Very bad poll news for Obama and the Dems (speech not working per Ras)

[papau]

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2008/03/very_bad_poll_news_for_obama_a.html

March 22, 2008
Very bad poll news for Obama and the Dems
Richard Baehr
The latest news from the Rasmussen Tracking Poll is very encouraging for McCain.

Obama's favorable-unfavorable is 46 to 51, its all time low, demonstrating no ability yet to stanch the bleeding. No wonder they trotted out Bill Richardson with his Fu Man Chu beard.

But here is really evidence of what has happened with white voters:

* Arkansas: McCain leads Clinton 50-43. McCain leads Obama by 59-30.
* Kentucky: McCain leads Clinton 53-43. He destroys Obama 64-28.
* Lower middle income whites have deserted Obama. In one Pennsylvania poll, Clinton now leads Obama by 26. She has now taken the lead from him in North Carolina. Rasmussen national numbers: Clinton 46, Obama 44.
* Head to head general: McCain 49, Obama 41; McCain 49, Clinton 43.


No question that Hillary is the stronger general election candidate. She is more competitive in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida. Obama does better than Hillary in states Dems will lose anyway: Georgia, Wyoming, Kansas, Nebraska.<snip>

[xultar]

1. interasante

[Teaser]

2. Let it sink

.

[xultar]

3. You're opposed to hearing the news? ROFL. Just put the poster on Ignore

if you don't want to read the news.

[roguevalley]

96. two threads up he is winning.

[BeatleBoot]

4. Yeah, it will pass over if we just ignore it

[buff2]

5. OB has already sunk

and he's taking the dems down with him.

[BeatleBoot]

8. Ain't it the truth

[Iceburg]

107. K&R

[Skip Intro]

Oh, just close your eyes and tap your heels together and it will all go away.

:eyes:

[fightthegoodfightnow]

38. Who Has More Delegates?

No clicking your feet will change that.

[Skip Intro]

44. Who has enough delegates?

Yep, can't hope that into existence either, eh?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

49. Certainly Not Clinton

Obama has more delegates than Clinton.

That's the reality you, as a Clinton supporter, can only HOPE for.

[musicblind]

97. i've seen you post this in several threads

It does not MATTER that Obama has more delegates than Clinton if he does not have enough delegates. If a loaf of bread is 1.50 and Obama has 1.25 and Clinton has 1.00 NEITHER has enough money to get the loaf of bread. Now lets say there are is friend of the Obama and Clinton's standing outside the store. He has an extra dollar on him that he doesn't need. He COULD give it to Obama, Obama has more money and needs less, or he COULD give it to Clinton.

You also cannot claim that it will tear apart the party if Clinton wins by supers or that supers wont give her the delegates. The reason being that you do not know the circumstances of the future, nor do I. Clinton COULD narrow the gap of delegates significantly, or Obama could have a major mishap and sink drastically. If the majority of the nation and democrats badly wanted Clinton as the nominee, forever whatever reason, then the supers would probably not see a lot of reprecutions. In fact, polls show that Obama supporters are MORE accepting of Clinton as the nominee than Clinton supporters are of Obama as the nominee.

Personally I believe Obama has this wrapped up, I see a hard up hill fight for Clinton that will take a LOT of luck, and a LOT of things to go JUST her way in order for her to suceed. However, I do not see it as IMPOSSIBLE for Clinton. REGARDLESS. Bragging that you have a 1.25 means nothing, not even bragging rights, when the loaf of bread costs 1.50. You're still going hungry at that point.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

104. At Least You Make a Case Based on Reality

I give you that. But of course, you would do better telling your perspective in response to a Clinton supporter.

[musicblind]

119. Hopefully, deep down inside, most Clinton supporters like myself know the truth.

I would hope they are not ENTIRELY delusional and REALLY think that she has this wrapped up. I wouldn't say she has a 10% chance of winning. But it's probably no greater than a 20% chance. 25% percent MAYBE. Even though Joe Trippi claimed 30% I felt like he was over estimating. However, if you really think you are the best one to run the country, and you feel strong enough that Health Care should be mandated or that your particular policy differences are the best. If you felt like you honestly could get us out of Iraq the cleanest and fastest way... then I don't think a candidate should drop out if they have a one in four, one in five, or even one in ten shot of doing what they think is best for the country. The main difference is that each of us feel a different person would be best for the country. Though, please know, that I strongly disagree with anyone who thinks Barack Obama would be BAD for the country. He wouldn't. I think that the Clinton machine as a whole will be more experienced and prepared for the White House on day one, but I also believe that Obama will appoint skilled, experienced, and knowledgable advisors to provide any experience he feels he needs. He is going to make an outstanding president if elected. I wish that people could support one candidate and still respect, if not the other candidate, then that candidate's supporters. No one here should hate another democrat. We are all in this together. We are going to save the world this november. I also agree with you that I wish Hillary had never ever ever said what she said about John McCain. Even if she feels it, I personally have respect for McCain because of his time serving his country, but she should know better. (I am not voting for McCain btw. Respecting someone does not mean you need to support that person or agree with them.) I am not above making a critical point of the person I support if I believe it is true. Overall though, I still perfer her for a variety of reasons. None of those are saying Obama would make a bad president, he has a lot of positives about him as well. IMO.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

120. We are going to save the world this november.

Your optimism suggests you are a closet Obama supporter. :) Ok.... just kidding.

I'm very disappointed in the type of campaign Hillary Clinton has run. It panders to the worse in our political process and stands in sharp contrast to Obama.

I've gone from a strong Clinton supporter, to a weak Clinton supporter, to a weak Obama supporter to a strong Obama supporter. I fear that the longer this goes on the less likely I am going to be able to support Clinton should she win the nomination. Experience is nothing if it means more of the status quo and quite frankly, that is what Hillary Clinton represents to me.

[GoldieAZ49]

90. you do realize those delegates do not transfer to the GE

[fightthegoodfightnow]

101. Meaning YOU Don't Care

........ what Democratic candidate has more delegates. Apparently, the majority of Democratic delegates disagree with you.

[GoldieAZ49]

111. we won't know that until they vote, pledged and supers can vote anyway they want

so until a vote is cast no one knows if they agree or not

[TahitiNut]

117. Oh? So, when will the house fall on Hillary?

:rofl:

[Life Long Dem]

116. It's meaningless. All the polls in the world won't pull Hillary out of this.

[Nitrogenica]

6. Sorry Paupau.

Bye.

See you in a few months.

[BeatleBoot]

15. Another Ignore?

Too funny.

[cbayer]

41. He now occupies my ignore zone. And he is the ONLY one there.

I am announcing this because I am so sick to death of this person announcing that he is ignoring everyone.

He reminds me of Bush. Only hears what he agrees with.

Good riddance.

[musicblind]

98. I think there should be a RULE that you're not allowed to tell someone if you ignore them

I know you're not allowed to tell someone if you used the alert button. Maybe there is such a rule about the "ignore" feature and everyone ignores it. It seems to me that it would fall under "calling that person out infront of everyone." Dunno.


But you are right. I can hardly read a thread without that guy showing up to tell everyone posting that they have been put on ignore. Becomes meaningless after a while.

[Hepburn]

113. IMO, I think it is appropriate to tell someone they are being put on ignore...

...so they do not waste their time responding in that their posts cannot be seen.

[musicblind]

115. Hmm. I didn't quite think of it that way. I know I saw a post a little while back

where someone requested that DU start a program to notify people via email if someone ignored them. Maybe that would be best. I just worry that some people use it to "get back" at posters they disagree with. I agree a lot of posters say REALLY inappropriate stuff, I just don't ignore people because I fear that at some point that poster MIGHT say something worth hearing and then I would have been ignorant to that information. You never know. Hopefully this will all end well and everything work out soon.

[emilyg]

71. Who the heck cares. Ego trip for you?

[musicblind]

99. You do seem to show up in nearly every thread I read and put people on ignore

Maybe you should do so less often. When you do it all the time it becomes meaningless and tends to say more about YOU than posters you have put on ignore.

Plus, I know I saw a mod post that you can't inform someone that you hit the "alert" button. I do NOT know if that applies to telling someone that you used the ignore button.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

7. VERY BAD NEWS FOR CLINTON

Obama has more delegates.

[LisaL]

9. What's the point of winning the battle, but losing the war?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

18. Good Point

Vote for Obama.

[musicblind]

100. Good analogy. Also check out my bread analogy.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5215541&mesg_id=5218217


:)

[buff2]

10. Not enough to take the nomination

:thumbsup:

[fightthegoodfightnow]

17. That's Right - Clinton Does NOT Have Enough for the Nomination

Get it?

Clinton will never win the nomination without CHANGING party rules to give her Florida and Michigan.

Pathetic and a play right out of the Karl Rove playbook on American politics.

Had enough America?

[buff2]

20. Haven't you had enough

[fightthegoodfightnow]

26. Swallow

Swallow your own bile as you choke America.

:sarcasm:

Don't you just hate those who believe in their candidates?

[rug]

14. The Titanic had more napkins.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

21. Irrelevant

........... but if you are a Walt Whitman supporter, consider this:

Would WW support DOMA or "Don't Ask, Don't Tell'

Not.

[rug]

23. Walt Whitman?! BWAAAHAAA!

[fightthegoodfightnow]

31. Whatever

Take a pill.

Obama will make sure you have the health care to do so even if Clinton failed to.

[cbayer]

46. Uh, that's Marx.

Making assumptions without data can really be telling at times.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

48. Huh?

What did Hillary Clinton's 'experience' do to end the war in Iraq, end "DOMA" or end "Don't Ask, Don't Tell'?

Nothing.

[cbayer]

53. I'll say this for you.

You are passionate and have your talking points down.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

57. Passion and Points are a Good Combination

Thanks.

[OzarkDem]

11. Obama would rather see McCain win

nothing new about that.

[Yael]

16. Yup. He has been saying that all along.

:freak:

[buff2]

19. BO needs to get the hell out NOW

before he does more damage to our party.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

36. Clinton needs to get the hell out NOW

before she does more damage to our party.

The only person who is a uniter rather than a divider is Barrack Obama.

[Seeker30]

87. Completely agree

[Iceburg]

109. Yes he does! /nt

[gristy]

35. Do you have any statements of his that convey or imply this?

Could you post them please?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

42. What a CROCK of .................. SH*T !!!

More fear mongering from another Clinton supporter.

[Speck Tater]

12. OMG!!!!!!!!! Say it isn't so!

Oh, wait. Five minutes from now someone else will post a poll with the opposite outcome.

Newton's Law. For every poll there is another equal and opposite poll.

[Thepricebreaker]

95. Actually lately most polls have been bad vs McCain.. all the fighting...

[grantcart]

13. You have no shame

The American Thinker is a daily Conservative internet publication with articles on the topics of national security, economics, diplomacy, culture, and military strategy.<1> The articles published are often mentioned on The Rush Limbaugh Show. The site frequently endorses conservative commentators such as Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh

[buff2]

22. You seem to know enough about it all

Just sayin....

[grantcart]

68. 10 seconds and I got it from wikipedia - I had never heard of 'Thinker' before

But I learned my lesson before when I posted from a couple of sources that I wasn't familiar with. One thing I learned about DU is that there are lots of well read folks here and if you quote from far right sources they are going to give a long historical dissection. But your reply obvious implies that you also think it is a shameful source

just sayin . .

[gristy]

29. Ah, thank you. I had asked the very question you have answered.

[papau]

70. The Ras data is as stated - Obama censorship on progressive sites hide this

[undeterred]

24. aaaarrkkannsssaass? and knnttkkyy?

Like they were gonna vote for Obama anyway?

Hillary has already lost.

[Milo_Bloom]

25. So Clinton would lose her home state by 13 points?

OUCH!

Obama is clearly the only choice.

[gristy]

27. Who is this so-called "american thinker"

A Quinnipiac University poll released 3/18 shows Sen. Hillary Clinton leads Illinois Sen. Barack Obama 53 - 41 percent among likely primary voters. You report "one Pennsylvania poll" shows Clinton leads Obama by 26. Care to let us know what that "one Pennsylvania poll" is?

In other Quinnipiac polls, Clinton lead by 16 on 2/14 but only by 6 on 2/27.

[ingac70]

28. Kansas is in play...

Lots of Boeing workers and friends and family PO'd at McCain over Airbus getting that tanker contract.

[Aussie leftie]

30. Why did Bill Richardson endorse Barack Obama

When the people that he claims to represent endorsed Hillary Clinton.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

33. Integrity

Just a thought.

[Aussie leftie]

45. Are you saying that Bill Richardson has integrity?

I was intrigued by the irony of the fact that he betrayed the Clintons on the anniversary that Judas betrayed Jesus.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

47. I Wouldn't Know About That

I'm not sure I can imagine Clinton forgiving Richardson.

That would require a Christian heart.

[Aussie leftie]

54. why does she need to forgive him?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

56. You're Right

Screw party unity.

Every man and woman for themselves.

That's certainly the Clinton mantra.

Bill Richardson is right: Obama rocks.

[Aussie leftie]

60. Party Unity

Is that the name of a new political party?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

61. No

Just something Barrack Obama hopes for and Hillary Clinton will never be able to because she is hopeless.

[Aussie leftie]

64. that is not a fair statement to make

remember, they are both politicians

[fightthegoodfightnow]

67. One Panders to People's Hopes and Another Panders to People's Fears

Who has a trademark on what?

Each political candidate has made a decision on their copyright.

Which one is yours?

[Aussie leftie]

69. there is more pandering going on than pandering for hopes and fears

I think a combination of the two candidates would be ideal. I personally prefer the lady and you prefer the man. I thought it was wonderful when Obama won his senate seat in the half term elections. From what I had read at the time, he was showing a lot of promise (and still does). Looking from outside the square to me it seems that he needs to finish the term for the position he was elected for. I think he started reading his own publicity and got carried away. He will have many opportunities in the future to run, but unfortunately, I can only see the Dems losing now in the general election if he wins the nomination. I think he has already peaked. I hope I'm wrong.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

72. Nonsense

You write: ' I personally prefer the lady and you prefer the man.'

I never thought about it like that. I prefer the best candidate.

You write: 'He will have many opportunities in the future to run, but unfortunately, I can only see the Dems losing now in the general election if he wins the nomination."

Based on what? I've seen nothing from either his Senate experience or his life experience to suggest he will lose particularly since he is beating your candidate now.

I would rather have a candidate that panders to the Democratic party than one who panders to the GOP, but that's just me.

[Aussie leftie]

80. you are starting to get very pedantic

"I prefer the lady and you prefer the man". Obviously, I think the lady is the better candidate.
Secondly. I think if he runs now, he will be beaten. In my opinion, he is still inexperienced and the American public would be very wary of "inexperience" since the George Bush fiasco. Where you ask what I base my opinion on, it seems the polls are starting to get a bit shaky.

I personally feel that Hillary Clinton has a better chance of winning over the "disallusioned republican" vote.

May I say though, that it is a pleasant change to have this debate with someone who isn't spewing venom all over the keyboard.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

82. Coming from the Campaign that *IS* getting Beaten

........ that's funny.

[Aussie leftie]

84. I hope you are right and I am wrong

because the whole would is depending on the American voters to get rid of the EVIL Republican Party in November.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

85. I Suspect that Both Clinton and Obama Voters

......... will lose sight of that given the current escalating war of words.

For my part, I am beginning to question whether or not it's worth it.

Personally, some of the Clinton tactics are, in my opinion, right out of the Karl Rove playbook and I just want to barf.

I suspect you will vote for Obama before I will vote for Clinton.

I didn't always feel this way, but what Clinton has found herself needing to do to win the nomination is enough to completely turn me off.

Let's hope I can rise above Clinton although quite frankly, I don't see much of a difference between McCain and Clinton.

[Aussie leftie]

86. Unfortunately, I cant vote in your election

however, I worked very hard to oust Howard in the last Federal election we had in Australia. I am secretary of a local branch of the Labor party and worked hard during that campaign. I am a political junkie and just love following American politics. John Edwards was my first choice and I was so disappointed when he was forced to drop out. Maybe he may come back in 2012.

Hopefully, if Obama is nominated, he will be able to withstand all that the repugs are going to throw at him. Anyway, at the moment, I'm in heaven. I just love an election campaign.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

103. Agree

I hope so as well.

[Aussie leftie]

65. that is not a fair statement to make

remember, they are both politicians

[Mooney]

110. HA HA HA HA (etc)

So Hillary Clinton is Christ? That is FUNNY FUCKING SHIT. Will she be rising from the dead today? Did she do any transubstantiating lately?

The Judas/Richardson analogy has got to be the downright stupidest, most melodramatic horseshit to come out of this abortion of a primary season. It just goes to show what an narcissistic view of themselves the Clintons and their loathsome surrogates have.

It's really the last days in the bunker. Hopefully the Russians will break through the front lines soon and put us all out of our misery.

[emilyg]

74. Self-interest.

[TheWatcher187]

59. Because she is done

Stick a fork in her

[GreenTea]

76. No.

Keep watching!

PA in a month, and then we'll know for sure.

[Seeker30]

88. Richardson sold out to the highest bidder

Fuck him.

[Hepburn]

114. What people that Richardson represents "endorsed" Hillary?

What the hell are you talking about?

[LaPera]

32. Hillary and the "big" states.....

HILLARY TAKING CALIFORNIA, NEW YORK, FLORIDA, OHIO, MICHIGAN. NEW JERSEY & TEXAS (AND IF PENNSLYVANIA) IN THE PRIMARIES.... AND SHE WOULD TAKE MA IN THE GENERAL ELECTION, SHE WOULD THEN WOULD ONLY HAVE TO TAKE WI....(ALONG WITH A FEW SMALLER STATES, HI & VT AND THE "LEFT COAST" OR & WA) VERY IMPRESSIVE!

BUT, WE KNOW THE REPUBLICANS WILL STEAL OR TAKE TX, FL & OH, ALONG WITH THE SOUTH AND ALL THE RED STATES AND THEY WILL TAKE AK, THEN ALL THE REPUBLICANS WOULD HAVE TO DO IS TAKE OR STEAL PA, NJ AND WI IN THE GENERAL ELECTION - THAT WOULD KEEP IT CLOSE ENOUGH FOR THE REPUBLICANS TO STEAL THE PRESIDENCY.

ALSO, THE SMALLER SOUTH-WEST, HOME STATE ARIZONA WILL WILL GO TO McCAIN, AND NEW MEXICO, THE REPUBLICANS HAVE SHOWN THEY CAN STEAL IT.

[gristy]

40. wow, I started to respond, but now have decided to

slowly back away....

[LaPera]

50. Not sure what you mean?

Just my thoughts....

[gristy]

55. Ok - glad to have the volume turned down...

Paragraph 1: Are you talking primary or GE here? I keep rereading and keep coming to a different answer. Clinton's successes in the primaries do not map into success in the GE. You speak of the two elections as being equivalent on a state-by-state basis.

I am pretty confused by the 2nd paragraph too.

[LaPera]

63. Usually, most of the "big".......

industrial states that Clinton won in the primaries go with the Dems in the general election.

I'm mostly talking about the general election, but also referring to the "big" states Hillary was able to take in the primaries (along with the more smaller liberal states like, HI, VT, OR & WA that she would probably win in the general election).

But, just as important is how the republicans will keep it close enough to steal with their electronic voting machines, voter purging, etc....which they have had years (and have been working on) to steal....and they will give it their best shot, they got the Dem candidates they wanted to use and smear with their powerful media machine to keep the general election close, and close, is ALL the republicans want and need to steal it.

[xultar]

34. x

[Az_lefty]

37. poll this poll that...let the voting begin

the Rasmussen Tracking Poll has, in the past, been very accurate and totally off the mark. Obama is the only candidate left in the race with any integrity. I would no more vote for Hillary Clinton than I would for McCain. Thier both bust cronies and will do their level best to cover up for the crimes of the bush White House...just like Bubba. Your opinion may vary, but that's where I stand.
Have a nice Saturday night...

[Thickasabrick]

39. Why do we get all worked up? We haven't seen her tax returns

yet...or McCain's. Patience grasshoppers.

[FyurFly]

43. He is unelectable...

Joe Sixpack will never vote for Obama.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

51. Pandering to Race are You?

Joe Sixpack is not America.

[gristy]

52. I believe Joe Sixpack has already been voting in droves for Obama

You'll need to clarify and back up your statement, I'm afraid.

[jackson_dem]

66. No. His economic base is the most affluent voters

His worst groups are the poor and working folks,

[TheWatcher187]

58. Hillary does well in all the states Obama will easily carry in the GE

That argument works both ways don't kid yourself Obama is the only one of the two that has a chance to turn some reds to blue, Hillary is done anyway

[gristy]

62. Welcome to DU!

:hi: Be sure to visit some of the other forums too (GD, LBN, The Lounge). GDP is a dangerous place.

[BlueJac]

73. You are so funny.........

Get on the Obama train and give it up. We must unite behind the candidate.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

75. get on up there girl!

[PerfectSage]

78. What no sigline picture? Try this toesucker. OMG you're gonna drink the kool aid soon?

Get the toesucker reference now. Sailed over my head. 1996 is so before my time.


GObama!
Go Dean's 50 State Strategy!
Go Grassroots!

[ElsewheresDaughter]

83. tsk tsk and you with a Dali LLama avatar....sometimes karma sucks

be nice

[PerfectSage]

89. tsk tsk, How come I don't guilty? Try harder.

Be nice? But that's beta male loser advice that Bill never listened to?
The Dalai Lama is the emobodiment of compassion. Unfortunetly, I'm only at the compasionate, smartass embodiment stage.

[JRH_Mom]

77. Hmmm

Does anyone here wonder why this is happening? I've always said that there's nothing we can do to change anything. I wanted to believe, but there is to much $$$$$$ behind running this country to ever let ANYONE who gives a damn about the people in....it sucks, it sucks bigtime and I have a daughter I have to worry about growing up in a world that's getting scarier and scarier.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

81. If Fear is Your Thing....... then ...........

......... Bush ......... whoops........... I mean Clinton.......... is your candidate.

[wisteria]

79. I heard and read just the opposite and polls mean very little at this point.

Especially since McCain has been virtually unreported this week and many of the Clinton distortions have not been given much press.

[VotesForWomen]

91. correct analysis. nt

[maximusveritas]

92. Who is recommending this piece of crap OP?

It's just repeating a RW blog's BS spin of some Republican pollster's BS poll. Since when is that crap recommended here?

[Hoof Hearted]

93. Clinton leads in North Carolina. He is toasted.

[Blondbostonian]

102. Obama and Clinton are even in NC

He's hardly toast. I expect him to win NC by at least 4-5 points.

[LulaMay]

94. Thanks for the dose of reality.

[Blondbostonian]

105. Here's some reality for you

How do you think Obama supporters will accept their candidate losing if he has more delegates, votes and states won?

It will tear the party apart. That is a guarantee of victory for McCain.

[onenote]

106. if you are concerned about electability, why post a poll that shows HRC

has higher unfavorables than Obama and her unfavorables increased by even more than Obama's over the polling period? Just curious why this supposed "bad news" for Obama isn't even worse news for HRC?

[marshall]

108. Plan B--Hillary! in 2012, this is the groundwork

Hillary knows she has lost the nomination, now the next phase begins.

[Hepburn]

112. Why are you posting some bullshit from a piece of conservative trash?

You know...the old adage: You are what you post.

Are you also on the bandwagon in regard to their support for teaching Intelligent Design in the public schools? If you think trash from this POS organization is credible, then maybe you do not belong on the DU.

[Honeycombe8]

118. Not time for polls to reflect speech. We need to see what they are next wk. That'll tell us. nt