Hillary Campaign Says No To New Michigan Delegate Proposal

[WeDidIt]

Why am I unsurprised? We are now fully into Hillary's final firewall being 2012. There can no longer be any doubts whatsoever, she wants McCain to win so she can run again in 2012.

Camp Hillary is rejecting the new plan floated today by Michigan Dems that would seat the delegation by awarding 69 delegates to Hillary and 59 to Obama.

Hillary spokesperson Isaac Baker emails over this:

"This proposal does not honor the 600,000 votes that were cast in Michigan's January primary. Those votes must be counted."

This is beyond the pale.

TPMElectionCentral

[GarbagemanLB]

1. Wow. She really expects for the delegates to be seated AS IS? What a joke she is.

[WeDidIt]

8. It's her only chance

She has to deny Obama any delegates whatsoever from Michigan, otherwise there is no possibility for her to gain the nomination.

Plus, if this ends with Michigan and Florida not being seated, she has an argument for taking it to the convention floor, further wounding Obama and setting up her 2012 run.

[SlipperySlope]

87. Is she insane? Does she think she can steal the election in broad daylight?

Doesn't she know these things need to be done in smoke-filled back rooms?

[VeraAgnes]

93. Not all the votes in 2000/Fla were counted........

we got *bush. Not all of the votes in 04/Ohio were counted....we got *bush.


That issue is clear.

So, do you want this to be the next election history note?


The 08 Democratic Primaries chose not to count any of the votes in Michigan and Florida so they got.................Obama.

"Obama, he looks just like Bush."

I don't think so! Count ALL the VOTES!

[VeraAgnes]

9. The voters in Michigan

expect their vote to count. I agree.

[GarbagemanLB]

apparently Hillary doesn't, because she just dismissed a potential agreement.

[Rageneau]

70. It was Obama who rejected all previous -- much more fair -- compromises.

In fact, Obama was so afrid of what the REAL outcome of a Michigan Primary would be that he was HAPPY to take his name off that ballot and HAPPY that MI votes wouldn't count.

If he CARED about the voters of Florida and Michigan, he would have agreed with the HRC Campaign to a complete, fair, impartial, timely, well-monitored re-vote in both Florida and Michigan.

But Obama's folks didn't want any PART of a fair and accurate vote in Florida and MIchigan. The Obama Campaign strategy was always to EXCLUDE those states.

Obama obviously wants to be the nominee of only 48 states and the champion of only PART of the Democratic electorate -- because he wouldn't permit the rest of the Democrats to have a fair say.

[DevonRex]

17. Why, when she was the only one on the ballot? nt

[last1standing]

21. Thank you for telling me what I want - all the way from Pittsburgh.

I want my voice heard and that is exactly what Hillary Clinton and the power grubbers in our state legislature made sure would not happen.

You're disingenuous post is very offensive to those of us who have been silenced.

[Independent-Voter]

58. Seems to me you should be whining to your elected state representatives instead

You my want to bone up on that whole representative-republic thingy instead of goofing off on a politics board. I suspect it'd do you a world of good.

[tokenlib]

And that is why the primary votes must NOT count!!!

It was a flawed, defective, unfair election. Hillary deserves no credit for simply staying on a ballot in a contest even she said would not count for anything.

Seat the delegates--but with no role in determining the nominee!! Give them 50/50 so they can feel a part of things--but no edge for Hillary.

[Schema Thing]

38. That's hard to believe

maybe I'm just brilliant and honest compared to MI voters...


no, that's not true.


therefore, we can assume that they, like myself, would not expect their vote to count as if they had been involved in casting a vote in a real, honest election campaign.

[mckeown1128]

47. except their vote was suspect....

Do you really think that a vote tally with zero votes for Obama was accurate as to the preference of MI voters???

[gal]

55. You know it's not all about Florida & Michigan..

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

67. Well, no, I expect my vote to not count

How does my vote count, when I voted "uncommitted"?

Did I mean "Obama"? Or "Edwards"?

I don't know what to expect, but I hope the MI delegates' and Super-D's votes don't count. Rules were broken, consequences understood and agreed on.

I hope our leadership (Dean) holds the line on this.

[tpsbmam]

83. What about all of the voters who didn't vote because

they were told their votes wouldn't count? What about the fact that she was the only top-tier candidate who didn't remove her name from the ballot, despite their agreement to do so. Sorry, I can't disagree with you more. She violated her agreement -- Obama took himself off the ballot. This was a fair offer. If they had to negotiate the percentages a tad, fine. But to seat them as is is absolutely wrong.

[revolve]

85. So you speak for the voters of Michigan

Cause Im a voter in Michigan and dont expect my primary vote to count because all the candidates were not on the ballot

[vssmith]

88. NOT me

I was angry that we were disenfranchised but now you cannot change the rules in the middle of the game. I don't want our delegates to even be seated. Many people here, thinking that the primary was not going to count, either did not vote or crossed over.

DO NOT SEAT OUR DELEGATES!!

[roguevalley]

46. this was said to be Michigan's last chance to propose. she wants

it all. Reminds me of a girl standing in class stamping her feet and demanding she be first. Hopeless, awful, shameless. Its hard to watch.

[Clear Blue Sky]

74. I think her goal is the nomination now, not yet posturing for 2012.

[hokies4ever]

79. Hillary wants +58 delegates from FL+MI

Heard it from Wolfson on a conference call on youtube yesterday. Since FL+MI has 366 total delegates, that's a 65-35 split of the delegates. That's right folks, Hillary wants FL and MI delegates split 65-35 for her. Did she get 65 percent of the vote? Of course not. But that's what gives her the most delegates without sounding completely absurd by requesting something like an 80-20 split.

[Quixote1818]

2. This just makes me want to scream!

:banghead:

[endarkenment]

3. It is time for DU to call it over.

The zombie clinton campaign can no longer be viewed as legitimate.

[stray cat]

4. Hillary is denying Michigan voters a chance to count

[anigbrowl]

40. Which is a good thing - now she can't accuse Obama of that. .nt

[Hawkeye-X]

5. Hear that Michiganders?

Hillary rejects you!

[tokenlib]

33. That's OK--a lot of us rejected her!!! n/t

[cali]

6. She's just screwing herself with her desperate and pathetic crap

her campaign has actually tried to argue that Obama should get 0 delegates out of Michigan. Revolting.

[DB1]

20. I almost wish they would re-vote, Obama would likely win.

[cottonseed]

73. Bingo. I think that would happen with a lot of the BIG states.

I'd love to see a revote. He'd gain more ground and probably win. This goes for every big state. I would wage California would no go to Obama (and the SDs here realize that).

[DemVet]

He's the one who took himself off the ballot. You tell me which delegate was stupid.

[msallied]

Hillary should have taken herself off the ballot as well, like everyone else did.

Your idiot argument is rather stale.

[Scout]

54. except everyone else DIDN'T

your idiot argument is idiotic

[msallied]

68. You have just proven yourself King Idiot

The names on the final ballot were as follows:

Hillary Clinton
Uncommitted
Undecided
Dennis Kucinich
Mike Gravel

[DemVet]

69. So I guess you just took over as King, huh? You just proved Scout's point.

[msallied]

92. I'm sorry, but HOW MANY Democratic opponents were there?

Edwards? Dodd? Do tell...

[revolve]

86. Kucinich Tried To Take His Name Off

He filed his paperwork incorrectly

[WeDidIt]

48. What part of tehdefinitoin of the word "participate" don't you understand?

participate (v) - To take part in something.

By having her name on the ballot when there was an option to remove after signing the pledge, Hillary Clinton particpated in the election.

Under the rules, she should receive NO DELEGATES WHATSOEVER from the seating of Michigan because she participated.

[cali]

49. Sorry. bzzzt. It was agreed by ALL the candidates that Michigan

would not count at all. Not a whit. And precious Hill agreed just as much as Obama. The candidates were encouraged not to participate. Hilly just couldn't bear to not hedge her bets. What you call stupid, I call honorable. If she doesn't agree with this, she won't get a single fucking delegate out of MI, because it won't be settled before Obama is effectively the nominee. That's fine with me. Tough shit for hilly.

[dancingme]

52. Hillary is above the rules

Obama followed the rules.

[bowens43]

57. Tell us which candidate has integrity.

It sure isn't that cackling banshee you support

[mckeown1128]

66. She said the vote wasn't going to count...

that sounds like voter suppression to me.


She also is being hypicritical... she says the vote didn't count..... so no one campaigned or stayed on the ballot... then she claims victory and demands that the vote count.

[MadBadger]

7. Give her 300,001 and give him 299,999

[LakeSamish706]

10. And Barack had nothing to do with this decision other than signing onto it...

As I understand it, the Obama people have already agreed to this.

[newmajority]

11. I suppose she wants the 666,666 votes in Hell (not Michigan) counted too?

Maybe she will GO THERE and count them herself, by hand? :grr:

[whistler162]

56. and the pea soup concession....

[quantass]

12. I'm glad she said no. Eventually a FORCED-FED 50-50 split will only be left, the only REAL choice.

[thoughtcrime1984]

Well, she is now the bottleneck in the process

If they had a re-vote, I think Obama would win outright. I wish MI and FL could do a firehouse caucus, then we could be done with this mess. It'd be close to a wash, maybe a few delegates to her, IMO. To pretend that he got zero votes in MI is just plain stupid, and once again she comes across as far less than Presidential.

[MadBadger]

13. This just proves that its all about her and not about the voters.

[Tropics_Dude83]

50. It always has been-I'm glad I came back around to seeing that-n/t

[DevonRex]

14. Ahh. She loves Soviet-style elections. nt

[Connie_Corleone]

15. That is fucked up! When will the nightmare end?????

[uponit7771]

16. WOW...already...WOW...k...I just WISH this was a joke or some alternate plan or something

[nichomachus]

18. Strange words from a campaign that was practicing voter supression in SC

[helderheid]

19. "This proposal does not honor the 600,000 votes that were cast in Michigan's January primary..."

You mean the ballots that didn't have Barack Obama's name on it because he was following the rules?

:eyes:

[BeyondGeography]

22. Tracy, Tracy, Tracy

[Botany]

23. And Ohio State wants a re-do on the last 2 national championship games

Earth to Hillary ..... it is over .... you lost .... go away

[EFerrari]

32. Check this out, Botany: Does it look to you as if the HRC campaign

always intended to claim MI and FL? It does to me.

Bearing that in mind, there was a "glitch" in the MI "uncommitted" vote that night. In 20 counties, those votes were being counted as "write in" votes, not "uncommitted". So, even if you wanted to measure how many votes Obama potentially got, you couldn't.

:tinfoilhat:

[Botany]

61. Hillary has been a no good shit through the whole campaign

Although she didn't "campaign" in Florida .... she showed up for endorsements,
did some "meet & greets" where she just had to stop her limo and press the
flesh w/ "crowds" that just turned up to say "hi," and went there and gave victory
speech after the election that wasn't supposed to count happened.

I used to like her a little but now :puke:

She has lost the race .... move on Hillary

[EFerrari]

77. I never liked her but thought it was just me and tried,

for a while, to give her the benefit of a doubt because of my own bias.

You have to overlook a lot to continue to do that.

This is the beginning of the end of the end.

[democracy1st]

24. they are disgusting

[rinsd]

25. I doubt that plan would have been agreed to but it seems more than fair.

Its looking more and more like the delegates from MI & FL will have to wait until after the nominee is voted on to be seated.

[MadBadger]

30. She is trying to build an argument for the nomination through winning the popular vote

I think they should give her 1 more vote than Obama, so she has an advantage and the votes are counted. What will she say then>

[rinsd]

39. As I have said, you can't make the pop vote argument with MI.

FL maybe you can treat as a straw poll....maybe.

But you can't count votes where one candidate has either none or undeterminable (because a percentage Edwards voters also went with the Uncommitted option).

[last1standing]

26. The power grubbers here know they've fucked up and that we're pissed with them.

They're trying to backtrack now but the person they pulled all these strings for doesn't want to help them the way they helped her.

I hope our spineless Dems realize now what happens when you make a deal with the devil.

[4themind]

27. Is this an 'all for me and none for you sentiment'?

Or a "only one candidate.... only one choice"

[NanceGreggs]

28. The irony of all of this is ...

... that while she's desperately trying to 'find' enough delegates to make a case to the SDs, she is demonstrating how unstable her own desperation truly is - not exactly what anyone wants in a presidential nominee.

[WeDidIt]

34. Meanwhile Obama is calm, cool, collected on the House Floor

and gets rock star treatment from Hillary endorsers and Republicans as well as undeclared super delegates.

[Warren DeMontague]

29. Time for Gore, Dean, Pelosi, etc. to step in and put an end to this. nt

[antigop]

31. Her "path to victory" was described in the WSJ

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5884308&mesg_id=5884308

[global1]

35. Given What We've Seen All Over This Country - If Obama Goes Into A State.....

with his ground game and he campaigns - he either wins or really closes the gap if Hilliary is favored.

So I say - lets have a re-vote in both MI and FL. Let the Obama Campaign pay for it. I rather see our donations go to a re-vote versus paying off Hillary's debts so she goes away as was suggested.

This would fly in her face - put up or shut up. My guess is that she backs off of a re-vote because she knows the outcome - and that Obama would win it.

Or another suggestion - if Hilliary is so intent to have both MI and FL count - well she should use her money - like the $11 mil she has already loaned to her campaign - and let's do a re-vote.

In both cases - there would be ground rules - give them both 10 days to campaign in each state before the re-vote. The only problem is we are running out of time.

[Ichingcarpenter]

36. Play Misty for Me....

This is Sad to see the end of the Clinton era go down like this.

[Skidmore]

37. She's buying time and praying the muckrakers come up with something.

[Renew Deal]

41. I thought seating the delegates was going to honor the votes.

There's another idea. Wait until June 4 and then decide. Obama will get te full load of supers by then.

[redqueen]

42. This is the SECOND time she's shot down one of MI's proposals.

She doesn't want to seat the delegates.

So be it. Don't seat them.

[1776Forever]

43. Can anyone believe her audacity! Who are the elitists? Come on!!!!!!!

[high density]

44. What total douchebags. They really think a contest where Obama got zero votes is valid?

So much for the Clintons running a positive campaign as promised by Larry O'Donnell last night.

[bunnies]

45. What. A Fucking. Hypocrite.

She has no shame.

[Kittycat]

51. So pathetic.

[oviedodem]

53. Hillary Supporters: DONT DARE SPEAK ABOUT OBAMA PREVENTING THIS EVER AGAIN!!

[gal]

59. She only wants them to count when its to HER advantage

What's new...

[canucksawbones]

65. no, she wants more

remember that when Michigan then went on to pick delegates to be seated Hillary managed to get half the delegates that would be from the "someone other column" in essence picking up 80% of Michigans delegates.

Hillary wants more than her share.

The crux, however, is that Fl and MI have to pay a price. If no penalty is enforced on them then what is to stop every state from breaking the rules next time. The message that would be sent out by a DNC that doesn't make FL and MI pay for breaking the rules is that rules mean nothing (as Hilary is fond of saying her campaign runs on her rules, not the rules of the game)

GK

[my3boyz]

60. Shocking! Not! lol nt

[whistler162]

62. and in other news....

the Colorado Rockies are asking that they be declared the winners of the World Series by default.

Since Boston didn't show up for the last three games of the series.:sarcasm:

[reflection]

63. Her duplicitous stance on this issue

cheapens the vote-counting Gore and Kerry were fighting for in 2000 and 2004.

Every time I think it's gotten as bad as it's going to get, Hillary comes along to lower the bar once again and slither under it. What a grotesque display of chicanery and deception she is creating.

[Vinca]

64. The primary is for the delegate vote, not the popular vote.

That's how it was in 2004 and in 2000 and in 1996 and in 1992 . . .
but, if it makes her happy, divvy up the popular vote, too. Oh . . . wait . . . I forgot. She wants them ALL. Forget that she signed the original agreement that created this mess and that Obama wasn't on the ballot.

[workinclasszero]

71. C'mon guys! Didya REALLY think Hillary wanted a fair way to

seat the MI and FL delegates??:crazy:

Hillary Flashback: Michigan election not going to count
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULxxBz-PAjg

Hillary Rodham Clinton is a stone cold liar!

[democrattotheend]

72. Does anyone know how many delegates Clinton and Obama would get out of Florida?

I just read on the Boston Globe site that if the Michigan delegates were seated according to state party rules, Clinton would get 73 and Obama would get 55 (not sure how that's possible, but that's what it says). I'm curious how many delegates they would each get if Florida was seated. Does anyone know?

[burythehatchet]

75. Hillary Clinton: You are the smelly armpit of the Democratic party.

god I hate this person.

[butterfly77]

76. She has some damn nerve...

she shouldn't even get 69 they should be split evenly. What does she want another vote, at that time I was for her I am now for Obama...

[OneSelf]

78. Sadly...

I'm not surprised. This is pure desperation.

[tekisui]

80. She wants to keep it as a wedge issue.

She also turned down other offers, like the firehouse primary re-do.

[gateley]

81. Give her what she wants --

he'll still win.

I'd love to hear what she has to say then.

[WeDidIt]

82. Nope, he'll let it go to the R&BC

realizing that she'll get a worse deal out of them.

I'm becoming more and more convinced the rules and bylaws committee will punish the two states fairly harshly and reward Obama for playing by the rules.

Clinton will now be lucky to come out of that hearing with a net gain in delegates.

[Khaotic]

84. Hillary Can Just ...

As DX would say

SUCK IT!

[SoonerPride]

89. Pathetic

she is pathetic

[Thrill]

90. Again its all about destroying Obama now. Not winning the nomination

[City Lights]

91. My-way-or-the-highway Hill strikes again.

:thumbsdown: to Hillpocrisy.