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Here's the dirt that the Right will use against Hillary

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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:24 AM
Original message
Here's the dirt that the Right will use against Hillary
Edited on Wed Mar-05-08 11:49 AM by NightWatcher
{On Edit: I didnt want to play in the mud, but the argument has been made that McCain will use dirt against Obama so it's better that he fight it now and not be surprised in the Fall. If that is the way we want to play things, let's remind Hillary of the things that the Right has and WILL throw at Hillary should she take the nom. The repukes spent 8 years investigating the Clintons and I fear that will come right back to the front of their talking points.}



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitewater_(controversy)
The Whitewater controversy (also called the Whitewater scandal, Whitewatergate, or often simply Whitewater) was an American political controversy that began with the real estate dealings of Bill and Hillary Clinton and their associates, Jim and Susan McDougal in the Whitewater Development Corporation, a failed business venture in the 1970s and 1980s.

David Hale, the source of criminal allegations against President Clinton in the Whitewater affair, claimed in November 1993 that Clinton, while governor of Arkansas, pressured him to provide an illegal $300,000 loan to Susan McDougal, the partner of the Clintons in the Whitewater land deal.<1> This allegation by Hale was questionable, as it contradicted his own testimony in the original FBI investigation of the failure of Madison Guaranty in 1989, where Hale did not mention Clinton in reference to this same loan. Hale also had a history of creating dummy companies, then looting federal funds, such as SBA loans, from them, and allowing them to fail. Only after coming under indictment in 1993 for charges in just such a scheme did Hale make allegations against Clinton.<2>

A New York Times article published during the 1992 U.S. presidential campaign reported that Clinton and his wife had invested in and lost money in the Whitewater development project.<3> A U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission investigation resulted in criminal charges against the two principals in the Whitewater project, but the Clintons themselves were never charged. Three separate inquiries found that there was insufficient evidence to charge the Clintons with criminal conduct in the land deal


Lets also remember the billing records from the Rose Law Firm which disappeared for a while....

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/arkansas/docs/recs.html

In January 1996, a long sought-after copy of billing records from the Rose Law Finn were identified and turned over to prosecutors by Carolyn Huber, a White House assistant to Hillary Rodham Clinton. Ms. Huber, herself a former Rose Law Firm employee, recognized the records and realized that they had been among papers that she had removed six months earlier from the First Lady's book room on the third floor of the White House.

The mysterious appearance of the billing records, which had been the specific subject of various investigative subpoenas for two years, sparked intense interest about how they surfaced and where they had been. Shortly after the discovery of the records, Hillary Clinton made history -- she became the only First Lady ever called to testify before a Grand Jury inquiry

Ms. Clinton and her attorney have stated publicly that the billing records confirm that, as an attorney at the Rose Firm in the mid-80's, she was not significantly involved in the representation of Jim McDougal's savings and loan, Madison Guaranty.

According to the Rose records, Hillary Clinton billed Madison for 60 hours of work over a 15 month period. Ms. Clinton's attorney argues that this represents a de minimus amount of work and includes billings for work performed by Rose Finn lawyers working for Hillary Clinton at the time.

But Whitewater investigators believe that the billing records show significant representation. They argue that the records prove that Ms. Clinton was not only directly involved in the representation of Madison, but more specifically, in providing legal work on the fraudulent Castle Grande land deal.

In particular, investigators zeroed in on the individual billings, including a dozen calls and meetings with Seth Ward, the individual whom regulators determined was a "straw man" in the Castle Grande deal. These contacts occurred during a period of time, including early 1986, that Ward was engaged in efforts to obtain sales commissions from McDougal that would later tip regulators to illegalities at Castle Grande.


Webster Hubbell also worked with Hillary and Rose Law Firm and he went to prison

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Webster_Hubbell

He was appointed by Bill Clinton as chief justice of Arkansas State Supreme Court in 1983.
<snip>
In December 1994, Hubbell pleaded guilty to federal mail fraud and tax evasion charges in connection with his handling of billing at the Rose Law Firm, a firm with partners that once included Hillary Clinton and Vince Foster.
<snip>
In January 1993, Hubbell's former partners at the Rose Law Firm discovered what appeared to be irregularities in Hubbell's bills to clients. The Independent Counsel later found that Hubbell had billed clients for services he never performed, and that he failed to report that income on his tax returns. Shortly after Independent Counsel Robert Fiske opened a criminal probe into the matter, Hubbell resigned as associate attorney general on March 14, 1994.<1>

The day before Hubbell announced his resignation, there was a meeting of senior White House officials, including President Bill Clinton, First Lady Hillary Clinton, and Chief of Staff Mack McLarty. At the meeting, McLarty told Hillary Clinton that White House employees would "be supportive" of Hubbell. During the sixteen months after Hubbell's resignation, he received seventeen employment contracts from supporters of President Clinton. He received approximately $450,010 in consulting fees from those contracts, but did not report all of that income on his tax returns.



Remember to also mention- Norman Hsu

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/09/26/hsu_raised_big_money_for_clinton_supporters/

Disgraced fund-raiser Norman Hsu did a lot more than just pump $850,000 into Hillary Clinton's campaign bank account: He also raised hundreds of thousands of dollars for local, state, and federal candidates who have endorsed Clinton or whose support she courted.

A major fund-raiser for Democrats since 2003, Hsu became one of Clinton's biggest bundlers - gathering scores of individual checks and sending them to her campaign. But since revelations last month that Hsu was a fugitive in a 15-year-old California fraud case, Clinton has said she would return the $850,000 she has taken from him and his associates.


If we'd like to be lazy and take pages from the right wing (as seems to be Hillary's plan) we can go and look at these summaries

NUMBER of Hillary Clinton fundraisers convicted of, or pleading no contest to, crime: 5

NUMBER OF CLOSE BUSINESS partners of Hillary Clinton who ended up in prison: 3. The Clintons' two partners in Whitewater wereconvicted of 24 counts of fraud and conspiracy. Hillary Clinton's partner and mentor at the Rose law firm, Webster Hubbell, pleaded guilty to federal mail fraud and tax evasion charges, including defrauding former clients and former partners out of more than $480,000. Hillary Clinton was mentioned 35 times in the indictment.

IN THE 1980s, Hillary Clinton made a $44,000 profit on a $2,000 investment in a cellular phone franchise deal took advantage of the FCC's preference for locals, minorities and women. The franchise was almost immediately flipped to the cellular giant, McCaw.

IN 1993 HILLARY CLINTON and David Watkins moved to oust the White House travel office in favor of World Wide Travel, Clinton's source of $1 million in fly-now-pay-later campaign trips that essentially financed the last stages of the campaign without the bother of reporting a de facto contribution. The White House fired seven long-term employees for alleged mismanagement and kickbacks. The director, Billy Dale, charged with embezzlement, was acquitted in less than two hours by the jury.

DRUG DEALER Jorge Cabrera gave enough to the Democrats to have his picture taken with both Hillary Clinton and Al Gore. . . Cabrera was arrested in January 1996 inside a cigar warehouse near here in Dade County, where more than 500 pounds of cocaine had been hidden. He and several accomplices were charged with having smuggled 3,000 pounds of cocaine into the United States through the Keys.

The above photo was taken in front of the White House Christmas tree with Hillary and Clinton campaign donor Jorge Cabreras. Jorge is a convicted drug smuggler and friend of Fidel Castro. According to the New York Times, April 4, 1997, Jorge was solicited for his donation by a Democratic operative in the lobby of a hotel in Havana! The $20,000 check to the Clinton campaign came from an account linked to cocaine money. At the time the above photo was taken, Jorge had two felony convictions, but the Secret Service cleared him to enter the White House anyway.

________________________________________________________________

IN 2007, A Pakistani immigrant who hosted fundraisers for Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton became a target of the FBI allegations that he funneled illegal contributions to Clinton's political action committee and to Sen. Barbara Boxer's 2004 re-election campaign. Authorities say Northridge, Calif., businessman Abdul Rehman Jinnah, 56, fled the country shortly after being indicted on charges of engineering more than $50,000 in illegal donations to the Democratic committees.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/03042007/news/nationalnews/pro_clinton_dirty_cash_man_flees_nationalnews_christine_field.htm
A Pakistani immigrant is wanted by federal authorities on charges he channeled $30,000 in illegal contributions to Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton's presidential war chest.

The FBI is hunting Los Angeles businessman Abdul Rehman Jinnah, who vanished soon after his grand-jury indictment for violating federal election laws last May.

Clinton's camp has denied any knowledge of Jinnah's scheme, which is also alleged to have funneled more than $50,000 in illegal donations to the political action committees of Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.), the Los Angeles Times reported yesterday.

Jinnah, 56, a cellphone and frozen-yogurt businessman, allegedly collected campaign donations from family members, friends and employees at fake fund-raising events - then reimbursed them. The scam allowed him to evade the $2,000 limit on individual contributions to candidates, the feds say.

He is believed to have fled to his native Pakistan after his indictment on charges of conspiracy and making illegal campaign contributions.

The FBI has posted Jinnah's mug shot on its featured fugitive list.

Clinton's campaign said Jinnah's allegedly illegal contributions would be donated to charity. A representative said the campaign had no knowledge of Jinnah's activities and had not been contacted by federal investigators.


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monmouth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'd like to see those income tax returns also. She's been avoiding that one..n/t
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
2. All he needs to do is keep on doing what he does
he doesn't need to sink to her level. He has more pds, and is at no risk of losing that edge. The sds will go with whoever has the most pds. I wouldn't worry about it.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. That was my thought. He doesn't need to stoop to her level.
NGU.


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samdogmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #5
25. I sure hope he can stay positive and ultimately win!
In the long run, this will be the better lesson for all of politics. Going dirty might win a victory here and there, but overall the positive message trumps!

Thus, a page will be turned in Campaign Theory 101!

I can't wait for the day that dirty campaigning becomes a thing of the past!
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
3. Obama smears R us store is open after a successful test marketing of the race card in SC
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truebrit71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. You're a broken record pal...that's all you've got? And it was HRC's husband that played the race..
...card in SC...NOT the other way around...
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #6
35. ***YAWN*** All this crap has been investigated and there was
not much of anything there. Do you have any other charges against HC?
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
34. I wish I could "kick and recommend" your post...
but I'll do so in spirit.:hi:
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ginnyinWI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
4. well I'm making a small change of my own
Instead of calling her Hillary, I'm switching to HRC. It's a more fitting name for a DLC pol.
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WhiteTara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. Hey, thanks for that
not that I want to support this thread, but I think I'll switch HRC too.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
7. He won't go negative... he doesn't need to, and his campaign knows it.
They predicted which states they'd win, and other than winning Maine, they've been spot on. Hillary's wins had nothing to do with her going negative. Everything's going better than expected. :)
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Kokonoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #7
16. Spot on
His message is positive, he already won. Zellery can only energize a small percent of voters with hate, and she still blew the big leads.
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waiting for hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
8. And you are a Democrat?
Jeez, and to think I was thinking the goal was putting a Democrat in the White House, not swift boating our own.
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geek tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. Did you ask Hillary Clinton that? n/t
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. if it's good enough for Hillary to go negative, why cant we?
her supporters scream "rezko" a thousand times a day, why cant we have something to shoot back with?
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. no... last 24 hours hrc supporters been telling us dirty politics are good politics
that we are all suppose to jump in and fight each other. bettin more shit to throw at hillary than obama
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Cheap_Trick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #13
33. all they have is rezko and hussein
and making words like hope and change into dirty words to be sneered at like a neocon would.
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dchill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. "...not swift boating our own."
You said it, not me.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
10. No thanks.
The nomination is effectively over. I believe in science not faith.

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casus belli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
14. Sorry, this Obama supporter won't be using Whitewater....ever
The word leaves a particularly bad taste in my mouth, seeing as how it has already been under the microscope, cost taxpayers millions of dollars, and wound up finding no wrong doing except a fling with an intern.
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
17. Use a fabricated Republican smear attempt? No. Just fucking NO. That's sleazy.
Not to mention below contempt. What, we're supposed to act like REPUBLICANS? No way.

Redstone
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. hrc supporters telling me sleaze is good. makes a fighter. what we want? n/t
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. read my edit. this is what the repukes will use in the fall
this is why rush is pulling for her. they attacked her for 8 years and they will in the fall too.

I hated to have to do this, but I fear a setup from the republican machine like rove and rush
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #19
29. OK, I'll grant that your intentions were good. But it's still a lousy idea.
Redstone
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
20. But she's already answered, "like 8 questions"...
oops, that was Barack.
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EmperorHasNoClothes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
21. Obama has already won by staying positive.
He's not going to go negative at this point.
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pampango Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
22. It's a bulllshit argument to throw dirt at Obama "for his own good". It is just as BS
to argue that throwing dirt at Hillary will be done for some "higher purpose". Those are just rationalizations for conducting dirty politics yourself. If you want to play dirty, then do it, but don't claim that your doing it for the party's or opponent's good. You're doing it for your own benefit.

"The argument has been made that McCain will use dirt against Obama so it's better that he fight it now and not be surprised in the Fall. If that is the way we want to play things, let's remind Hillary of the things that the Right has and WILL throw at Hillary should she take the nom."
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. I fixed the post to greater reflect my concern
Hillary is using dirty tactics to try to beat Obama, but what the Hillary supporters dont seem to get is that if she wins the nom, the right will turn so hard and fast and will attack her like they did all throughout the 90's. Rush built his career trashing her and would love to rip into her again this fall. That she is using the same tactics to fight Obama that the right has used and WILL USE on her is terrible.
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Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
24. Whitewater? Rose Law Firm? You missed Vince Foster. But see, there is your problem with all of these
and a point many have tried to make - this mud has been thrown at Hillary for years, it is ineffective now, she is vetted on these issues - old news is not news. That means not only will throwing these old accusations at Hillary fail as a strategy for Obama, but for McCain as well.
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splat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. Digging up ancient Ken Starr witch hunts is a snooze, and says there's no news
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #24
30. is it ineffective? I am scared that the 'rush limpballs' will use this to defeat her
I really hated to post that garbage, but I am afraid that the dirt from the 90's will be used again.

We have to win the White House in order to save the Supreme Court.

I do wonder if the right wing mouth pieces are pushing for Hillary because they know this garbage will work again.
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Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #30
39. But aren't you now saying you are operating from a position of fear?
You're scared of what rush might do?

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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. First Rush was powerful enough to name our nominee. Now he's so weak...
...that he can't even do what he's done to us time and time again?? :crazy:

NGU.


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Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. Who said rush picked our nom - obama won the repuke vote.
and still lost.

Whitewater? Are you serious?
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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
27. I really thought DU was a refuge from these right-wing attacks.
Edited on Wed Mar-05-08 11:58 AM by bigtree
Now Obama supporters here are emulating Ken Starr.
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #27
31. not emulating Ken Starr, but fearing that Hillary is being lured into a trap
by the right wing noise makers who will throw this shit back on the air once she takes the nom.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
28. Some but not all. I know of more possibilities.
I'll show some class right now until I can't take it anymore when pushed. I'd like to reverse this direction the party is on. There needs to be a walk over to the Clinton camp by prominent dems soon to tone it down.
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Windy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #28
37. Do you honestly think that HRC gives a damn about the party elders opinions?
she is going to continue the slash and burn policy because it worked for her.

Obama needs to strike back! and HARD.
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cottonseed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 02:13 PM
Response to Original message
38. Michigan voters may want to read up on Tata Motors
and the Clinton's Indian connections before any redo of the vote there.
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msallied Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
40. These people are dirty dirty dirty...
Never trust a professional politician, no matter what party. The longer they stay in, the more they all start to look alike.
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nonconformist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
41. Old news, ineffective. nt
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