Dean Changes his Tune. Whoever is the most "electable" candidate, will be the Nominee.

[Tellurian]

"Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean said superdelegates should make known their choices on the Democratic nominee for president by the end of June. Ultimately, he said he believes their decisions will be based on who is more electable, rather than necessarily who has the most pledged delegates, because that is what party rules stipulate."

"This is essentially pretty close to a tie here," Dean said on NBC's "Meet the Press."

"What's going to happen in the last nine primaries is there's going to be some feeling at some point that one of these candidates is more likely to win than the other and that person will get the nomination. I can't tell you who that is, I have no idea who that is, but that's what's going to happen" Dean said.

Dean also said he expected the party to heal from the bitter primary race if superdelegates make their decisions in June and that he believes Michigan and Florida delegates will be "seated in some way."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080427/ap_on_el_pr/democrats

This article also states...Obama refuses to debate Hillary- and I guess, according to Dean, it's not just the math that matters..It's who is the "strongest" Candidate at the end of these last Primaries!

http://www.taylormarsh.com/images2/hillaryclinton_wideweb__470x308,02.jpg

[cali]

1. sigh. Dean is saying what he's said all along, hilldroid.

[Kittycat]

4. No use trying to reason with a Hillis44 person.

They're only interested in spreading republican talking points and bumping elbows with Scaife. I doubt very many of them are even democrats - we know they're not activists/grassroots - because they're not under the bus with the rest of us, LOL.

[Tellurian]

13. actually, I'm spreading Dean talking points...

or haven't you noticed there is an OP at the top of the page.

[DemVet]

37. Please refrain..

...from calling Hillary supporters such names as Hillbot and Hilldroid.

Thank you...have a nice day.

[Danger Mouse]

48. Have you asked your fellow Hillary supporters to refrain from calling Obama supporters

Obamabots and Obamaniacs and the like?

[DemVet]

70. Why should I? That's your job.

[chascarrillo]

74. Whatever, hilldroid.

[marshall]

81. Isn't "Dittohead" a more accurate term for Hillary zealots?

They are her most active and vocal base.

[dcindian]

87. Right now only Neodems and ditto heads are supporting Hillary

So there :)

[Usrename]

53. Zellbots would be much more descriptive, wouldn't it?

:evilgrin:

[GarbagemanLB]

2. The SDs will not overturn the delegate leader. Sorry.

[PoliticalAmazon]

18. They would risk an uprising of Democratic Party voters, possible exodus from Party. n/t

[pompano]

56. I sure hope you....

are right, I really do. However, I have had an uneasy feeling lately that there may be a fix in the works. Something sure smells funny and it's not my lip. After 3 elections/selections we all have developed a third sense for voter manipulation. Once the media jumps on board it is virtually over for certain candidates, ala abRNC. The big money power brokers corporate theives (Hillary's base) have never had to take "No" for an answewr, I doubt they will start now.

I have suspected it all along as the SDs sat back idley while this party imploded on a day to day basis, and did nothing, most of them.

They were sitting back and waiting for Obama to step in a bucket of concrete that way at least they had the appearence of being fair to the candidate. This script may have been written long ago, and the fake outrage by Hillary was never genuine but certainly Academy Award winning.

I hope I'm wrong but I have an uneasy gut feeling. That will be, if true, the straw that broke the camel's back as far as me being a Democrat ever again. I'm not too dab durn far from an "I" on my voter registration card as it is. If henhouse shit like this unfolds, I have no reason other than a gut feeling it will, It'll make my decision so very much easier.

[newmajority]

3. Dean hasn't changed his tune about anything.

But nice try, drug pusher. :evilgrin:

[Kittycat]

5. They're having a run on Cialis at their Hannity talking point link today.

Everyone click today :rofl:

[Tellurian]

14. Typical 0bama supporter, fails to address the topic ..

next..

[Hawkeye-X]

32. I'll address the topic - Dean has always been very consistent

and that's exactly what he said.

You're trying to spin "electable" into who's popular - which is not the way the primaries work.

And go tell your webguy to fix the His44.org before I go upstream and notify Bluehost.com that the client's spamming which is against their AUP.

Hawkeye-X

[Tellurian]

6. Dean is not saying because Obama has the most delegates he is the nominee...

Dean is waiting for the results of the last string of primarys to determine the candidate who is the "most electable".

So all this nonsense the Bama peeps are pushing, spoon feeding the masses Obama is the Dem Nominee... is pure bunk! The underscore in the OP released today is Dean's carefully worded quote. His words sound nothing like the BS hype pedaled here daily by the reading comprehension challenged.

[graycem]

62. "More electable"

will NOT be judged on Hillary's opinion of more electable. If you think that the SD's do not know what the ramifications of their actions will be, whichever way they decide to vote, you're mistaken. Pledged delegates have a larger influence on that decision than any other element because they know the people voting for him, you know the people they need to win an election, will feel like it was all a sham. But, twist away.

[rodeodance]

67. more electable can mean criteria -such as sociological groups in big

states. who they perceive can best take on mccain in national security ect ect.

[Bad Thoughts]

7. Misrepresentation

Dean is quite vague on what it means to be the most electable candidate. You inserted your own metric--who is strongest at the end of the process--into his words.

[Tellurian]

16. Dean isn't vague at all...Dean's direct quote is in the OP

I don't have a problem understanding what Dean is saying. Apparently he isn't saying what you want to hear. You prefer telling people Obama is a done deal..0bama hasn't been crowned the Dem Nominee by anyone of authority. This race is still wide open.

[Orsino]

35. Then you noticed that "electable" wasn't his choice of words.

Let's just be careful about what is and isn't a direct quote.

[Bad Thoughts]

42. You are parsing

I've seen the whole interview, and Dean is asked about this several ways. He is consistent--SDs can vote however they want, by whatever criteria they want. What he predicts--which is different from an instruction to the SDs--is that they will vote for whomever they think will beat McCain. A prediction is not a guideline or instruction.

Even in the quote, Dean is talking about what he thinks will happen: that a prevailing sense of who is electable will become clear to the SDs, and they will be swayed accordingly. Again, this is not an instruction.

[anonymous171]

8. Still shilling for that spam site aren't you?

[goldcanyonaz]

9. Dean can not believe that Hillary has this much support.

and, us women ain't gonna back down.

[RC]

10. So then, you are backing Hillary because she is a female?

I'm not black, so why am I pushing Obama?
Is it maybe because he is a little more in tune with the American voter? He is not so quick to fly off the handle? He doesn't damage our foreign policy by threating to nuke Innocent civilians? Is more mature and thoughtful under pressure. McCain and Hillary seem to have a lot in common here.

It really is time to get some adults in charge for a change. Hillary hasn't proven herself to be a mature adult during this campaign. In fact just the opposite.

[goldcanyonaz]

11. Huh? I am a black female who supports Hillary. how has Obama proved himself?

[RC]

24. Obama has proven himself to be a responsible adult.

How has Hillary proven herself to be mature enough to handle the responsibilities of the presidency? With her negitive campaining, she comes up a little short in that area.

In case you didn't get it and you didn't seem too, I was being satirical about the sexism/racism of having a white woman and a black man running for the same office that has had neither occupy it.

Peace

[Zhade]

38. For starters, by not being caught in lie after lie with documented proof, unlike clinton.

Whine all you want about his alleged "lies", you can't provide one shred of concrete evidence of your assertions.

Meanwhile, clinton - Tuzla video, NAFTA meetings, mother who died IN HOSPITAL and WITH insurance.

You, and her, fail. Utterly.

[Tellurian]

45. Try typing in coherent sentences..

with additional information explaining your point of view in more detail about who, when, where and why..

my crystal ball is in the shop.

[rodeodance]

68. Obama has been caught in "in lie after lie with documented proof,"

[frickaline]

12. The title to this thread is a horribly misleading spin - here's the direct quote

"Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean said superdelegates should make known their choices on the Democratic nominee for president by the end of June. Ultimately, he said he believes their decisions will be based on who is more electable, rather than necessarily who has the most pledged delegates, because that is what party rules stipulate."

[boston bean]

15. woot, even better! nt

[Tellurian]

19. Yes, It's finally occured to Dean..

That Pelosi, Reid, Kennedy and Kerry are not the end all of the Democratic Party. That every eye in the World is on him in spite of any previous deals he's made with these slovenly groupbots.

[Tellurian]

17. Your exact direct quite is in the first paragraph of the OP..

what is it with these people?

[frickaline]

20. The problem the title is misleading, like I said, what's not to get?

Dean hasn't changed anything, the rules are the rules, he's just stating them again for anyone that was unaware. He's sticking to his guns and standing behind the party rules as they were agreed upon prior to the campaign.

[Tellurian]

21. Of couse he has...a few weeks ago he was touting Hillary step down..

[frickaline]

27. Not true, April 1st video enclosed - he has never changed this to my knowledge

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/23904990#23904990

Do you have a source for your assertion?

[dkf]

22. Candidates with high unfavorables like Hillary are unelectable.

Jeez...why do I even need to explain this.

[Tellurian]

23. Obama's unfavorables have risen with the Wright scandal..to 51% and climbing..

[dkf]

28. The only person with worse unfavorables than Hillary Clinton is George Bush.

Get with the program.

[Tellurian]

29. Obama is getting there with his "God Damed "America Pastor..

[DemBones DemBones]

50. Obama has picked up delegates in red state caucuses and

primaries but there is little chance of any Dem carrying states like Idaho, Utah, Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, South Carolina. He can't win any key Democratic blocs except the African-American vote and that's not enough to win the election.

Obama supporters need to get with the program and realize that an Obama nomination means a McCain presidency. Did you know that Obama has never won an election against serious competition? The one time he had real opposition he lost.

Obama has an lot of connections to people of questionable character which will continue surfacing; Wright, Rezko, Meeks are just the tip of the iceberg that will sink Obama's ship.

[cottonseed]

25. Dean knows SDs will swing for Obama

He's co-opting Hillary's argument. When the SDs complete their move to Obama she will not have one thick leg to stand on.

[Tellurian]

30. When you place your thumb on the scale; you're cheating...

thats what Courts are for. To decide if undue influence was used to decide an outcome.

[cottonseed]

34. I don't see what you're saying.

Hillary's entire reason for still being in requires the SDs to put their collective thumb on the scale.

[Zhade]

39. clintrolls don't mind cheating when it favors clinton.

They hue and cry about Fl and MI's unfair elections (particularly MI), yet don't mind every OTHER state being overruled by the SDs as long as clinton wins.

Thankfully, it won't happen, and idiots like the OP will be forced to stop lying about Obama or get the fuck off DU. I'm looking forward to the day Obama is officially the nominee for that very reason.

[Tellurian]

44. No, this has nothing to do with the SDs..

What I'm speaking about is the DNC Committee themselves.

[JoFerret]

26. Demographic data suggests that those suffering most

are favoring Hillary.

Makes sense to me.

[Hawkeye-X]

31. Who cares what you say - you have ZERO credibility with me - your His44.org is still infected

and I'm not interested in what you have to say until you get that thing fixed.

[intaglio]

33. Look Tellus person we all know

1) you support RW authors
2) You have a fixation upon Hillary to the point of insanity
3) That Dean has said this all along
4) That Hillary and her backers want rid of Dean
5) That Hillary will have to bribe or coerce votes away from Obama

[Zhade]

36. MEANWHILE, HERE IN REALITY: Dean maintains what he's always said, and Obama will be the nominee.

NT!

[NJSecularist]

40. What he has always said is not consistent with what the Obamites like to hear.

For a month or so, he has said that the superdelegates will choose who is more electable.

That may be Obama, but it may be not.

Must really bother the Obamites who thought the nominee was going to be handed on a silver platter because he has a miniscule delegate lead. :rofl:

[Hawkeye-X]

43. Coming from an ex-Obama supporter

I'm not surprised that you'd spout that bullshit.

Guess what? PA was her last chance to make a dent on Obama's delegate lead - she FAILED.

[Tellurian]

47. Yes, you are exactly right..

What I gather from Dean's statements today, he is getting a little shaky about his past pronouncements of the procedure stated in the DNC Rules for choosing the Dem Nominee. Dean has moved the goal posts so many times, I doubt he himself knows what the actual rules state, because he's never taken the time to read the Rules himself...

[susankh4]

41. He is singing a different tune, isn't he?

That makes me happy if he really means it!

May the Dems win, in 2008!

[Obamanaut]

46. How about this interpretation

"What's going to happen in the last nine primaries is there's going to be some feeling at some point that one of these candidates is more likely to win than the other and that person will get the nomination. I can't tell you who that is, I have no idea who that is, but that's what's going to happen," Dean said.

(same link as OP)

Here's what I think. In the last nine primaries, somewhere between #1 and #9 there will be a feeling that one will win THE PRIMARIES. That person will get the nomination.

[Yossariant]

49. Or --- you could read what he said, instead of wishfully thinking what you want him to say:

MR. RUSSERT: The candidate with the most ELECTED delegates is not guaranteed the nomination?

DR. DEAN: The rules say that the candidate with the most delegates gets the nomination, and I support the rules.

MR. RUSSERT: So that the superdelegates could, in effect, overrule the elected delegates?

DR. DEAN: That, you know, you shouldn't think of it that way. So-called "superdelegates" are, in fact, elected by exactly the same people who vote for the elected delegates. This is just--this is like an--a representative democracy. You elect a--80 percent of the delegates, and they have to do what you ask them to do. The others, the 20 percent you elect, essentially do what's in their best judgment, just like the House and the Senate does. Sometimes you like it, and sometimes you don't.

[Hoof Hearted]

51. I think Dean is laboring under the assumption that he'll still have a job

in a few months. He's an idiot.

[amelia]

52. K&R

[GoldieAZ49]

54. On uniting the party after a nominee is selected Dean said it would be critical

for the loosing candidate to rally their supporters behind the nominee. He said it took him 3 months to get his supporters behind Kerry.

[HopeforChange]

57. Ain't gonna happen with Obama Supporters if Clinton Gets it.

[GoldieAZ49]

58. And therein lies the problem

More Clinton supporters than Obama supporters have said they will not vote for the other candidate

I think it was 29% to 19% respectively, last I looked.

This is their hard core constituents and the numbers are probably a bit exaggerated, however they are large enough for dems to lose regardless of who the nominee is.

I think, but I could be wrong, that the candidates have hard feelings toward each other and will not enthusiastically support the other. They say they will, but they have to say that. We shall see.

[eridani]

55. No candidate who constantly used Rethug framing is electable

Obama occasionally breaks out of it, while Clinton never does.

[Tellurian]

59. It would be good if you could provide a few examples

Of Obama's rethug framing and that of Hillarys, allowing the reader to better understand what your claiming is the difference.

[eridani]

66. Obama has attacked Clinton from the right on Social security and health care

However, those offenses are pretty mild compared to Clinton attempting to scare the shit of of voters and naming McCain as more suitable for "commander in chief" than Obama. Obama breaks that frame on this issue and racism as well. Every time a Democrat even uses the term commander in chief when talking about presidential qualifications costs us hundreds of thousands of votes.

ttp://www.rockridgenation.org/blog/archive/2008/03/17/ask-rockridge-we-need-a-president-not-just-a-commander-in-chief

We were recently asked if "commander-in-chief" is a right-wing frame and whether progressives should refer to the presidency in this manner.

Though the words themselves are neutral, they have been used within a right-wing frame that is not obvious. The frame includes the following:


--The overriding challenge facing our country is military in nature.
--The military role of the president is therefore far more important than all of the other jobs he or she performs.
--Military experience, or direct experience with military affairs (e.g., the Armed Services Committee) --is the single most important experience needed for the presidency.
--The country should be governed on a military basis. The state should first and foremost be a security state.
--The temperament needed for a president is martial; the president should be a fighter and should be engaged in fighting.
--The governing style for a president should be giving orders and making sure they are carried out. --Others in public service should be obedient to the president’s orders.

That is what it means to make the “commander-in-chief” question the main issue in a campaign. The commander-in-chief frame shifts the role of the president away from governing our nation and into the more limited scope of managing military affairs. It takes us away from domestic questions, including other questions of protection and leadership.


That frame is not what America is about. It does not embody fundamental American values. Nor does it portray what the role of the government is in our democracy. The dual roles of government are protection and empowerment, as we have written elsewhere. Protection is not just military or police protection, but a wide range: consumer protection, worker protection, environmental protection, social security, protection from natural disasters and disease, and protection from economic devastation.

[Tellurian]

72. So your faulty comparison is based on nuance vs real issues?

[eridani]

73. The real issue is that Dems never win by repeating and validating Rethug framing

Fake chest-thumping and boogaboogabooga scare tactics do nothing but harm to us.

[Tellurian]

75. Well, thats the DNC for you..the stumbling and bumbling that has gone on is shameful

The DNC's behavior of late is appalling. The DNC has NEVER Won a presidential election. What does that tell you?

[eridani]

76. The DNC is not spreading Rethug memes and framing

That would be the Clinton campaign, and to a far lesser extent, Obama. The DNC is doing party organizing in all 50 states, something that never happened in the 80s and 90s. It takes time to recover from that kind of fucking up.

[Tellurian]

78. The DNC is making it possible for the GOP to win the election

what does it take for you to understand the mess Dean, Pelosi, Reid, Kennedy and Kerry have made of the DNC.. Kennedy is so embarrassed to campaign openly for Obama, he's visiting his volunteers instead on the Campaign trail.

After today, I imagine Kennedy fell off the wagon and will be incommunicado for a few months, until this scandal blows over. If it ever does.

[eridani]

85. The DNC has never been more effective at organizing Dem chapters in 50 states

Hillary is the one saying that the Rethug is more competent than another Dem.

[Tellurian]

86. Organizing and producing positive results are strangers to the DNC

[eridani]

89. You must think this is still the 90s, you know--

--back when we were bleeding governorships and losing control of Congress. This has changed since 2004, fi you hadn't noticed.

[graycem]

60. He has not changed his tune..

He has said this all along. It's a matter of selective hearing on your part. He has stated the rules many times, and is just doing so again.


GOV. ED RENDELL (D-PA): The popular vote is, to me, a much fairer indicia than the pledged delegates because the pledged delegates are elected in a very undemocratic way.

(End audiotape)

MR. RUSSERT: Do you agree with that?

DR. DEAN: Well, no, I don't. First of all, I don't agree with it. And secondly, look, we have a set of rules. My job here is not to side with one candidate or the other and talk about pledged delegates or superdelegates or any of that stuff. My job is to take the rules that everybody started with and enforce the rules without fear or favor of any candidate.
---

DR. DEAN: So Senator Rendell may say--I mean, Governor Rendell may not like the rules, but the rules are what we started with. Most of them have been in place for the last 25 years. That's what we've got to go by, whether you like the rules or you don't like the rules.

MR. RUSSERT: The candidate with the most elected delegates is not guaranteed the nomination?

DR. DEAN: The rules say that the candidate with the most delegates gets the nomination, and I support the rules.

MR. RUSSERT: So that the superdelegates could, in effect, overrule the elected delegates?

DR. DEAN: That, you know, you shouldn't think of it that way. So-called "superdelegates" are, in fact, elected by exactly the same people who vote for the elected delegates. This is just--this is like an--a representative democracy. You elect a--80 percent of the delegates, and they have to do what you ask them to do. The others, the 20 percent you elect, essentially do what's in their best judgment, just like the House and the Senate does. Sometimes you like it, and sometimes you don't. But these folks are elected, all, all of them, almost all of them are elected. A tiny minority are not elected; they're appointed. But most of them are elected. They're elected by the same people who went to the--who go to the conventions and go to the--vote in the primaries. They're governors, senators. A lot of them are, are, are DNC members. There's 21-year-olds there, there's--50 percent are women and so on, and on, on it goes. So this should not be looked at as some bunch of cigar-smoking folks in the back room slapping each other in the back and electing the next president. It doesn't work that way.




There has been NO tune changing. He is reiterating what he has said all along. As an Obama supporter, if she wins fair and square there is no problem. It is the backroom dealings we do not want, from EITHER candidate.

[tekisui]

61. No tune change there.

He is saying what he always has. SD's can choose, for their own reasons. Whomever they feel would be the best Nominee.

[Forkboy]

63. He hasn't changed anything, and neither have you.

[Freedom Train]

64. Dean gets it!

And if he's had this opinion all along, even better!

[Apollo11]

65. Howard Dean is being totally fair and balanced

I am studying the transcript of yesterday's Meet The Press, and it is clear to me that Howard Dean is being "fair and balanced".

Dean is defending the right of the superdelegates to exercise their judgement and support whichever candidate they think would have the best chance of beating John McCain in November.

He does not agree with the Obama campaign's implied position that the superdelegates are obliged to vote for whichever candidate has the most pledged delegates after all the contests are wrapped up.

Dean also said that he hopes the Rules Committee will find a way of dealing with Florida and Michigan that takes voters rights into account: "First, you got to respect the voters. The voters of Michigan and Florida were not the people that screwed this all up."

I have no idea why Obama supporters are jumping on this interview as if Dean was dissing Hillary or something.

Transcript: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24338217/

[Tellurian]

80. No,there is much going on behind the scenes not made public..

"Yesterday, at a strategy session I attended in Washington, DC, Clinton campaign director Terry McAuliffe alerted those present that two superdelegates from Florida had filed a formal complaint with Party's rules committee board, which is refusing to count them. Regardless of the status of the seating of the Florida delegation, it is a violation of DNC rules to refuse to seat the Florida's superdelegates (superdelegates are not chosen by primary).

Guess what Howard Dean is doing? Refusing to refer the complaint to the rules committee. Terry urged everybody in the room and everybody we know to contact the DNC and specifically ask that the RCB address the complaint filed by the two Florida delegates. The telephone number for the D.N.C. is 202-863-8000. Call and simply say that you want to make sure that the Party's rules committee addresses the Florida superdelegates' recently filed complaint immediately."

http://heidilipotpourri.blogspot.com/2008/04/very-specific-action-alert.html

"Senator Obama and his surrogates, including MoveOn.org, are waging a public relations battle to pressure the DNC to refuse credentials to the Michigan and Florida delegations for the Democratic National Convention. Their message consists of misrepresentations and lies about the DNC rules concerning these states. Unfortunately most news outlets and commentators are repeating this misinformation without ever checking the Obama campaign's claims for accuracy against the actual DNC rules.

It is critical that every one of us combat this misinformation. There has been much discussion recently about the will of the voters. We can't accurately determine which candidate has the greatest support amongst primary voters if we disregard the preference of 1.5 million voters in Florida while giving outsize weight to the 250,000 who caucused in Iowa, and even more outsize influence to the mere 20,000 people who participated in the Democrats Abroad contest.

Senator Clinton won decisive victories in both Florida and Michigan in January and is entitled to the delegates she won from those states. In the tight race for delegates, Florida and Michigan could decide who will be the Democratic nominee for president.

Regardless of who wins the nomination, it is important that the victory be based in the rules. If the nominee's victory is perceived to be based on false information or rules violations, the Party will be divided going into November. We can't afford such a scenario.

Please correct all misstatements and cite the actual sections of the Rules where applicable. Also direct the person repeating the misinformation to the actual DNC Delegate Selection Rules posted online at,

http://a9.g.akamai.net/7/9/80 82/v001/dem ocratic1.download.akamai.com/8082/pdfs/2 008delegateselectionrules.pdf

[Kurovski]

69. The upshot of all this and everything you will ever post is:

Senator Clinton has lost the nomination. You are trying to promote every possible angle to keep that terrible knowledge from yourself and the team. I will likewise pretend that the posts that lie, spin and manipulate are not intentional, but are borne of desperate desire.

The cruel insults, the striking out at others from Clinton supporters, are mere expressions of anguish and sorrow.

It is time for us to get in touch with our compassionate side when it comes to Clinton supporters. It is painful to lose. We all know what it feels like.

[Tellurian]

77. You should know..

You do all of what you posted, everyday in every way crudely and spitefully to all Hillary supporters!

And remember this:

Hillary will be the Democratic Nominee! Practice saying, Madame President!

http://www.taylormarsh.com/images2/hillaryclinton_wideweb__470x308,02.jpg

[Kurovski]

79. "I know you are but what am I?"

That's it?

"Mien Madam President".

I'll try to be nicer.

[Tellurian]

84. I'd appreciate that..

[mkultra]

71. he probably shoudl just say

Whoever is NOT Hillary should get the nomination.

Which is the case.

[SanchoPanza]

82. Of course electability is a key issue.

The operative word here, I believe, is "Duh."

Many of the currently unpledged delegates are elected officials, many of whom are seeking coat tails to ride in November. You also have a number of Senators who don't wish to create bad blood with either candidate. The rest are DNC members who are remaining unpledged for any number of reasons (wishing to remain impartial, seeking to get a cushy White House job/ambassadorship, etc). The remainder are Florida and Michigan delegates, who are irrelevent.

How this translates into a groundswell of SD support for Senator Clinton is the real mystery. You are making the assumption that your candidate is the only one who is electable. It's a mighty big one.

[Iwillnevergiveup]

83. Dean also stressed

that whoever LOSES the nomination has more influence in the general than he does. He told Russert it took him months to get his loyal supporters to get behind John Kerry and work for him as Dean did. Can we expect the same from Hillary?

:shrug:

[indimuse]

88. HA!

K&R! Thanks.