Governor Crist: Florida primary was 'fair to Obama'

[seafan]

FL Governor Charlie Crist



OK, Charlie. Though you are a moderate Republican, I have REALLY tried to give you the benefit of the doubt about your performance as Governor of Florida.

But, when you are saying that Florida's ill-fated primary vote 'was fair to Obama', you are blowing it.


Nothing about what has happened has been fair.

And how to go about fixing it is not for you to decide. It is for the Democratic national leadership and the Florida Democratic Party to decide.


Instead, why don't you go over to the Legislature and beat on some heads in your own party, to restore some fiscal responsibility in our budget? Why don't you stop this Republican hostile takeover in our Legislature from repeatedly assaulting the quality of life for the people in this state?

Instead of prancing around with John McCain, get back to "the office" and stop your waffling on these tough issues. I don't think your second year in office will be as relatively unchallenged and comfortable as the first.



Via Raw Story, March 6, 2008:

Florida's Republican governor doesn't think his taxpayers should pay for a Democratic party do-over of its presidential primary, and he insisted the results of January's non-election was fair to Barack Obama.

Obama lost Florida's Jan. 29 primary to the then-higher-profile candidate Hillary Clinton after all Democratic candidates agreed not to campaign there. The vote allocated no delegates to the Democratic convention after state officials violated party rules in moving up the state's primary. (Ironically, if Florida had played by the rules it would have voted Tuesday along with hotly contested Texas and Ohio, a role in which its results could have had substantial impact.)

.....

Party leaders are discussing the possibility of a re-vote in Florida and Michigan, which also moved up its primary in violation of party rules. Florida Gov. Charlie Crist says the previous election should count in light of the record turnout it inspired.

"We want them all to be seated because democracy matters. ... The people should be heard," Crist said.

Asked whether an election in which both candidates agreed to stay on the sidelines really was a fair election..

"We think so," he said, noting that the Obama campaign ran a national ad that also ran in Florida before the primary.

Charlie, a national ad does not give a candidate *à la carte* control over blacking it out in any state that is inconvenient.



And these disjointed comments from Governor Crist:

.....

Crist insisted that Florida was right to deliberately defy party rules in moving up its election, even knowing that such defiance would result in its losing delegates.

"Moving up the election is the right thing to do. Democracy is always the right thing to do," he said.

Earlier in the program, Crist defended the moved primary with flowing invocations of the American Revolution and Cuba in a single thought.

"What matters is that we set a date for the people to be able to vote ... to put Florida at the forefront of choosing the next leader of the free world. That's our right that our Founding Fathers put forward when the founded this country. So many Americans have fought for that precious right," Crist said, pivoting to Cuba. "You know, in Florida, just 90 miles south of Key West there's an island called Cuba where they don't have that precious right."

:crazy:



Charlie, our patience is wearing thin. Stay out of this.

[NightWatcher]

1. He's a repuke, he does not have the Democratic Party's best interest in mind

just like rush sticking his head into our primaries.

If a repuke says it, let's go with the opposite

[blocker]

2. let the party decide, not thoses in love with clinton!

we all know the love between hillary and her supporters, same goes for Obama, let a neutral intelligent voice decide!

[Warbler]

30. Fair's fair

The voters of Fla and Mi deserve to have their votes count.

[Rainbowreflect]

36. So you think it is fail that Clinton's was the only name on the ballet

in Michigan? You think it is fair that they change the rules now?
I do think the voters should be heard but just counting as is is not fair.

[Justitia]

38. It's not "fair" to try to steal an election by changing the rules in the middle of the game.

If the Clinton Machine can't win honestly, they are willing to steal it w/the help of a Republican governor - JUST LIKE THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION.

In MI, Obama wasn't even on the ballot, but the MI Governor - GRANHOLM rec'd a nice donation from criminal Norman HSU, which was arranged by HILLARY CLINTON. What a shock!

The Clintons will buy or steal this election any way they can.

[Cha]

49. Then the officials of Florida and Michigan should

have waited one more fucking week instead of making their power play. The voters should take their officials who caused this inequity to TASK.

[Skip Intro]

3. Im confused, how was the FL primary unfair to any of the candidates?

All their names were on the ballot, and no one campaigned there (except for the Obama ad).

Sounds like a level playing field to me, with a slight advantage for Obama.

[mmonk]

5. Because many voters stayed at home.

I've heard some radio stations were telling people it was a republican primary only.

[LostinVA]

11. You do realize they had a record breaking turnout, right?

[MonkeyFunk]

12. And yet a record number of democrats voted

1.7 million of them. More than twice as many as in 2004.

What evidence is there that any particular candidate gained or lost? Would the delegate allocation have been any different? 1.7 million is a very large statistical sample.

[LostinVA]

13. Jinx

[Spider Jerusalem]

22. There were state taxation initiatives on the ballot.

The Democratic primary was STILL INVALID by the DNC's rules; see Supreme Court cases Cousins v Wigoda, 1975, and Democratic Party v. Wisconsin, 1981/ The meat of the respective rulings, from Cousins v Wigoda:

2. In the selection of candidates for national office, a National Party Convention serves the pervasive national interest, which is paramount to any interest of a State in protecting the integrity of its electoral process, and the Circuit Court erred in issuing an injunction that abridged the associational rights of petitioners and their Party and the Party's right to determine the composition of its National Convention in accordance with Party standards. P P. 487-491.

And from Dems v. Wisconsin:

Wisconsin cannot constitutionally compel the National Party to seat a delegation chosen in a way that violates the Party's rules.

You have no argument. This is what is known as 'settled law'. It is established through precedent. There are no grounds for legal challenge. The only fair and equitable thing is a revote.

[MonkeyFunk]

25. No government is trying to force the seating of the delegates

so your legal citations are meaningless.

The DNC has chosen not to seat them. They can choose to change their minds.

[Spider Jerusalem]

28. Except Dean has made it very clear they won't.

Not without a revote. The delegations as they stand are tainted. And it certainly sounds like they're moving to trying to force the delegations to be seated at the convention; lawsuits, intervention of two state governors, total disregard on the part of sai governors for the rules established for the primaries by the national Democratic Party...the idea that those INVALID delegations, from contests that, by Democratic Party rules, DID NOT HAPPEN, should be seated at the convention, makes a mockery of the process. I'd be saying the same thing if Obama had won those states and not Clinton. The rules are the rules (as you yourself are so fond of pointing out re the issue of superdelegates...you can't have it both ways).

[MonkeyFunk]

31. They'll resolve it

Dean's not dumb enough to throw away MI and FL in the general election.

[Spider Jerusalem]

32. Florida's gone red in three out of the last four.

It's not a likely pickup in electoral votes this time around either, honestly. Michigan has been blue in the last four; the demographics, particularly the large urban African-American population, make it a much more likely state to end up in the Democratic column in November than Florida, regardless of the outcome of the delegate situation.

[MonkeyFunk]

33. It would be supremely stupid to blithely throw them away

It will be resolved.

[Spider Jerusalem]

34. It would be even more stupid to assume that resolution can come without a revote.

But then, why worry about little things like fairness when the situation as it currently stands favours your preferred candidate, right?

[MonkeyFunk]

53. And I believe very deeply

that you guys don't want to do what's fair because doing so would hurt your candidate.

[MonkeyFunk]

54. Who cares?

It would be stupid to give up on it now.

I thought you guys got hard-ons over the 50-state strategy. Now it's a 48 strategy?

[Spider Jerusalem]

55. Versus Clinton's fifteen-state strategy?

[Captain Hilts]

24. Let's all say that together "a record number of Democrats voted" with a FULL slate of candidates. nt

[blocker]

7. SKIPINTRO, i know it's hard to explain since you love clinton but!

There was a rule you know what a rule of law is right? that HILLARY CLINTON and all the participants agreed before the campaign started. They all knew that it would not count, just like an exhibition game in sports, now since "hillary won", she wants them seated, it's called cheating and changing the rule in the middle of an election! Inverse the situation, what would you say if Obama would have won?

[MonkeyFunk]

14. The rule of law?!

:rofl:

[blocker]

16. Wow you clinton lovers, it's hard to explain rules with you

where do you guys come from?

[MonkeyFunk]

26. Which law are we discussing?

[Justitia]

39. Now, when have the Clintons EVER let rules get in the way of their ambitions? -eom

[burythehatchet]

43. If "the hill" doesn't give a rat's ass about rules, why would her Hillaroids? n/t

[ProgressiveEconomist]

15. Would HRC net 38 delegates and 288,000 popular votes over Obama in a fair

election, where Clinton name recognition was not the main factor in a very early contest, before Obama's charisma could have a chance to win over hundreds of thousands? I don't think so, and I cannot believe that you really do, either.

288,000 popular votes from yet another blatantly undemocratic election in Florida would wipe out half Obama's hard-won margin in LEGITIMATE, FAIR primaries and caucuses in other states. See the spreadsheet and CNN links at http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4918049 .

Does that sound "fair" to you?
.

[blocker]

18. Well change party if you don't like the rules!

[Iceburg]

51. And yet several weeks ago Dean offered to pay a share of the do-over costs

and now he is saying they have an general election to get ready for.
So he offered to help pay for a re-do then withdrew the offer a few weeks later.

"that time is gone..."

"We can't afford to do that now ... We need our money to win the presidential race," he said.

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Dean_urges_doover_voting_in_Fla._0306.html

Who could have imagined that a general election would follow the primaries

[dansolo]

56. The advantage was for Hillary

She had the name recognition. Obama was not as well known at the time of the Florida primary. Hillary had the advantage of huge name recognition. That is why Hillary's 20-30 point leads seem to evaporate as each election approaches. If California didn't have early voting, he may have knocked her out on Super Tuesday.

[AzDar]

4. First Jeb (Waterhead) Bush, now Charlie Crist....wtf is it with Repube

governors of Florida trying to sway DEM elections?

[SoCalDem]

8. You need to ASK that question?

Because at the heart of it, they are all about maintaining THEIR power, and dems stand in the way of that..so they walk on the dems and crush them...and cheat them at every opportunity:grr:

[AzDar]

20. Only if we allow them to.

[TwilightGardener]

6. Sorry, Charlie. You'll never be VP. Plus, no one's buying your "girlfriend".

[Kittycat]

9. Actually - I would say that it wasn't fair to ANY of our candidates.

FL could have had a different impact for Edwards as well, and yes Clinton - or anyone else who wasn't allowed to campaign there.

[book_worm]

10. isn't it interesting how these republicans are wanting Hillary to be the nominee?

[UALRBSofL]

17. They don't care who our nominee is

They have been flooded with phone calls from people wanting a re-vote and there votes to count. So, as a governor, it's his place to speak for the people of Florida.

[AnarchoFreeThinker]

19. guess who they want to run against

[DJ13]

21. Why does Hillary need a REPUBLICAN to help her steal an election?

First McCain is better than Obama, then Rush gets his Texas listeners to try and throw that primary, now another REPUBLICAN is trying to help Hillary steal the nomination.

This is too much.

[Justitia]

37. Birds of A Feather. I'm sure she's promised him something. The Clintons are so secretive & shady.

[tritsofme]

47. I didn't realize trying to stop 1.7 million Democratic voters from being disenfranchised

equals stealing an election.

Only in Obamaland.

[Colobo]

23. Hey Charlie C(h)rist... go crucify yourself.

[blocker]

27. heres a good read on this:

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/05/congressman-calls-special-meeting-to-discuss-fla-mich-delegate-dispute/

[workinclasszero]

29. Don't you get it dems? The REPUBLICANS are trying to help you!

They are doing all they can to help Hillary destroy the Obama movement in the party.

They realize if Obama is swept into power, his coattails will be enormous and they will be out of power for decades!

But Hillary brings the same old scandals and divisions that have kept the dem party small, divided, and powerless since Bush took over.

This has the stink of Rove all over it!

How fuckin STUPID can democrats be when the see Rethuglians trying to help Hillary and are good with it?!?!?!?

[madfloridian]

35. We now refuse to watch Hillary on TV

We just turn the channel.

I can only take so much of spin and lies. No more.

[Justitia]

41. Saw your esteemed Senator Bill Nelson lying his ass off this morning. He's so scummy. -eom

[madfloridian]

42. I called his office.

The aide kept trying to pin me down on some poll. I finally said would you hush and let me talk? I said Nelson has done one thing. He has us despising his candidate.

[Justitia]

44. He's trying to push the lie that a "republican" legislature did this to the Dems in FL.

He never tells the truth about that, that it was INTRODUCED by the (turncoat) DEMOCRATS in the state legislature and they pushed to get it passed.

Didn't it win passage w/almost a unanimous vote also?

[burythehatchet]

45. Amen. She's Lieberman to me. n/t

[flpoljunkie]

40. CNN's Bill Schneider just said FL and MI 2 of 4 states where R's outnumbered D's in primary voting.

Every other state has had record Democratic turnout. No way should the voters of Florida or the DNC accept the January 29th primary results as legitimate!

[Az_lefty]

46. It wasn't fair to anyone, the candidates didn't campaign there.

Crist needs to stay out of this one.

[Cha]

48. Stupid!, Charlie...bugger off.

Take your disingenuous statement, take some time out and come back and as Guv of Florida tell us what really happened. You don't wanna lose credibility over freakin' hilary, do ya?

[npincus]

50. Doesn't this asshole have a state to run?

[ProSense]

52. Vice Presidential Tea Leaves and a Dig at Obama (Crist is not to be trusted)

March 6, 2008, 2:45 pm

Vice Presidential Tea Leaves and a Dig at Obama

By Michael Cooper

WEST PALM BEACH — After Senator John McCain campaigned here Thursday morning with Gov. Charlie Crist of Florida – one of his many oft-mentioned possible running mates – Mr. McCain pointed out to reporters that the governor had “committed to serve the state of Florida when he ran to be governor of the state of Florida.”

The two men attended a fund-raiser together, stumped at a diner where Mr. McCain called Mr. Crist “one of the greatest governors in the history of this country,” and then the two men held a news conference in an airplane hangar here.

There, Mr. McCain praised Mr. Crist effusively once more, and said: “As many of you may recall, his endorsement of my candidacy obviously was very crucial in my ability to win the primary here in the state of Florida, and I’m very well aware of the importance of Florida in the general election.’’

<...>

That drew a sharp rejoinder from the Obama campaign, which sought to tie Mr. McCain’s criticism to a similar line of criticism that Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton used earlier this year.

“John McCain and Hillary Clinton both have the experience of supporting a Bush Cuba policy that has failed America and the Cuban people for fifty years,’’ Bill Burton, a spokesman for the Obama campaign, said in a statement. “Instead of empty rhetoric, Barack Obama actually has a strategy to help advance liberty for the Cuban people, starting with lifting all restrictions on family travel and cash remittances and pursuing direct diplomacy. Cuban Americans will be our best ambassadors for change, and will give the Cuban people more space from their regime.”

[ProgressiveEconomist]

57. Kick!