What would it take for you to NOT vote for OBAMA or NOT vote for CLINTON?????

[musicblind]

I am honestly curious. Please list the candidate you are currently supporting and then tell what it would take for you to NOT vote for that person. You may never vote for the other candidate, fine, but what would it take for you to NOT vote for the person you are currently supporting this primary season.

It can be anything:

An endorsement

A scandal

Finding out they are an alien from outer space.

For example:

I support Obama and if I found out he had lied to the American public and WAS in the pews of Wright’s church when the Reverend made his infamous comments… I wouldn’t vote for him.

OR

I support Clinton and if I found out that her tax returns showed the Clintons achieved all of their new found wealthy by taking money in exchange for pardons or favors then I would NOT vote for her.

I am just honestly wondering, amongst some of the more HARDCORE fans… what WOULD it take for you to change your mind during this primary season?

Please keep this civil. I have tried to be fair to both candidates, giving examples of both candidates. This isn’t for flames, this is for discussion. :)

[CreekDog]

1. as my aunt said, "i would vote for Fidel Castro before I would vote for a Republican"

I'm kinna there.

[musicblind]

8. oh lol

I mostly meant in the primary season. I couldn't imagine people voting for McCain instead of a democrat lol

[XemaSab]

53. Fidel/Che '08!

:patriot:

[DemzRock]

2. It would have to be something horrendous...

Since either one will be better than McBush.

It would have to be something that PROVED they were worse than McBush... Very little comes to mind that would prove that...

Maybe the alien thing. haha

Actually, most Martians are probably better than GOP leaders.

[Evergreen Emerald]

3. When Obama used the race card to win SC, it really turned me off

before that, I was content with both democratic candidates. I will never vote for McCain. But, it will be very hard for me to vote for Obama because of his divisive ways.

[cali]

10. Even though it was clearly dear hilly and bill who blatantly played

the race card in SC and elsewhere to try and frame Obama as a fringe minority candidate in the upcoming contests, I'll still vote for her if by some fluke, she's the nominee. I'm not an idiot. I uinderstand what's at stake. Only selfish, sanctimonious sorts who don't give a shit about the SC and other vital issues won't vote for the dem nominee.

[Evergreen Emerald]

13. It was not clear. "Fairy tale" is not racist.

Obama jumped on anything to attack Clinton on race on SC cause that is where he needed to align the voting block against Clinton.

[cali]

17. that's revisionist

Obama was ahead in SC before the fairy tale comments. It couldn't be clearer that the Clinton gang stepped in the shit.

[Evergreen Emerald]

18. I disagree...as do the facts

[cali]

28. You haven't posted any facts

I have. Fact: obama was ahead in SC before the fairy tale comment. Fact: Bill Clinton compared Obama to Jesse Jackson. Fact: Andrew Cuomo and Bill Shaheen and Penn made racially charged comments. You are allergic to facts, dear.

[MethuenProgressive]

27. cali! Well said! Agree 100%!

"Only selfish, sanctimonious sorts who don't give a shit about the SC and other vital issues won't vote for the dem nominee."
:yourock:

[sniffa]

29. Ignored is a known liar, and also can't be reasoned with

[Evergreen Emerald]

55. I hope that you are not talking about me.

I am not and never have been a liar.

I am stunned that you would think it appropriate to post something like this.

[OhioBlue]

11. Is this a new talking point?

Is the Clinton campaign trying to do damage control b/c they have been called out on their racist campaign strategy?

More projection?

[Evergreen Emerald]

15. Not knew...fact

and I have been saying it since it happened. Look at the facts.

[OhioBlue]

32. I have looked at the facts

The Clintons have sold out and used a racist strategy in their quest for power.

It's despicable.

[MethuenProgressive]

26. Obama's Swiftboating the Clintons on race was disgusting.

The HuffPo's expose of the Obama Camp's memo plotting to Swiftboat the Clintons should've been the pin the popped the Obama balloon. But the Hate people have for Hillary blinded them to the truth, and they became conditioned to believe anything spake by Him on High.

[MediaBabe]

48. I agree. n/t

[MediaBabe]

49. I agree. n/t

[0007]

4. An all out Neclear War. With the city I live in receiving a direct hit. n/t

[musicblind]

5. So death? haha

[cali]

6. I can't imagine that anything either of them do could

prevent me from voting for either of them. I'll vote for the dem nominee, period. The Supreme Court, just to name one issue, is too important to me.

[rug]

7. Talking up an Iran war.

[musicblind]

9. That's a good one.

I CERTAINLY understand that

[CTyankee]

12. I will vote for the Democratic candidate in November.

Whoever that is. The bad stuff that has come out on either one has not been a deal breaker for me. But I think it has or will on voters we thought we'd take in a cakewalk in November: disaffected Independents and even some Republicans.

I initially supported John Edwards but when he dropped out before my primary I decided to vote for Hillary. I am in her demographic of middle class, white, female in her sixties. The deciding argument, however, was made by my husband, who is NOT in that demographic. He got me in tears talking about my commitment all my life to feminism. He is a strong feminist and is currently a donor to local and state organizations that benefit women and girls, so he puts his money where his mouth is. It was hard to argue with...

[Orsino]

14. The Democratic Party would somehow have to outdo the GOP in corruption...

...anti-gay, anti-family and anti-worker brutality. Or perhaps the Dem nominee could be revealed as guilty of some crime against humanity that somehow outweighs the risk of Republican control.

[DainBramaged]

16. Why stir up the pot?

Polling for the Reich wing masters to adjust their talking points???:popcorn:

[musicblind]

No

I think a lot of people misunderstood the post, though their responses have still be intersting. I was asking about the PRIMARY election and what it would take for supporters to change their minds on the PRIMARY election. I don't think I made myself clear. I'm sorry. Either way, the posts have been informative and non flammatory.

It just seems that some people on here would NEVER switch from Hillary or Barack no matter what that person did. I wanted to see if there were things that would get a person to switch their decisions. One person said coming out in favor of war in Iran for example. No one thinks the Dems WOULD do this, but it is informative to know that IF they did... that people are not being slaves to the candidates but to the ideals those candidates are representing.

[IndianaJones]

19. when Obama used SC poll results and targeted bigot voters it turned me off to him. nt.

[jaxx]

21. Who were the bigoted voters?

Please elaborate.

[IndianaJones]

24. homophobes. I think you know though, and its been well established Obama disciples don't care. nt.

[jaxx]

31. No, wait and tell me about this.

Homophobes? Obama targeted homophobes? I'd like to hear more.

[musicblind]

40. He is talking about the McClurcklin thing I believe

as a Gay person that does bother me, but if he would come out (after the fact, not before) and make an apology all would be well. Because of the incident I worry that MAYBE he doesn't mean what he says about civil unions. I hope he does and his church has a GOOD track record of supporting members of the glbt community. Still I'd like to hear more from him on the issue. I am very dissappointed that no candidate is openly supporting gay marriage. Hillary, the candidate I am voting for in the NC primary does not support this and I think she should. Please do not flame me for this post. I'm being very upfront and honest about how I feel, but I still have a lot of respect and admiration for Obama. I am a democrat and even though I am voting for Hillary I believe that Obama too would make a very good president. Well at least neither of the two viable candidates since Gravel is not really going to win this thing.

[moobu2]

72. Me too. It'll take more than some speech to get me to vote for him

Most of the people I know feel the same way.

[MethuenProgressive]

20. I'll vote for the Democrat even if we decide to let McCain win and nominate Obama.

I'd rather we had a fighting chance, but I'll vote for Obama as a protest against McCain anyway.

[goclark]

22. I'm for Obama and everyone knows that the Clinton's have lied

for many many years.
They have lied over and over and over again and it is well documented.

Specifically it is more about their divisive campaign tactics that I can not tolerate.

I have supported them for all these years and they have destroyed their once beautiful relationship with the African American community to return to POWER.

So to say that if Obama told a "lie" about his minister would cause me to not vote for him is not at all in my thought process.

That is such a trumped up " Rush/Rove Playbook" much ado about nothing compared to Hillary's willingness to throw the kitchen sink at a fellow democrat.

Hillary is a McCain lover and thus I could only vote for her under these terms ~ if Sen. Obama wins the nomination and he had a Fireside Chat to tell the world that he had to ask her to be VP to bring the party back together,I would do it for HIM.

Not her, but for HIM and for the Democratic Party that is dear to my heart.

Other than that, she can win with the supporters that she inspired.

But she would not get my African American WOMEN vote -- never.

Keep on spinning the Wright story and see where that Rove tactic gets you with the African American voters of this country.

Since "McCain has experience" and she has "experience" what is the difference? She can't separate herself from him so that must mean there is no difference.

And there is NO DIFFERENCE, she is a Republican.

And do a little google on Hillary and the "Fellowship." That is a real eye opener. This is not something a preacher said, this was her choice to be a regular member of a religious group composed of the very Republicans that she kisses up to....

I with Obama, your post helped me to cement my choice.
Thanks

[musicblind]

30. Wow ur overly sensitive. Geesh

My post gave two examples. One for Clinton and one for Obama of something that MIGHT effect a person's decision on them. I pulled the first two things that popped into my mind. I didn't say that YOU felt that way. But there may be people that feel that way. There may be people who are okay if Clinton has a tanted tax record and there may be people who are not. What Wright said IS wrong to have said. I am a gay man living in a very conservative community where it is illegal to buy and sell ALCOHOL because the southern baptists control my town. I am afraid to go to the store, or pump gas after dark for my own safety as an openly gay male... but it would be wrong for me to say similar things as Wright said about the straight community. I don't think Wright is a bad person, and I consider him a fellow Christian, but I can see why some people would be bothered by it. Obviously, according to the polls, it has not turned out to be nearly as big a deal as many people thought. That's a good thing, if we end up with Barack as our nominee then we do not WANT it to be a big deal. However, to claim that no one should ever look at what Wright said with some kind of question on their mind is not true. I have deep respect for the black community, I have many black friends, have been in four different interacial relationships, and have worked with Dr. Edwards creating two short films that help to promote African American rights, culture, and issues. The last one was a wonderful film called Scripture Cake about the acceptance of interracial marriage in the south. So to here people on these boards call me or anyone a racist because they have concern about the inflammatory language spoken by Wright... that's not fair or true. And for the record, of COURSE I do NOT believe Obama feels the same way as Wright does, and I do think that he handled it well by going on all of the major news outlets RIGHT AWAY to set the record straight.

[goclark]

33. I never called

YOU a racist.

I salute you for your willingness to reach out to my community and I likewise have always reached out to your community. I will continue to do so.

[musicblind]

38. Thank you, I'm sorry, I over reacted

I've been very frustrated with the Wright situation. It seems like such a tough spot. I think everyone has freedom of religion, and at the same time did feel uncomfortable by some of what he had said. I remember back when I was at the School of the Arts and my best friend there was black and my family was taking a cruise that summer and we wanted to take him with us. He agreed and it was going to be so awesome and his family told him they didn't want him going because we were white. We managed to work everything out in the end, and he got to go, and his parents met me, and it was a great time! I think in the south it seems like such an open wound, because so much of it happened right here, it was such an awful thing, and there are people here who REMEMBER it happening. We did a video for the civil rights museum in Greensboro to memorialize the sit-ins that took place at Woolworth's counter in 1960. One of the people in the video with me actually KNEW one of the waitresses that worked at that counter during the sit in, and brought a hand signed recipt to the shoot. I think there is still a lot of anger in the southern communities, and rightfully so, I also think that there is a lot of guilt amongst younger white people because of what their anscestors, and in some cases parents, have done. Hearing Wright bring these things up is difficult for me I admit, and at the same time I know that there NEEDS to be a voice for every opinion no matter how different or radical. Things are not all well in America on the race issue. Not by anymeans. Still, I think that race is slowly becoming less and less of an issue with each generation. Our High School president was black my senior year. This is in a town that, again, doesn't even allow alcohol to be sold. Now, a lot of the reason she was so accepted was because she was such a great person with a great, magnetic, personality... but it still says something positive, I hope. I really hope, and believe, that my grandkids (if gay adoption is legalized in this state) will not care at all. I know many many people my age who don't care one way or the other. So I don't know what to make of the Wright situation. I think it does look bad for a presidential candidate, and if the words were replaced with "black" instead of "white" it would be all the more shocking. But I also understand why he would be angry. He is rather old and has LIVED through the worst of it. He has seen how awful things can be, and when you see that it makes you angry. I think some of what he said is technically hate speech because it would be hateful if I said it to someone else, but I do not blame him for saying it. If I had been through what he has been through... I'd probably say it too! I think that Obama understands where the Reverand is coming from, but does not agree with him. I feel that way with many friends. I a friend who is very poor and seems to really genuinely hate people with wealth. I don't agree with him, but I kind of understand where he's coming from when I know what he has done and seen. I think it was good for Obama to go on the news and address it. He did well with that and if he is our nominee during the general election this goes to show that he will FIGHT any attempt to tear him down. I am voting for Hillary because policies I prefer. I think Hillary is a good woman, but I also admire Obama and respect him as well, and I will be enthusiastic to pull the lever for him in Nov.

[Hepburn]

23. Barack Obama would have morph into ...

...Hillary Clinton for me NOT to vote for him in November.

[goclark]

25. Duplicate

[Ino]

34. If Obama accepted Hillary as his VP...

I would not vote for him.

[democrattotheend]

47. That's ridiculous

You support Obama but would not vote for him for president if he selects Hillary as his VP?

For Christ's sake, given the divisiveness of this primary season, we are going to have a hard enough time hanging onto the Clinton supporters if Obama gets the nomination (or vice versa). The last thing we need is people refusing to support their own candidate because of who they pick for VP.

[XemaSab]

54. I think if Obama can forgive her

I can too.

It would be tough, but I'd suck it up.

[stillcool]

35. I can't imagine...

the one thing that would be so vile, that would cause me to change my mind about either of these candidates. But it would have to be something the candidate did. Not a few excerpts from a sermon that an elderly Black man gave.

[Texas Hill Country]

36. They would have to be to the right of the Republicans... which I doubt

[theredpen]

37. If neither of them win the Dem nomination

[NoodleyAppendage]

39. What would it take for me to NOT vote for Clinton? Her being the Dem candidate for Pres.

Otherwise, I'm either not going to show up at the polls or will vote for Nader. I will not vote for another Bush or Clinton EVER AGAIN.

Enough with the Clinton/BFEE Presidental nepotism and monarchy.

J

[bobbert]

41. I won't vote for Obama if Clinton is the Democratic nominee.

I won't vote for Clinton if Obama is the Democratic nominee.

That is all.

[musicblind]

42. Clever answer! I like that :)

[lame54]

43. Martial law

[musicblind]

62. lol n/t

[RichardRay]

44. I'm certain there's SOMETHING that would make me vote

for John McCain, but I can't think of what it would be. Short, that is, of things like shoveling live babies into a truck with a pitchfork to take them to the ovens. As much as I support or don't support Obama, Clinton or even McCain, I don't put any of them that far beyond the pale.

[CakeGrrl]

45. I'll support whichever candidate wins the pledged delegate count as long as

the Supers vote consistently with the majority, wherever that lies.

[ORDem]

46. Live boy or dead girl... n/t

[MediaBabe]

50. Nothing will change my support for Hillary Clinton

I've read just about every lie and distortion that has ever been printed about Mrs. Clinton for years now and still admire her from the bottom of my heart. I cannot think of any lie they could make up that would cause me to change my admiration and respect for her.

[musicblind]

61. I look forward to the chance to hear her speak in NC.

And am voting for her. And am taking two of my friends to register tomorrow so they can vote for her. But I wouldn't say that NOTHING could change my mind about her. If I BELIEVED she was a truly bad person, I would not be able to vote for her anymore and would switch to Obama at that point.

[stratomagi]

51. Well something like selling your own party down the river

which Clinton has already done...but barack would have to do something awful to a puppy for me not to vote for him. :evilgrin:

[XemaSab]

52. Are we talking about the primary or the GE?

I already voted for my man in the primary, so it's hard to rethink my choices there.

My only discomfort with him is his stand on GLBT Americans and his non-condemnation of McClurkin, and if he said something unequivocally bigoted against gays THAT would be a primary deal-breaker.

It would take a hell of a lot for me to not support him in the GE. He'd really have to do something awful for me to not turn out to vote for him against McCain. Throwing gays, choice, seperation of church and state, or other liberal values under the bus would really weaken my support for him, as would a hawkish stance on war. If he did those things, what would be the point of voting for him against McCain? :shrug:

(Oh, and on edit: an endorsement from Al Gore, Howard Dean, or someone like Barbara Lee for Hillary would give me pause.)

[musicblind]

65. Wow thank you for

being so honest. You know, as a Gay person I want to thank you for standing with us on the McClurklin issue. It does hurt my feelings a lot, and I wish he could come out against it like he did Rev Wright. But since you were so honest about someone you support. As a Hillary supporter I'd like to say something positive about your candidate, because Obama moved me to tears today when I listented to his speech on race. I almost didn't cry, but at the end when he was telling his story about mustard and relish sandwhiches and ended the speech, I couldn't help it. I he becomes our nominee, I just really hope he comes out against the McClurklin issue and in full support of GLBT rights. I'd be soooo proud of him as our canidate then. Though I am proud of both him and Hillary at this point and either will make great representatives for our party.

[cooolandrew]

56. For him to shun HRC voters and ridcule them call them delueded or something.

[uponit7771]

57. For Obama to be overly oppurtinistic

[grantcart]

58. I support Obama.

It would be difficult for me to support Clinton on one of two issues

1) If she were to have gotten the nomination by using anti democratic or devious methods,

or

2) If I became convinced that McCain was less likely to start a new war than Clinton.

[musicblind]

66. Do you feel that Clinton would be more likely to do that

than McCain or were you just using it as an example? Not accusing, everyone has a right to their opinion, so if you do feel that way it is okay. Just asking.

[aquarius dawning]

59. It will take barack obama getting the democratic nomination for me to not vote for him.

:evilgrin:

[musicblind]

67. you would not at all vote for him if he is the nominee?

[ZombieHorde]

60. Demanding more capital punishment.

Listening to country western music.

Advocating war with Iran.

Advocating stricter punishments for drug users.

[musicblind]

68. listening to country western music?

hahahaha, they'd also lose all of their gay supporters too!

and yes, capital punishment is a big issue for me. I can't stand it. How people think that two wrongs make a right is beyond me. Do you know... where does Obama stand on capital punishment? Is he for abolishing it?

[SunsetDreams]

63. If I died

[chyjo]

64. I will respond honestly

As things stand if Clinton were the nominee I cannot see myself voting for her in the New York State General Election. I believe that if she is the nominee she will most likely win New York handily and I have no need of casting yea for a candidate who I deeply dislike and distrust. Of course, if , and this is a big IF for some reason the New York State Polls prior to the GE of McCain v. Clinton look like a nail-biter I would probably swallow that pukey taste in my mouth and vote for Clinton, however if that were the case it would probably mean McCain was looking at a landslide win, so we would be screwed anyway.......

[musicblind]

70. Well thank you for being honest

I personally support Clinton and like her bunches (obviously) but everyone is entitled to an opinion. I also appreciate that you are willing to sacrafice for the good of the party/country in a situation IF it were close. I, however, will personally vote for Obama with great enthusiasim if he is the nominee. But like I both of them. :)

[LWolf]

69. I currently support no candidate for president.

Here's what it takes for me to NOT vote for HRC:

The DLC
Penn
IWR
Kyl/Lieberman

Just to begin with.

Here's what it takes for me to NOT vote for Obama:

He's a hawk campaigning on being against Iraq, but he wants to continue the war on terror, and he leaves unilateral military action on the table.

His blurring of the separation between church and state.

His support of merit pay for teachers and more privatization of public education.

His support for NAFTA.

He leaves corporate insurance and pharmaceutical companies feeding at the health care trough.

He admires Ronald Reagan.

He rationalizes letting a homophobe campaign for him.

Here's why I won't vote for McCain: He's a republican.

[musicblind]

71. Yeah...

I think that's the main reason I'm not voting for McCain too.