Obama has my support if for no other reason, this... (any teachers in the house?)

[ourbluenation]

And the last thing is, if your child is misbehaving at school don't curse out the teacher. You know who you are. It's not the teacher's fault that your child is misbehaving. That's some home training.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/11/obama-urges-parental-resp_n_96216.html

sign me, teacher's wife

[redqueen]

1. Oh yes... LOVE that!

:applause:

[Starbucks Anarchist]

2. Obama hates parents!

Come on, you know that's coming in 5, 4, 3...

[Symarip]

3. Why does he hate parents?

Obama is nothing but a hatemonger!

:sarcasm:

[ourbluenation]

4. here's more...

"Parents if you don't parent, we can't improve our schools," he said. "You've got to parent. You've got to turn off the television set in your house once in a while, you've got to put the video game away once in a while."

thank you thank you thank you for stating the obvious that no one seems to want to say out loud.

[roguevalley]

55. teacher here. digging that BIG time.

[mtnsnake]

5. Kudos to him for that

All too often, many parents try to to avoid too many of their own parental duties by passing them on to the teachers. He has been very outspoken about this.

[leftofcool]

6. I hate to break this to ya Obama,

there are lots of bad teachers out there who are at fault for the misbehavior of some childen. You can start by getting rid of the stupid teachers first....ie the ones who barely passed their teaching exams with a 70%. That should dump about half the teachers in the US. Then move on and get rid of the abusive ones. You can easily recognize this crowd....they are the ones who yell and scream in the classroom usually telling kids to shut up or telling kids how stupid they are. Do away with the unions so these shitheads can be fired and then create a new system of tenure for the good ones and give them good pay to stay on.

Signed.....a retired teacher with 24 years experience who has seen it all, both good and bad

[democrattotheend]

10. Are you being serious or snarky?

Are you seriously calling for getting rid of the unions? Are you sure you are a Democrat?

Yes, teachers' unions are not perfect, and sometimes they keep bad teachers in place, but without teachers' unions, teachers would be fired when they had been there a while and got too expensive, or whenever a parent got up in arms because Little Johnny didn't get an A. My dad's cousin is a public school teacher in Arizona, which is a right to work state, and she said the union is really weak and teachers get treated like shit.

[leftofcool]

12. Very serious!

And in 24 years, I have never heard of a teacher getting fired for not giving out A's

[mrreowwr_kittty]

17. They have HUGE teacher turnover in AZ.

The idiot you were responding to ought to move here and teach for a while if she thinks getting rid of unions is such a hunky-dory idea.

[leftofcool]

19. That is what tenure is for

If you have such a big turn over, your teachers are going elsewhere for either more money, better benefits, or better academics.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

26. It's just that simple isn't it?

Except it isn't. AZ is not only a right-to-work state but we also have a legislature full of wingnuts who are extremely hostile to public ed. Some of them have openly stated that they want to dismantle the public school system and replace it with vouchers and charter schools. The teachers unions, such as they are, have been one of the few effective bulwarks against them. How the fuck is "tenure" supposed to stave that off? I mean, apart from making teachers too scared to speak up out of fear of losing their jobs and tenure?

[leftofcool]

29. Tenure has to be structured properly to work

If it is done correctly, you do not need unions. As long as there are teachers unions, you will never be able to get rid of the shit teachers and there are many.

[Name removed]

53. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[damonm]

64. Now, that is just flat uncalled-for,

And I'm alerting it.

[Texas Hill Country]

22. 1. Not all dems support unions... 2. and there are some F'd teachers out there...

[leftofcool]

24. Absolutley!

[PVnRT]

31. LOL Yes, we need to cater to anti-union Democrats now

Give me a break.

[knixphan]

35. indeed.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

44. Like Mark Penn?

Honestly, I cannot for the life of me understand why Clinton has the support of any union, let alone so many of them. They must have figured they were siding with the winner when they picked her.

[ourbluenation]

54. Teachers I know who dont support unions are right wingers who think the

school administrators and school boards will stand by them out of benevolence.



:rofl:

[Voice for Peace]

14. I once had a teacher call me to complain about my daughter.

In a nasty, tattletale voice, she was reporting my daughter to me. She was not doing well in her class, and skipping some classes and hanging out with bad kids. So this teacher told me.

I said to that teacher, with all due respect, if a kid isn't doing well in a class I think the teacher bears some responsibility. And I know her friends, and who she hangs out with, and they're not bad at all. And I know my daughter, and how much she loves learning, and I know what she's going through right now in her life. So thanks for your concern but I'm on her side 100%.

And that teacher's tone of voice completely changed. I would never in a million years take the side of a teacher over my kid.

With all due respect to the very difficult job of being a teacher... don't EVER try to turn parents against their kids.

[leftofcool]

18. Good

Always side with your child until you learn different. That is the way it should be

[Voice for Peace]

62. Thanks, I was beginning to feel like I shouldn't have jumped in here.

I'm passionately negative about the public school system, which I know is unfair to many who work hard in it, trying to make it good. But it always seemed like minimum security prison to me. I never saw a kid who wanted to be there.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

25. "I would never in a million years take the side of a teacher over my kid."

OMG, parents with this attitude not only make the jobs of teachers difficult, but they are also the reason there are so many ill-behaved, spoiled, annoying little BRATS out there.

No one is trying to turn you against your kid. And if a lot of people besides that teacher start telling you things about your little precious angel, they may have a point. Just saying.

[leftofcool]

27. I'm sorry

there is no such thing as an ill-behaved, spoiled, annoying BRAT. There ARE little people out there who need to be taught manners, academics, classroom discipline and patience because they are, after all, little and learning. And I certainly hope that parents do indeed believe that their children are precious angels even when they do naughty things

[PVnRT]

32. Did you teach high school?

Why don't you ask my wife about the students in her class whose parents told them that it's OK to cheat, as long as they pass?

Yep, clearly it's her fault.

[leftofcool]

34. Did someone say this was her fault?

[PVnRT]

37. Your posts would imply that teachers are to blame

and their devil-unions who keep them employed.

[leftofcool]

41. Yep, some are to blame

[mrreowwr_kittty]

42. There are also a lot of parents out there

Who refuse to discipline or hold their kids accountable because they've been fed reams of psycho-babble and "self esteem" nonsense. Trust me, I'm dealing with this right now in my own life. My bf's almost-19 yo son lays around the house most of the day playing video games. He takes 3 classes at community college and that's it. He's lucky to be able to do that, considering he was expelled from high school for selling Adderol to other students.

He refuses to get a job or help around the house. He is utterly incapable of doing anything for himself and whines incessantly. From pre-school on, my bf and his ex trotted him around to various shrinks and they medicated the crap out of him. My bf has an entire shelf devoted to "Dealing With Your Exceptional Child" and similar tracts. So now you have this young adult who takes one pill in the morning to help him pay attention (to god knows what) and another at night to put him to sleep. Paid for by his father. He can't drive and his social skills are non-existent. I finally put my foot down and we are making slow but steady progress with him in terms of getting him out of the house and doing things. He now has a bus pass instead of demanding to be driven everywhere. That's good but at this rate I estimate he'll still be living with us when he's 30. Does he have some genuine problems that require therapy and possibly medication? Undoubtedly. Does that excuse his parents for indulging and coddling him his entire life, failing to instill any sense of personal responsibility in him? I think not. Is he an anomoly? Hardly. Right off the top of my head I can think of 6 other young people, children of my friends and acquaintances, who are exactly the same. Medicated, coddled, and too "special" to have to contribute to the household in any way or even do their own damn laundry.

I swear, it's become a suburban disease. I have yet to meet a parent lately who doesn't tell me their kid is "exceptional" or "gifted" or something. No one has an average kid, apparently. They don't exist anymore.

[ourbluenation]

47. and in the end it doesn't serve their child either. sad. n/t

[mrreowwr_kittty]

57. It borders on abuse and neglect IMO.

My bf is a very intelligent guy in every other respect but he and his ex got some really crummy ideas about parenting and child development from the so-called "experts". B/f is so conflict-adverse when it comes to the boy and so afraid of damaging his fragile psyche in some way that he'd rather make excuses about his son's "issues" than make him do anything. The mother is just as bad, if not worse. She's basically palmed him off onto his dad and has little to nothing to do with him. The kid is very smart and knows just how to manipulate his dad to get him to leave him alone or give him what he wants. At the same time the boy is clearly lonely and miserable. I feel bad for him but I'm also tired of seeing him lazing around all day and raiding the fridge. And I'm serious about how many other kids I personally know who are exactly the same. All of them boys BTW. Not sure why that is, though I know there are various theories about that.

[Blondiegrrl]

66. Wow. I hope this is meant to be sarcasm. Because if not ... wow.

... there is no such thing as an ill-behaved, spoiled, annoying BRAT.

Um. Yes. There is.

If you don't believe me, just look to our current president. Everything I've read about his youth indicates he was a teacher's worst nightmare.

[Voice for Peace]

61. This teacher was.. it was bizarre. But the phenomenon I noticed all the time at this high school

was that parents and school tended to gang up against the kids.
The parents were extremely ambitious for their kids to succeed.
It wasn't a healthy kind of ambition though, from all I saw.

[Blondiegrrl]

65. ... because their precious little snowflake would NEVER do anything wrong.

Yeah, I agree with you. I'm a parent. This has nothing to do with "taking a teacher's side" and everything to do with common sense. If a teacher takes the time to call a parent at home about a child's behavior in class (or OUT of class, if they're skipping), then chances are there is a legitimate concern there that needs to be addressed.

[ourbluenation]

46. eh. for about a year in jr high my son's body was taken over by a demon.

he was a right a-hole who thought he had all the answers. A very good student. One day I came to pick him up from school as usual, and his math teacher was standing out there with him, neither saying a word. She explained the difficulties she was having w him, and every fiber of being knew she was right even though he denied it. That poor woman was at her wits end but she liked him and wanted him to succeed. In the end they became friends, but not without my insistence that he treat his elders with respect, always. You can disagree and debate with your teachers, but always w respect.

Plus, it's just good common sense to get along with the people who grade you.

[PVnRT]

20. "Do away with the unions"

That tells me all I need to know about you.

[leftofcool]

23. Really?

Ever been in a teachers' union? Ever seen abusive teachers keep their jobs because they were in a union? I have. It is a sad sight. And you don't know anything about me

[PVnRT]

30. The only people I've heard bitch about the unions

are the right-wing assholes who blame everything on the teachers, and start howling about how they need to be "accountable" and blah blah blah. No, I know plenty about you from that statement alone.

Come to Indiana, where the only thing preventing teachers from being treated like second-class citizens is the union, which in many districts can't even go on strike. Spare me your anecdotal evidence about the plague of mean teachers yelling at students.

You know, maybe you ought to back up your ranting bullshit with things like "evidence" instead of grinding your axe by giving the middle finger to a core Democratic constituency.

[knixphan]

36. hear hear

[leftofcool]

40. Heres ya some evidence

A first grade teacher puts elmers glue on a paper plate and shoves the plate into the face of a child. Why? Because the little one dips his finger into the glue bottle and puts it into his mouth which is usually the norm for a first grader. Not only should this teacher have been fired, she should have been strung up in the teachers lounge as an example of piss poor and abusive teachers. Nothing happend to her, not even minimal discplinary measures because she was in a union. Teachers do need to be held accountable for their actions and for what they teach to young people. Maybe not for your kids though, eh?

[Voice for Peace]

63. The problem is a combination of bad parenting & poor teaching.

If parents are really good, a kid can survive a lousy school. If a school & the teachers are really good, they can help troubled kids to learn & excel.

When kids are disrespected at home and/or at school, they naturally act out. This is human nature, and it's healthy (my opinion.) If the response is punishment, restriction, disrespect, the kids act out more.

Public school as it is in most schools is an entirely unnatural & unhealthy learning environment.

[TheWraith]

43. Check out Obama's education proposals.

Some of the things that are getting him flak from other people include getting rid of bad teachers, and bonus pay for those whose students excel.

[ourbluenation]

51. on the whole, the problems are rooted at home. as a teacher you know this.

be honest.

[flor de jasmim]

7. Thanks for posting this - I almost didn't click, because I'd heard so many speeches,

but it was worth it--both for the article itself and the messages below. I think it's great that parents and kids alike always cheer when he tells people they need to turn off the TV (who knew!?) and spend time with their kids.

[Fredda Weinberg]

8. My mother would disagree. She taught vocational school in one of

Brooklyn's poorest neighborhoods - never had a student she couldn't reach and often took over those other's couldn't handle.

[npincus]

13. I don't think your point contradicts what the OP is saying.

Obama is talking to parents and telling them not to blame the teachers if you aren't parenting your kids, and that they need to be repsonsible parents. He is not saying that teachers have no role in helping troubled students, certainly they do. My mom was a 5th great teacher in a poor neighborhood in Queens, so totally agree with Obama and get where he's coming from.

[Fredda Weinberg]

49. I think you're overlooking the obvious

"It's not the teacher's fault that your child is misbehaving"

I don't know what that means to you, but it's clear to me - and my mother would disagree.

[DevonRex]

9. We had a very difficult kid.

He was hell to raise and hell for the high school teachers to deal with. The thing that always surprised me was that the teachers he was rude to STILL cared about him. It would have been so easy for them to write him off and have him suspended or even expelled.

The other thing that surprised me was that this one teacher in particular understood the position we were in as his parents. We wanted him held accountable but we also wanted him to graduate.

In the end we all did a very difficult dance to keep him in school so he could finish. And sure enough, he cleaned his act up in college and now he's a great person. I wonder what would have happened if the teachers had washed their hands of him. Nothing good, certainly.

Anyway, my respect for public school teachers grew and grew throughout the whole ordeal. They really deserve to be the highest paid people in our society.

[leftofcool]

11. Now those are the teachers you keep paying the good money

Congrats to your son and to you and his teachers. I had one young man like that years back. He had great parents and we worked with him until we were blue in the face. I still get emails from him once in a while. Last year, he and his pretty wife and new baby girl flew out to see us. He sure was glad to be on spring break. Said he had a math class of students who were eating his lunch. I think he will teach for about 16 more years before he retires.

[DevonRex]

15. I think he's a better person

for having gone through that than he would have been if his life had been just peachy all the way. It certainly taught him not to be judgmental about other people's troubles. And I think that his teachers always knew how gifted he is and did their darndest to make sure nothing catastrophic went on his school record that would hamper him later on.

He did go back to the school last year to apologize to the ones who were still there and just to say thanks for having put up with him. The only one who was a bit cool towards him was his soccer coach. Seems that coaches remember hard losses forever. And when the captain of the team shows up tipsy for a big game, it's kinda hard to forget. :)

[leftofcool]

21. LOL. Coaches can be an odd lot

[ourbluenation]

50. oh please explain

by the way, not only is my husband a teacher, but he's also coach. I'd love to know why he's odd. Maybe because when you do the math, his coaching stipend pays him about .10 cents and hour, except after he's paid for all the supplies himself we're actually at a net loss. So yeah, besides his other low paying labor of love aka teaching, he has another one called coaching, which does make him odd in today's world.

but yeah, go ahead and tell me why he's odd.

[spartan61]

16. I'm a retired 2nd grade teacher and I say

Kudos to Obama!!! Parents tend to forget that they are the first teachers children have. Children need and want discipline. They know someone cares when boundaries are set.

[DemBones DemBones]

28. Talk is cheap -- what would he DO about the problem?

He's never taught anyone but law students so I doubt he has a clue what a public school teacher has to deal with.

[PVnRT]

33. Uh...what?

He's siding with the teachers and telling parents that they need to be more involved with their children's education. Which makes "I doubt he has a clue what a public school teacher has to deal with" pretty nonsensical, since that's exactly what he's addressing.

[knixphan]

38. talk isn't cheap when it's a wake-up call.

[1776Forever]

39. Oh yeah - I agree totally - I have noticed as an older person that parents seem to delegate this

to the TV, Video Games, even other people in a public venue like a movie theater or grocery store! I guess I should have said SOME parents delegate this to be fair not ALL of them! And I have told a few of them that too! I raised 5 boys and never did I get a report from school that they misbehaved!

:hangover:

[BlueIdaho]

45. Parenting is a verb

Just because you have kids doesn't mean you are a "parent."

[Bucky]

52. Parenting is a gerund

Also a participle. "To parent" is a verb.

This is a thread full of teacher, Blue, so you better watch your step or you'll be sitting in detention hall.

[BlueIdaho]

59. Pass the dunce cap this way... nt.

[Writer]

48. I will definitely agree with that.

Obama doesn't dig helicopter parents. THANK GOD!

[QC]

56. How do you feel about his support for "merit pay" and vouchers? n/t

[yasmina27]

58. Where have you seen/heard about him supporting vouchers?

I don't see anything on his website about this:

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/education/#k-12

As far as merit pay goes, I think it bears some consideration. In our district, teachers already earn more for advanced degrees. I read a realistic book over a year ago that described ways in which a teacher could receive "merit" pay, w/o relying on parents' or students' opinions. It actually sounded like some great ideas, and when I thing of the name of the book, I will post it.

As far as the msg. in the OP, I totally agree. My kids know I will always take the teachers side (except in an extreme situation, like the one mentioned earlier with the glue), as do their teachers. They are expected to respect adult authority, even if they disagree with them. We've never received a call from the school regarding their behavior. Parenting is the key, as is setting expectations for their behavior. I think some parents have bad memories of school themselves and look at their kids' teachers as targets for their revenge against the "system".

[NewHampshireDem]

60. In the age of cell phones ...

I send a kid to the office, and before he gets there, his mother is calling the principal to find out why I'm picking on her kid.

When I was in school, my mother was the *last* person who I wanted to know that I got in trouble; today, it's often the *first* person the kid tells. (The second being their friends, so they can brag about how the stupid assistant principal gave them detention, but they're going to skip it because their mom said it was stupid to get detention for getting kicked out of Mr.NHD's class for refusing to put away the iPod that mom bought him for Christmas, because it 'calms him down', even though he plays it so loud that everyone else in the room can hear it, which is like crack cocaine for the half dozen other kids in the room with ADD so that even that one really really nice kid who never gets into any trouble is yelling 'Turn that #$$% off, I'm trying to do my work' and pretty soon the whole classroom is starting to resemble a pop corn popper without a top but somehow the girl with the black hoodie still manages to sleep through it all.)

Oh well ...

And as for unions, I'd rather talk about the problems with our criminal justice system: If we simply did away with defense attorneys, prosecutor's jobs would be much easier and all the guilty people would be in jail.

[AtomicKitten]

67. He does and so do his supporters. Obama is winning Colbert's challenge for PA's schools.

He calls upon all of us to pony up. This guy is causing a wave across America that runs on truth and community. And I hope what Colbert has done in Penn for the schools with his website fundraising challenge can be replicated in schools across America. It's time to be the kind of society we all imagined. In the words of Thom Hartmann, activism begins with you - tag you're it.