You are only one voice among millions...when the millions speak as one we listen. And get used to the mocking and spit on if obama win the nomination or presidency he will be torn down...My obama was Bill Clinton and look what they did to him and to Hillary.

[cboy4]

406. Why do you have such a chip on your shoulder about

your age?

Man, you seemingly mention it constantly.

I comes across as faux outrage.

We get it, you're a young Obama follower.

[Danger Mouse]

410. it's not faux outrage.

once i saw 'the worst generation,' i saw red.

[Warpy]

411. When you're old and grey, you'll say the world is going to hell, too

and that the trip is being conducted by all those punk kids under 30 who don't have the life experience to know when they're being conned.

It has been this way since the written word has recorded it and probably ever since the first hominid stood upright and found if you banged two rocks together hard enough, one would break into a useful tool. It will be that way long after you and I are gone.

[dog_lovin_dem]

416. This 49 year old mother

of a 25 year old son salutes you, Elrond! My son voted for the first time in 2004. He had moved 2 hours from home a couple of months before and drove back here just to vote for John Kerry. He was almost as upset as I was with the outcome of that election, but it hasn't deterred him in the slightest.
All of his friends were/are politically active, progressive thinkers who have taught this old gal alot more than I care to admit! I attended my first peace rally in his new location and he picks up yard signs for me at his local flea market.
I admire the young people of this generation and, most times, enjoy their company more than people around my age who refuse to see/think outside the box. Of course, it may be the rural area where I live that has affected the perception of the people my age, but it hasn't seemed to affect the young people. You guys and gals give me hope for the future of our country and our world. Don't let those who would try hold you down.

[knight_of_the_star]

417. I'm with you there

What I really like are the ones who bash those on the younger end who weren't old enough for 2000 and worked our asses off in 2004 and get flak because supposedly we haven't saved the world yet. Where were they?

[Drunken Irishman]

422. I'm 23 and I tire of it too.

People bitch when the youth don't get involved in politics and then when they do, they're told their opinion doesn't matter, they're too green and they don't have enough world experience. Well bullshit, come live my life and we'll talk about world experience. My father fought in Vietnam, suffers from Agent Orange and PTSD. I grew up poor in the projects and watched as people overdosed and died of stab and gunshot wounds. I saw my house shot up because people mistook it for a rival gang member's house. I saw both my parents starve for my brother and I could have food. I saw my parents go without for we could have a good Christmas. I've had to put up with a drunk father, who verbally and physically abused me. I went without healthcare as a child, didn't visit my first dentist until the age of 20. So don't tell me I'm not good enough, strong enough, or experienced enough to have an opinion.

I've lived through hell and I'm not about to take a backseat to someone who thinks I have no standing on political issues.

[vickitulsa]

425. Perhaps you need to think "operative" instead of accepting

on the face of it the idea that certain people have a "need to insult" your generation. That "need" you see in them may in fact be well-tuned planning put in action through their hateful, divisive words.

I'm just surmising from seeing so much crapola being posted here lately, that it's highly likely those who incite the animosity and inter-generational strife and bickering are simply non-allied (with us) operatives whose intent is to divide us, and by dividing, conquer us.

"Crapola," btw, is a word my dad used. Remember we "boomers" naturally got a lot of what we are and how we think from the WWII generation, even if we launched a pretty good revolt against all we saw wrong with their ideas as well.

That's the way it always goes, imo. We each embrace what's worthwhile and reject what is garbage from the generation(s) before our own. Often we don't see that very clearly until we get old enough in our turn to gain some real perspective, but from my observations it seems to be true.

We must not let the bastards get us down! ;)

"Us" being those like you and me and so many others here (and "out there" too) who want to see an end to the entrenched ways of corrupt, cozy, two-party power politics collaborating to rob us of all that should be ours in this country.

The disruptors are trying to capitalize on the mistaken theory that old and young are natural enemies, when in all honesty I see boomers and young adults far more realistically as logical allies. When you think about what we went through in OUR youth -- with our rebellion against "the man" and "the system" that sucked bigtime when we inherited it, with our inspired determination to "change the world" with our enthusiasm and involvement in movements for change -- we boomers DO have so much more in common with young folks today than either group may at first recognize.

Speaking only for myself now, I have to tell ya that I haven't been so genuinely moved in ages as I am these days to see what's going on among the young people! I am excited by your excitement and enthused by your enthusiasm ... and it feels just terrific. It is positively REjuvenating!

It's such a powerful and amazing thing that it overcomes even the rather jaded cynicism that has set in over the years of frustration and disillusionment I've endured.

Beyond that, I just plain LOVE you guys!

You gotta keep in mind that just as we were experiencing some successes, we were shot down -- quite literally (you've heard of Kent State in 1970?) -- by an "establishment" that refused to yield any of their power. When we tried so hard to change things, to rout out the oldtime politicians and bring a fresh new attitude and HOPE onto the field, we were punished violently and ultimately silenced.

Think of all those assassinations of the 60's that robbed us of our inspiring leaders and disillusioned us so thoroughly. Think of the scenes you've maybe witnessed via newsfilm from the Chicago '68 Democratic convention where police were bloodying our heads and dragging our young asses into their paddywagons, carting us off to jail for our enthusiasm and determination to bring change.

When you ponder those times in this light, perhaps it's possible to understand why some -- those of my generation who aren't operatives here but who ARE hatefully cynical bullies and venomously divisive types -- might actually believe they're going to accomplish our goals by shutting you up, shouting you down, even insulting you.

Either way, I hope you can ignore them -- even pity them for their desperate grubbing for a last stab at attaining power, for they have none. I have only read about halfway through this thread so far, but I see far more posts from older people here supporting and encouraging you than denigrating you, and I'm very glad of it! I hope this reassures you that the very few hateful spewers of divisiveness are definitely no more welcome among or to us than they are to you.

Whatever their reasons for their abominable behavior, it likely has nothing to do, really, with Obama or Clinton or the amazing vigor of young people and a lot to do with their own agendas and bitterness. That is, if they are NOT operatives. You see? :)

I'm not saying, however, that you should ever have to put up with their nastiness and their ridiculous insults. No one should have to do that. I'm just hoping you don't let it taint your view of an entire generation because you can find plenty of wonderful examples of cool gray heads who support you a thousand percent and happily join hands with you. :hi:

Hey, of COURSE we support you and welcome your contributions! We ARE on the same team, and we veterans are fairly well exhausted. We desperately need your input and your efforts, your earnest dedication and your fresh "legs." I've been heartened immeasurably by your substance as well as your spunk!

Truth is, the way I see it, we could never reach our mutual goals without ya.

Believe me, we who haven't abandoned all hope need and want you in this fight with us. (I almost said, "We who are about to die salute you!" :evilgrin: )

It is not, after all, so much for ourselves any longer that we continue the good fight, but for you. And to the extent those of my generation have exploited and despoiled the planet in all the ways that has been done, I fervently hope the ones who actually CAUSED that devastation are eventually the ones who are held to blame for it. NOT the ones of us who tried so hard to stop it.

My friend, my comrade, my brother or sister with the unlined face and bountiful positive enthusiasm, I embrace you! :hug: :pals:

[Zorra]

429. You....

...who are on the road
Must have a code that you can live by
And so become yourself
Because the past is just a good bye.

Teach your children well,
Their father's hell did slowly go by,
And feed them on your dreams
The one they picked, the one you'll know by.

Don't you ever ask them why, if they told you, you would cry,
So just look at them and sigh and know they love you.

And you, of tender years,
Can't know the fears that your elders grew by,
And so please help them with your youth,
They seek the truth before they can die.

Teach your parents well,
Their children's hell will slowly go by,
And feed them on your dreams
The one they picked, the one you'll know by.

Don't you ever ask them why, if they told you, you would cry,
So just look at them and sigh and know they love you.

(Teach Your Children, by Crosby, Stills, Nash, and Young)

Peace

[Zorra]

430. If my words did glow

with the gold of sunshine
And my tunes were played on the harp unstrung,
Would you hear my voice come thru the music,
Would you hold it near as it were your own?

Its a hand-me-down, the thoughts are broken,
Perhaps they're better left unsung.
I dont know, dont really care
Let there be songs to fill the air.

Ripple in still water,
When there is no pebble tossed,
Nor wind to blow.

Reach out your hand if your cup be empty,
If your cup is full may it be again,
Let it be known there is a fountain,
That was not made by the hands of men.

There is a road, no simple highway,
Between the dawn and the dark of night,
And if you go no one may follow,
That path is for your steps alone.

Ripple in still water,
When there is no pebble tossed,
Nor wind to blow.

If you should choose,
to lead must follow
But if you fall you fall alone,
If you should stand then who's to guide you?
If I knew the way I would take you home.

If I knew the way, I would take you home.
(Lyrics by Robert Hunter)

[Zorra]

431. A perfect day,

the sun is sinkin' low
As evening falls, the gentle breezes blow
The time we shared went by so fast
Just like a dream, we knew it couldn't last
But I'd do it all again
If I could, somehow
But I must be leavin' soon
It's your world now

It's your world now
My race is run
I'm moving on
Like the setting sun
No sad goodbyes
No tears allowed
You'll be alright
It's your world now

Even when we are apart
You'll always be in my heart
When dark clouds appear in the sky
Remember true love never dies

But first a kiss, one glass of wine
Just one more dance while there's still time
My one last wish: someday, you'll see
How hard I tried and how much you meant to me

It's your world now
Use well the time
Be part of something good
Leave something good behind
The curtain falls
I take my bow
That's how it's meant to be
It's your world now
It's your world now
It's your world now

(Eagles)

[yellowcanine]

437. It is all a lie anyway (that Obama's support is mainly the youth vote). There are plenty of old

farts like me that support Obama. And I am not African American either. Rationalization and denial seems to be the prevailing attitude in the Clinton camp these days.

[Tarc]

442. There's plenty of Republican interlopers as well

who take advantage of open primaries.

[yellowcanine]

445. Yeah well I am not Republican either. I am an old Yellowdog Democrat. And I support Obama.

Why not just admit that Obama has a lot of support - Democrats, Independents, moderate Republicans, whites, African American, Hispanics, men, women, old, young, rich, poor. - instead of falsely trying to pigeon hole his supporters?

[mculator]

440. I'm 28 for Hillary

REMEMBER NADER, MAN? We are all too quick to go with the flow, and I learned my lesson. I picked Hillary on the restoration argument, because while they managed to make it look like the "past", I LIKED THE PAST!

Not everyone in our generation has been insulted! I get quite a bit of love from both camps, man! They want our vote!

I'm for Hillary, you're for Barack, and we're both right.

[NoSheep]

443. I'm 45 and I'm with you. This is a crazy time at DU. I'm shocked by the venom.

The only thing I can think is either we have a bunch of trolls trying to disrupt or that people have really lost their minds after 8 years of shrub and his goons. It's probably both. I hate what I see here these days and largely ignore most of it. Put the jerks on ignore until after this blows over. Or go to the Lounge and chill for a while. Perhaps your state forum is less hateful..Or start your own blog! Power to the good people! ALL the good people!! Thank you for your participation!

:hi:

[COFoothills]

447. Your generation just hasn't made it's mark yet...

...and has yet to be replaced by a younger generation that is disengaged and lazy, so as to make yours less so.

I'm 40 and my generation had the same rap. Ditto for every generation of youth before it. Until they grew into themselves and had someone younger to beat on.

[MagsDem]

451. I think adult supporters of Obama are cult members and kool aid drinkers too

I hope that makes you feel better. Has nothing to do with age as far as I'm concerned.

[Ken Burch]

452. It's mainly the boomers who've gone DLC or GOP who hate you guys

They think THEY had the right to be political and defiant as young people, but that nobody after them does.

They are the sort who live up to these lines from Phil Ochs, a singer of their generation(who was mocking the attitude, not embracing it):

"Oh sure once I was young and impulsive,
I wore every conceivable pin.
Even went to socialist meetings,
learned all the old union hymns.
Ah but now I've grown older and wiser,
AND THAT'S WHY I'M TURNING YOU IN!
So love me, love me love me, I'm A Liberal.

[eilen]

453. Being a gen xer

I sympathize with your plight. My first election was between Reagan and Mondale. I voted for Mondale, watching the returns.... well let's just say it was a good thing we were in a pub with many pitchers. It really felt like there was no choices, no options, nothing for anyone who wasn't a boomer. I grew up hearing about how great the 60's was, watched Nixon resign on tv as a kid, saw companies like Westinghouse lay off my dad and hundreds of others to get a boost in the stock market, saw Americans held hostage in Iran and odd/even days at the gas stations. My parents went broke during the 70's when real estate went through the floor and no one could get a mortgage with the best credit ever-- the banks were not lending, there were just not enough mortgages available. The jobs were non-existant for entry level people after college because of the recession and all the laid-off experienced boomers were on the job market as well. I guess my gen felt like they could not compete-- . We were pissed off, and kind of hating everyone and felt very anti-hippie. You have to understand, we couldn't even get our music played on the radio unless it was some college station late at night. Ramones, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Minor Threat, Dead Kennedys, Sonic Youth, Descendants, Black Flag-- it was like a blackout, our voices were censored.

We did the Diy thing and decided to make our own lives, culture and not buy into the corporate hustle--And thus were called "the Slackers" and treated with derision. I wish we had the internet, digitial music recorders and players etc. it would have made things much less expensive and easier. Demographically we were a nonstarter so no one really cared what we thought, just were ticked off we weren't signing on their agenda. Mostly my dh and I have voted 3rd party when we could.-- we really didn't care for the major parties that seemed to serve up the same dish, different plate, brought to you by "pick your favorite corporate interest."

Now I'm the one over 40, I have a teenager--a son who is 15 and I totally encourage him to think for himself. He and his friends are more inclusive and open than previous generations. I remember it being a big deal for inter-racial dating in high school, now, it is not even a blip on the radar. My son and his friends don't understand the hoopla over gay marriage-- what is the big deal they wonder? Indeed. I enjoy talking to people in their 20's and 30's because frankly, most of the people my age caught whatever it is the yuppies did in the eighties and have materialitis (think of the adults in the movie American Beauty). I think the younger generation are even more attuned to environmental concerns. Just because wildlife conservation isn't at the top of their list instead it may be green energy and green building-- it still spills over to conservation--it is a shift in focus that ultimately has the same effect.

Now I can't speak for everyone who is in my cohort nor can I totally generalize the Baby boomers (frankly, it is too long a time period to truly classify everyone in that gen). My parents were born in the the late 30's and early 40's and were older, trying to raise young families during the youthquake of the late 1960's, they hadn't experienced the great horn of plenty that was the fifties because their families were PTSD from the depression and war (my mother immigrated from Germany after WW2). They were not "tuning in" and "burning out". But they were party to the divorce and consciousness-raising trends of the 1970's and voted for Reagan even though they were Democrats. When I say "parents" I am referring loosely to a group of up to 6-7 people as they divorced and cohabited/remarried, rinse and repeat. My actual bio parents-- Mom married 2x, Dad married/cohabited 3x, Stepdad married 3x. Although I don't know if my Dad actually voted for Reagan, he was a Dyed in wool dem, but very limo lib.

So don't take it personally. Most of the older generations are pretty much still as clueless and don't feel much different than they did when they were 22. I think calling young voters "hitler youth" because they support Barak Obama is pretty juvenile and assy. That kind of stuff gives people with liberal and progressive ideals a bad name-- invoking Hitler whenever someone doesn't agree with them... It's like a Rwinger calling someone a communist if they don't agree with their brand of free trade. I encourage you to continue to question everything and not allow yourself to be intimidated by "yammering once-geniuses." I hope you stay engaged when it comes to the voting booth because aside from what many think, it's the vote not the noise that counts and labels suck.