Hillary's "secret" strategy is to win the popular vote.

[kentuck]

That is why FL and MI are so important for her. The only way she will have any credibility or legitimacy is if she wins the popular vote. It is almost a certainty that she will not win the most delegates. However, if she is very close in the popular vote when all the primaries are over, she can stake claim to being the popular favorite of the people. Obama will say that it is all about who get the most delegates.

But, much depends on the next 3 primaries. If she loses the overall popular vote in PA, NC, and IN, then she will seriously consider her options. Without the popular vote, she will only be running a quixotic campaign with no credible way of winning. This would have to be the only strategy that the campaign is presently running on - win the popular vote and convince the Super Delegates that the people want Hillary. The voter turnout in PA and NC will be very, very important.

[greguganus]

1. Popular votes are easier to steal. n/t

[lumberjack_jeff]

3. Right. Unlike caucuses. n/t

[KittyWampus]

2. there is NO SUCH THING as a "popular vote" in a Primary that includes caucuses

any DU'er who even posts about the "popular vote" displays a willful ignorance.

[kentuck]

4. And the same might be argued in regards to FL and MI...

We cannot count the popular vote in a state where the candidates were not able to campaign or where some were not even on the ballot.

[SoFlaJet]

6. and.........

all the fake concern about "disenfranchising" us Floridians (who I can only speak for, as one) I can tell you guys this; We aren't worried whether or not our asshole delegates are seated at the convention or not because we WILL be voting in HUGE numbers in November, regardless-for Obama-at least in this household.

[kentuck]

8. Florida is mostly a political pawn at the moment...

I agree.

[HereSince1628]

9. I don't know about willful but pointing out what goes into a vote count

certainly should reduce the ignorance.

[BumRushDaShow]

5. This contest is to select a candidate

The selection is based on delegates. Period.

She has lost. Time for her to concede and let's move on to fight McCain.

[kentuck]

7. That is exactly the argument of Obama supporters.

However, these same folks thought Al Gore should have been President in 2000 because he won the popular vote. The popular vote still holds a lot of sway within the Democratic Party. That is why it is important for Obama to win the popular vote and the most delegates. Only then will Hillary give up the ghost.

[wileedog]

15. Apples and oranges

If Florida swings the other way, Gore WINS the Electoral College vote. The argument was that because the FL election was a complete mess, then perhaps it was valid to look at the next yardstick down, which was popular vote. If Bush had in fact been winning the Electoral College by 160+ then this Gore popular vote logic would have been completely moot.

There is no valid argument for turning over a legitimate and large Pledged Delegate vote count on the basis of popular vote, unless the rules are changed before the contest.

None.

[dansolo]

18. Which same folks are you talking about?

If Gore had lost Florida by 100000 votes, he would have still won the popular vote, but no one would have argued that he deserved to be president. But there was clear evidence that illegal voter disenfranchisement that was orders of magnitude greater than the margin of victory. That is why I believe that Gore really won the election, not because he was the popular vote winner.

[kentuck]

20. Many, including myself, believe that Gore won popular vote in FL

that Bush and Gang stole enough votes to make it close and then refused to have all the votes counted and then appealed it to the Supreme Court, who had no business whatsoever trying to determine who voted and who did not vote in the state of Florida.

[shraby]

10. She can't make that claim without considering

the popular votes from caucuses. If she doesn't consider them, she is disenfranchising another bunch of states.

[kentuck]

13. Aren't those votes counted in the popular vote?

Isn't that how they determine the number of delegates to each candidate??

[freesqueeze]

11. FL and MI are a done deal

Continued discussion in that area on the part of the Clinton Camp is pure obfuscation.

[kentuck]

12. But...

If Hillary is behind by 200,000 votes at the end, she will say that her votes in FL should be counted and that would give her the majority of the popular vote. The popular vote should not be so readily dismissed. That is why it is important for Obama to continue to win the popular vote also. That is the only card that Hillary has left.

[loveangelc]

17. You really think Hillary will close a 700,000 vote win in PA to 200,000???

bc she probably won't win NC.

[kentuck]

21. Are you counting FL and MI??

I think Hillary had about a 300,000 vote majority in FL??

[loveangelc]

24. no, bc I don't think he leaders and those over the convention will allow them to be counted

until there is a nominee.

this isnt going to the convention.

[wileedog]

19. Everyone be careful

We're moving the goal posts again. Watch yer heads.

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[loveangelc]

16. ...What if she wins Pa and loses Nc?

everyone knows she's going to win pennsylvania.

north carolina and indiana may just be the final showdown.

[kentuck]

22. My point is that Hillary thinks she may win the overall popular vote..

when all is said and done, if FL and MI are counted? She will then argue before the Convention that she won the majority of votes and should be the nominee? She would argue that the caucuses shold not carry as much weight as the popular vote. I think Obama understands where she is headed with this. If he can continue to beat her in the popular vote, she will have no legitimate claim. I think she understands that point as well. She wants the popular vote....bad.

[JayFredMuggs]

23. You mean she wants to count Michigan because.....

She was on the ballot and Obama wasn't?

Gee how CONVEEEENIENT!!!! Isn't THAT SPECIAL!!!

[kentuck]

25. Doesn't hurt to try, huh?

She says they didn't have to take their names off the MI ballot? And the FL primary was right after Obama had won his big victory in SC. He was on a roll. Everybody knew about him and his name was on the ballot in Florida, as was john Edwards, and Hillary won by a large margin anyway. Personally, I think Hillary has a better argument with Florida than with Michigan.