Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The amazing support the Clintons gave Kerry in '04....read on

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
journalist3072 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:08 PM
Original message
The amazing support the Clintons gave Kerry in '04....read on
Edited on Thu Mar-20-08 10:14 PM by journalist3072
I've just finished reading a post here on DU, where the OP claims the Clintons did nothing to help Kerry in 2004.

And that's not the first time I'v seen that outright lie.

So, for anyone who still believes the Clintons were MIA in 2004, allow me to disabuse you of that notion. This is exactly why I email myself these kind of articles, so I can refer back to them as needed.

Read on:

By Howard Fineman
MSNBC contributor
Updated: 5:15 p.m. ET Oct. 25, 2004PHILADELPHIA - They mapped Bill Clinton's path to the stage in Center City so that he wouldn't have to climb too many stairs, which was thoughtful, because he looked like what he was: a guy who had had quadruple bypass surgery only a few weeks ago. The shock of light-gray hair was familiar, as was the ironic, world-weary smile; as was the European cut suit. But he was so skinny that he didn't fill it out, and his skin was sallow, and his long sculpted fingers looked as though they had been painted by El Greco. When he spoke, his voice was reedier, thinner and more tentative than we remember: no anger, no volume and no Lewinsky-era drama.

Still, in eight minutes in front of a crowd of 80,000 Democrats that stretched from City Hall to 17th Street, the former president summarized the case against George Bush and for John Kerry better than Kerry himself has ever done, with more humor, concision and bite. Among the pundits, the assumption was that Clinton had come to town to jack up the black vote, which is true as far as it goes.

But as I listened to Clinton I was reminded of the political genius he possesses to speak to the dispossessed and the comfortable at the same time. His first argument: that Bush and the Republicans had indulged in runaway spending in Washington, which meant that the Japanese and Chinese — who are buying all the T-Bills — will control the fiscal destiny of our children.

Clinton's appeal was shrewdly conservative and flag-waving. He defended Kerry's call for a rollback of Bush's top-rate tax cut as a matter of patriotism: Wealthy folks (he is one of them) should be willing to sacrifice. Kerry, he said, would build a "larger Army" than Bush's and be tougher on al Qaida and homeland defense. With deadpan skill, he called the Republicans "our friends" and then caricatured them as go-it-alone bomb throwers.

Finishing with a flourish, he said that if one side is trying to scare you and playing on fear, and the other side makes you think and offers you hope … you know what to do. Kerry has been selling fear, of course: on the draft, on Social Security, on the war. But you couldn't tell that by listening to the sweet if somewhat enervated reasonableness of William J. Clinton.

The rally was a coup and an inspiration for the Kerry team here in Pennsylvania. This is one of about 10 battleground states, and Kerry has a better chance here than the president. The GOP is well-organized, relying on the war and conservative values, but the Dems are pumped on the economy and on the idea that Bush is just another Republican who favors the rich.

I hear that Bush will be here three times — only two have been announced. He will do Lancaster, Bucks County near Philly and, I hear, a last stop in Southwestern Pennsylvania, the Pittsburgh area, near Election Day, probably on Monday. The Dems are working just as hard, with John Edwards scheduled into Scranton (Hillary Clinton next day, then Scranton native Joe Biden after that) and Kerry due to make at least one more stop. Auditor Bob Casey, who is pro-life and popular, nevertheless is making TV ads for Kerry. It's support that could help in "The T," the middle of the state, as well in conservative Catholic areas of Pittsburgh and Philly.

I'm still waiting for this election to break in a dramatic way. If I sense any movement in any way, and it is slight, it seems to be in Kerry's direction. A light breeze, not a gale. That's the way it felt in Ohio, where I spent two days last week. Bush had been ahead by eight, and went prospecting in other Midwest states, but had to rush back to defend Ohio after the polls narrowed to even there. Did the president get back soon enough?

It's one of the key questions of the election.

Another, of course, Pennsylvania. Kerry needs to come out of Philly with a big margin to compensate for GOP votes elsewhere, in more conservative areas. In 2000, Al Gore won the city by about 340,000. This time, Kerry is hoping for at least 375,000 (that's what Gov. Ed Rendell just told me) or even 400,000 (which is what Rep. Chaka Fattah just told me). If they get to the Fattah number they are going to be hard to beat in the state. Bush is making his big plays in the Northeast and the Southwest — essentially Scranton, Wilkes-Barre and the suburbs and exurbs of Pittsburgh, which are trending Republican on social issues, if not economic ones.

Clinton, meanwhile, is on the move to the extent that his health permits. He is leaving here for Florida, and after that he is going to Nevada. "This is an ambitious schedule for a guy who just had heart surgery," said Rendell.

But it's one that the Dems need.

_________________________________________________

Chelsea Clinton enters political arena by stumping for Kerry

KEN THOMAS

Associated Press


KISSIMMEE, Fla. - Former first daughter Chelsea Clinton, shielded from the public during her years in the White House, delivered her first political speeches Saturday as she campaigned for Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry.

The only child of former President Clinton and Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., said she was "a little nervous" about making her first speech in Tampa. That was followed by an appearance in the Orlando area, and she was scheduled to speak in suburban Fort Lauderdale later Saturday.

"I'm not quite an old pro but thankfully, I come from a family of old pros, and hopefully I'll do them proud," Clinton said.

Clinton has rarely spoken in public, even after leaving Washington.

Weeks short of her 13th birthday when her father was first inaugurated in 1993, her parents took great pains to guard her privacy. Only in 2000 did Clinton take her first steps into the spotlight, accompanying the her father at events while her mother campaigned for Senate.

After graduating from Stanford University in 2001, Clinton studied for a master's degree at Oxford University - where her father was a Rhodes Scholar from 1968 until 1970. She then landed a six-figure consulting job in the New York office of London-based McKinsey & Company.

Clinton's appearances in Florida indicate how important the state is to the Kerry campaign. Florida decided the 2000 election, and its 27 electoral votes are the most of any swing state in 2004.

"To be honest, I couldn't imagine being anywhere else today," Clinton said at a rally near an Osceola County polling location. "I couldn't imagine not being in Florida because the stakes are too high and the choice is too clear."

Touting the Kerry-Edwards ticket, Clinton said she believes in "their vision and their plan for America, and I know that it will work because of everything that we experienced as a country during the eight years that my father served as president."

During her three-minute speech, Clinton said her father's administration "proved that we can move people out of poverty, that we can swell the middle class, that we could balance the budget and still create more wealth."

Clinton was only one of several daughters of prominent Democrats on the Florida tour. She was joined by Caroline Kennedy, Karenna Gore Schiff, Vanessa Kerry and Cate Edwards.

Introducing Vanessa Kerry, Clinton said she "was proud to call her my friend, and in three days I hope to know her as our next first daughter."

Caroline Kennedy said Clinton was a person of "grace and dignity."

"If you think her parents are smart, you should talk to her."




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
billbuckhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. Hillary's opponents will tell any lie to keep her from winning
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. LOL...like you don't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. Are you now going to stalk billbuckhead for 3 days calling him a liar...
before being forced to save face and make an apology thread? :eyes:




Mad?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:40 PM
Response to Reply #19
59. Are you going to stalk me for three days being an idiot?
Mad? Or just stupid?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #1
27. So says a preeminent liar.
NT!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Rene Donating Member (758 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #1
86. So very sad to read that post and then realize how John Kerry and Caroline Kennedy have
figuratively stabbed Hillary Clinton in the back. Shame on them. I can't say enough about how stupid and shallow I think they are.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-21-08 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #86
90. No, my dear friend, THIS is what stabbing someone in the back looks like:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zabet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
2. K and R
:patriot:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:11 PM
Response to Original message
3. Does it say anything about Bill defending Bush against the left on Iraq or congratulating Rove for a
"marvelous job"?

The Clinton did just enough to say "look we did something," and half of what they did was sabotage Kerry's campaign (see Carville and McAwful).


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
18. Right, just in case he won
which he did.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
23. A kick for Hillary and Bill Clinton.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
26. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
juajen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #26
62. We really shouldn't dislike Obama because of posters like this.
He is obviously only on the board to spread dissension among democrats. I am putting him on ignore, and in all my years here, he is only the second or third person that I have done this to. From now on, I am going to judge the supposed Obama supporters by their character, and if they lack it, they will be put on ignore.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fedupinBushcountry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #62
84. I am putting you on my
Ignore list due to your not calling out a fellow Du'er for calling him/her an a**hole. Talk about lack of character.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
juajen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:40 PM
Response to Reply #3
58. Present only facts supported by links or you are not to be believed.
I'm tired of the shit being spewed on this board. Put up or shut up!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-21-08 08:27 AM
Response to Reply #58
92. Here is a fact that Hillary people like to ignore:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg

John Kerry owed the Clintons NOTHING.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
5. Kerry supported Clinton in 1992 when he became nominee, 1996 , during impeachment
during all of Hillary's Senate runs etc.

Kerry defended Bill against Bob Kerrey when he tried to bring up the draft dodging stuff.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #5
30. Yep n/t
Edited on Thu Mar-20-08 10:22 PM by politicasista
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
6. K&R For the Clintons.
Hillary's opponent is a craven political scumbag who will do and say anything to win.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. "Hillary's opponent is a craven political scumbag who will do and say anything to win."
So glad Kerry endorsed Obama! Aren't you?

LOL!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. I really am. Judging by the "pull" he had in his home state he is damaged goods
after folding like a cheap tent when Bush stole the election from US.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. That's funny! You hoped he'd endorse Obama, but are using him to prove Bill's loyalty?

Click me!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Yeah, that's how loyal the Clintons are to the party -- they even support
our most unpopular candidate.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. A better candidate than Hillary, who did two things Hillary couldn't do:
tell the truth and win the primary!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. John Kerry couldn't close the deal against GWB, and is thus responsible for the4 years of sheer and
utter hell that is Bush's 2nd term.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. Bill loved that. He got to hang out with Bush Sr., Rove and now is buddies with Limbaugh! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #36
41. Bill's a winner.... sometimes he gets tired of hanging with losers like JK.
I will never forgive that sob John Kerry for promising to fight for every vote and then closing up shop.... never will I trust that guy again.... never!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #41
47. He's hanging on to Hillary and she's not winning! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. She'll be in the White House soon. There is no way that the Clintons will fall
to the craven ambitions of David Axelrod and his puppet, Barry O'bama.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. She's doing a good job of pretending to lose, and of the candidates is deemed least trustworthy!
Go Obama!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #51
54. No one cares what your perception is. The Goddess of Peace will soon ascend to her throne.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #54
66. Do you think I care about yours?
Warped and delusional?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-23-08 05:14 AM
Response to Reply #54
95. right. Not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-23-08 05:49 AM
Response to Reply #54
96. I can only wish she were
Edited on Sun Mar-23-08 06:39 AM by OhioBlues
No goddess of peace would have voted for war would she? If she were a really good goddess she would have felt in her bones that this was a corporate war but since I believe she knew what she was voting for she can't be a goddess of anything peaceful. Well that and a goddess would not have to exaggerate her skills and experience.

Keep it real, she's the last one I would have hoped to be in this race, I'm going to vote for her but only if I have to against McCain. She is the closest of all the candidates to being "more of the same".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. YES--BO was a scumbag for giving those pics to the NYT--Hypocritcal he is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #17
42. I hope he hand delivered them! Are they embarrassed by who they invite to the WH? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #10
21. NY Times says Obama campaign provided them with Clinton/Wright photo


Forum Name General Discussion: Primaries
Topic subject NY Times says Obama campaign provided them with Clinton/Wright photo
Topic URL http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5183818#5183818
5183818, NY Times says Obama campaign provided them with Clinton/Wright photo
Posted by ruggerson on Thu Mar-20-08 09:34 PM

"In providing the photograph to The New York Times, the Obama campaign appeared to be trying to divert some attention to the Clintons after a week in which Mr. Obama’s relationship with Mr. Wright has left him facing one of the biggest challenges of his campaign."

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/20/photograph-of-bill-clinton-and-rev-wright-surfaces /

"Responding to the Times's report that Obama campaign had "provided" them a photo of Bill Clinton and Jeremiah Wright (which had surfaced a bit earlier here and elsewhere) , Clinton spokesman Jay Carson emails:

"The Obama campaign put this photo out? How pathetic," he said. "Less than 48 hours after calling for a high-minded conversation on race, the Obama campaign is peddling photos of an occasion when President Clinton shook hands with Rev. Wright. To be clear, President Clinton took tens of thousands of photos during his 8 years as president."


http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0308/Clinton_aide_Obama_pushing_Wright_photo_pathetic.html
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #21
31. If Clinton is innocent, what's the problem?
But of course, she's not, and anything that makes that obvious point is treasonous.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #31
37. get a grip--what the heck are you calling treasonous.
If Clinton is innocent, what's the problem?
Posted by dailykoff


But of course, she's not, and anything that makes that obvious point is treasonous.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. So she isn't innocent?
What a surprise.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. Innocent of what?? you are making no sense to me at all.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #43
60. If the Wright association is innocent, why are you whining?
:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #60
64. 20 yrs of BO association with Wright vs a Bill C. handshake at a WH . ha ha.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #64
69. So why did you call Obama a scumbag if Clinton is innocent?
:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #60
67. btw--the BO assoiation with Wright was not innocent. good bye
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #67
70. Oh? What is she guilty of?
:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
7. rec
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AX10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
8. K & R!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
9. K&R
Good info.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
11. a kick for the Big Dog and Hillary
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
12.  Oct. 25 was too late to help much.
The swiftboaters had struck and the debates were over. By that time it looked like Kerry had it wrapped up anyway.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #12
22. Did you miss the part about Bill Clinton having BYPASS SURGERY???

That sidelined him for a while, as it would anyone.

Can Obamaniacs not read or not reason?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Did Hillary have bypass surgery too?
Oh wait, she was at his bedside 24/7 nursing him back to health, not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #24
35. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #22
34. Dick Cheney has them all the time, that didn't stop his evil ass from campaigning! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #34
57. LOL!
:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
13. Thanks for your reseach--nice to set the record straight
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
InvisibleTouch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:15 PM
Response to Original message
15. Thanks for posting this! Gets a Rec from me. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fedupinBushcountry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. This is proof ?
by Howard Fineman. Not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #16
48. Rove would be proud of you KILL THE MESSENGER
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fedupinBushcountry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #48
74. Rove is quite proud
of your slam bam thank you ma'am responses. Get real.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
29. and classic - Kerry returned the favors with
Edited on Thu Mar-20-08 10:22 PM by JoFerret
a premature stab in the back.


ah politics
twas ever thus


(I supported Kerry from fairly early on in 204)

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #29
38. Supporting the better candidate is harldy a stab in the back.
Endorsing McCain is a stab in the back. So are the right-wing e-mails she sends out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #38
46. clearly he thinks so. I don't
Edited on Thu Mar-20-08 10:31 PM by JoFerret
whatever


maybe he has fallen under the thrall - the total suspension of critical faculties and sense of human decency that does affect SOME obama supporters.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #29
40. seems to be a meanness in his comments--not necessary.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. yep - unnecessary
.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #44
50. I do not diss kerry--just disappointed at this point.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #40
82. Compare them to Bill Clinton's - Kerry is by far the nicer
You also ignore that in calling "Kerry's comments" inappropriate - she was agreeing with the RW that he was dissing the troops -though Kerry was a man who was a troop when Bill Clinton REALLY dissed the troops. There is NOTHING I ever heard Kerry say about any Democrat that comes close to that. She knew that there is NO other Democratic Senator who has cared more or done more for the veterans and troops. (It is not "inappropriate for an exhausted man to skip a 2 letter word in a speech - I bet both clintons have done so. Inappropriate is telling a joke about Ghandi working at a gas station or some of BC's activities.)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #29
78. No HRC stabbed him in the back in November 2006
Kerry endorsed Obama, saying that both HRC and Edwards were qualified to be President and would lead the country in the right direction. He did not owe anyone an endorsement.

You also forget that both Clintons attacked Kerry/Feingold as cut and run - and then when he wasn't running adopted that position - never giving him any credit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:23 PM
Response to Original message
33. I bet that all that campaigning did not balance the harm done releasing his book in July 2004.
Just what every nominee - especially one who lost June in the media to Reagan's funeral and canonization. In the book, where he credits McCain not the candidate of his own party for the work on reconciling Vietnam - though McCain's own book credits Kerry as the person it couldn't have been done without and where he has this strange discussion of whether to support Kerry against Weld in 1996. (just what the Senate would have needed a 56th Republican - and one who had vetoed the MA program that was the model for S-Chip - rather than the guy, who with Kennedy wrote the first bill that Hatch and Kennedy altered significantly to create S-Chip - that difference was too insignificant to mention.

The bigger problem was just that it dominated the talk shows and news - when Kerry and Edwards would likely have had more chance to introduce themselves. Not to mention - the first thing every journalist did was to go to "L" in the index.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #33
63. Odd isn't it.
And then he had surgery.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:29 PM
Response to Original message
45. Thank you for finally putting to rest the lie that has been told over 1000 times on this forum
:thumbsup:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #45
52. at least
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #45
53. It's not a lie. Token support at the end of a long campaign
isn't worth much. When he was needed he was AWOL.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #53
55. Yeah, he should have put off his heart attack until a more appropriate time. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #55
61. The swiftboaters started that spring.
When was his heart attack?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #55
81. LOL
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #53
65. Jesus Christ himself couldn't have saved Kerry from losing to the imbecile in chief
What a loser of a campaigner that guy was. Thank God we won't have to go through another FRUSTRATING ordeal like Campaign 2004

"Someone, quick...take a picture of me windsurfing before I have to come in and change into camouflage to go hunting and kill some innocent birdies so the gun people will like me."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #53
71. Bill C. was sick at that time. Do you know anything about compassion?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #71
73. Judging from what we've seen on this forum I highly doubt many of them do!
Edited on Thu Mar-20-08 10:54 PM by mtnsnake
The Hillary supporters seem to be the ones with empathy and class...you know...like you and me, rd :smoke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #73
76. I like to think we do:-)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #71
75. I know about politics
and if B or H had actually wanted to help Kerry they had many opportunities to. They didn't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #75
79. Your bias is bleeding thru my computer screen. Good night to you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-21-08 08:16 AM
Response to Reply #71
88. You misunderstand what some of us Kerry supporters have said
Edited on Fri Mar-21-08 08:39 AM by karynnj
You make the issue campaigning in fall 2004. The lack of support that I and many others have spoken of - with no Kerry quotes to back us up - are based on our observations of negative things he and his allied did - not anything not done. Some are:

1) Releasing his autobiography in July 2004. Bill Clinton is reputed to be the sharpest politician of our generation - any high school kid could see why this is a bad idea in the run up to the election. As it was, June was a month when Kerry could get little coverage - as it was solid Reagan coverage for at least 3 weeks. Then Bill Clinton took a fair part of July - and all of us were treated to learning that the reason for Monica was "because I could". Now, frankly I could have happily lived my whole life not knowing that. This was a repeat of Bill Clinton having a confessional interview about getting his family back after Monica in the week before Gore's convention. You need to either challenge his political acumen or accept in both cases he had some need to fight off Gore or Kerry becoming the head of the party and President.

2) In the book, he has 2 strange pages where he writes of the 1996 MA Senate race. Kerry was the nominee almost 2 months before he finished editing his book - so you know that he reviewed this knowing Kerry was our candidate. The overall impression was that he liked Kerry's competitor more but wanted Kerry to win because of his knowledge on the environment and technology. He also mentioned Kerry's long term work with disadvantaged youth, noting there were no votes in it. Now, none of these 3 were big 2004 issues. Not mentioned were most of Kerry's strongest issues - foreign policy, terrorism (BCCI was already shut down), and healthcare, where Kerry had just written,with Kennedy, the precursor bill to S-CHIP based on the plan that had just passed in MA over Weld's veto! In the sections on Vietnam reconciliation, Clinton extends a huge amount of praise to McCain, nearly ignoring that our nominee was the chair of the committee and, per all accounts of those on the committee, did an incredible job and was the one person most responsible for its success. Now, I think most people, unlike me, looked up "Lewinsky" not "Kerry" in the index - but for people who read that nearly 1,000 page book those pages played into the Republican theme that he didn't accomplish much in the Senate.

3) There were Clinton and Clinton ally generated stories all through the period he was convalescing that Kerry's campaign was poorly run and that he was not listening to Clinton's advice. In fact, Kerry numbers went up when he concentrated on Iraq and the War on terror, rather than the economy as Clinton advised. These stories hurt.

4) In the wake of defeat, is when Clinton was the worst. That he praised Rove on the campaign he ran and made a point of saying he liked both Kerry and Bush within a week or two of the election hurt. Then there was the whisper campaign generated by Clinton allies that Kerry was not taking a place as just 1 of the 100 Senators and implying that he was at odds with Reid. The fact is that Kerry, by virtue of being the nominee, was a party leader - not the party leader, but a party leader - a status that the Clinton allies were denying. Clinton also had a conflict of interest as the last former President and the husband of HRC - this showed most when in 2005, he spoke of Kerry, a Democrat with far more national security credentials than almost any other Democrat, as weak on defense - rather than embracing Kerry's position on the war on terror. With the specter of Kerry running, he likely didn't want to hand that to Kerry. However, had the Democrats continued to keep that as their policy, the reaction of people like George Will that Kerry was right would have positioned us best on national security. The fact is that contrary to the list in BC's book, there was no Senator who understood more than the guy who wrote "The New War". The constant belittling Kerry and blaming Kerry for the SBVT by all the Clinton people was painful - and that did color my picture of the Clintons for the worse.

As to the campaigning, the question I would ask is who called whom. I seriously doubt the Kerry campaign begged him to campaign. By the time Clinton campaigned, Kerry alone had already had huge rallies - that broke all previous records. Of course Bill Clinton was a draw - but I seriously doubt the attendance had it just been Kerry would have been much less. I saw the entire thing on CSPAN and it was emotional - as the first time Clinton was out and he was good - but Kerry's speech was equally well received - judging from the applause. The media reports all spoke mostly of Clinton, because his being out was the news. In fact, either CNN or MSNBC cut away as soon as Clinton ended. So, newswise - I would guess it helped Kerry less than the local coverage of a just Kerry rally would have. Now, I've seen people post that Kerry would not have won PA without that rally. This is extremely unlikely - this was downtown Philadelphia - an area that ALWAYS is very Democratic. The African American turn out across the country was record breaking - even where Bill Clinton didn't go. There is no reason to think Philadelpia would be different. In Pittsburgh, it wasn't Clinton but THK who made a difference. I suspect that was the case in the affluent Philadelphia suburbs - as there were likely many independents that remembered her as their Senator's wife and as one ex-PA Republican in my area accepted Kerry as good because otherwise she wouldn't have married him.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-23-08 05:10 AM
Response to Reply #45
94. About bloody time
there's plenty of crap about both candidates without making stuff up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
juajen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
56. It was obvious at the time what a strain it was for Bill to campaign
so close after his surgery. I watched in fear thinking any moment he might collapse. I'm glad you have these articles and that you posted them. I'm sick of the perfidy in relegating the Clintons to a dishonorable mention in our political discourse, and wonder at what is causing it. I believe the answer is an infusion of troublemakers that are difficult to detect. It would be much easier if they came on to DU with their username circled in red, and the words "here lie dragons" as a warning.

We also have an unusual amount of republicans interfering in our primaries this primary season, alternately voting for both of our leading candidates and manipulating our results so that at times we honestly don't know what our results are.

The Democratic Party has to come together at the convention and change the way we do business with our own elections and prevent this travesty from happening again. It was so easy to manipulate the caucuses, and, I believe, Obama made the most of this manipulation. This is why I will never support him.

One thing is sure, DUers who come on here spewing filth about the Clintons are suspect. We have had very few democrats who have helped the party more than the Clintons, and it's time for everyone to start looking deeper at posts that vilify them. I also wish that DU's administrators would make it more difficult for our board to be manipulated as I believe it has been done this primary season.

Democrats are wonderful people. Unfortunately, we are too trusting, resulting in infiltration of our ranks and, as Rush Limbaugh says, "creating chaos among the dummocrats". Isn't that special! We are being directed like puppets by our worst enemy, Limpballs.

I implore you, good democrats all, do not fall into obvious traps set by our enemies. Support your choice without malice towards another candidate. If your choice fails without tearing down another dem candidate, he or she isn't worth supporting.

Look at the reasons for your support carefully, and re-evaluate if facts change. Read carefully and always challenge so-called "facts" without any basis.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #56
68. I think we all were worried about Bill at that time. He rushed to get out to help Kerry.
These lies just make me sick.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #68
72. Oh. Please.
Fantasyland is thata way.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #72
80. And you would know better than most.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SaveOurDemocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
77. Thank you for posting this ... that LIE has been repeated

here so many times over that it's becoming DUrban Legend.


K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MessiahRp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:07 PM
Response to Original message
83. Yay for making two whole speeches...
Boo for letting one of your cronies (Carville) betray the entire party by giving legal strategy to fight Ohio to his stupid ass wife who worked for Bush

Boo for telling John Kerry to turn his back on gay people and come out against gay marriage because the Clintons have zero principles.

Rp
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:19 PM
Response to Original message
85. Howard Fineman was a Clinton pusher. And the Clinton support- not so amazing. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NJSecularist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-20-08 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
87. The myth that the Clintons did nothing to help Kerry was untrue.
Carville deserves all the blame he gets, however. What he did was despicable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-21-08 08:23 AM
Response to Original message
89. Where are the behind the scenes things he did to "help" Kerry?
Look, the Clintons only do things to "help" others if they get credit for it. A couple appearances at the last minute after undermining Kerry's campaign the previous spring and early summer doesn't cut it. Everyone knows what Clinton was saying in the spring of 2004 while promoting his book (sucking the media oxygen from a new nominee who was introducing himself to the American people): that Bush was doing a great job in the War on Terror.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
workinclasszero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-21-08 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
91. Hillary jumps on Kerry with her Rethug allies including Bush
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg

"What Senator Kerry has said was inappropriate"

Yeah thats some really great help there eh?

Hillary standing with her rethug allies Bush and McCain just like she does today against Obama!

This woman needs to change parties and take the rest of the neocon DLC dems with her!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BooScout Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-21-08 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
93. Thank you
I too have seen lies about this perpetuated here at DU. It's sickening what they have said in support of their candidate.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 26th 2024, 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC