Obama's Non-Qualities Continue to Capture Voters

[NanceGreggs]

After reading the many posts about how Obama is just “a bunch of pretty words” with no substance, and how his supporters continually bash Hillary because they simply can’t come up with anything positive to say about Obama, I thought I’d conduct a little survey of my own to see how that theory holds up.

Guess what, people? The Hill supporters are right. The question posed was: “Why do you support warm-and-fuzzy-speeches Obama when Hillary is so obviously the superior candidate?”

Here’s a random sampling of those I spoke to:

“Obama is talking about pulling the troops out of Iraq, ways to provide health insurance for more citizens, making college more affordable – gee, the list goes on and on. I’d have to say it’s his non-position on these issues that finally won me over.”

“I’m a little disappointed that despite being an exceptionally articulate speaker, he couldn’t come up with a really riveting tale about running for cover in the midst of sniper-fire in Bosnia. But that aside, he’s got my vote.”

“I think it’s his non-stance on the fact that the war in Iraq is illegal, immoral, and should never have been started in the first place. I appreciate his total silence on the topic.”

“His incredible ability to not encourage hope and optimism, along with not taking issue with the highly successful status-quo way of running the government, was a real eye-opener. This is just the kind of non-committal fence-sitter we need in the White House.”

“For me, it was the way he refused to take a stand when Reverend Wright was being vilified. I don’t know about the rest of the country, but that kind of ducking an issue spoke volumes about his inability to take a strong position in the face of opposition. The minute he chose to slink off with his tail between his legs rather than address the controversy, I knew we had a timid, weak-kneed winner on our hands!”

“More than anything else, it’s his stubborn refusal to point to the disastrous situation we find ourselves in as the obvious result of eight years of Bush’s failed policies – all of the times he has done so notwithstanding.”

“Not being willing to answer questions from regular American voters – yeah, that’s what did it for me. The way he stays aloof, adamantly refuses to get out there and talk to regular folk about their worries and woes – well, I’m not ashamed to admit it. This is just the kind of lack of substance I’ve been prayin’ for.”

“Well, truth be told, Obama’s got so much not going for him. Ahead in every poll, more delegates, more votes, more momentum. It’s these kind of negatives that drew me in, hook, line and sinker.”

“I’m almost ashamed to admit it, but I keep hearing substance in his speeches. As much as I try to ignore it, his policy positions keep comin’ at me, plain and simple. I suppose I’m just supporting him because I’m too stupid to hear what he’s not saying.”

“I just think the best way to solve our country’s problems right now is to elect the candidate with absolutely no ideas, no substance, and no ability to lead a nation. And bashing Hillary is much more important to me than getting a job, being able to afford to educate my children, and just generally having the better life she keeps promising.”

“I’m completely disgusted with what our country has become, thanks to the Republicans. That’s why millions of people who think the way I do are going to vote for the most unelectable Democrat this November. We’re in it to lose.”

There you have it, folks. When the majority of voters believe that a no-substance, pretty-words talker like Barack Obama is a better bet than the candidate who is losing by every possible measure, we’re in for a world of hurt – like winning the presidency in November.

I just hope you’re all happy now.

[billbuckhead]

1. And here's something to refute your pipe dream

"At the Obama Town Hall Meeting in Harrisburg on Sunday night, capital city bloggers (Progressives, all) were gloomy. Looking around the place, they could find nobody from state or city government, not even "down to the third degree," as one put it. When Hillary Clinton had come through two weeks before, everybody had shown. There are a couple of interesting things about Clinton's dominance in Pennsylvania at a time when Obama continues to lengthen his lead nationally, both in the polls and in pledged delegates (Even Mississippi took a delegate away from Clinton yesterday and gave him or her to Obama.) First of all, you have to ask yourself why government officials and employees are supporting Clinton if hers is a lost cause. Maybe ordinary Quaker Staters don't grasp the significance of math and momentum but surely civil servants do. Part of the answer lies in the stubbornness and civic pride of these Quaker Staters. They want their chance to vote, they're looking forward to it, they've been waiting patiently for their turn--and they darn well don't want to be told their vote is only a rubber stamp on Obama's passport to the nomination.

Another reason for Clinton's appeal among the Pennsylvania political class speaks to the heart of her strength as a candidate and potential president. Such professionals know that she will keep an eye on specific projects and make sure of their implementation. During Obama's Harrisburg Q & A, a lady complained about "the way America treats its cities." Specifically, she wanted to know if Obama could assure the good citizens of Harrisburg that the new federal courthouse, which was supposed to be built in the inner city neighborhood only two blocks away, would in fact be built. The federal government had approved the funding (130 million), but the money had never been released. One thing about Barack Obama for which you have to give him credit is that, unlike most politicians, when he doesn't know the answer he admits as much. So the best Obama could reply was that "if Bob Casey likes it," then the plan must be a good one. Clinton, on the other hand, likely knows every detail about that project and has already promised every Harrisburg official that she will personally make sure of the courthouse."
-----------snip-------------------------
<http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mayhill-fowler/pennsylvania-voters-dismi_b_94393.html>

Hillary's opponent is just a big bullshit artist who preys on people's hope's.

[DerekJ]

4. I don't get it. What is that article has to do with the OP?

[gcomeau]

6. Well, since we're re-using replies...

...I'll re-use the one I posted in the other thread you used this one in.

(Ok, it's also because I'm disappointed barely anyone even looked at this when I posted it in it's own thread)

Clinton as Administrator

The majority of politicians are Administrators. We all know this when we take even a small moment to consider the matter. They are capable managers. They are skilled at navigating and employing the bureaucracy. They delegate tasks and responsibilities fairly well. They keep the gears turning and the machine oiled and prevent it from breaking down too often or too badly... most of the time. They inspire confidence in their supporters that they are capable and reliable. They keep people comfortable in their beds at night knowing someone is at the wheel who isn't going to run the ship into an iceberg.

What they do not do is institute real, sweeping change.

It's not necessarily because they don't want to, it's because they lack the toolkit necessary to get it done. Administrators are very good at using the political machinery, but the political machinery isn't constructed for revolution. It's very much made for the status quo. Maintaining the current state of affairs and telling people they should be comfortable with it is what it does best. If a persons main strength is their experience running the machine then they are well qualified to run the machine the way it usually runs. Demanding successful large scale reform and revolution from an Administrator isn't really fair to them, that's not what they're trained for.

Hillary Clinton is an Administrator. This is not to say she can't have great new policy ideas, she certainly can, she's a very smart lady. That is not to say she will not call for extensive change or does not desire to see it happen. That is not even to say she will not actively fight for it. She just isn't equipped to see it through successfully. She would make a very capable president. She would be a gargantuan improvement over the last 8 years, and relative to them that difference may very well give the impression of sweeping change and revolution even if it is really more a return to the status quo after an 8 year radical departure into total incompetence. And for many people that's what they would be more than happy to see, so she appeals on those grounds. The experience argument is all about this.

Obama as Leader

Very few politicians are Leaders. Leaders don't just manage people, they inspire them in masses. They mobilize them in hordes. They don't just organize projects and staff committees... they ignite movements. They can use the machine, but they do not rely on it, because they are capable of bringing in such massive levels of support from quarters that don't typically come into play in day to day politics. The people who would be apathetic and uninvolved under the direction of an Administrator, leaving it to the machines own devices to get anything done, are out in the streets actively working for reform when rallied by a Leader.

If you want real reform, if you want the true possibility of sweeping change in how the government operates, you need a Leader to get it done. There are never any guarantees involved when you put your bets on a Leader. The fact that they have the tools necessary to institute reform doesn't mean they will... but they're your best shot at it.

Barrack Obama is a Leader. One only has to poke their head up and look around to see the evidence of it anywhere you turn. An entire generation of traditionally apathetic and uninvolved younger voters are swarming all over the democratic primaries with enthusiasm and ferver. Millions of individual donors are funding his run. Campaign offices nationwide are overrun with volunteers wanting to contribute.

When Clinton speaks people nod their heads and comment on how she has some good or even great ideas and a firm grasp on policy. Her long term supporters get excited by the prospects she offers. When Obama speaks people who have never even hear of him except in a passing news report do double-takes and switch their allegiances while those already on his side go ballistic at every confirmation of what an inspiration the man is. This is a man who many people had never heard of at all before the 2004 Democratic convention, but who, when exposed to him there for the first time, had the instant initial impression "good god, imagine him as a presidential candidate". He totally and completely overshadowed Kerry, effortlessly. I loved Kerry, I though he was a really smart guy, I can't express how superior he would have been as a president these last four years... but he was another Administrator. He didn't have it in him to inspire anyone who wasn't already prone to political activism. Obama is in a whole other league. People who are committed to seeing Clinton win certainly can't deny the effect, so they respond by trying to downplay or belittle it in an attempt to defend their candidate. All talk no action. Just words, no experience. An "empty suit". A cult of personality. "Drinking the kool-aid".

They are so, incredibly missing the point.

The man can motivate people to get excited and active about political reform when nobody else can get them off their couches to even cast a vote. If you want to get truly significant change and reform implemented in government that's what it's going to take. People recognize it in him. They don't turn out by the thousand screaming about hope and change just because Obama says "Hope" and "Change" a lot, it's because they see the potential for it to actually be realized when they're exposed to him and what he's doing.

As for the electability arguments in the GE, I don't buy them. Current GE polling is greatly effected by the continuing internal warfare over the Democratic primary. Beyond that, McCain is many things... he's a patriot whatever his detractors may say, he's a genuine war here, he's got a public image as being less dogmatic and more moderate than most Republicans (accurately earned or not)... but put that man on a stage, in front of thousands of people and a national television audience, in the first live verbal presidential debate, arguing for why we need to 'stay the course' in Iraq and explaining why it's not a bad thing that he doesn't really understand the economy and on the other side of the stage... is Barrack Obama and all the policy positions he's laid out over the last many months. Just put the outcome of that contest in your head. If McCain is smart he'd refuse to ever be in the same room as Obama and a camera from here until November, because Obama will very politely, civilly and respectfully annihilate him in a live debate. By November I expect the electoral map showing a clear victory if not a total blowout for Obama once the nation turns their true attentions to Obama vs. McCain instead of Obama vs. Clinton.

And there's my perspective on the "intangible" factor at work in this contest... except it isn't intangible at all in Obama's case. It's laid out in stark and concrete terms every time you look at the nature of his support base.

[TheDoorbellRang]

12. Did you post this as an OP somewhere? It's very good

I've enjoyed reading your posts, BTW. Good to se what I'm thinking articulated so clearly.

[gcomeau]

15. Over here...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5370004

Many hours, 63 views as of now. At least 8 or 9 of those are me. Pretty sad considering the traffic in here, I really should have spiced up the title or something. If I'd called it "Why Obama is AWESOME!!111!!" I'm sure it would have been clicked on about 500 times by now. Oh well.

[mikelewis]

88. List of titles that will get you read by DUer's... "Obama caught molesting goat!"

"Hilary sells crack to third graders."

"Obama the Negro!!!!"

"Hilary the C*nt"

"Obama and Jeff Gannon? WTF?"

"Hilary is Jeff Gannon? WTF?"

"Obama hates white children!!!"

"Hilary eats black children!!!!"

And my all time favorite...

"Obama and/or Hilary caught raping the mentally challenged."

If you stick to the spirit of these title's you can get you message out on GDP... of course, to get to the greatest page (which is the best we peon's can hope for) you have to expand on these issues or have something equally riveting and quick to read. Don't put too much meat in your post and the deeper it cuts the faster it rises... And welcome to DU...

[beltanefauve]

101. May I have your permission

to cut, paste and e mail this? It expresses my feelings and opinions better than I ever could.

And I promise to kick your original thread, if it's still active!

[insanad]

113. Impact of Empty Words

http://my.barackobama.com/yestheycan

[anigbrowl]

10. Speaking of bullshit artists

Specifically, she wanted to know if Obama could assure the good citizens of Harrisburg that the new federal courthouse, which was supposed to be built in the inner city neighborhood only two blocks away, would in fact be built. The federal government had approved the funding (130 million), but the money had never been released. One thing about Barack Obama for which you have to give him credit is that, unlike most politicians, when he doesn't know the answer he admits as much. So the best Obama could reply was that "if Bob Casey likes it," then the plan must be a good one. Clinton, on the other hand, likely knows every detail about that project and has already promised every Harrisburg official that she will personally make sure of the courthouse."

So the writer doesn't actually know what, if anything, Clinton has said about it, but assumes that she is all over it and will personally take care of it. That's not policy, that's backscratching. I certainly want a more efficient government, but even more, I want an executive that doesn't BS people and tell them what they want to hear all the time.

[roguevalley]

39. ah, all that perfection and no one wants her. sigh.

[GTurck]

78. I would opt for...

a more effective government. Efficient is a little to hard to achieve given humanity's (species Americanus) proclivities but effective is truly achievable. That is what has gone down the tubes since the Reagan Revolution and it was deliberately done.

[RaleighNCDUer]

100. "...it was deliberately done."

-- with considerable help from the DLC.

[BornBlue]

83. Besides,

Do you really expect all the Presidential candidates to know the details of every minor construction project in the country? I mean c'mon unless they are from that specific state how are they supposed to know that X courthouse or Y highway has been delayed in construction for one reason or another? It is getting a bit unreasonable. The President is supposed to handle the big issues, if they were expected to manage every little project in the country nothing would ever get done.

[LiberalLovinLug]

111. Bullshit artist indeed

Sounds to me like Obama told the truth, no matter how it may have hurt him, and Clinton just knee jerked and promised anything to anybody she could in order to be elected. No doubt she has (over)promised every super delegate a high position in her administration as well. "You're my #1 choice for VP, but keep it on the down-low for now"

[polpilot]

11. She's Sooooo great! But...but...she's losing....

[NanceGreggs]

17. Sorry, but ...

"Clinton, on the other hand, likely knows every detail about that project and has already promised every Harrisburg official that she will personally make sure of the courthouse," is just the kind of vague rhetoric that has resulted in her obvious, and mounting, losses in this race.

It's just another, however trivial, example of how she's likely to do something, or how her promises are suspect at every turn.

She promised that she would abide by the rules that said FL and MI would not count - until she realized she needed the votes, at which time that promise went out the window.

She was the likely winner until she wasn't the likely winner, at which time she started moving every goalpost on the field - and then some.

SHE IS LOSING THIS RACE. And no article, no screed, no yeah, but is about the change that situation.

It's time to start facing the facts, instead of ignoring them entirely - the way Hill is ignoring the writing on the wall.

[bjobotts]

107. Which ever candidate it's time to stop praising their stands and get them to start listening to the

voters. Not for profit healthcare...not make do with the profiteers at lower rates.
Stop building "permanent' bases in Iraq not just withdrawing the troops.
Stop threatening Iran with regime change unless they do what we want them to do, not just starting diplomatic relations.
Our whole country needs to be turned around after 30yrs of Reaganomics have destroyed the middle class and made a few people ultra rich, not just changing NAFTA.

You're disguised ridicule of Clinton is not what Obama is about, what he wants from his supporters. If you insist on putting forth the idea that Obama doesn't need direction it only makes it harder to get him to listen to what the voters really want. Sorry but he's not that progressive, and not nearly as progressive as his supporters are.
Your posts usually are without such venom and this is a deviation from your normally optimistic and pleasantly insightful posts. The first time you've ever disappointed me...or maybe I should just act like a normal Obama supporter and say it's great, no improvements needed here, such things could never be said about Clinton.

[NanceGreggs]

116. I don't know whose OP you're responding to ...

... but it obviously isn't mine.

The entire OP was not about 'praising' anyone's stand, but merely a response to those who say Obama is just talk, and doesn't have a position on anything.

There is nothing 'disguised' about my ridicule of Hillary. Up until a few months ago, I was a big Hill fan (though not a supporter of her candidacy). Since then, she has done and said far too many things that have changed my attitude towards her completely. And after lying about Bosnia, she deserves the ridicule.

And I am quite sure that Obama does not think that any of his supporters have somehow relinquished their right to speak their minds.

[grantcart]

23. by the way thanks for the free press on TVOR getting two delegates for Obama in MS

and that really is the only thing worth responding to in your drivel

[madrchsod]

33. it is bob casey`s problem not baracks

hillary can not promise anything to anyone in harrisburg....

"Clinton, on the other hand,likely knows every detail about that project and has already promised every Harrisburg official that she will personally make sure of the courthouse."

does she or does`t she?

[AX10]

46. kick

[TLM]

63. Way to spin....

the apparent situation Clinton finds herself in... where her support has dwindled away to just the old school party elite power players who see their 30 year death grip on American politics slipping away with each point Hillary drops in the polls and each delegate she loses.

[Alter Ego]

76. I'm waiting for the part where you call Obama

"the affirmative action candidate".

[dbmk]

82. Not only will she have promised it

She will add a tale of her running to the building previously there, while being under fire from warring gangs.

Yeah, she might have promised it as described. Good chance though, that her actually knowing about and acting on it would be as much BS as Obama is accused of here.

After the sniper story - calling her opponent a bullshit artist is beyond incredible.

[Terran]

103. Here's what kills me about this assanine response:

Clinton, on the other hand, likely knows every detail about that project and has already promised every Harrisburg official that she will personally make sure of the courthouse.

There's a big difference between making politcal promises for the purpose of getting elected and actually keeping promises after one is elected...something we've seen spectacular failure in from the Bush administration. It's absurd to think, as this piece seems to imply, that Mrs. Clinton actually knows the details of every single federally-funded project in existence. Is she "likely" to know why HUD hasn't come up with a contract yet for my agency's year old grant to house homeless people in St. Louis? I seriously doubt it. As with every other criticism I read about Mr. Obama, this one is utterly lame and without substance.

And when it comes right down to it? I don't give a fuck if Pennsylvanians want to give more of their votes to Hilary. Because it's not going to affect the outcome at this point.

[ksquire]

109. if overcoming a 20 point lead is him failing

i hate to see how he does when he starts succeeding. hrc may really be in trouble then.

[graywarrior]

2. *snort* It's so much fun watching a guy who can't win winning.

[billbuckhead]

20. The general election will be far different and far nastier

and the media will be on their side. Our candidate will get as much good press as a peace march. If the GOP media machine could push Jesse Helms over the finish line, a far better candidate like McCain will be very dangerous.

[grantcart]

22. so your argument is that because it is going to be a more difficult campaign

we should go with the candidate who could not handle the easy one?


That is what you are saying right?

[NanceGreggs]

27. Jesus, wake up!

That's exactly what they're saying. Our best chance of beating the GOP is to put the loser out there as our nominee.

Don't you understand that the person who couldn't beat the upstart with no credentials is the BEST person to beat McCain?

Honestly, grantcart, it's time for all of us to get with the program. Like, duh, what part of the best way to lose an election do you not understand!?!

[NC_Nurse]

30. LOL!

:rofl:

[stevietheman]

89. Oh my... you're good! :) n/t

n/t

[billbuckhead]

32. The political correctness that protects Hillary's opponent during the primary will be gone

Republicans are proud to be racist and will end all the racial jujitsu Hillary's opponent gets away with in the primary. Hell, they're actually giving Low Dobbs a radio show! The sad thing is that the Pukes will be able to peel away large swaths of working class whites, elderly whites(actually a growing class), Hispanics(another growing class) and Asians(another growing class) for a generation because liberal elites and college students think they can have a African-American racial redeemer. Hillary's opponent is their last hope since the Clinton's have been able to put together coalitions that have beat the Republicans in the past and losing to them is imprinted in their reptile minds. Beating black candidates is what the GOP is best at and they can even push a Jesse Helms over the finish line. Hispanic friendly McCain will be a walk in the park against a black candidate.

[NanceGreggs]

34. Yeah, you're coming in loud and clear ...

"Republicans are proud to be racist ... will end all the racial jujitsu ... peel away large swaths of working class whites, elderly whites ... African-American racial redeemer ... beating black candidates is what the GOP is best at ... walk in the park against a black candidate."

Anything you want to add, just in case we didn't get your meaning?

[billbuckhead]

36. Those who ignore history will repeat it

Sadly the people who need a Democratic president the most will will be punished the most because of this failure to come up with a winning candidate.

[NanceGreggs]

37. Don't you mean those people who NEED ...

... a white Democratic president?

[billbuckhead]

40. Yeah, like the majority of voters in real world voting

Why hand this election to the Republicans on a silver platter on something as insignificant to the enlightened such as yourself, as race? Edwards was way ahead in poll matchups. The Clinton's have a long history of winning and building coalitions. Why turn what should have been an easy electoral victory into a racial referendum? Vanity?

[NanceGreggs]

43. It only seems to be a 'racial referendum' to some people ...

... those who can't seem to focus on anything else. Do you know anyone like that?

[billbuckhead]

45. Then why is it more important to have a black candidate than to win?

The media will easily turn this into a racial referendum. I don't think the average person is as colorblind as you think or they say they are in the corporate polling.

[NanceGreggs]

48. More delegates, more votes, more supporters ...

... more financial contributors, more campaign volunteers, more attendees at rallies ...

I guess the citizenry is a lot more colorblind than you, and your candidate-of-choice, had hoped for.

[billbuckhead]

49. Democrats generally are, but Americans generally aren't

Look at the extremes Americans go to be with their own race, particularly on Sunday morning. BTW, I live in one of the most diverse neighborhoods in America, the DeKalb county border of Buckhead in Atlanta. I fear many of the people who vote against Hillary's opponent will never come back to the Democratic party and turn the border states and even the mid-Atlantic states into the same politics as the South, the white party against the black party. I watched Republican crossover vote in the primary take out Cynthia McKinney in neighboring DeKalb county. Women do have it tougher in politics.

[NanceGreggs]

50. Yeah, that's the ticket ...

... people should stick to 'their own kind'.

And don't come back and tell me that's not what you're advocating - because it is.

[billbuckhead]

51. I'm not the one going to an ethnocentric church on Sunday morning

I'm just observing reality.

[NanceGreggs]

54. And the 'reality' you are constantly 'observing' ...

... always has to do with race.

This OP was a response to the constant charge from Hillary supporters that Obama supporters can't find a single positive thing to say about their candidate, and that is why they lash out at Hillary.

You have now proven, over and over, that not only do you not have a single positive thing to say about Hillary, the only thing you have to say about Obama is that he is black.

News flash: Everybody already knows that Obama is black. They also know that he's winning this race.

I realize that's hard for people like you to swallow, but there you have it.

[billbuckhead]

75. More personal attacks?

BTW, I've posted many pro Clinton posts.

[nxylas]

117. My only fear is that it could be used to justify another stolen election

I have a nightmare vision of the M$M on the day after the election, telling us that "the exit polls showed Obama way in the lead, but McCain won with 101% of the vote. There can be only one poss...shut up, Pilger!...there can be only one possible explanation; the electorate lied to the exit pollsters for fear of being thought racist". I hope that Obama's GE campaign is accompanied by a concerted effort to ensure a free and fair election.

[Ken Burch]

74. No, you're calling for us to accept "segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever".

You want us to be a party free of hopes and dreams.

Your candidate is better than that.

She could win on the merits.

Don't dishonor a good person.

[DWilliamsamh]

86. Unless you don't go to church on Sunday morning

You are almost guaranteed to be going to an "ethnocentric" church on Sunday morning. You made that point yourself.

[Voltaire]

93. You are thinking like a fear-based unit

And the paradigm is changing.

[Ken Burch]

73. The colorblind would also likely be sexist.

If they wouldn't vote for an African American against McCain, they equally wouldn't vote for a woman.

We don't need the votes of racists anyway. They're a pathetically small and declining minority of the electorate and none would vote for ANY Dem. And you know it.

Don't dishonor your candidate.

[BornBlue]

95. Long History of Winning, Coalition Building? HUH?

They may have been powerful 10-15 years ago, but dynasties change, and they have been removed. The future of this party does not lie with them any longer. They built a fabulous coalition while he was running for the White House, but where is it now? She has run a laughable campaign. She used Guiliani(sp?) tactics of ignoring small states because TX/OH/PA ect were going to be her fire-walls.
The youth is waking up, and we do not want to end up bitter and jaded like our parents. I keep coming back to the idea, that we as Americans, are raised to feel powerless. The government for so long has used fear to control the population, ie the Cold War/McCarthy-ism, Vietnam, terrorists the list goes on. . .It is time that we fight back, stop the negative and empower the youth. You have to look at it through our eyes. We were told we could do anything as long as we went to college, well the reality is, we can't. This is why Obama is motivating the youth, he is telling us, before it is too late, YES WE CAN.
If you honestly believe that McCain can beat Obama you are sorely mistaken. Traditional electoral maps make it look daunting, but we have to re-write the maps. Obama is going to get votes from states that have traditionally not been as critical. A new era is dawning, where FL and OH don't get to make the rules any longer.
In my opinion, the vain candidate is Ms. Clinton. She has run her race as if she was going through the motions, like she was entitled to be the next President. She is down due to poor campaign managing. She is a brilliant woman, who would make a fine president, but to echo an earlier poster, she is not a leader, Obama is.
Lastly, since it is 40 years since Dr. King was assassinated, can we please stop the racial insults, at least for today?

[Number23]

68. Preach!

Don't you mean a white Democratic president?

Go get'em, girl!! The thing I don't get is that the white people who are always asserting that racism is not the factor that it once was, that racial discrimination is not nearly as bad as it used to be and that blacks would be doing soooo much better if only they worked harder and didn't spend all of their time drinking, drugging and other assorted sins, are the EXACT same white people who scream that America is just too racist to elect a black president.

Well which is it? If the country is so horrible that it won't elect a black man for president regardless of talent and ability, then why is it so inconceivable that racism is a real live obstacle that blacks and other people of color have to endure every single day? Conversely, if the country is marching so decidedly on the path to genuine equality, why do so many whites consider Obama absolutely unelectable because he's black???

Carry on, Nance. You're doing just fine.

[GTurck]

77. Who...

would be? In a climate where even the so-so candidates are daily buffeted by their own side who would qualify?

[ExPatLeftist]

90. Nostradamus, is that you?

You seem to already know the outcome of the election, both if Clinton is the nominee and if Obama is the nominee. And try to use meandering assumptions to convince people to vote according to your "visions". Fact is, no one knows how the general will go and your "logic" is just a bunch of assumptions designed to support your candidate, nothing more.

Here's a weird idea, how about people vote for the candidate that each one of them, individually, thinks will be the best president rather than all of us following your amateur prognostications built on top of biased estimates and assumptions?

In other words, maybe we should vote by conviction rather than trying to game the system using a strategy based on whatever crap you decide to make up?

[guyanakoolaid]

61. If the GOP was so good at beating black candidates

how did Obama ever get into the Senate in the first place?

[billbuckhead]

114. Their major candidate had a sex scandal

[ginnyinWI]

62. oh come on now--

Both have characteristics that the GOP is going to exploit. They would play the woman-commander-in-chief thing to the hilt, for one thing. And there are plenty of things they've got lined up for her--and she's a Clinton, the most hated name in Republican-dom.

To win in November you have to run a smart, well-funded campaign. The one whose campaign looks like that right now is Obama's.

[eridani]

64. They're proud to be misogynists too, right? n/t

[guyanakoolaid]

66. Billbuckhead - You are a racist.

No ifs and or buts about it. You talk about "liberal elites and college students (who) think they can have a African-American racial redeemer," as if by simply stating your racist views you make them the views of all Americans. You are telling us not to vote for Obama because of race.

I think you see that Hillary lost her last shred of credibility with the Bosnia thing, and you are going for the last play in the playbook. It's disgusting, and your lack of shame is appalling.

Hillary will lose, and she fully deserves to. It will be that much sweeter that racists like you, and people who still live by the old-school politics of "do or say anything on any position to win", will feel the pain.

[beltanefauve]

104. Ah!

So that's the person whose responses keep showing up as, "ignored"!:rofl:

[Hestia]

98. And? So?

They'll be digging their own grave and we will just sit back and watch them. I am sure most of ya'll are aware that the masks are slipping and people are simply nauseated at the same rhetoric. What makes you think the same ol' same ol' is going to work this time? People have bee screaming for the adults to show up and take charge. They are, they just can't be controlled, hence Obama's popularity.

It kinda makes you wonder what everyone was thinking when busing happened around the country. You know, x kids to bused to y kids neighborhoods and visca versa - it was a large PITA but we really did see what it looks like on the other side of the fence. We found out that you can't really racially stereotype everyone, on all sides. Which is why the racial card is no longer working. We know the truth out here in the real world where we all haven't grown up in a hermetically sealed gated community. In doing so, we know how to separate the wheat from the chaff, or Who Is Going To Stab Us In The Back And Who Isn't?

Besides - if someone is going to vote against someone for racial reasons, what can we really do? That's a learned response as a child and if you grow up with racial hatred, there isn't really anything we can do about it. Nothing will change their mind and they really aren't worth riling up. Walk away and find some better playmates. Nobody said you have to be friends with these people (though if they are family you do have to put up with it to a certain degree). Poking sticks at them isn't doing them or yourself any favors. It'll just make them angrier and more resolved in their hatred.

[Usrename]

102. Obama is black?

Oh noooooes!

:wow:

[mkultra]

58. i guess her starting out with 37% strong negs will help her then

[Ken Burch]

72. And both of our candidates, both being equally qualified, are equally vulnerable to that.

Nothing in your post makes a case for either.

[H2O Man]

3. Very good.

The past seven years have been so harsh, that many democrats really do not believe that what Obama is saying is true. But they will. Soon enough, they will.

Nominated.

[VolcanoJen]

5. Oh, huge kick and rec, Ms. Nance.

:dem:

[babylonsister]

7. Oh, snap! Love ya, Nance! Great job, as usual. nt

[thevoiceofreason]

8. I'm not non-rec'ing this thread!

Great job.

[immoderate]

9. I want someone I could beat at bowling.

--IMM

[grantcart]

26. ok but you better hurry up and play him because I don't think his learning curve is very long

[immoderate]

31. Yeah, and I'm not getting any better.

:)

--IMM

[izzybeans]

13. Wonderful as usual.

Thank you.

[rug]

14. Don't forget his courageous leadership in returning art to the schools.

Where would we be without him.

[Willo]

16. Well done Nance, good points n/t

[TheDoorbellRang]

18. Yes, indeed

A substantial analysis of our candidate, Nance. :thumbsup:

[mindwalker_i]

19. That does it!

Alright, that's it! You, Nance, are now DEAD TO ME!!!!!!!!!


grrrrr, and stuff

:)

[NC_Nurse]

21. I am.

VERY happy! $40 million in March. The campaign is coming here and we are READY!
I am working the office ALL DAY tomorrow and I'm completely psyched.


:woohoo:

[roseBudd]

28. Thank you for all your hard work!

[Berry Cool]

24. Another winner from Nance!

K&R

[grantcart]

25. you have exposed one of the primary lapses of logic that has infected Clinton town

i.e. style and substance are not now nor have they ever been inherently mutually exclusive.

Its just that simple.

[NanceGreggs]

35. Precisely.

And their efforts to convince the voters that they are mutually exclusive is part and parcel of the Clinton machine downfall.

[grantcart]

41. What is amazing is that they have been able to keep this show functioning

without any unifying message at all.


Besides 'I am not going to quit' what is the compelling message of the Clinton campaign right now. They have completely lost all control or impact on the campaign narrative.

[NanceGreggs]

44. Well ...

... the current narrative seems to be that if it wasn't for Obama continuing to get more votes, more delegates, more financial contributions, and more supporters, Hillary could still win this thing.

Winning an election when reality gets in the way is such hard work.

[grantcart]

59. doesn't really make you want to reach for your checkbook now does it?

[NanceGreggs]

60. Judging from Hill's lack of funds ...

... I guess that goes without saying.

As a result, I suppose the Professional Goalpost Movers Union members will get stiffed just like everybody else.

[ZombieHorde]

110. "when reality gets in the way is such hard work"

Reality makes everything harder. Down with reality!

[lumberjack_jeff]

57. They're not mutually exclusive. Witness JFK.

They're not a package deal either.

Why was Samantha Power fired? Not for calling Hillary a monster, but because she put a quantifiable timeline to Obama's ambiguous and equivocal Iraq promises. "16 months, best case scenario". This compares poorly to Hillary's 60 days to begin withdrawal.

Health care? "make it cheaper and it'll be universal". No, it won't. You make it optional and it won't be universal. Nor will it be cheaper - because it's not universal.

[TLM]

67. nope wrong....

""16 months, best case scenario". This compares poorly to Hillary's 60 days to begin withdrawal."


I see clinton supporters passing on this spin from Hillary's campaign over and over. They take Obama's comments or those from his campaign staffers etc. regarding how long the withdrawal from Iraq may take to complete ... then compare it to Hillary saying when she would START that process of withdrawal, and try to spin it as if Obama's time frame wasn't for completion, but also for starting the process.

Like saying it will take 6 months to build a house, then someone else saying they can begin building a house in 5 minutes.

"Health care? "make it cheaper and it'll be universal". No, it won't. You make it optional and it won't be universal. Nor will it be cheaper - because it's not universal."

It is a hell of a lot cheaper when I'm not being FORCED to pay for it. Universal doesn't mean mandatory, it means universally available. Hillary already lost once with the forced healthcare program BS.

Obama is right... driving down the prices and expanding coverage programs so healthcare is affordable and available to anybody who WANTS it, is the way to go. Taking a premium out of my check to pay for a plan I'm forced to join is bullshit.

[DearAbby]

29. As Always...

:thumbsup:

[bigbrother05]

38. Thanks Nance, another classic

[Cha]

42. Very well convolutedly written,

Nance..I enjoyed reading about how Obama is so not doing anything that he's winning hands down!

[jgraz]

47. K&R -- brilliant!

Thanks, Nance!

[Alii]

52. Nance, per usual...

FANTASTIC!

gcomeau, great also. At least the Barack Obama narrative portion.

Educate the uneducated. This is not to insult that huge portion of Hillary's demographic base, the uneducated, for even they are able to learn...hopefully. Read, listen to debates, observe public statements, etc. And then, make a wise decision...Barack Obama.

It will never cease to amaze me that with such low poll ratings as it relates to honesty, truthfulness and integrity that Hillary's still in contention...but not for long.

Keep up the good work. Eventually...

From Rambo in Bosnia to Rocky to Paulette Revere. Next? Georgia Washington crossing the Delaware? Hopefully not. Rocky (Stallone) endorsed John McCain.

[PerfectSage]

53. ROFLMFAO you forgot the sarcasm emoticon.

I had WJC pegged as "run of the mill shit scum politician", GWB as a "fuckin' idiot" and have HRC pegged as WJC 2 or worse.

I'm as happy as a pig in shit with BHO.

http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=12532

[lumberjack_jeff]

55. Barack Obama, the specificity candidate.

No, sorry. Can't keep a straight face.

Can I keep the pony anyway?

[Hepburn]

84. Sure, why not. ~~ you can keep the pony...

...it goes well with the horse shit that Hillary puts out! :hi:

[ZombieHorde]

112. Hi lumberjack_jeff

Barack Obama, the specificity candidate.

What do you mean?

[GOPBasher]

56. I love the way you write NanceGregg.

:thumbsup:

[ekwhite]

65. Right on the money, as usual Nance

I love ya :hug:

[AtomicKitten]

69. Enough with the speeches and the big rallies.

Wow. There is no way in hell I'm going to vote for that SOB more than once in the general election. He'll probably just go on to win. That kind of narrative and his capacious coattails will surely tether the Democrats to the steering wheel of America. And we all know what that means: Governing. Please. The Democrats? No way.

Way.

K&R

[BigBearJohn]

70. Wow Nance. What a uniter you are! Obama would be proud.

[Demeter]

71. The Thing I Like Best About Obama--He Doesn't Knife Himself--Or Anyone Else

with the exception of W, and all Obama has to do is point out the facts, and that's knife enough for George.

[yellerpup]

79. How much longer before you kick Mo Dowd off the Op-Ed Page

of the NYT? I'm all for change! K&R! :kick:

[nvme]

80. over 80 % of the country

Although I absolutely hate polls, it is pretty profound that over 4/5ths of the country believes we are on the wrong trac. I dislike the fact that Hillary is doing everything to undermine our democracy.(By that I mean she is now targeting pledged delegates). It is the most under-handed tactic I have seen so far. When she claims florida and michigan need to be heard in one breath, then claims the pledged delegates are not necessarily bound to the votes they are entrusted. How far down will you sink? upto this point with all said and done. with out florida and michigan, Barak has 700k plus votes. counting florida and michigan his lead is 120k. that gap would have been bigger if obama (like clinton)didn't follow the rules and had his name on the Michigan ballot. It horrifies me to think about how much goodwill the Clintons have squandered. I am amazed.

I digress. Given the current dissatisfaction that exists over America's direction, Obama will win the GE. He will do so by a very large margin. That is if he brands Mc Cain as the sequal to the chimps legacy. Remember, 2 things mc cain has said he is not strong on economics and 100 years war. those are the big guns that need to be fired.

we have all the ammunition but the one problem remains, we are using our arsenal on each other. Meanwhile the home foreclosure act is sending funding to banks for bad loans then buying and refurbishing the foreclosed house as a means to further alieviate the banks losses. dont worry though the gov is gonna give money toward credit counseling. Gimme a break. give the troubled mortgagee a break help those losing houses. The banks and deregulation caused this mess(a repub initiative). If the banks had stuck to regular guides then the borrowers would be having loans that took up no more than 28 % of their income.

My point is that I am begging Clinton and her supporters if she doesn't score big in Pa (by 15 % margin) bow out from the race for the good of the party and country. If the situation were reversed yes i would want to see him stay but ultimately I would encourage him to do the same.

God bless America

[grantcart]

81. kick

[K Gardner]

85. K&R

[woundedkarma]

87. I believe his words...

Nance, great post. I've also read some of your replies to a certain racist on here, it's nice to see.

Just pretty words. That's funny. The difference between Obama and Clinton is that I BELIEVE Obama's words. I believe he MEANS those words. Clinton lied about the bosnia trip. She's lied about other things. I don't trust her in the least.

Then, Obama gave the speech on race. This is a man with guts, who knows what's going on. He's not afraid to speak out about one of the worst taboos in the country.

Did you listen to the speech on the economy? Yah.. that was nothing but pretty words. *blink*

You can call them pretty words if you want but what I hear when I listen to this man is hope, inspiration. I think there might be a chance for the country to come back from this horrible brink we're teetering on. I think we might even save the planet.

McCain is 4 more years of bush. Clinton is 4 more years of bush light with no change in the way anything is run. Obama is change. Obama is America healing. Obama is the only chance we have of restoring this country to what it should be. Constitution intact.

[stevietheman]

91. Brilliant post. Thanks, Nance! n/t

n/t

[Kablooie]

92. Oooh. Moi broin 'urts. Moy broin 'urts.

[Norrin Radd]

94. kr

[IronLionZion]

96. They think they can keep us keen by being mean.

I simply have to love the good people on GDP who think the best way to win support and influence people is to insult us, particularly with respect to our intelligence and decision-making abilities. I wonder how well it's working out for them. It's a good thing we have so many intellectual superiors here to draw conclusions and make decisions for us.

I love your posts Nance! You write with a very witty style and substance. Keep them coming.

Proud cultist here!

[parkeradison]

97. Regarding "Obama's non-qualities"

Yes, there's nothing like good sarcasm.

[Scurrilous]

99. K & R

:thumbsup:

[sybylla]

105. Another K & R

Nobody says it like you do, Nance. Words cannot express my gratefulness for your wit and eloquence.

:patriot:

[mcollier]

106. And the Choir Sings

YES WE CAN!!!!!

[shagsak]

108. Great Post!

Took me a minute to catch on, it's been a long day.

[azmouse]

115. kick