Clinton is a terrible speaker, Obama is a great one

[mudesi]

And now for something completely superficial.

I think a lot of the Obama "cult" meme comes from the fact that people genuinely like him. When Obama gives a speech, he comes across as confident, intelligent, and "presidential". Clinton, on the other hand, comes off phony, scripted, and insincere.


The problem with the majority of Americans is that they vote for who they like, based on personality and speaking skills. Issues be damned, it's always the charismatic one who takes the election. George W. Bush came off as the likable Texan cowboy while Al Gore was the wooden bore. (Yes, I am well aware of the fact that Gore actually won and that the election was stolen, but it shouldn't have been so close). Even after 4 disastrous years, Kerry "lost" (again, they stole it - I know) because he just wasn't very charismatic.

Ronald Reagan, easily the second worst president in the history of the United States was likable. He gave a great speech, and was good at one liners. His phony apologies came off as sincere.

I wish it were only about the issues. If it were, Kucinich would have been the President by now. His policies coincide precisely with what it means to be a true American. Freedom. Peace. Socialism. Single payer universal health care. Equitable wealth distribution. Fighting poverty.

Hillary Clinton's speaking style is, to be quite blunt, not very good. I don't think one needs to be a rabid Obama supporter or Clinton hater to be objective about this. I am anti-Clinton because of her war vote and her stubborn refusal to take responsibility for it, but if she were a great speaker, I would say so.

I don't like Obama policy wise at all. His health care plan is just as bad as Clinton's and he's not nearly where he ought to be on gay rights. Both of them are also apparently pro capital punishment and anti gun control, which makes them liberal not at all. But Obama is a good speaker, and I can't deny such a thing.

If you compare the charisma factor between McCain and Obama versus McCain and Clinton, it's no contest. Obama wins hands down. While I believe even Clinton can beat McCain, I think Obama would mop the floor with him in the general election.

[Breeze54]

1. I disagree.

Kucinich is a better orator than both of them put together!!

[GreenPartyVoter]

4. Yep.

[Jersey Devil]

20. Yeah, but he looks like Alfred E Neumann

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[Breeze54]

22. But it's what's between the ears and in the heart that really counts....

[woolldog]

2. Socialism?

Is what it means to be a true American?

[mudesi]

7. Social security, welfare, public roads, schools, libraries, fire departments

...the list goes on.

[Freida5]

3. All hat No cattle

[BOSSHOG]

5. Can't buy it totally

She ain't that bad and he has not inspired me at all. His campaign plan is to be an empty suit and blather on about hope while his supporters (like the townspeople of Springfield (The Simpsons)) line up to buy a monorail from him. However, its working for him.

I am an awesome speaker, love to be on the podium, spent years instructing, debated in High School and College. You should vote for me.

[Iris]

10. Plus, people genuinely liked Bush and he is a HORRIBLE speaker.

On that, I'm sure we ALL can agree.


It would be a welcome relief to me to hear either Democratic candidate speaking as president.

[Quixote1818]

18. Bush is a great campaigner though. He can give a good speech

He sucks at Press Conferences when he has to think on his feet.

[waiting for hope]

6. Obama a motivational speaker?

Please! :boring: But then, my candidate was Edwards, and neither Obama or Clinton compare. Just watch the Iowa Jeff/Jackson dinner and see what I mean.

[blm]

8. Gore and Kerry won. The RNC stole those elections for Bush and a weakass DNC let them

do it both times.

[Bucky]

9. Hogwash

Clinton might feel a little scripted, but she's no phony and she sure as hell isn't insincere. She means what she says and she's clearly a good manager and a powerful legislator. I doubt she'll be nominated, but if it happens, I think she'll make us Obamists proud to be Democrats

[bellasgrams]

16. Thank you Bucky, you're the first BO supporter that hasn't been

mean or hateful in some way at Hillary. If BO's supporters would listen and watch Hillary, they would agree.

[Nederland]

24. I see nothing in her campaign...

...that indicates that she is a good manager.

[JoFerret]

25. Well said Bucky

And I think I can live with a President Obama. Although he is not my first choice and I do find him rather preachy and manipulative among a number of other weaknesses.

But compared to Bush and all other GOPers of recent vintage he is perfection. And next to McCain he is a towering GIANT.

[sandnsea]

11. Well, the speaker has to be going somewhere

It's not enough to just give a great speech. It's identifying values Americans see in themselves and communicating a vision based on those values. I know DUers don't tend to get it, but laundry lists don't work and that is what has hurt the Dem Party for years. Hillary hasn't been able to articulate her values and how her values are going to make the country and world better.

[LisaM]

12. I never thought Bush (or Reagan) was likable

and I am sincerely puzzled by people who think that they were. I am WELL AWARE that it's so - but I found both to be creepy. I liked Kerry's intellectualism and dry humor. I enjoyed Gore's phraseology and control of the issues. I frankly never understood Bush's appeal in the least, but even his appeal was (to me) stronger than Reagan's. I found Reagan to be nothing short of smarmy.

Because this is who I am, I frankly don't see the appeal in Obama's speeches. I am not discounting that the style appeals to many. I just can't relate to it. I would like to see BossHog speak, though.

For a good old barn burner of a speech, the best one I ever saw was Tom Harken at a union hall here in Seattle back in 1992. Passionate, issue-driven, rousing, and just plain exciting.

[Beregond2]

15. Reagan, etc.

I have been baffled ever since he first became President how Reagan got the reputation for being a "great communicator." I used to force myself to listen to his speeches, trying to understand the phenomenon. The man couldn't put together a coherent thought to save his life, let alone express it well. Is it an accident that the only quote one ever hears of his is "Tear down this wall!" That's great speaking?

I saw a study once where they analyzed people's reactions to Reagan as a speaker. Those who mostly focussed on his body language and tone of voice thought he was brilliant. Those who actually listened to the words thought he was a moron. Maybe this has something to do with our becoming an illiterate culture, and so more vulnerable to visual and aural manipulation.

Don't ask me to explain Dubya. There is no explanation. An ugly, stupid little man oozing evil from every pore. What does it say about the ability of many Americans to read character, that he became President? I lose all hope when I think about it...so I don't.

[mudesi]

19. Neither did I

But that's because we're both liberals who focus on the issues, not the character.

[griffi94]

13. you said that you think the cult meme

comes from the fact that people genuinely like him. imho people don't genuinely know him. they know what he says at rallys, but as you pointed out people seemed to genuinely like bush as well. bush is a disaster, and obama could easily be just as big a disaster. imo he doesn't have a long enough track record to show what he might really do or not do once elected.

[El Supremo]

14. Hillary says "you know" too much. And...

Barack says "uh" too much.

Other than that, neither are bad speakers.

[juajen]

17. I believe that is in the ears of the behearder!

NT

[Freida5]

21. The media created him and the media will destroy him

[JoFerret]

23. Swoon...

(...I am always wary of anyone with high charisma. Always dangerous.)