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writes3000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:12 PM
Original message
Obama Campaign's Memo On Clinton's National Security "Experience"
Released by Obama adviser, Greg Craig, as shown on MSNBC:

"She (Clinton) never managed a foreign policy crisis, and there is no evidence to suggest that she participated in the decision-making that occurred in connection with any such crisis. As far as the record shows, Senator Clinton never answered the phone either to make a decision on any pressing national security issue -- not at 3am or at any other time of the day."

Damn, the campaign sure can counter-punch.
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Bullet1987 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
1. It's about time they did this...Obama has been too complacent
on Clinton's claim to having 35 years of experience. Everybody scratches their heads on that one...even Clinton supporters can't tell us what exactly she did for 35 years that warrants being seen as some foreign policu guru.
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islandmkl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. well, just since '92.....
you have Bill's being prez and since = 16 years

Hillary was there the whole time & the Senate = 16 years

just add those together and you have 32 years....


maybe Chelsea is good for another 3 years or so....
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high density Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #4
23. Hillary's time spent in her mother's womb must count for something as well
I'm sure back then she was already developing a hatred for caucus states.
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hogwyld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
27. You forgot the nexus of the free world
Little Rock, Arkansas.
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rndmprsn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. another roundhouse to go with the VP non-sense too =]
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Metric System Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. So the Obama camp's argument is what? That Hillary doesn't have much FP experience & Obama has even
less?
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islandmkl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. nice rovian logic....however....
because you don't have more does not mean I have less...
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ORDagnabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. no I think its that hillary lies and pads her resume
Kosovo:

Senator Clinton has said, "I negotiated open borders to let fleeing refugees into safety from Kosovo." It is true that, as First Lady, she traveled to Macedonia and visited a Kosovar refugee camp. It is also true that she met with government officials while she was there. First Ladies frequently meet with government officials. Her claim to have "negotiated open borders to let fleeing refugees into safety from Kosovo," however, is not true. Her trip to Macedonia took place on May 14, 1999. The borders were opened the day before, on May 13, 1999.
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Lucinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Doesn't mean she wasn't assisting before her trip.
:)
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ORDagnabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. True but I got a whole list of these.... can you help by explaining them?
Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 12:52 PM by ORDagnabbit
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Lucinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. Sure here are a few
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writes3000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Obama is the superior candidate because he has better judgment.
Her limited foriegn policy experience (such as it is) doesn't qualify as a crisis expert.

That's the argument.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
17. THIS Judgement?
Obama-->Rezko-->Auchi-->Saddam Hussein & Muammar al-Gadaffi
EXCUSE ME: Obama got his money from Rezko who got his 3.5 million from Auchi:

Where's the media? Where is Obama...I think there are people who want to chat...*** Obama "Phone Home"...Hometown reporters :::The Chicago Sun-Times headlined a brief article March 4, 2008, with "Sen. Obama, time to call us about Rezko:

(312) 321-2417," accompanied by a suggestion ...




-Nadhmi Auchi is an Iraqi-born billionaire who was charged along with Saddam Hussein for conspiring to assassinate Prime minister (president) Abdul Karim Qasim

and stood trial in 1959. (Auchi gave fellow Baath Party members machine guns from his home for Saddam Hussein.)

-Auchi protected secret money for Saddam Hussein AND Muammar al-Gadaffi.

(Remember, Obama's Trinity church Pastor Wright went with Nation of Islam minister Louis Farrakhan in 1993 to visit Libyan socialist leader Gadaffi.)

-Auchi also financially backed Saddam Hussein's plan for a pipeline from Iraq to Saudi Arabia.

-Rezko was also a business partner with Nation of Islam Founder's son: Jabir Herbert Muhammad.

Why isn't the media talking about all of Barack Obama's scary friends who have ties to the worst people in history?

*Don't forget William (Bill) Ayers and Bernadine Dorhn of the Weather Underground.

*Obama's cousin Raila Odinga who just became co-President of Kenya this week (after 1,000 people were killed) whom Obama is said to be close to...who signed a

secret pact with Muslim jihadists who were to ethnically cleanse people?

And why does Raila Odinga use Obama's exact same campaign slogan: CHANGE....Vote for CHANGE: Look at his website:

http://www.raila07.com/


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/nov/16/iraq.politicalcolumnists
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goletian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. experience is not an issue
hillary has picked an argument she cant validate, and its also an argument she cant win vs mccain.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #3
26. No. It's that experience isn't all, that she's inflating her experience
and that Obama has good judgment and she doesn't. Love that this was written by Greg Craig. You know who he is, right?
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
9. Here's the memo:
Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 12:23 PM by babylonsister
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/On_another_primary_day_Dem_candidates_0311.html

Obama's campaign released the following memo to reporters Tuesday morning.

To: Interested Parties
From: Greg Craig, former director, Policy Planning Office, U.S. State Department
RE: Senator Clinton’s claim to be experienced in foreign policy: Just words?
DA: March 11, 2008

When your entire campaign is based upon a claim of experience, it is important that you have evidence to support that claim. Hillary Clinton’s argument that she has passed “the Commander- in-Chief test” is simply not supported by her record.

There is no doubt that Hillary Clinton played an important domestic policy role when she was First Lady. It is well known, for example, that she led the failed effort to pass universal health insurance. There is no reason to believe, however, that she was a key player in foreign policy at any time during the Clinton Administration. She did not sit in on National Security Council meetings. She did not have a security clearance. She did not attend meetings in the Situation Room. She did not manage any part of the national security bureaucracy, nor did she have her own national security staff. She did not do any heavy-lifting with foreign governments, whether they were friendly or not. She never managed a foreign policy crisis, and there is no evidence to suggest that she participated in the decision-making that occurred in connection with any such crisis. As far as the record shows, Senator Clinton never answered the phone either to make a decision on any pressing national security issue – not at 3 AM or at any other time of day.

When asked to describe her experience, Senator Clinton has cited a handful of international incidents where she says she played a central role. But any fair-minded and objective judge of these claims – i.e., by someone not affiliated with the Clinton campaign – would conclude that Senator Clinton’s claims of foreign policy experience are exaggerated.

Northern Ireland:

Senator Clinton has said, “I helped to bring peace to Northern Ireland.” It is a gross overstatement of the facts for her to claim even partial credit for bringing peace to Northern Ireland. She did travel to Northern Ireland, it is true. First Ladies often travel to places that are a focus of U.S. foreign policy. But at no time did she play any role in the critical negotiations that ultimately produced the peace. As the Associated Press recently reported, “{S}he was not directly involved in negotiating the Good Friday peace accord.” With regard to her main claim that she helped bring women together, she did participate in a meeting with women, but, according to those who know best, she did not play a pivotal role. The person in charge of the negotiations, former Senator George Mitchell, said that “ was one of many people who participated in encouraging women to get involved, not the only one.”

News of Senator Clinton’s claims has raised eyebrows across the ocean. Her reference to an important meeting at the Belfast town hall was debunked. Her only appearance at the Belfast City Hall was to see Christmas lights turned on. She also attended a 50-minute meeting which, according to the Belfast Daily Telegraph’s report at the time, “ a little bit stilted, a little prepared at times." Brian Feeney, an Irish author and former politician, sums it up: “The road to peace was carefully documented, and she wasn’t on it.”

Bosnia:

Senator Clinton has pointed to a March 1996 trip to Bosnia as proof that her foreign travel involved a life-risking mission into a war zone. She has described dodging sniper fire. While she did travel to Bosnia in March 1996, the visit was not a high-stakes mission to a war zone. On March 26, 1996, the New York Times reported that “Hillary Rodham Clinton charmed American troops at a U.S.O. show here, but it didn’t hurt that the singer Sheryl Crow and the comedian Sinbad were also on the stage.”

Kosovo:

Senator Clinton has said, “I negotiated open borders to let fleeing refugees into safety from Kosovo.” It is true that, as First Lady, she traveled to Macedonia and visited a Kosovar refugee camp. It is also true that she met with government officials while she was there. First Ladies frequently meet with government officials. Her claim to have “negotiated open borders to let fleeing refugees into safety from Kosovo,” however, is not true. Her trip to Macedonia took place on May 14, 1999. The borders were opened the day before, on May 13, 1999.

The negotiations that led to the opening of the borders were accomplished by the people who ordinarily conduct negotiations with foreign governments – U.S. diplomats. President Clinton’s top envoy to the Balkans, former Ambassador Robert Gelbard, said, “I cannot recall any involvement by Senator Clinton in this issue.” Ivo Daalder worked on the Clinton Administration’s National Security Council and wrote a definitive history of the Kosovo conflict. He recalls that “she had absolutely no role in the dirty work of negotiations.”

Rwanda:

Last year, former President Clinton asserted that his wife pressed him to intervene with U.S. troops to stop the Rwandan genocide. When asked about this assertion, Hillary Clinton said it was true. There is no evidence, however, to suggest that this ever happened. Even those individuals who were advocating a much more robust U.S. effort to stop the genocide did not argue for the use of U.S. troops. No one recalls hearing that Hillary Clinton had any interest in this course of action. Based on a fair and thorough review of National Security Council deliberations during those tragic months, there is no evidence to suggest that U.S. military intervention was ever discussed. Prudence Bushnell, the Assistant Secretary of State with responsibility for Africa, has recalled that there was no consideration of U.S. military intervention.

At no time prior to her campaign for the presidency did Senator Clinton ever make the claim that she supported intervening militarily to stop the Rwandan genocide. It is noteworthy that she failed to mention this anecdote – urging President Clinton to intervene militarily in Rwanda – in her memoirs. President Clinton makes no mention of such a conversation with his wife in his memoirs. And Madeline Albright, who was Ambassador to the United Nations at the time, makes no mention of any such event in her memoirs.

Hillary Clinton did visit Rwanda in March 1998 and, during that visit, her husband apologized for America’s failure to do more to prevent the genocide.

China

Senator Clinton also points to a speech that she delivered in Beijing in 1995 as proof of her ability to answer a 3 AM crisis phone call. It is strange that Senator Clinton would base her own foreign policy experience on a speech that she gave over a decade ago, since she so frequently belittles Barack Obama’s speeches opposing the Iraq War six years ago. Let there be no doubt: she gave a good speech in Beijing, and she stood up for women’s rights. But Senator Obama’s opposition to the War in Iraq in 2002 is relevant to the question of whether he, as Commander-in-Chief, will make wise judgments about the use of military force. Senator Clinton’s speech in Beijing is not.

Senator Obama’s speech opposing the war in Iraq shows independence and courage as well as good judgment. In the speech that Senator Clinton says does not qualify him to be Commander in Chief, Obama criticized what he called “a rash war . . . a war based not on reason, but on passion, not on principle, but on politics.” In that speech, he said prophetically: “ven a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences.” He predicted that a U.S. invasion of Iraq would “fan the flames of the Middle East,” and “strengthen the recruitment arm of al Qaeda.” He urged the United States first to “finish the fight with Bin Laden and al Qaeda.”

If the U.S. government had followed Barack Obama’s advice in 2002, we would have avoided one of the greatest foreign policy catastrophes in our nation’s history. Some of the most “experienced” men in national security affairs – Vice President Cheney and Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and others – led this nation into that catastrophe. That lesson should teach us something about the value of judgment over experience. Longevity in Washington, D.C. does not guarantee either wisdom of judgment.

Conclusion:

The Clinton campaign’s argument is nothing more than mere assertion, dramatized in a scary television commercial with a telephone ringing in the middle of the night. There is no support for or substance in the claim that Senator Clinton has passed “the Commander-in-Chief test.” That claim – as the TV ad – consists of nothing more than making the assertion, repeating it frequently to the voters and hoping that they will believe it.

On the most critical foreign policy judgment of our generation – the War in Iraq – Senator Clinton voted in support of a resolution entitled “The Joint Resolution to Authorize the Use of U.S. Military Force Against Iraq.” As she cast that vote, she said: “This is probably the hardest decision I have ever had to make -- any vote that may lead to war should be hard -- but I cast it with conviction.” In this campaign, Senator Clinton has argued – remarkably – that she wasn’t actually voting for war, she was voting for diplomacy. That claim is no more credible than her other claims of foreign policy experience. The real tragedy is that we are still living with the terrible consequences of her misjudgment. The Bush Administration continues to cite that resolution as its authorization – like a blank check – to fight on with no end in sight.

Barack Obama has a very simple case. On the most important commander in chief test of our generation, he got it right, and Senator Clinton got it wrong. In truth, Senator Obama has much more foreign policy experience than either Bill Clinton or Ronald Reagan had when they were elected. Senator Obama has worked to confront 21st century challenges like proliferation and genocide on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. He possesses the personal attributes of a great leader – an even temperament, an open-minded approach to even the most challenging problems, a willingness to listen to all views, clarity of vision, the ability to inspire, conviction and courage.

And Barack Obama does not use false charges and exaggerated claims to play politics with national security.
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writes3000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. DAMN, Now That's A Memo!!!
Wow. Thanks for sharing. Wow.
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Independent-Voter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. That'll leave a mark!
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #9
32. Thanks, babylonsister..
hilary musta thought she could go out and say anything, do anything and nobody would fact check her.
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #9
33. "ven a successful war"?
How do I volunteer to proof for Obama's team?

Or is this a DU copy/paste error?
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islandmkl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
10. Sinbad for Secretary of State!!
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JimGinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
11. Her "National Security Experience" Was Always A Very Weak Argument...
Her "Tea Party" diplomacy meme is comical.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
14. The hypocrisy is amazing. Obama can attack her experience but she can't do the same to Obama
Obama attacks her experience: AMEN!!!!!!!!!
Hillary attacks his experience: SHE IS TRYING TO SABOTAGE HIM SO THE RETHUGS WILL WIN AND SHE HAS BEEN A RETHUG PLANT ALL ALONG!!!!
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writes3000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. Do you see him praising John McCain? Do you see him saying she has LESS experience than McCain?
It's simple, really. There is a big difference between the two.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Hillary didn't exactly reveal a big secret by saying McCain has more experience
After all, Obama is vying to be the least experienced president ever.

He does praise McCain as a "hero", not to mention praises Reagan to bash Bill Clinton.
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writes3000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. He calls McCain a hero for his years in the military. He didn't claim that Clinton was less-than.
You KNOW the difference. You're just avoiding admitting it.

And that tells me all I need to know.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. Everyone in the world knows McCain has more experience than Obama
It wasn't a secret. Only Obama's supporters are in denial about this. If it is Obama vs. McCain experience won't be a positive for Obama. He will have to rely on the judgment on Iraq and Iran argument.
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #29
35. Hillary would also have to make the judgement argument against McCain
No? :shrug:
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Drachasor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #20
36. Not true, Abraham Lincoln had a lot less experience than Obama
In contract, Buchanan (who did nothing to stop the Civil War, even as States were leaving and stealing military supplies on his watch) was an immensely experience candidate. Guess which one is routinely rated as the best President ever and which one is rated as the worst....

Experience isn't all it is cracked up to be.
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ellacott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #14
25. They are attacking her lies and exxagerations
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cooolandrew Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
19. I think Barack's advisors speak well for his foreign policy.
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Voice for Peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
21. thanks! k/r nt
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
28. This is one of the first clear mis-steps of the excellent Obama campaign
"Neither of us is qualified" is a psychological sop to Obama fans, but not a very useful argument in appealing to anyone outside his supporters.

The correct move was to raise people's comfort with him as CIC.

Raising doubts about Clinton's CIC qualifications is a disaster because it simultaneously diminishes Obama's even lower level of experience.

He doesn't want an experience fight because he really is inexperienced... it's something he cannot wish away. However ridiculous Clinton's level of experience is, he has even less than ridiculous.

He did well with "change VERSUS experience," and ought to stick with that. When he was on fire he accepted that Hillary is experienced, and questioned whether her experience had led to good choices.

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Drachasor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #28
34. That's not what he is saying
He is saying that she is exaggerating her experience, and overstating her role as First Lady. Guess what? That's exactly what she is doing!

Experience is overrated anyhow. Some of our greatest Presidents had little experience. Abraham Lincoln, Theodore Roosevelt, Franklin Roosevelt, John Kennedy, and others. Some of our worst Presidents were our most experienced. Buchanan had extensive experience, for instance, but he utterly failed as a President and did nothing to prevent the South from leaving the Union or arming themselves (among many, many other failures -- he is almost always ranked as the worst President in American History by Historians)
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #28
37. First of all, less than none? It's still zero.
McCain's CIC experience? zero, also.

Secondly, you must have scanned, and missed:
"In truth, Senator Obama has much more foreign policy experience than either Bill Clinton or Ronald Reagan had when they were elected. Senator Obama has worked to confront 21st century challenges like proliferation and genocide on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee."

I think he also should have mentioned his work on the Homeland Security and Veteran Affairs Committees, not sure why those are left out.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 01:48 AM
Response to Original message
30. Personally, I think he ought to go with the judgment meme
And go after McCain's poor judgment and temper tantrums to boot.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-12-08 01:52 AM
Response to Original message
31. "Or any time of the day"....
I have to hand it to the Obama campaign for putting up with the desperate clawing of the hilarys with such class when there's so much real work to do.
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