Hillary keeps saying "all the votes should count"

[Blarch]

But the ONLY way she can win is if the votes are ignored and the supers go against the will of the people.


How do Hillary supporters rationalize this ?


Another thing that bothers me is that the Hillary supporters are fine if Bill and Hillary praise Karl Rove and vow to run their campaign just as he would.

How do they rationalize this hypocrisy ?

Who would have thought that the Democratic Party has a republican wing ? ...but here we are.

[pocoloco]

1. You didn't realize that when

Impeachment was taken off the table???

[Cronus Protagonist]

2. Let's see, count the votes and that goes against the will of the people?

You must have had some funny mushrooms for lunch.

[Blarch]

3. Ummm..

she wants all the votes counted...and she wants the supers to go against those very votes.

Whats so hard to understand ? ...the only way she can win is if the votes are ignored.

[Cronus Protagonist]

12. Link?

To where Hillary wants the superdelegates to go against the votes.

[Blarch]

14. The fact that she is still in the race.

It's the only way she can win.

Hillary Huckabee Clinton.

[Cronus Protagonist]

21. puhlease

... pffffttt... that's the sound of your wild claims deflating.

[EFerrari]

4. Let's fix a revote for Hillary.

Why not? What do rules matter -- after all, it's HILLARY.

[Cronus Protagonist]

13. No, lets revote to find out what the voters really want

That is, ipso facto, what an election is all about.

[EFerrari]

17. During the MI primary, in 20 counties the vote for uncommitted

were counted as write in. Their system is dirty.

Before we know what voters want, we have to secure their election results. Clinton isn't interested in doing that.

[KAZ]

35. Go beat your dead-horse somewhere else. You're messing up the place.

[buff2]

5. If all the votes can't be counted

then what is the sense in voting? How can we be sure our votes count?

[Blarch]

7. If the supers ignore the votes, then what is the point of voting ?

If Hillary gets her way...ALL the votes will be ignored and the supers will give her the nod.

How fucking thick is your skull ? ...how can the Hillary supporters not understand this ?

Please explain how she wins if Obama has the most votes, most delegates, most states won, most primaries won, most caucuses won ? Lets be honest now.

[maddiejoan]

6. I don't think you understand how it works

If a candidate gets 2025 delegates --then their win for the nomination is a lock.

If a candidate does NOT get them, than their race for the nomination is of course too close to decide simply by pledged primary delegates.

If that is the case --it is now the votes of the super delegates to break what is, in essence, a tie for the nomination.

How hard is that to get?

[LSparkle]

8. What is "in essence, a tie" ... what if a candidate had 2020

or something like that? Would that also be considered a "tie"?

We aren't goig to be facing that situation this year, but I think a lot of
this depends upon how close the end results are. If Obama is still up by 100
delegates when all primaries have concluded, then that really isn't a tie,
and the SDs ought to take that margin into account when they decide whether
to truly "vote their conscience" and potentially overturn the will of the people.

[maddiejoan]

11. Why do you think

there is a number that a primary candidate has to win?

[LSparkle]

15. No, just that calling it a tie isn't accurate -- there will be a difference

and the extent of that difference ought to be considered.

It's the difference between whether SDs just nudge a candidate over the line
or accomplish a coup d'etat.

[maddiejoan]

18. Of course it'll be a consideration

but it won't be the only consideration --nor is it obliged to be --nor, I might add, is it even desirable for it to be.

[Blarch]

19. I will let you in on a little something...

There is no way she can win ...and still respect the will of the people.

And you seem to be fine with this.

[maddiejoan]

20. You forget something important.

There is as much "will of the people" behind Hillary at this point.

The difference in their respective support is minute at best.

[Blarch]

23. Your right.

He only won TWICE as many states ...and his delegate lead is so small that it is almost impossible for her to catch up to him...you do the math.

If it is so close, then why would she have to CRUSH him in all remaining states just to get close ? ...My dog knows the answer, do you ?

[maddiejoan]

27. Using a RW style point are we?

I didn't realize land mass is what elects our Presidents.

The facts are his delegate lead is not enough to make him the nominee without super delegates himself.

By DEFINITION of the Democratic primary process that makes this a statistical tie.

The super delegates are not obliged to follow the rules that Obama would like --they are obliged to follow the rules the DNC has set.

Clearly --you understand the DNC rules as well as your dog.

[Blarch]

16. And the supers should go with the will of the people..

don't you agree ?

Do you think the person with the most delegates and votes and states won should get the nod by the supers ?

Or do you think the supers should go against the will of the people, as if they never went to the polls in the first place ?

[maddiejoan]

22. when the difference is their support is that minute?

you make it sound like Hillary's support is far below Obama's

at this point the difference is teeny weeny.

You can scream will f the people all you like --but Obama's 'lead' is not an indicator of 'will of the people' --it's a narrow advantage.

[Blarch]

26. That is the stupidest thing I have ever read.

"but Obama's 'lead' is not an indicator of 'will of the people' --it's a narrow advantage.
"

He has more votes, more states won, more delegates ...IT IS THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE ...WTF

Hillary supporters have gone fucking crazy ..am I being punked, Ashton, is that you ?

[maddiejoan]

29. Read your own posts

they are far dumber than mine.

The "will of the people" is split between the two nominees.

[Blarch]

36. There is a clear leader at this point.

Do you agree ?

[maddiejoan]

39. No

Obama didn't close.

He didn't get the delegate lead needed to close the deal.

THAT's the point.

Don't like it?

Take it up with Dr. Dean.

[Dawgs]

30. So I guess you were okay with Bush stealing the Prez from Gore, because the lead was 'teeny weeny'.

You're embarrassing yourself... again!! You should really give it up.

[maddiejoan]

32. Quite the opposite

Gore WON the popular vote.

Your contention that the 'will of the people' is represented by a slim delegate lead is Bush's position.

Thank you for proving my point for me.

Hillary will go into the convention with the popular vote.

[Skink]

9. Florida and Michigan might have really influence the primary season had..

they stayed where they were. Interestingly Michigan only moved because NH actually moved up. The plans Dean had were solid moving South Carolina and Nevada. NH should have faced the some sort of penalty for moving up.

[Yossariant]

10. Ya mean like if the superdelegates follow the RULES?!

:rofl:

[Dawgs]

24. Read the OP again.

It's hypocrisy to ask the supers to ignore the votes of the people, when you are also arguing that 'all votes should count'.

[Yossariant]

28. According to the RULES, the superdelegates do not follow the "votes of the people."

Hypocrisy is ignoring one RULE and insisting on the implementation of another RULE -- like Obama and his toons are doing.

[AJH032]

37. my thoughts exactly

This seems to be the average Obama supporter logic: Rule A (don't count count FL/MI) should apply, but Rule B (super delegates decide for themselves) should not apply.

[jgraz]

25. She means "all the votes for ME should count"

[KalicoKitty]

31. Why should my vote for her be wasted?

[maddiejoan]

34. Because

Obama sez so.

:shrug:

[MercutioATC]

40. No, because Michigan knowingly, and after being warned, still CHOSE to break the rules.

If there is blame to be assigned, lay it at the feet of those who caused this...the voters of Michigan (and Florida) who elected the people who CHOSE to defy the party.

We get the government we deserve.

[AJH032]

33. easily rationalize; you would just disagree with the conclusion

Pledged delegates (roughly) represent the will of the voters. Therefore, all votes should be counted and represented via these delegates.

The super delegates, however, are a separate part of the nomination puzzle. They are not bound by any voter. Therefore, it is not a contradiction to say that all votes should be counted (that is, represented through pledged delegates) in addition to letting the super delegates vote how they choose to.

[Skip Intro]

38. Obama called Hillary "bush/cheney lite" early in the campaign, and here we are again.

He was soundly booed at a debate when he compared Hillary to gouliani and romney.

Yet here we are again.

How dare she run against the chosen one? How dare she not step aside and allow the coronation to continue unfettered? What a monster.

And when did Bill and Hillary vow to run "their" campaign as rove would?

Then ther's this little fact about which there seems to be an Obama-group amnesia: the supers will decide the nominee. Neither will have the pledged votes to win the nom. The supers will decide.

How do Obama supporters address the hypocrisy of being all for the system when it trashes the votes of Democrats in two major states, yet don't trust that same system to play out? It's like they fear democracy or something.