TYT: Is Hillary Positioning for 2012?

[ihavenobias]

(As usual, the following is only an excerpt, NOT the entire article. Please click the Huffington Post link for the entire piece. Not only will you get the full context, but it's easier to read at HP and the article includes hyperlinks.)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cenk-uygur/is-hillary-positioning-fo_b_92904.html

Is Hillary Positioning for 2012?
By Cenk Uygur

The Politico laid it out very clearly yesterday - and solidified what we've known for weeks - this race is over. Obama has the nomination.

Even Hillary Clinton's own campaign admits it! Politico reports, "One important Clinton adviser estimated to Politico privately that she has no more than a 10 percent chance of winning her race against Barack Obama, an appraisal that was echoed by other operatives. In other words: The notion of the Democratic contest being a dramatic cliffhanger is a game of make-believe."

It's somewhat hilarious to watch the media eat up the campaign spin on the record, that she's got a great shot to win this and win the Presidency. Of course, the race gets a whole lot more boring with lower ratings when it's Obama vs. McCain, probably with a huge lull in the campaign, where - God forbid - the news media will actually have to go out and find and report news, and not just campaign talking points sent to them.

I've been trying to figure out for weeks why Hillary Clinton is still in this campaign because the math has been obvious for quite some time now. Even Mitt Romney had the - what would you call it, decency, wisdom, common sense - to drop out after he realized it was mathematically impossible (or next to impossible) for him to win.

There is one possibility as to why Senator Clinton might still be in this race, inflicting heavy damage on the presumptive Democratic nominee. That reason is Hillary 2012.

Now that's a heavy charge. I can't read her mind, so I don't know what her true intentions are. We can only judge based on her actions. Her staff understands and agrees that she has a very, very small chance of winning, but she is still willing to go after front-runner of her own party in the strongest possible words.

Look at what she has said about the man she privately believes will be the Democratic nominee for President:

He has not crossed the "Commander in Chief threshold" like John McCain has.

He cannot be trusted to answer the phone at 3am.

His only experience is a speech from 2002.

That he is disenfranchising voters in Michigan and Florida (even though she agreed to the same rules he did when those states stepped out of line in the primary process).

And, as Bill Clinton intimated yesterday, he doesn't love our country, like Hillary and McCain do.

Those are some serious blows against someone in your own party and might seriously hurt his chances of winning the general election. In fact, every day that Senator Clinton stays in the race is another day she spends money damaging Senator Obama. And every dollar she spends is a dollar in John McCain's pocket.

It almost makes you ask - does she want him to lose?...(For Cenk's answer to this question, please click here: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cenk-uygur/is-hillary-positioning-fo_b_92904.html)

[splat]

1. This is somebody's pretension of omniscience, but he doesn't know either

Don't begrudge him the paycheck he gets for writing this, but he hasn't peeked into the future to see how it actually all comes out.

Everybody's story lines is just speculation, bent more or less to fit the candidates they like.

(Does he really think she wants to go through all this twice, and at 64?)

[ihavenobias]

7. I'm assuming you not only didn't read the article, but you didn't even read the entire excerpt

If you had, I doubt you'd have made that same comment. You clearly didn't see this (***emphasis mine):

"Now that's a heavy charge. ***I can't read her mind, so I don't know what her true intentions are. We can only judge based on her actions***. Her staff understands and agrees that she has a very, very small chance of winning, but she is still willing to go after front-runner of her own party in the strongest possible words."

[splat]

10. I read it; unless he's omniscient, none of this will affect the outcome

History is not a straight line.

[ihavenobias]

12. :( guess I will no longer read his articles. I didn't know he wasn't omniscient!

I hope he's at least omnipresent? I mean, if he's not, is there even a point to reading his articles??

[splat]

14. He's getting paid to write something he's probably not present today, being Easter

You can find a voice for every slice of the info spectrum. They aren't all gonna be right. Read if you like to spend your time that way, but next week, they may be reacting to some other watershed moment.

[ihavenobias]

17. What's with your weak "he's getting paid" angle?

If you want to talk about suspect reading of motives, I'd start with your own questionable analysis.

[Cha]

21. That poster doesn't use

logic only knee jerk hilary attacks..ad infinitum.

[ihavenobias]

31. Thanks for the heads up on that so I don't waste my time n/t

[PatGund]

2. Personally??

I suspect this is more true than I would like it to be.

[rpannier]

3. Doubt it

She's not a stupid person.

4 years ago, Barak Obama was not even a person of interest, much less a major player in discussions on who the Democratic nominee would be.
In fact, it appears that most people felt he got a free-ride into the Senate courtsey of running against Alan Keyes.

However, 4 years later here we are and she is locked in a struggle with Sen Obama. A struggle she is losing.
If she loses (and it appears she will) and then he loses in the GE, she will have a cadre of core Democrats that will blame her for the loss and will never vote for her.

In addition, four years from now, there will most likely be a new group of Democratic politicians that will run for the WH (should Obama lose or stumble badly if elected).
She will be fighting not only them, but the perception that she screwed the Party for the sake of her own ambitions.

This conspiracy sh*t put forth by people is rather tiresome.
She knows this is pretty much her only shot.

[ihavenobias]

8. She's intelligent yes, but also incredibly short sighted

She's employing tactics that are not only damaging to the likely Democratic nominee (Obama) making him less likely to win in November (which is why the idea behind the article can't be dismissed as "conspiracy"), but they're also damaging to her in the long run.

Really, she's going to make experience and foreign policy know-how the central argument of the campaign? Against McCain? Not to mention McCain already has tons of material for devastating commercials which will use Hillary and Bill's own words and images against her (i.e. McCain is so experienced, McCain loves his country, etc.).

Again, incredibly short sighted...just a downright terrible idea, in every sense of the word.

[Cha]

23. "Intelligence" is as intelligence does and

miss lyin' hilary hasn't done an intelligent thing since this campaign started and way back to Oct 2002 when she didn't read the 90 page NIE report before she gave the vote for bushit's War On Iraq.

Obama is the intelligent one. And I know you know..I'm just through replying to certain posts that aren't dealing in reality.

[Divernan]

15. She's a spoiler - if she can't have it, she'll punish all the Dems who beat her.

I think in her twisted, delusional way of thinking - and her inability to give up on her dream, she is quite capable of kidding herself that she could run again in '12. But even if she didn't hang on to that impossible dream, she would be so furious at losing that she'd really enjoy destroying Obama.
As has been said, "The Clintons are always there when they need you." In other words, they are not there for their country, or for their party - but only for themselves.

[Yael]

4. I don't doubt this for a minute.

[Johnny__Motown]

5. Yes, I see no other reasonable explanation of her "endorsement" of McCain and her continued slander

of Sen. Obama

[mw]

6. Yep. Hillary would rather kick the board than let Obama win.

That's what it looks like, anyway.

Hillary's best chance to be President is to get McCain elected now, and then run again in 4 years. That's a fact.

What we can't know is if Hillary has decided to take that path. By her recent actions, I'd say yes.

[mkultra]

9. she has a better shot at 2016

[Johnny__Motown]

11. I doubt it, if Obama wins then the VP will have the best shot at 2016

[mkultra]

18. good point

[OhioChick]

13. Judging How She's Run Her Campaign Thus Far....

I would not doubt it.

[grantcart]

16. I used to think so when I thought they were getting a lot of campaign contributions

but don't think so now.

[still_one]

19. After what has happened in this campaign, if she doesn't get the nomination

there is no way she will have the opportunity again

The same thing probably applies to Obama also

[Cha]

20. Thanks, ihavenobias..Excellent analysis as usual byTYT..

]b]"Is she that cynical? Does she care that little about her own party or her own principles?"

Name one "principle" that hilary clinton has?

[Onlooker]

22. I think Hillary needs a loss before she steps down

She probably has a lot of powerful backers who are pissed off at the situation. I think after her next loss she'll concede, and might even do so if PA is close. I suspect the decision is not all hers at this point.

[better tomorrow]

24. 2012....the end of the Mayan calendar.....

Why did the ancient Mayan or pre-Maya choose December 21st, 2012 A.D., as the end of their Long Count calendar?

Because Hillary was running for President and won....:rofl:

[Tom Rinaldo]

25. What a foolish spin

Even if one accepts that Clinton's chance to win the nomination is as low as ten percent, that is more than high enough to justify staying in the race at least until she finds out how well she does in PA. A 9 to 1 odds horse wins at virtually every race track in America on every single day. Hillary Clinton has half the Democrats in America supporting her for President. Many people outside of her inner circle have sweat blood for her and have a great deal of personal energy invested in wanting to see her become President. Hundreds of thousands of people have donated hard earned money to her campaign and they don't want to see her quit while there is a real chance, long shot as it may be, to win the nomination.

Millions of Democrats haven't gotten a chance to vote yet, and anything can happen in politics in a matter of several weeks that could change the momentum of this race and political perceptions about the wisdom of nominating Barack Obama president. Hillary Clinton is absolutely correct to remain in the race after winning the popular vote in three out of the last four primaries while polling strongly in the next one also.

It obviously has become the new Obama campaign strategy to orchestrate a message that Hillary can't win after Obama failed to beat her in the last round of primaries.

[Bullet1987]

26. I've been saying for a while that I think this is part of her "kitchen sink"

strategy. It's very sad really.

[better tomorrow]

27. The scariest thing is that......

if she runs in 2012, and Jeb Bush runs in 2012 (remember, Barbara Bush calls him number 45) then we will have a Bush running against a Clinton.....and that WOULD be the end of the world!!!!!

[Ian_rd]

28. I know, I know, I'm reposting this

But I worked hard on it! Waaaa!

[navarth]

29. I personally don't want to believe that she would do something so dastardly

but I'm unable to overlook the 'endorsement' of McLame and the bad stuff she's throwing at Obama.

I suspect she will drop out soon. I'm hoping she will repair any damage she's done. Perhaps it's 'just politics' and after Obama is confirmed as the candidate she can fix things up? One can hope.

I'm completely willing to have her 'un-disappoint' me.....but as usual, Cenk makes an excellent argument.

my 2 cents

k&r

[Eurobabe]

30. I'd believe it, otherwise she would exit gracefully n/t

[angie_love]

32. Hes saying out loud what many of us Obama supporters know in our hearts already

And it is what he said: UNFORGIVEABLE.

[karynnj]

33. I doubt it could be 2012 - it could be the Clinton wing retaining control of the party

The things they are doing will not be forgotten by 2012, especially if Obama loses. I assume they will attempt to keep Obama from being perceived as a party leader as the semi-successfully did with both Gore and Kerry. The question is whether they can maintain their control over the party when many may feel that they destroyed the chances of the party to win once they lost. If they are able to keep control of the party - my guess they give HRC the Senate Majority slot and run someone, young, untarnished and controllable in 2012, thus retaining some power.

[CherylK]

34. It is hard to read her mind but what other explanation is there?! n/t