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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 12:33 PM
Original message
About those low blows...
Virtually every pundit, regardless of political bent, has propagated the meme that Hillary has run a scorched-earth, kitchen-sink campaign that leaves Barack Obama no choice but to reluctantly start playing a little hardball.

This meme has reached nearly 100% saturation. Even the seraphim that circle Obama's head are surely telling him to take the gloves off.

This weekend, a friend wrote me, saying that Hillary's "running the way a Republican would... always out to destroy their opponent... trying to emasculate him, belittling his credentials to be president, even as she dangles the second spot. That the kind of chutzpah you expect of GOP primary contestants in any year but this one."

Another said that she gives the impression that "she would sacrifice her whole party and all semblance of dignity for her shot at the White House."

And a third termed her response to the "Is Barack a Muslim?" question "sleazoid," until I sent him Eric Boehlert's thorough debunking of that mini-meme.

For those who’d rather print the fact than the legend, the Clinton campaign has assembled a strong case showing that the Obama campaign is, and has been, a veritable factory for tear-down-your opponent mudslinging.

Clinton Internet Director Peter Daou has circulated an e-mail listing numerous examples of the Obama campaign using its famous way with words to completely belittle Hillary Clinton, doing what she's endlessly accused of doing: endangering the opposing candidate's chances in the general election.

The Clinton campaign also created a more-exhaustive compilation of Obama's attacks on Hillary, dating back over a year, at www.attacktimeline.com.

Now, for those who are ready to rethink the media-fed myth that Hillary's the low-blow artist in this fight, and that Barack's a political pacifist, let's consider the topics that are generally cited as the crookedest cuts of all.

First, the race card. Let's not be lying nitwits here. Race (and gender) were always factors in this campaign. You could fill a library with citations about the "meaning" of this "historic" campaign, the signals it would send to the world, and so on. But bringing racism into the mix was the http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=aa0cd21b-0ff2-4329-88a1-69c6c268b304|Obama campaign's invention>. What else do you call twisting Bill's "fairy tale" comment about Obama's Iraq War credibility into racism? And morphing his praise for LBJ's role in civil rights into a dance on MLK's grave, thereby helping seal for Obama a nearly unanimous black vote in South Carolina? It's beyond me how anyone who has hit the fainting couch over divisive campaign tactics doesn't recognize this as the low point of this campaign — the fabrication of claims that your opponent is a racist (and, to boot, so is the only Democratic president we've had since 1980).

Secondly, maybe you're in a lather over the "3AM ad." Putting aside the surreal New York Times op-ed which saw images of sleeping white children (two of whom, as the commentator observes with grave suspicion, "seem vaguely Latino") as a callback to the Willie Horton ad and Birth of a Nation, the ad says — in its cheesy and derivative way — that the candidate who paid for the ad is the better bet in a crisis. Just the kind of underhanded implication you'd expect from someone who didn't have the decency to quit the race when the Kewl Kidz said she should. Shameful. Why can't she run uplifting ads, which claim her opponent will "say anything and do nothing." What could possibly help the party more in the general election? If Hillary pulls this thing out, she'll probably want to run that ad herself, with its warmly supportive message of progressive unity.

Finally, there is Hillary's statement implying that only she, among the remaining Dems, can match up to McCain on experience. Given how Dick "Gravitas" Cheney wiped the floor with John Edwards in the 2004 debate (despite how singularly terrible Cheney's "experience" is), this is a legitimate concern for the general election, no? Still, once again, Obama plays the gentleman, by saying that Sen. Clinton has "higher negatives" and reveling in the implication that his supporters won't back her in November.

I'm going to name my Unity Pony "higher negatives," because that's what a high-road candidate would say. Oh, and as with Obama's other above-board blows, this preceded the offending Hillary statement or ad.

What Obama's putting out about Hillary is good for the party, right? Just like his supporters' endlessly perpetuating the myth that Hillary is a monstrous cheater, who runs like a Republican and will gladly destroy her party in a deranged and desperate grab for "her precious." How could that possibly hurt her, and us, in the general election?

It can't, because she's a zombie, a machine, a bitch, and certifiably insane, as we hear 24/7. She may cry crocodile tears, but she isn't capable of feeling any real pain — and if she does she deserves it, right?

Nothing you say about Hillary or her husband — no matter how demeaning or untrue — could ever hurt them personally, or could diminish her chances in the general election, because she mustn't be allowed to be nominated. Even if Obama has to steal votes in FL and MI, with his cynical 50/50 ploy, because that's the right thing to do.

Because she's the devil. This I know, because AM radio told me so. It would be bad for the party to think otherwise.

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. What AM radio WON'T tell you is that Clintons protect the Bushes - always have and always will.
And THAT is why Clintons are fighting this out the way they are.

http://consortiumnews.com/2006/111106.html


Their mission is to protect the secrecy and privilege of closed government and to throw roadblocks up against any Democratic leader who advocates for open government.

The way they did to Gore, to Kerry, and now to Obama. The difference is that more Democrats have tired of the Clintons' manipulation of the party and are not standing for it, anymore.
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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. So, why does Obama fight the way he does?
Because completely trashing your opponent is OK when you're Barack Obama and your opponent is Hillary Clinton?

I just gotta learn those rules!

http://www.theleftcoaster.com/archives/012147.php

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Rules--haven't you heard? There ain't no rules
We make 'em up as we go along.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Obama is slow to the starting gate when it comes to trashing. But he knows now
what not enough Democrats knew when Clintons were undermining and sabotaging other Dem leaders over the past two decades.

Sad, but, true.

And observed by historian Douglas Brinkley in April2004:

http://www.depauw.edu/news/index.asp?id=13354

During Bill's high profile DefendingBushOnIraq book tour in 2004:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/06/19/clinton.iraq/

Carville sabotaging Ohio Dem voters on election night....for WHO?
http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/coffeehouse/2006/oct/07/did_carville_tip_bush_off_to_kerry_strategy_woodward


Hillary - would never trash a Dem, eh?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg

Clintons have always sided with Bushes and have kicked many any honest Dem AND their years of hard work to the curb to do so.
http://consortiumnews.com/2006/111106.html
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Rageneau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. Parry is forever angry that Bill didn't prosecute the BFEE, but it was pragmatics, not protectionism
A big, big, knocj=k against Big Dog is that -- despite his reputation in some circles -- he has no killer instinct. No one can quote me a single time where he outright insulted any of his opponents, including the meanest and vilest of them.

When he came into office, Clinton decided that he would get nothing done if he made enemies of the GOP by prosecuting the many open Iran-Contra crimes. He was stupid not to do so, because the GOP was never going to cooperate, and because he let some heads off the chopping block that came back to bite him.

Parry is right to be disappointed. I share his regrets. But he is wrong to accuse Clinton of collusion with Bush. There was nothing in going easy on Bush for Clinton, except his hope that he could lead the country away from the apst and into the future.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #8
22. Baloney - it wasn't JUST IranContra and you know it. Jackson Stephens was Bill's moneytree
for a decade and he underwrote Bill's primary campaign. Stephens BROUGHT a terrorist bank named BCCI into this country and Bill's deep-sixing of all the BCCI matters throughout the 90s, not only protected GHWBush, but also Jackson Stephens, Dubai and Saudi royals, and other characters like Bin Ladens, Adnan Khashoggi, AQ Khan and Marc Rich.

You REALLY want to claim it was all because Bill naively wanted support for domestic issues from Republicans when he HAD a Dem controlled Senate and House?

Is that why those same Dubai royals are lining Bill's bank accounts by the TENS OF MILLIONS lately?
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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. For argument's sake I' will give you all of the above.
You seem to omit the most damaging and trecherous - the scripted and repeated - endorsement of McCain's resume and "Obama gave a speech" which will almost certainly be featured material on 527 ads in the fall.

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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. The OP is a Taylor Marsh wannabe so it's no surprise she does that. nt
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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. "She?"
Why do you conclude that I am a "she"?

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Because you're trying so hard to be like Taylor?
Besides, what's wrong with using the feminine pronoun by default once in a while?
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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Am I?
That's news to me, mister man.

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Have you read the above, which you accepted (for the sake of argument)?
I specific discussed the McCain resume/experience kerfuffle.

As for "Obama gave a speech," it's in response to Obama's constant claims that his speech (and not his record when he actually got to the Senate and voted virtually identically to Hillary) that proves he has better judgment. Also, do we expect that his "merely" making a speech will reflect unfavorably upon him when stacked up against #1 Iraq War cheerleader John McCain? In what way is that "damaging" to Obama in a head-to-head in November? Compare that to painting Hillary as someone who wanted the war, as opposed to someone who did what Has Blix wanted, which was to give the U.S. and U.N. a big stick to ensure better weapons inspections but wouldn't have been stupid enough to start bombing when the inspections were successful?

I like what this guy said about the conditions under which Obama gave that speech:
“You know, I think very highly of Hillary. The more I get to know her,
the more I admire her. I think she’s the most disciplined—one of the
most disciplined people—I’ve ever met. She’s one of the toughest. She’s
got an extraordinary intelligence. And she is, she’s somebody who’s in
this stuff for the right reasons. She’s passionate about moving the
country forward on issues like health care and children.

“So it’s not clear to me what differences we’ve had since I’ve been in
the Senate. I think what people might point to is our different
assessments of the war in Iraq, although I’m always careful to say that
I was not in the Senate, so perhaps the reason I thought it was such a
bad idea was that I didn’t have the benefit of U.S. intelligence. And,
for those who did, it might have led to a different set of choices. So
that might be something that sort of is obvious. But, again, we were in
different circumstances at that time: I was running for the U.S. Senate,
she had to take a vote, and casting votes is always a difficult test.”

Barack Obama, The New Yorker, November 7, 2006


Actually, I do take issue with one thing he said -- a misstatement which he repeated in the most recent debate: claiming that he was running for the U.S. Senate when he made that famous speech. Actually, he was running for the Illinois State Senate at the time and hadn't yet declared a U.S. Senate bid.

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. not really glanced over it - it is completely irrelevent because it doesn't
confront the real charges that come directly from her and her campaign and are offered without apology or excuse

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anamandujano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
6. Thank you. Bookmarking and REC.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
13. That's a truly marvelous spaghetti al diablo concoction of fallacies, snark, and cherry-picking, ...
... highlighted with strobes and a carefully lit smokescreen. Bravo! It must take time to develop such a sauce using tripe as a way of bringing home the bacon. Poor Hillary! So misunderstood and (first-, of course) victimized by the dark forces of evil. Sure does make it all so clear. All them references! Wow! Ann Coulter, eat your heart out!
:eyes:
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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. I wish I had your gift for well-constructed argument n/t

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Obviously.
:shrug:
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lwcon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Oh, and speaking of strobes
Your sig gave me a Pokemon headache. Just sayin'....

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Tragic
:nopity:
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. lwcon is doing a very bad Taylor Marsh impersonation. nt
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Is that the love child of Maureen Dowd and Matt Drudge?
Edited on Mon Mar-17-08 05:45 PM by TahitiNut
It's hard to keep the players strait(-jacketed). It's nearly an hour of my life I'll never get back - clicking on links and following nested references that led in malcharacterized circles over piles of monkey shit and through ponds of amphiboly. It takes a truly sick mind to concoct such tangled webs of spit and venom, imho. Coulteresque compounded.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. LOL!
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Johnny__Motown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
18. "Kitchen Sink" Is Hillary's campaign's phrase. don't blame anyone else for that
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
19. What's up with trying to recreate history?

December 10, 2007
Third Clinton Volunteer Knew Of Smear E-Mail

A third volunteer for Hillary Clinton's campaign was aware of a propaganda e-mail alleging that Barack Obama is a Muslim who plans on "destroying the U.S. from the inside out."
"Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential Candidacy," the email reads. "Please forward to everyone you know. The Muslims have said they Plan on destroying the U.S. from the inside out, what better way to start than at The highest level."


Two Clinton volunteers, Linda Olson and Judy Rose, have already been asked to resign from the campaign for their roles in forwarding the e-mail. The AP reported yesterday that Olson, a volunteer coordinator in Iowa County, sent a version of the e-mail to 11 people, including Ben Young, a regional field director for Chris Dodd's campaign. Young passed it on to the AP.

http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2007/12/third_clinton_v.html


Kerrey Apologizes to Obama Over Remark
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=4031436
Kerrey's mention of Obama's middle name and his Muslim roots raised eyebrows because they are also used as part of a smear campaign on the Internet that falsely suggests Obama is a Muslim who wants to bring jihad to the United States. Obama is a Christian.

The Clinton campaign has already fired two volunteer county coordinators in Iowa for forwarding hoax e-mails with the debunked claim. Last week, a national Clinton campaign co-chairman resigned for raising questions about whether Obama's teenage drug use could be used against him, so Kerrey's comments raised questions about whether the Clinton campaign might be using another high-profile surrogate to smear Obama.


Source: Newsday
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2007 at 12:04 pm
Barack Obama Accepts Apology From Hillary Clinton

Washington D.C. 12/15/2007 09:17 AM GMT (FINDITT)
Hillary Clinton went straight to Barack Obama with an apology following a staffer's remarks about any skeletons that may be lurking in Obama's closet, pointing out that she had accepted the staffer's resignation over the disparaging remarks. Obama accepted her at her word, according to his campaign staff, and is moving on without letting it interrupt his campaign plans.

Obama is currently leading the polls in Iowa and New Hampshire, the two early primary states often considered key to the process, according to numbers at usaelectionpolls.com, but on a national level Clinton still holds a huge lead. The most recently posted poll results show Obama with 31 percent of the probable voters in New Hampshire backing him with 29 percent showing support for Clinton.
http://www.transworldnews.com/NewsStory.aspx?id=30629&cat=5



Hillary: Sorry for Any Offense Campaign (Bill) Has Caused

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB65wJ6Rcfs


Bill Clinton Asks for a Second Chance
By Liz Halloran
Posted February 11, 2008

The morning after his wife, Hillary, was routed in three state contests by Sen. Barack Obama in their dead-heat battle for the Democratic nomination, former President Bill Clinton made his case for her before a packed Sunday service at one of the largest black churches in Washington, D.C.
But first he offered an apology of sorts for racially tinged comments he made about Obama and his candidacy that have triggered a backlash in the black community and among many other Democrats.

Clinton invoked his "worship of a God of second chances" in pronouncing himself glad to be at the Temple of Praise, which claims nearly 15,000 members. His invocation of second chances echoed comments he made early last week at black churches in California, where he campaigned for his wife before that state's Super Tuesday primary, which she won.

http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/campaign-2008/2008/02/11/bill-clinton-asks-for-a-second-chance.html


Bill Clinton To Apologize At LA Black Churches
Once again, Bill Clinton is ready to repent.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/02/bill-clinton-to-apologize_n_84573.html
On Sunday the former president is scheduled to visit black churches in South Central Los Angeles, where he's expected to offer a mea culpa to those who "dearly loved him" when he was their president, Rep. Diane Watson (D-Calif.) says.
Watson, a member of the Congressional Black Caucus who has endorsed Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.), tells us she'll usher the former president to more than half a dozen churches in her district where she says he needs to "renew his relationship" with congregants who were turned off by his racially tinged
comments in the days leading up to and following the South Carolina primary. (Such as when Clinton compared Sen. Barack Obama's landslide victory to Jesse Jackson's wins in 1984 and 1988.)



Clinton Camp Pushes O-Bomber Links: Ignores Her Own Radical Ties

By: Justin Rood
ABC News - The Hillary Clinton campaign pushed to reporters today stories about Barack Obama and his ties to former members of a radical domestic terrorist group -- but did not note that as president, Clinton's husband pardoned more than a dozen convicted violent radicals, including a member of the same group mentioned in the Obama stories.

"Wonder what the Republicans will do with this issue," mused Clinton spokesman Phil Singer in one e-mail to the media, containing a New York Sun article reporting a $200 contribution from William Ayers, a founding member of the 1970s group Weather Underground, to Obama in 2001.

In a separate e-mail, Singer forwarded an article from the Politico newspaper reporting on a 1995 event at a private home that brought Obama together with Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn, another member of the radical group.

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4330128&page=1



January 6, 2008, 5:18 pm
Edwards: No Conscience in Clinton Campaign
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/edwards-no-conscience-in-clinton-campaign/
By Julie Bosman
KEENE, N.H. – John Edwards angrily took on Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton at two news conferences in a row on Sunday, saying that her campaign “doesn’t seem to have a conscience.”



COMPTON, Calif. (AP) — Hillary Rodham Clinton and her campaign tried to mend ties to black voters Thursday when a key supporter apologized to her chief rival, Barack Obama, for comments that hinted at Obama's drug use as a teenager. The candidate herself, meanwhile, praised the Rev. Martin Luther King and promised to assist with the rebirth of this troubled, largely black city.

Bob Johnson, the founder of Black Entertainment Television, apologized
for comments he made at a Clinton campaign rally in South Carolina on Sunday that hinted at Obama's use of drugs as a teenager.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-01-17-johnson-apology_N.htm?csp=34

Clinton Surrogate Compares Obama Ad to Nazi March

http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20080201/cm_thenation/45278988_1
Fri Feb 1, 2:23 PM ET
The Nation -- On a media conference call organized by the Hillary Clinton campaign today, Clinton surrogate Len Nichols compared an Obama health care ad to Nazis.
----------
Accusing political opponents of Nazism is an outrageous smear. Raising the specter of a Nazi march in response to a health care mailer that evokes the insurance industry is so absurd, it would be hard to take the attack seriously, were it not launched from a high profile national campaign conference call in this crucial stretch of the presidential race. And political observers know, of course, that the Clinton Campaign regularly arranges opportunities for surrogates to launch these kind of smears, which are later followed up with apologies. (See: Bob Johnson, Bill Shaheen, Bob Kerrey, and Francine Torge, to name the most recent offenders.) For his part, Nichols did not immediately return a call requesting further comment.
-------------------------
Len Nichols, Director of New America's Health Policy Program, stated, "For nearly 17 years I have worked tirelessly to reform our nation's struggling health system. Today my passion overwhelmed me. I chose an analogy that was wholly inappropriate. I am deeply sorry for any offense that my unfortunate comments may have caused.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg
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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
20. "Shame on You Hillary Clinton!" Barack yells out
while finger poking and acting oh so moritfiied and pissed and hurt. with pout included.

it just doenst' happen that way, does it?
Thats why its ridiculous to say that Obama is playing dirty like clinton. It's laughable.

he's the adult with the real confidence and this is making people pay serious attention t him - and it pisses off Her Royal Vileness to no end, because she truly looks and sounds like an idiot when she does her kitchen sink.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-18-08 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. Some people really think we DON'T pay attention....



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg


Hillary's low blows are suppose to be a source of pride for Dems, eh? Too bad it's almost always against OTHER Dems.
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