If you are a Clinton supporter who is unsure about supporting our nominee, Obama

[Colobo]

in the fall, can you come in and tell us why? What are you expecting from him? What do you wanna hear him say or see him do?

What do you need in order to support our nominee and join forces to beat McCain in the fall?

[Colobo]

1. Please talk to us.

[highplainsdem]

2. I want him to put Hillary on the ticket.

I would like some assurance that he really can unify the party, and build a coalition.

I'll vote for him anyway, given the alternative. But it won't be with any real enthusiasm, and I won't give him much chance of winning the GE.

Unity tickets are a good winning strategy when the party is as evenly divided as ours is now. And it saddens me to see so many Obama supporters saying they'd never accept it.

Some of his supporters act as if they've already won the GE. All we've finished is a practice to see who's the team captain for the real game, and ALL the team members on our side are needed.

[Colobo]

4. Obama/Clinton is a fair option in my opinion.

[woolldog]

82. Obama/Clinton

:puke:

She would attempt to undermine his authority as president and weaken him at every turn if she were VP.

Plus I'm not convinced she would even want to win in 2008 if she accepted the VP slot. She might try to tank the campaign from the inside, as the VP candidate, in the hopes of running again in 2012.

Plus her presence on the ticket would undermine Obama's message of change and turning the page on the past.

Plus it would also kill some of his appeal with Independents and Republicans.

[salbi]

11. I'd like to explain why I dont want Hillary on the ticket....

I started this season being a Obama supporter but really liking all the candidates. After this long season and all the negative campaigning by Hillary I can't see her on the ticket. She has attempted to do so much damage to Obama that while it may get them votes to be together, I think there may be too many genuine bad feelings towards each other for either of them to work together for the good of the country.

As much as I hate to say it, I don't trust her to work to get him elected. She has continued to try to damage him even after knowing she won't win. I think she does want him to lose so she can run again in 4 years. I don't mean that as an insult to her supporters, it's just my thoughts after watching her these past months.

[StevieM]

128. And that attitide is why many of us Clinton backers are so angry

I don't agree with the version of history you have presented. Hillary has run for president because she loves the country. And if the race was truly rightfully over then Obama would have the needed delegates.

I don't think Obama supporters understand that the basis for reunification cannot be anything approaching the condescending terms that you will want. It can't be something like Obama saying: "We need to forgive Hillary and remember all the good she has done in the past. Yes, she has behaved badly, but we all make mistakes. If anybody deserves forgiveness and redemption it is Hillary Clinton. So let's let bygones be bygones and welcome her back. She once stood for the old order but today I truly believe that nobody is more committed to our revolution then Hillary Clinton."

This kind of condescending an degrading peace is no peace at all--it is a facillitator to a high five between David Axelrod and David Ploufe. Obama will have to chose between the high five and the Clinton supporters. Unfortunately, I think he is convinced he can have both.

Steve

[Texas Hill Country]

16. yup

[Ganja Ninja]

54. He can't put Hillary on the ticket.

Don't you remember her saying that both her and John McCain were better qualified than Obama? How can she debate a GOP VP candidate or go on the Sunday morning talk shows after that? She burned a bridge when she did that and that's her own fault. He couldn't possibly put her on the ticket.

[MonkeyFunk]

59. I don't remember that because she never said it

[Goblinmonger]

85. I remember that she said this:

"I think that I have a lifetime of experience that I will bring to the White House. I know Senator McCain has a lifetime of experience to the White House. And Senator Obama has a speech he gave in 2002."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/04/clinton-mccain-has-more-_n_89758.html

Sounds pretty much like it to me.

[MonkeyFunk]

88. Well you're wrong

[Ganja Ninja]

93. No you're wrong.

That was the comment. She's burned her bridges in this campaign and it's not Obama's job to rebuild them for her.

[Goblinmonger]

94. ???

She didn't say that?

[Terran]

103. lol, well how do you interpret those word, eh?

Sheesh, wake up.

[maddiejoan]

3. I'll vote for him

I just don't have any faith that he can win the GE, and if he even manages to pull that off --I don't think he'll be able to weather the difficulties of his first term. I truly believe Hillary was the right choice for the times. Sorry

I see Obama's nomination as a mistake that I'll just have to live with.

Thankfully, I don't see McCain as having more than one term either. The 44th Presidency is going to be a hard one.

Our shot at 8 years of a Democratic President followed by a 8 more years of a Democratic President will have sailed without a Clinton/Obama ticket.

So --I'll vote for Obama--but I won't get my hopes up the way I did for Gore or Kerry.

[Colobo]

5. I guess I can just ask you to stay tuned- I'm sure Obama will

impress you by handling McCain with relative ease. Or at least, that's what I'm hoping...

Still, nice to know you are on board.

[maddiejoan]

8. I wouldn't call myself "onboard"

Obama's campaign has left me feeling like an outsider looking in.

He's the first Democratic candidate to make me feel like that. The only reason I would pick him over McCain, is his policy positions are far closer to mine than McCain's.

Also --and this overlooked by the folks here at DU:

Hillary has made it abundantly clear that she will support Obama if he is the Democratic nominee. THAT means quite a lot to me.

[MonkeyFunk]

10. Yep

that's exactly how I feel. Like I've been left out, and I, too, have never felt like that before. And my first choice has NEVER gotten the nomination before, either. Something's different about this time.

[Colobo]

13. But what can he do to make you feel part of this great movement?

[maddiejoan]

20. He could become a Democrat

right now --it feels like he's running a third party science-fiction candidacy on the Democratic Party's dime.

Picking Hillary as his VP would be a start -- Frankly, I find his bold new vision of the future, complete with Soviet Constructivist style artwork, Corporate style loganeering, and Orwellian buzzwords to be frightening.

Your phrase "Great Movement" doesn't help

[Colobo]

23. You sound angry and dissapointed, and I truly respect your feelings.

Hopefully time will make you change your mind.

[maddiejoan]

24. Not angry or disappointed

I'm worried.

[Colobo]

26. I can understand that too. But I believe the sense of optimism

that is inside all of us Obama supporters will get to you at some point. There are greats ahead for America... believe it, maddie.

[maddiejoan]

27. All I can offer right now is my vote

and that's on shaky ground.

Today's little Hillbash fest trying to paint her as racist is definately not helping.

[BlackVelvet04]

44. You could start by not making us puke

by using the expression "great movement".

[Maven]

36. Agree 100%

with everything you said.

Well stated.

[MattBaggins]

40. I really hate to have to say this

but I am not really sure if she has made it abundantly clear or just payed lip service to it.

[tired]

120. How do you feel like an outsider?

Did you vote? Because if you did you were just as involved as most of us. Both candidates are status quo and that is something we must accept. I am glad that you will at least set aside your differences to vote for him IF he is the nominee. Just as I will do for Hillary IF she is the nominee.


The goal here is to not have another ass hole piss in our corn flakes every morning for the next four years.

[bleuvixen]

17. Yes

I hope I see that from him, I have zero faith in anyone in Politics and I hope he does right by the American People. That said I am still be hind him when he becomes the Nominee.

[BlackVelvet04]

53. He was looking for Hillary to

save him from all the Wright flap. He thinks Hillary was a tough opponent...I'm just soooooo sure he can handle McCain, LOL. Please, what alternate universe do you live in?

[msongs]

6. if we can't have a real progressive/anti imperialist, obama will have to do over mccain nt

[Colobo]

7. Let's unite.

[BlackVelvet04]

38. I find these "let's unite" posts

extremely disingenuous. NOW you want to unite while Obama and his supporters sat back and kept their mouths shut about the way Hillary Clinton has been treated? The misogyny has been at an all time high and as far as I'm concerned, now that you think you just may need our votes it is too late to extend the olive branch.

I have a suggestion as to what Obama and his supporters can do with their enthusiasm.

[newmajority]

32. See, this is what I can't understand

People speaking of Hillary as if she were the second coming of Jesus, Ghandi, and John Lennon all rolled into one.

Have you not paid attention to what the DLC is all about?

We have the opportunity to end their reign of terror over this party. Let's not waste it.

And for the record, I'm not saying Obama is the ultimate progressive either. But he recognizes the fact that the policies of the last 28 years are NOT working. And that alone makes him a better choice than Hillary.

[BlackVelvet04]

42. I've never seen anybody speak

of Hillary as Jesus, Ghandi and Lennon all rolled into one...that was the Obama supporters role.

[MonkeyFunk]

91. That's odd

Clinton supporters to me seem to be political realists. It's the Obama fans who seem to be looking for redemption in a politician. You assign near mystical powers to him.

[Mudoria]

81. Said it better than I could have

he'll have my vote in the fall but I won't be supporting him or doing any work to get him elected.

[Beacool]

9. I will not vote for Obama.

There's nothing that he can say to me to change my mind. If Hillary happened to be on the ticket, then I would hold my nose and vote for him. Otherwise, no way. BTW, plenty of others feel the same way.

[Colobo]

14. Why? For a Democrat to say such thing, there has to be a powerful reason.

[GarbagemanLB]

19. Obama the meanie took Hillary's rightful spot on the throne...isn't it obvious?

[BlackVelvet04]

45. Look, the garbageman is spewing garbage....

what a surprise.

[Beacool]

35. Plenty of them

Let's start with the fact that I have come to dislike this man almost as much as I dislike Bush. Every time he appears on my screen I change the channel. First time I have ever felt like that about a Democratic presidential candidate. I don't hate the guy, I just feel utter disdain for him.

I think that he's a slick operator who has managed to jump to the head of the line due to his great oratorical skills and charm. This would be fine if we were electing the prom king, but not a president. The country is in too much trouble to let a rookie hold the reins of power.

He lost me completely when they tried to make the Clintons appear to be racists.

The only way I can remotely see myself voting for him would be if Hillary is also on the ticket. Though, I have no idea whether she's even interested in the position.

[SanchoPanza]

83. The Line?

There is no line. No one deserves to be the nominee of a political party, much less the President of the United States. Vice Presidents have been challened by members of their own party. Even Presidents have been challenged by members of their own party. Do you feel the same way about Bill Bradley? Bobby Kennedy?

Even if there was a line, by what right does Sen. Clinton have to be at the head of it? In terms if longevity in public office, she is actually close to the bottom of all the seekers of the Democratic nomination. Biden has been in the Senate since 1972. Dodd since 1980, but served in the House for 6 years prior. Richardson had been in the House for 14 years prior to becoming governor of New Mexico. Kucinich was mayor of Cleveland for one term, then served ten years in the House. Gravel served 12 years in the Senate. Obama spent 8 years in the Illinoid Legislature. The only person she beats is Edwards, who served one term in the Senate.

[Eric Condon]

126. You need to ask yourself: who exactly was it that "made the Clintons appear to be racists?"

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Qqd2dfjl2pw

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-05-07-clintoninterview_N.htm

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2008/1/11/91224/1850

[salbi]

15. That is the same as voting for McCain

I do understand your feelings. There have even been times when I have been so angry at Clinton that i have said on here that I would never vote for her. Then I calmed down and realize that although she would not be my first choice, she would be 100% better for the country than McCain would be. I hope that by November, you will be able to look at it that way too. You don't have to like Obama, but please do what you must to keep McCain from winning.

[BlackVelvet04]

48. No it's not the same as voting for McCain...

it's the same as NOT voting for Obama. I don't OWE him my vote.

[salbi]

66. Of course you don't owe him your vote, but do you really want McCain to win??

[BlackVelvet04]

67. I don't want Obama to win any more than I want McCain to win...

I refuse to hold my nose and vote yet once again.

[Terran]

105. You've argued yourself into a corner

Do you actually believe the two men are the same?

[cjsmom]

64. I have been a democrat for over 30 years

And I will change my party affiliation the day after Obama gets the nomination. Why? Because I am a moderate and he is too much of a Marxist for me. You can call me a racist if you want, I do not care. As far as I'm concerned Obama's skin color is the least of his problems as a candidate.

[nadinbrzezinski]

68. Obama a Marxist? WOW

I've known marxists in my life.... and I mean dyed in the wool classic marxists.

BO is NOT one...

Of course we may want to ask you for any speech where Obama used Marxist analysis

And yes this needed to be confronted

It is right up there with Obama is a muslim meme, and comes from the same source, the RW

By the way if he was a marxist... he'd not be about to take the nomination

[Emit]

78. That's the long-standing Fox News, Hannity, Rush meme

I wonder how many people who believe this "Obama is a Marxist" get their 'news' from Fox and right wing talk radio? :shrug:

[nadinbrzezinski]

104. BINGO

And this is from Fox....

People need to go buy a fucking clue.

It is getting bad....

[Eric Condon]

127. So his skin color is a "problem?"

Thanks for clearing that up.

Guess what? We're not stupid. We get it. I'm alerting.

[bleuvixen]

21. Sad to hear

Sorry, as a staunch Hillary supporter myself, this is terrible to hear and I do hope you reconsider for you, for your country, for fellow americans, for your children's and for MY children's future.

[yodermon]

55. Enjoy Scalia's claws in your uterus, then. n/t

[Emit]

79. Now that's a poweful picture!

egads

Think, people, think, before you cast your vote for McCain!

[A-Schwarzenegger]

109. Yoicks!

[Bucky]

84. I heap scorn on you. I ridicule you. I insinuate that you're a fanatic & a racist.

Then later, I'll blame your divisiveness if we lose the election.

.

[Beacool]

110. Funny, accurate, but funny!!!

:rofl:

[faithfulcitizen]

86. I said the same thing about Kerry in 2004.

and I voted for him. Still think he was the wrong pick, but I did what was right.

[otohara]

102. Bea

you're not cool.

[Beacool]

111. Says you.............

:7

[justinboston2008]

12. Because I worked tirelessly for Deval Patrick

and I ate the bull shit served by Axelrod hook, line and sinker. One only has to look at the dismal approval ratings of our first hope and change Governor and see that when it comes to hopeful rhetoric. I watched it get deflated like an undercooked souffle. I think Senator Clinton is the right candidate to take on McCain and I think Senator Obama will not win. Plain and simple. Does that mean that I won't vote for him? Of course not, but I will be saying I told you so come November.

My parents generation had to have their McGovern. So I guess it is our turn.

[Marrah_G]

92. Wow... i guess I am not the only one. I posted much of the same below

[Beacool]

112. Oh yeah, Axelrod, Obama's Karl Rove.

He's specialty is getting AA candidates elected. He's good at his job, pity he chooses the light weights like Patrick and Obama. All fluff, no substance.

[BigDDem]

18. I've said from day one

I just don't think he's ready. I mean he started running for president 2 years into his FIRST term as Senator.
To be frank, I have a lot of resentment toward some of the Obama supports. I have been called a "racist" and "hater" simply because I
don't think he's ready. WTF? I would say that for anyone who ran for
president with the same amount of experience. Black, white, brown, whatever.
I've also said many times that he's smart, very talented and without a doubt one of the best speakers I've ever heard.
I simply don't think he's ready.

[Hatchling]

22. I'm trying to come around.

It's difficult with the perceptions I have of Obama and his campain tactics. I won't go into those perceptions because that isn't the point oft his thread.

I was at the "write-in HIllary's name/vote for Mckinney stage". Since Hillary has said that she will work her heart out to support the nominee, I have been trying very hard to reconcile myself to following her wishes. And only because that is what she has said.

What would make it easier is who his VP is. I want it to be Hillary. I would be content if he choose Biden. With either of those VP choices, I would come around immediately. Other choices will make it more difficult.

It has also helped that there have been a few non-virulent threads from Obama supporters explaining the advantages of voting for him. This thread is also a good one.

I also want her to go to the convention. This is important to me. I have no hope now that it will make any difference in the nominee, but I remember how disappointed I was when Edwards broke his promise to go all the way to the convention. Just let her do that. If our first viable woman candidate has to lose the nomination, let it happen at the convention, not by forcing her out. It's only a few weeks. Let it play out.

[MonkeyFunk]

25. I will vote for him

but that's all I'll do. Not even a yard sign.

I find something very worrisome about his campaign - the hatred his supporters spout, the anger, the "with us or against us" mentality. I find it all very right-wing.

Never in all my years of being active in politics have I seen the winning team be so mean, so nasty, so ungracious.

[MattBaggins]

47. Oh come on and spare us

Your camp has not been one licking iota better behaved.

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MattBaggins]

77. I suppose Hillary followers have their blinders

and Obama supporters have their own

[Wetzelbill]

123. I've been neutral on both but no way is that true

Both sides are equally as bad. Obama's started off worse, but Hillary's supporters around here caught up in the last two months. It's ugly all around, neither side is above the fray, but both sides seem to think they are better than the other. Not so. And I'm not saying you specifically, I've always respected you. As for the getting kicked out the party or Senate, you are right, I haven't seen anybody say that about him, and yeah, her credentials get questioned all the time.

[stillcool]

113. I have read your posts...

and you are very consistent. Accusations and slurs don't get you too far do they? Or is that really what it's all about?

[DemVet]

28. What do I need from him? MORE EXPERIENCE!

[Beacool]

29. Bingo, give the man a prize!!!!!!!

Therein lies the crux of the matter. This overly ambitious guy with a huge ego has very little experience.

[my2cent]

30. Thank you

[newmajority]

31. So which President should he marry to get that "experience"?

:eyes:

[faithfulcitizen]

89. lol. he could leave Michelle for Madeline Albright?

:D

[Vinca]

34. Obama can't get in a time machine and add 20 years to his life,

so it boils down to voting for him - an incredibly intelligent man who is already making headway in Nigeria re foreign affairs - or McCain, a man with long experience who has consistently made the wrong choices. If you consider the people Obama is apt to surround himself with - people like Dodd, Biden, Richardson, Kennedy and Hillary Clinton - compared to McCain's likely advisors - Lieberbush, Lindsey Graham, Mitt Romney and the rest of the usual right wing suspects - it should be evident why the Democratic candidate should be supported. (And, of course, there is the Supreme Court to consider as well.)

[Hippo_Tron]

100. Lincoln had no experience, FDR had little more than Obama does

Hoover had decades of experience. Bush theoretically had "experience" as a Governor of a big state.

Experience is a crock. There is no experience that prepares one for the presidency. Some are good at it, some are horrible at it. You can't find out until they get there.

[Terran]

107. Bill Clinton had zero national experience. n/t

[BlackVelvet04]

33. I'm not unsure...

I know I won't support him.

It's too late for him to do anything that would change my mind.

The only thing I want to hear him say is he's dropping out.

[democrattotheend]

37. Why?

The whole purpose of this thread was for Clinton supporters to say why they won't or may not vote for him. Just calling for him to drop out doesn't add anything constructive.

[GarbagemanLB]

39. WHY? He took Princess Hillary's rightful spot on the throne! She DESERVED this nomination!

[BlackVelvet04]

43. Your username is appropriate. n/t

[GarbagemanLB]

46. Go ahead. Sit out November. Those pro-life groups will thank you when Roe v. Wade is overturned.

[BlackVelvet04]

49. Not my problem...

the young women of this country may just have to fight that fight all over again to appreciate it....I don't have to worry about getting pregnant. They can't be bothered to support a woman, fuck em.

[Forkboy]

51. That's the spirit!

:eyes:

[BlackVelvet04]

52. Oh, look, he used a rolling eyes emoticon...

I'm crushed.

[Forkboy]

58. You deserve nothing less.

Sorry you care so little for women's rights now that your choice lost. I can't think of a bigger example of immature spite than what you've just said.

Don't ever bring up sexism because you don't give two shits about women. You just made that clear. "Fuck 'em!"

Here's another one;
:eyes:

[BlackVelvet04]

60. I fought for those rights that most of the younger women take

for granted. They decided to piss on those rights when they couldn't stand up and criticize the obvious sexism against Hillary Clinton. They excused the "fucking whore" comments, they excused all the incidences of misogyny.

And the opinion of little forkboy on D.U. doesn't mean a damn to me.

[Forkboy]

63. It must mean something...you responded to it.

:hi:

[GarbagemanLB]

57. Wow. You sound like you'd fit more in with Freepers than here...

[BlackVelvet04]

70. gosh...

I think that's against the rules, isn't it garbagespewer? I used to post on a board that was mixed with liberals and conservatives and the Obama supporters have put the conservatives on that board to shame with their nastiness and bullshit. I didn't think that was possible...so it's not me who belongs with the freepers.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

73. Condi/Coulter '08!

They're women, right?

[nadinbrzezinski]

96. Now that is a DREAM ticket!!!!!!!!

Who's on top?

My lord, I went low I know

[Mags]

90. I agree with you on that. Let them take over, that's what they want

let them fight the fight that old women like me has fought for. I have done all I could do, but they prefer to sweep us out of the way, so as you just said, fuck em.

[Eric Condon]

129. So because female Obama supporters made a perfectly legitimate decision to support him over Clinton,

they deserve to lose the right to make decisions about their own bodies?

I'm sorry, but if you honestly believe that, then you are out of your fucking mind and don't belong ANYWHERE near these boards.

[BlackVelvet04]

41. I've tried to add something constructive many times...

only to be "shouted" down. What difference does it make why I won't support him? Seriously....can you or can he go back and change what's happened? If I stated my reasons why it would just be a reason for an Obama supporter to tell me how stupid and wrong I am...fuck that. I've had enough of that.

[nadinbrzezinski]

56. Take some time away from here

go take some walks in the park

Do some thinking

If in the end you want to seat the election out fine by me

But realize that in life we don't always get what we want. Lord knows I didn't want either Hillary or Obama to get the nod

But... the alternative... four more years of Bush... will destroy the country

Perhaps you don't care about roe v wade... do you care about social security?

[BlackVelvet04]

62. Sorry you don't get it...

how the fuck do you know what I do with my time? I seldom come on D.U. and now I know why.

[nadinbrzezinski]

65. Look, I get it... it is painful to see a dream end

But what I also get is that if McCain gets the presidency you will see much more than just social security or women's rights go away...

And I fear it is YOU who doesn't get it

By the way if you think Obama is my preferred candidate you'd be wrong... I voted for EDWARDS... but the primary is essentially over

It is time to line up behind the nominee... as hard as this may be... wear a hazmat suit if need be

You could also vote for McINsane (FOUR MORE WARS).. that is YOUR prerogative as a citizen

You can stay home, no problem go for it... your choice... in my view you abrogate your right to bitch ... but nobody can tell if you voted or not and I suspect you'll do it anyway.

:-)

You could vote third party... and lord knows I want to see strong third parties emerge... we need that... but to make that work we also need changes in electoral laws

You could write her in during the GE, which essentially is a vote for McCain

Them are your choices... Those are the ONLY choices.

That's it.

And many people who are PISSED right now will go to the booth in November and vote for Obama, quietly, holding nose, what have you, but they will. Some will vote for McCain... and if enough do... he wins... a few will seat it out... some will write her in, or DK or Nader or insert here... and a few will vote third party.

My goal is to get a Democrat into the WH... you think I am peachy keen about voting for EITHER BO or HRC? No... they are centrists, and far from what I think the country needs... but they are much better than McCain... and the math is clear... any clear thinking observer can see it now. BO is the nominee

[BlackVelvet04]

69. I'm not one who will be going to the polls and holding my

nose to vote for him. I get it...I get a whole lot about the Democratic Party and it SUCKS. they pitted their two most loyal groups against each other and for what? Kerry's, Kennedy's and Dean's petty dislike of the Clintons. Well, fuck em. I don't owe the Democratic Party anything. I've never walked lockstep with any party and I won't start now. IMO Obama is nothing more than the left's version of george w. bush....a manufactured empty suit do nothing candidate. So come November I'll take a page out of Obama's book and vote PRESENT.

What I see clearly is a Democratic Party who thinks they can take women for granted. Not this time.

[nadinbrzezinski]

71. Then say home, THIS WOMAN will be voting

on November

PERIOD

Why? I cannot look into my nephews eyes and vote for McCain, that is NOT the type of country I want to live in

But after the election don't bitch about McCain if he wins ok... don't bitch about the radical judges

Don't bithc about not having enough to eat

I don't want to hear about it.

[BlackVelvet04]

72. I can and will bitch about what I want when I want....

vote for who you want, I really don't give a shit.

[nadinbrzezinski]

75. You can do what you want...

....

And I will vote, because it is not ONY MY RIGHT but MY DUTY


Something that people who have that given to them by birth do not understand.

have a good day and chiefly life

[BlackVelvet04]

101. thanks so much for your permission...

you might want to scale back on the self-righteousness, though.

[nadinbrzezinski]

106. I hate to do this, but project much?

Serious.

What I am sorry is that some folks cannot be reached and that anger will consume you

[snooper2]

50. :)

this thread proves the usefulness of the ignore function...

Every "ignored" I see are obviously saying something to the effect, "I'll sit it out"

[Tarheel_Dem]

130. you got it. the usual suspects. it was all about identity politics for most

of them. They have made that quite clear upthread. She's a woman, therefore all women should have flocked to her side. Personally, I would love to see a woman elected to high office, but it has to be the "right" woman. And for me, Hillary is not that woman. However, Barbara Boxer would have been great, IMHO.

[LisaM]

74. I want him to assure me that he will scrap NCLB

and restore our public schools. That includes not championing merit raises for teachers, and it means no money to charter schools or vouchers.

Can you get that for me?

[nadinbrzezinski]

76. Scrapping the public school system is part of the REPUBLICAN platform Lisa

NCLB will be under heavy review.. which is code to so many changes will come that only the letters might remain when they're done

[LisaM]

80. I don't want to scrap the public schools

I want to scrap giving money to other things in their name.

[nadinbrzezinski]

95. Let me clarify, the GOP's goal is to privatize all

NCLB is a federal program

the concept was a good idea, why Kennedy took the bait.

Once we get the WH, and hopefully increase majorities... the program will be rewritten to do what it needs to do

And yes, the Education System in the US needs to be revamped... and if I had my way from a policy perspective I'd federalize the whole thing, as in REAL STANDARDS... and bring it in line with WORLD standards... this also means free public education all the way to a bachelors degree and a push for science, history and other subjects

That also means an educated population and that scares the damn pugs to no end

[LisaM]

97. I agree with that totally

I think charters and vouchers are the beginning of privatization.

[nadinbrzezinski]

98. Exactly and that is what NCLB is partly designed right now to do

why I expect a full revamp of the program.

Now if they don't... they'll hear from me

[Marrah_G]

87. I will vote for him, but I do not believe in him as many of you do

I write this knowing full well I will be endlessly flamed for daring to speak my mind- but you want honesty, here it is.

_________

I find his speeches to be full of pretty words and not alot beyond that.

Also, and I speak only for myself, from my own experiences... Obama is giving me the very same speeches, the very same slogans, all the same style, the rock star type following as someone else did recently.

I fought for this person, fell for every line, bought it all, hook, line and sinker.

Then I was sadly disappointed in how this person has performed since being elected and he has fallen off that pedestal.

I learned alot through the experience. I realize that none of the words mattered, none of the good speeches or being able to campaign or bring together the grassroots.... NONE of that mattered, because in the end we would have been better off with a far less charismatic and harder working candidate.

I want my candidate to be someone I can have faith in to do the job I send them to do.

I was for Gore, then Biden, then Edwards, Now Hillary and in the end it looks like I will have to vote for Obama.

I will vote knowing there is a good chance he won't win and without the confidence that if he does win he can do the job.

You wanted honest, I gave you honest. Hope and change and all the "yes we cans" will not do anything to turn this country around unless they are followed b the correct actions. I do not have faith that that will happen.

I think if he does win the GE that by March of '09 he will be a pariha here on DU, much like Pelosi and Reid, because he has been built up to be something I do not think that he is.

Also, and I know I will get jumped for this and in all honesty it doesn't really matter into my vote: I cannot stand his wife.

[lachattefolle]

99. Four words: Rev. Wright; Donnie McClurkin

As for what he could say or do, nothing.
I form my opinions of people based on their actions, not their words.

[stillcool]

115. You are basing "Your" opinion...

of "Senator Obama" on Donnie McClurkin and Reverend Wright?

[lachattefolle]

118. I'm sorry, was I not clear enough? I don't recall posting that I spoke

for anyone but myself so the "Your" is puzzling. I am basing my opinion of Senator Obama on his embrace of Rev. Wright, and by extension, Wright's racist views, and his providing a platform for Donnie McClurkin to spew his anti-gay views.
I am not asking you to understand or respect my point of view. I was simply responding to the OP's question.

[stillcool]

124. I apologize...I have no right to question..

your opinion, or how you arrive at it. I don't understand how an opinion of Senator Obama could be based..not on his votes, not on his positions, not on his life...but on excerpts selected by the media, and a "Gospel singing tour". I guess I just don't base my opinion of any person on extraneous events. But that is me, and if Donny McClurkin and Reverend Wright are what is important to you...so be it.

[Judge_Mental]

108. Obama cannot make sour grapes taste any better.

[Perry Logan]

114. Y'all lied through your teeth about Hillary. Then you called her supporters racists. Next question.

[stillcool]

116. I am so sick and tired of lies...

but here are some facts that I will never forget....

December 10, 2007
Third Clinton Volunteer Knew Of Smear E-Mail
A third volunteer for Hillary Clinton's campaign was aware of a propaganda e-mail alleging that Barack Obama is a Muslim who plans on "destroying the U.S. from the inside out. "Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential Candidacy," the email reads. "Please forward to everyone you know. The Muslims have said they Plan on destroying the U.S. from the inside out, what better way to start than at The highest level."

Two Clinton volunteers, Linda Olson and Judy Rose, have already been asked to resign from the campaign for their roles in forwarding the e-mail. The AP reported yesterday that Olson, a volunteer coordinator in Iowa County, sent a version of the e-mail to 11 people, including Ben Young, a regional field director for Chris Dodd's campaign. Young passed it on to the AP.
http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2007/12/third_clinton_v.html

Kerrey Apologizes to Obama Over Remark
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=4031436
Kerrey's mention of Obama's middle name and his Muslim roots raised eyebrows because they are also used as part of a smear campaign on the Internet that falsely suggests Obama is a Muslim who wants to bring jihad to the United States.
Obama is a Christian.
The Clinton campaign has already fired two volunteer county coordinators in Iowa for forwarding hoax e-mails with the debunked claim. Last week, a national Clinton campaign co-chairman resigned for raising questions about whether Obama's teenage drug use could be used against him, so Kerrey's comments raised questions about whether the Clinton campaign might be using another high-profile surrogate to smear Obama.

Clinton Co-Chair Resigns Over Obama Drug Remark
By JAKE TAPPER
Dec. 13, 2007
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=3992371&page=1
Bill Shaheen, the Clinton campaign's New Hampshire co-chair, stepped down Thursday one day after publicly raising the issue of the youthful drug use of her chief opponent, Sen. Barack Obama, D-Illinois

Shaheen, the husband of a former New Hampshire governor and an influential Democrat, was a constant presence by Clinton's side whenever she campaigned in the Granite State, where recent polls have her and Obama in a dead heat for first in that first-in-the-nation primary state.

Hours after the Wednesday release of a CNN/WMUR poll showing Obama in a statistical tie with Clinton for the first time among New Hampshire Democratic voters, Shaheen told The Washington Post that should Obama get the nomination, "one of the things Republicans are certainly going to jump on is his drug use."

Shaheen said Obama having been so open -- as opposed to then-Gov. George W. Bush, who refused to detail his past drug use during his 2000 presidential campaign -- will "open the door to further queries on the matter.
---------------------------------------
On Sunday, a second Clinton staffer -- Linda Olson, an Iowa County volunteer coordinator, who followed Jones County coordinator Judy Rose -- was asked to resign after reporters discovered she had forwarded an e-mail repeating the scurrilous allegation that Obama, a member of the United Curch of Christ, is a Muslim plant.

Hillary: Sorry for Any Offense Campaign (Bill) Has Caused
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB65wJ6Rcfs

Bill Clinton Asks for a Second Chance
By Liz Halloran
Posted February 11, 2008
The morning after his wife, Hillary, was routed in three state contests by Sen. Barack Obama in their dead-heat battle for the Democratic nomination, former President Bill Clinton made his case for her before a packed Sunday service at one of the largest black churches in Washington, D.C.
But first he offered an apology of sorts for racially tinged comments he made about Obama and his candidacy that have triggered a backlash in the black community and among many other Democrats.

Clinton invoked his "worship of a God of second chances" in pronouncing himself glad to be at the Temple of Praise, which claims nearly 15,000 members. His invocation of second chances echoed comments he made early last week at black churches in California, where he campaigned for his wife before that state's
Super Tuesday primary, which she won.
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/campaign-

2008/2008/02/11/bill-clinton-asks-for-a-second-chance.html

Source: Newsday
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2007 at 12:04 pm
Barack Obama Accepts Apology From Hillary Clinton
Washington D.C. 12/15/2007 09:17 AM GMT (FINDITT)

Hillary Clinton went straight to Barack Obama with an apology following a staffer's remarks about any skeletons that may be lurking in Obama's closet, pointing out that she had accepted the staffer's resignation over the disparaging remarks. Obama accepted her at her word, according to his campaign staff, and is moving on without letting it interrupt his campaign plans.


Obama is currently leading the polls in Iowa and New Hampshire, the two early primary states often considered key to the process, according to numbers at usaelectionpolls.com, but on a national level Clinton still holds a huge lead. The most recently posted poll results show Obama with 31 percent of the
probable voters in New Hampshire backing him with 29 percent showing support for Clinton.
http://www.transworldnews.com/NewsStory.aspx?id=30629&cat=5

Clinton Camp Pushes O-Bomber Links: Ignores
Her Own Radical Ties
By: Justin Rood

ABC News - The Hillary Clinton campaign pushed to reporters today stories about Barack Obama and his ties to former members of a radical domestic terrorist group -- but did not note that as president, Clinton's husband pardoned more than a dozen convicted violent radicals, including a member of the same group
mentioned in the Obama stories."Wonder what the Republicans will do with this issue," mused Clinton spokesman Phil Singer in one e-mail to the media, containing a New York Sun article reporting a $200 contribution from William Ayers, a founding member of the 1970s group Weather Underground, to Obama in 2001.
In a separate e-mail, Singer forwarded an article from the Politico newspaper reporting on a 1995 event at a private home that brought Obama together with Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn, another member of the radical group.
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4330128&page=1

Bill Clinton To Apologize At LA Black Churches
Once again, Bill Clinton is ready to repent.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/02/bill-clinton-to-apologize_n_84573.html
On Sunday the former president is scheduled to visit black churches in South Central Los Angeles, where he's expected to offer a mea culpa to those who "dearly loved him" when he was their president, Rep. Diane Watson (D-Calif.) says. Watson, a member of the Congressional Black Caucus who has endorsed Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.), tells us she'll usher the former president to more than half a dozen churches in
her district where she says he needs to "renew his relationship" with congregants who were turned off by his racially tinged comments in the days leading up to and following the South Carolina primary. (Such as when Clinton compared Sen. Barack Obama's landslide victory to Jesse Jackson's wins in 1984 and 1988.)

http://graphics.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/politics/20080112_nevada_lawsuit.pdf
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/17/a-feisty-bill-

clinton-defends-nevada-lawsuit/
CLINTON ALLIES SUPPRESS THE VOTE IN NEVADA...
On Meet the Press on Sunday, Hillary Clinton said her campaign had nothing to do with a lawsuit--written about by Nation Editor Katrina vanden Heuvel--that threatens to prevent thousands of workers from voting in the Nevada caucus on Saturday.
Back in March, the Nevada Democratic Party agreed to set up caucus locations on the Vegas strip for low-income shift workers, many of them members of the state's influential Culinary Union, who commute long distances to work and wouldn't be able to get home in time to caucus. It was an uncontroversial idea until the Culinary Union endorsed Barack Obama and the Nevada State Education Association, whose top officials support Clinton, sued to shut down the caucus sites.
The Clinton camp played dumb until yesterday, when President Clinton came out in favor of the lawsuit.
Clinton's comments drew a heated response from D. Taylor, the head of Nevada's Culinary Union, on MSNBC's Hardball. "He is in support of disenfranchising thousands upon thousands of workers, not even just our members," Taylor said of Clinton. "The teachers union is just being used here. We understand that This is the Clinton campaign. They tried to disenfranchise students in Iowa. Now they're trying to
disenfranchise people here in Nevada, who are union members and people of color and women."
Rank-and-file members of Nevada's teachers union also come out against the lawsuit filed by their leadership. "We never thought our union and Senator Clinton would put politics ahead of what's right for our students, but that's exactly what they're doing," the letter stated. "As teachers, and proudmDemocrats, we hope they will drop this undemocratic lawsuit and help all Nevadans caucus, no matter which candidate they support."
The lawsuit's opponents make a persuasive point. Creating obstacles to voting is what the GOP does to Democrats, not what Democrats should be doing to other Democrats.

Clinton adviser steps down after drug use comments
Earlier Thursday, Clinton personally apologized to rival Obama for Shaheen's remarks.
Obama accepted her apology, according to David Axelrod, the top political strategist for the Obama campaign.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/12/13/clinton.obama/index.html

January 6, 2008, 5:18 pm
Edwards: No Conscience in Clinton Campaign
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/edwards-no-conscience-in-clinton-campaign/
By Julie Bosman
KEENE, N.H. – John Edwards angrily took on Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton at two news conferences in a row on Sunday, saying that her campaign “doesn’t seem to have a conscience.”

COMPTON, Calif. (AP) — Hillary Rodham Clinton and her campaign tried to mend ties to black voters Thursday when a key supporter apologized to her chief rival, Barack Obama, for comments that hinted at Obama's drug use as a teenager. The candidate herself, meanwhile, praised the Rev. Martin Luther King and promised to assist with the rebirth of this troubled, largely black city.

Bob Johnson, the founder of Black Entertainment Television, apologized for comments he made at a Clinton campaign rally in South Carolina on Sunday that hinted at Obama's use of drugs as a teenager.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-01-17-

johnson-apology_N.htm?csp=34

Clinton Surrogate Compares Obama Ad to Nazi March
http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20080201/cm_thenation/45278988_1
Fri Feb 1, 2:23 PM ET
The Nation -- On a media conference call organized by the Hillary Clinton campaign today, Clinton surrogate Len Nichols compared an Obama health care ad to Nazis.
----------
Accusing political opponents of Nazism is an outrageous smear. Raising the specter of a Nazi march in response to a health care mailer that evokes the insurance industry is so absurd, it would be hard to take the attack seriously, were it not launched from a high profile national campaign conference call in this crucial stretch of the presidential race. And political observers know, of course, that the Clinton Campaign regularly arranges opportunities for surrogates to launch these kind of smears, which are later followed up with apologies. (See: Bob Johnson, Bill Shaheen, Bob Kerrey, and Francine Torge, to name the most recent offenders.) For his part, Nichols did not immediately return a call requesting further comment.
-------------------------
Len Nichols, Director of New America's Health Policy Program, stated, "For nearly 17 years I have worked tirelessly to reform our nation's struggling health system. Today my passion overwhelmed me. I chose an analogy that was wholly inappropriate. I am deeply sorry for any offense that my unfortunate comments may have caused.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg

[democrattotheend]

122. So you're basing your vote on Internet supporters?

If Obama has done something that makes you so mad you can't vote for him that's one thing, but basing your vote on the behavior of people on a message board is pretty stupid.

[Exultant Democracy]

117. If you are a Clinton supporter who is unsure about supporting our nominee...you might be a redneck.

that was my first thought when I saw the headline on the OP.

[yourguide]

119. They want him to be white, with ovaries, and married to Bill Clinton...

apparently anyone else is unelectable.

[tired]

121. I will vote for either nominee

That will not change. My number one choice dropped out before i even got a chance to have a say in the matter. I cannot go back in time and bump up the Arizona primary to get what i want. All I want is a Dem in the White House.

You people bitch and bitch about why "I won't vote for Hillary/Barack because...", the fact remains that John Mcfuckingshithead is the other option. What can you do?

You can either sit out or make the obvious choice and hold your nose. It is a sad fucking fact that until we change how we elect our officials, we will always have to choose between the lesser of two evils. They will always be beholden to someone other than us.

Life sucks... fucking deal with it.

[WinkyDink]

125. So now the term herein is "Clinton supporter"? How polite. Now.

And tes, I vote straight "D".

Why, I even voted for Ed Rendell. Shame on me.