has Hillary ever explained her vote against ban on cluster bombs ?

[JI7]

Cluster bombs and landmines are particularly terrifying weapons that wreak havoc on communities trying to recover from war. They are fatal impediments to reconstruction and rehabilitation of agricultural land; they destroy valuable livestock; they disable otherwise productive members of society; they maim or kill children trying to salvage them for scrap metal.

Over 150 nations have signed the 1997 Mine Ban Treaty. It pains me that our great nation has not. But in the autumn of 2006, there was a chance to take a step in the right direction: Senate Amendment No. 4882, an amendment to a Pentagon appropriations bill that would have banned the use of cluster bombs in civilian areas.

Senator Obama of Illinois voted IN FAVOR of the ban.

Senator Clinton of New York voted AGAINST the ban.

Analysts say Clinton did not want to risk appearing "soft on terror," as it would have harmed her electibility.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-rees/clinton-obama-and-clust_b_84811.html

[MrSlayer]

1. Has anyone ever asked her?

I wonder why? Especially considering ridiculous questions about flag pins and shit that have been asked.

[thoughtcrime1984]

2. Republican Neo-cons do not have to explain ANYTHING.

So STFU. :sarcasm:


BTW, great post!

[krispos42]

3. Probably because it's already illegal to use cluster bombs in civilian areas

The same way it's illegal to use white phosphorus in civilian areas.

Cluster bombs are an effective and useful weapon.

I understand that many of the complaints about cluster bombs is that many of the bomblets fail to detonate upon impact, laying like little land mines until disturbed.

If true (and I have no reason to doubt this), then we obviously need to make better cluster bomblet fusing mechanisms with a timer as a back-up detonation device.

[crankychatter]

12. 98% civilian casualties mostly children murdered or maimed

the International Red Cross has advocated this ban for obvious reasons

and you think perhaps she just wants to build a kinder, gentler bomb, eh?

and THAT explains that?

"philosophizing disgrace"

[JI7]

15. well, isn't that one reason she should vote against it's use

and what you say is like saying there is no need to ban machine guns because it's already illegal to use them to kill innocent people.

[tekisui]

23. And white phosphorous was dropped on civilians in Iraq.

We need US laws to ban the use.

[guyanakoolaid]

4. K&R

Most hillary supporters stick their fingers in their ears when confronted with Hillary's repeated pro-war votes. I'm not expecting much response or intelligence from them on this.

[lligrd]

5. Hillary Thrives On Violence

That has become quite apparent.

[Hardrada]

6. She unleashed her inner Genghis Khan!

[still_one]

7. No, and this was a bill introduced by Feinstein, not a liberal

The reason she voted for the IWR, the Kyle/Lieberman ammendment, the use of cluster bombs in civillian areas, and even sticking with Bill Clinton after he cheated on her so many times, is because of poltical ambition

She thought she could use Bill Clinton's political clout to advance her career. She thought voting for the IWR, Kyle/Lieberman ammednment, etc., and recently threatening to nuke Iran if they attacked Israel, would make her look tough.

All of these things make her look like a disingenuous person to in my view

[lligrd]

8. Another One That Used To Pretend To Be A Liberal

but apparently has no use for us now!

[still_one]

9. Feinstein always played both sides of the road. You may have thought

she was a liberal, and on some issues she appeared to be, but if suddenly the wind blew from a different direction, she would change in the blink of an eye if she thought it would help her politically

Sound familiar?

[lligrd]

10. Yep, I Don't Think Anything Pisses Me Off More That Those

who change sides for political reasons or to fill their own pockets. Neither Feinstein, nor Hillary will ever get another vote of mine.

[Moochy]

11. She's got a nice house for all her troubles

She's the Gatekeeper to the Party in the Golden State.

[newmajority]

13. At least she never fooled Jello!

He was on to Diane when she was still in SF

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLw45xAq904

[cali]

14. Actually, this legislation was offered jointly by Feinstein and Leahy

and Leahy is a liberal. I agree with you about Clinton's motivation.


http://leahy.senate.gov/press/200702/021507d.html

[chknltl]

17. Re: Senator Clinton's reasons, perhaps you are right perhaps no.

I can not get into her head like that, I CAN disagree with her actions though and do so often enough. I am a BIG fan of Senator Patty Murray-(D Wa), and she actually explained her reasons for voting for that Kyle/Liebermian bill. I disagree with her but to be honest I do not think she did it to advance her VERY secure political future. This is why I say I can not get into Senator Clinton's head as to why she acts and votes as she does. Here is a link to what Senator Patty Murray had to say about why she voted for Kyle Lieberman:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=184x14136

Part of me feels that the problem with BOTH Senators Clinton and Murray may stem from being courted so heavily by the Military Industrial Complex. I believe in my heart that Senator Murray may not be as tainted by the corpartists as is Senator Clinton but then she is not running for POTUS. Perhaps the M.I.C. has chosen her to be the next in line to carry their water because they knew that there was no way in hell a republican would wind up in the White-House in 08. I know that if I was a corporatist who did well under bush I would have wanted a Dem to groom for '08 and I would have started doing this long ago. (Which may explain why Senator Clinton acted as though she was going to be in the White House from early on AND why she acts as she does now)

[MADem]

16. Has anyone asked Obama why he has taken large sums from the people who MAKE cluster bombs?

They're a General Dynamics product. GD is owned by the Crown family, and the Crowns have given Obama hundreds of thousands over the years. That's the company for whom he put in that large earmark.

[hokies4ever]

19. Nothing wrong with using cluster bombs

in open battlefields away from civilian populations. It's an effective way to take out lightly armored tanks and supply vehicles. Notice that it's a ban on their use in CIVILIAN areas. Reading comprehension is essential.

[MADem]

25. Oh, I see. Clinton needs to "explain," and Obama does not. OK. NT

[hokies4ever]

18. She's a warmonger

screw innocent civilians. Hillary is just an idiot, plain and simple. Pandering to look strong on terror at the expense of innocent civilians in the wars she loves.

[MADem]

26. And Obama, getting tons of money from a company whose BUSINESS is WAR,

isn't.

Yup. Gotcha.

Cites, because we always like cites:

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/node/31965

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2008/3/13/20101/1807

These are interesting articles, FWIW.

[Texas Hill Country]

28. YUP. This is a very complicated subject with lots of implications. You cant simplify this one.

[JI7]

30. what has that got to do with Hillary voting AGAINST BAN ON CLUSTER BOMBS

[aquarius dawning]

20. I wouldn't have voted to hamstring our soldiers either. If cluster bombs save US soldier's lives,

they're OK as far as I'm concerned. We all know that BO is weak on national defense and this is just another clear example of why he is the wrong person for the job.

[formercia]

21. Funding for the Fellowship

comes in part from defense contractors:

http://www.larryflynt.com/notebook.php?id=134


--snip--
A U.S. government higher-up claims, on the condition of anonymity, that the Fellowship (which operates as a nonprofit organization) is merely a tax dodge for Big Business interests. "They use religious members as dupes to further their nonreligious goals," says the official.

However, it's hard to ignore the multitude of powerful people in this country who are involved. Noting its close ties with the White House and the defense industry, some Beltway insiders have dubbed the Fellowship Foundation the "Christian Mafia." One senior Pentagon official disclosed that The Cedars has been used as a CIA safe house.

The Fellowship is supported entirely by private donations, and its members are champions of pro-Big Business, anti-environmental and pro-censorship legislation straight from the policy statements of the Christian Coalition. Although the group does notable charity work and professes a deep love for Jesus, many of its financial backers have made billions manufacturing weapons of war. One big-time donor is Tom Phillips, chairman and CEO of Raytheon, a major supplier of missiles and laser-guided bombs.

--snip--

[Skwmom]

22. She has to look tough to win the presidency. So what if people are maimed and killed.

When people say the Clintons will do ANYTHING to win the presidency, that means anything. What's really troubling is how many Clinton supporters have absolutely no problem with this. In anything (including politics) you would think that there would be a decency line that a person would not cross.

[TragedyandHope]

24. A sign of strength or weakness?

:kick:

[Texas Hill Country]

27. the landmine ban is a very difficult on RE: Korea... it would require quadrupling our troops

or more.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

29. True, but we could demand smarter mines & bombs

It would not be overly difficult to engineer a cluster bomblet that disarms itself after a while, like 20 min after being dropped. Or the same with a mine, just a longer span (months or a few years) after being armed. But it would take Congress to push such a design.

Kids just seem to be attracted to shiny unexploded bomblets.