The only fair way to punish and resolve the MI and FL screw up!!

[Exilednight]

1. Strip Florida and Michigan of all their super delegates. If anyone deserves to be punished, it's the idiots who created this fiasco.

2. Hold the primary over, whether it be through mail in or actual polling places, it doesn't matter, but let the people decide.


Punish those that deserve to be punished and do not disenfranchise those that we will need in the GE.

This is the only fair way.

[madfloridian]

1. I think the superdelegates won't count unless there is a do-over..

and then they will. I may be wrong. Someone help me out here. I don't think they count now, but they will if there is a do-over. :shrug:

[Exilednight]

2. Currently, both states still keep the SD's. Only the public is being punished.

[madfloridian]

3. Do you have a source? I am trying to find where I saw that.

I have so much stuff on this, hard sorting through.

[Exilednight]

4. I'm looking for a link, but MSNBC said today that Florida still has its super delegates.

[Exilednight]

7. You're right, they currently don't count, but if we do have a do over election, let's keep the SD's

out of it. They're the ones who deserve to be punished, not the voters.

[Kokonoe]

8. This was posted earlier. It reads yes, but I don't know.

Four State Pledge Letter 2008
Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, South Carolina
August 28, 2007

WHEREAS, the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee, along with approval from the full body of the DNC, established the 2008 Presidential nominating calendar in 2005.

WHEREAS, the nominating calendar increases diversity with the early participation of African Americans, Hispanics, Asian Americans, Native Americans and labor members.

WHEREAS, the nominating calendar honors the traditional role of retail politics early in the nominating process.

WHEREAS, the nominating calendar provides geographical balance with contests in the Heartland, East, South and West.

WHEREAS, it is the desire of Presidential campaigns, the DNC, the states and the American people to bring finality, predictability and common sense to the nominating calendar.

WHEREAS, the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee will strip states of 100% of their delegates and super delegates to the DNC National Convention if they violate the nomination calendar.

THEREFORE, I _______________, Democratic Candidate for President, in honor and in accordance with DNC rules, pledge to actively campaign in the pre-approved early states Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire and South Carolina. I pledge I shall not campaign or participate in any election contest occurring in any state not already authorized by the DNC to take place in the DNC approved pre-window (any date prior to February 5, 2008). Campaigning shall include but is not limited to purchasing media or campaign advocacy of any kind, attending or hosting events of more than 200 people to promote one's candidacy for a preference primary and employing staff in the state in question. It does not include activities specifically related to raising campaign resources such as fundraising events or the hiring of fundraising staff.

[TheDoorbellRang]

9. Not so.

Currently there are 3253 PD's and 796 (or 795) SD's none of which are from FL and MI. This is where the 2025 ceiling is at -- it's one delegate more than half of 3253 + 796 = 4049

FL has 185/25 total delegates and MI has 128/28 total delegates that have ALL been excluded. If there's a redo, the new total is 4415 and the new ceiling to win the nomination is 2208.

Sorry I don't have a link at my fingertips right now but I've been taking copious notes on this for all the math threads.

BTW, I agree that even in a redo, the 53 SD's from FL and MI should still be excluded. I just posted that here earlier this evening.

[Rageneau]

5. Fla and Mich voters do not deserve to be punished by being disenfranchised.

It was not the rank-and-file voters in those states that moved the primaries forward. In Mich, the Democratic Party there thought it was time for states larger than Iowa and New Hampshire to decide our party's nominee. Perhaps the state's Dem Party deserves some sort of wrist slap, but not the average voter. The will of the voters in this big state deserves to be heard.

In Florida, there wouldn't be a problem were it not for the gamesmanship of the state GOP. Again, it isn't right that ordinary Florida voters -- two and a half MILLION of whom turned out to vote anyway that day -- don't get their voices heard -- thru no fault of their own.

It's almost like Karl Rove has infiltrated our party hierarchy and is convincing us to engage in a circular firing squad.

[NMMatt]

6. That's a great idea. -nt

[Demeter]

10. I'm Supporting This Idea Too!

The logic is unassailable. The superdelegates are the party leaders who got Michigan into this mess. The Democratic voter had little or no input into the primary, and never got a chance to vote in a meaningful way.

Disenfranchise the leadership and let the people's voice, unadulterated, be heard!