Remember how sure you were that we were going to win in 2000?

[mahina]

There was no way this country would elect such an obvious retard when given the choice of a brilliant competent person such as Al Gore.

Remember when * morphed into the Church Lady during the debates, and we were all so certain that even the slowest and most mislead 20% of Americans would see that he was obviously incompetent, and vote overwhelmingly for Kerry?

What did we learn from those bitter disappointments, and the election thefts that we suffered?
What are we going to do to make sure that never happens again?

[Texas Hill Country]

1. apparently we have learned nothing.

[JuniperLea]

2. Proud to be the first to rec this!

Time to stop bashing "the other candidate" and focus on the REAL enemy!

Wake up people! The hate you seed today will come back to haunt you as weeds that block a Democrat from the White House!

Learn from our past!

[Carni]

21. You summed that up very well

Very good assessment!

[snooper2]

3. I wasn't sure in 2000...

I was more sure we would win in 2004 than in 2000....Kerry didn't help himself any in that race..not to mention Ohio


Oh, and Gore "did" win :)

[Texas Hill Country]

4. 2000 should never ever have been that close, nor should have 2004

[ProSense]

6. Perfect opportunity to show how dumb this argument is:

In 2000, a margin of 500,000 votes was so close it allowed the Repubs to steal the election. Fast forward to 2004, and add another 8 million votes, and the claim is that it was still too close for the Repubs to steal the election.

If 8 million had turned out to be 11 million, do you believe the Republicans wouldn't have stolen the election?

[mahina]

15. Well we certainly should be prepared for that. So what

do you suggest we do about it?

[DangerDave921]

27. I'll probably regret this but . . .

How did the Republicans steal the election in 2000? I don't mean the haggle over hanging chads and dimpled chads, etc. How did they steal it, i.e., premeditated stealing?

Thanks!

[mahina]

33. Thanks for asking, no shame to ask!

For one thing, thousands and thousands of people, such as my auntie, were removed from the voting rolls by Katherine Harris, in charge of elections for the state of Florida and head of the Bush campaign in Fla.

Thousands and thousands and thousands.

For another thing, whole ballot boxes dissapeared after the election, never to be counted, found in ditches all up and down the state of Florida.

Among other things.

It was a crime.

[mahina]

34. This point alone deserves a whole day of DU postings.

The whole country needs to be reminded. The Supreme Court ruled that the vote count had to stop. Can you imagine?

So many think that it was recounted, but it was not.

The crowd that was screaming to end the count? Tom Delay's staffers. Anybody here have that photo with the names?

Delay flew staffers down to Florida to start a riot.

[DangerDave921]

31. Question about who won?

Didn't the whole media go down to FL and recount the votes all sorts of ways? I read that this group of media, after counting all the votes, determined that Bush still won. Am I missing something?

[NC_Nurse]

5. I think the atmosphere has changed a lot in this country since then.

Won't it be nice not to have assholes like Tom Delay and Bill Frist around?

Yes, there are others...but they were just such COMPLETE ASSHOLES, weren't they?

I think more than a few people were appalled at the messes they and Dubya got us into. Too bad
they didn't wake up until after the 2004 election.

[NewHampshireDem]

7. I can only imagine what Ignored is saying, but I assume the point they have missed is ..

that the lesson of 2004 should be 'never let up, never let an attack go unanswered.'

One of the fatal mistakes was when Kerry let the SBVfT dominate the news, while he sat back believing such vile and ignorant attacks would never stick.

So, yeah, the lesson is, don't let vile and ignorant attacks to unanswered. Push back and fight.

[LeftishBrit]

8. Well, you did win in 2000.

Jeb, Katherine Harris and some Supreme Court judges over-rode this.

Please tell me that McInsane doesn't have a brother who is governor of some key state!

[JimGinPA]

9. The Religious Right Blamed Gore For Bubba's "Indiscretions"...

That "I'll bring honor back to the Oval Office" meme was a dog whistle.

[DearAbby]

10. Gore did win.....

[mahina]

13. But did not prevail. So what lesson do you take from that?

What can we do to stop this from happening again?

I had a relative in Florida who was not allowed to vote- a wealthy white lady who went to vote the same place she has for many years, and she was turned away. 2000 was the first election she had registered as a Democrat.

I know Al Gore should have been our president, and it pains me so deeply to think of all the lost lives and lost time that our country has suffered as a consequence. I don't think it's possible to dismiss lightly the cost of those losses.

What have we learned of use going forward?

[Weevlitz]

11. Don't forget about "change"

In 2000, the "change" candidate was George W. Bush. After 8 years of a democrat in the White House...a significant portion of this country was ready for something different. That's just the way Americans are! We don't like things to stay the same for too long. Now, we've had 8 REALLY BAD years of a repube in the White House....people are ready for a change again...and Barack is offering that and THEN some with his message! Now, this doesn't mean it's in the bag. A lot could go wrong. I personally am of the belief that once Hillary is gone and it becomes a race between Mc-Bush and Obama...I honestly believe Barack wins this election by double digits. I don't think it will even be close! But like I said...in 6 months...a lot could happen. So while I'm feeling very good about Obama's chances this fall...I'm also feeling cautious...which is good! If everyone on our side feels good...yet remains cautious...we wont relax and we'll get him elected!

[FrenchieCat]

12. Democrats didn't do much about election thefts.......when they had the chance.....

which is really too bad.

Those Democrats so intent in fighting other Democrats to the death, could have done something, but chose not to. Just like they could have voted against war, but instead voted for it.

President Obama will definitely have to do something about election fraud ASAP, when he gets to the WH.

[mahina]

14. Frenchie, I hope you have a chance to read this downloadable manual, 'The Anti-Coup"

by Gene Sharp. http://www.aeinstein.org/organizations892f.html

Interestingly, the 198 Methods of Nonviolent Action is available there too. But I think we might all need a good look at methods of preventing the next election theft, and "The Anti-Coup" is the best manual I know of. Gene Sharp is a long time peace activist and professor of peace studies, once here at University of Hawaii, now at his foundation.

From the site:
The Albert Einstein Institution is a nonprofit organization advancing the study and use of strategic nonviolent action in conflicts throughout the world.

We are committed to the defense of freedom, democracy, and the reduction of political violence through the use of nonviolent action.

Our goals are to understand the dynamics of nonviolent action in conflicts, to explore its policy potential, and to communicate this through print and other media, translations, conferences, consultations, and workshops.

[FrenchieCat]

You know that Obama has tried to pass some bills on election fraud......

S.1975 : A bill to prohibit deceptive practices in Federal elections.

Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack (introduced 11/8/2005) Cosponsors (4)
Committees: Senate Rules and Administration
Latest Major Action: 11/8/2005 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Rules and Administration.

---------------------

S.4102 : A bill to amend the Communications Act of 1934 to prohibit the use of telecommunications devices for the purposes of preventing or obstructing the broadcast or exchange of election-related information.

Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack (introduced 12/7/2006) Cosponsors (None) Committees: Senate Commerce, Science, and Transportation
Latest Major Action: 12/7/2006 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation.
--------------------

S.4069 : A bill to prohibit deceptive practices in Federal elections.

Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack (introduced 11/16/2006) Cosponsors (4)
Committees: Senate Rules and Administration
Latest Major Action: 11/16/2006 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Rules and Administration.

[mahina]

18. Thank you, I didn't know.

Does referred to committee mean it's gone? That's what it means in our legislature.

What resources do you use to learn about legislation? You have much more information than I, thanks again for that.

[FrenchieCat]

19. There is a list of the bills authored by Obama

here: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas

[musicblind]

16. we need to GET RID OF THE ELECTORAL COLLEGE!!!!

That is such an archaic system. Lets say we were voting for president of my house. And my brother was in the bedroom, my mom was in the bathroom, I was in the living room, and dad and my sister were in the kitchen. Now lets say that I, my brother, and my mother all voted together to give three votes for my Mom to be president... but DAD won because his two votes came from the kitchen ... WTF? How does America not see something wrong with this system?

[wileedog]

22. Because if we go to a straight Popular Vote system

Not a single candidate will step foot out of the biggest states. Ever.

The concerns of places like WY, MT, RI, VT, etc would all go out the window as candidates prostrated themselves pandering to large urban areas where all of the votes are.

Its not a perfect system, but it just can't be tossed either.

[DangerDave921]

28. Please do some research

Before you vent. The founding fathers really did have some good ideas, and the EC was one of them.

[Bake]

32. You DO know that takes a Constitutional amendment ...

And you DO know how difficult that is to do ...

Bake

[AZBlue]

17. I wasn't sure in 2000. I am in 2008.

I knew a lot of people liked George Bush (for some unfathomable reason).

[Carni]

20. Nothing apparently!

I don't know how many threads and posts there are on DU currently, calling Hillary supporters racist pieces of crap etc and how the big O and his minions don't
"need their votes" "go find another party" etc etc

I see a level of denial and arrogance by the Dem party currently that far surpasses anything that went on in 2000!

[leftofcool]

23. Dems have learned something?

I doubt it.

[stillcool]

24. We need an unprecedented...

voter turn-out which I believe we will get. The other good news is this:

VerifiedVoting.org, our partners, and voters across the country have successfully persuaded the majority of state governments to pass legislation or establish regulations to require VVPR. 28 states, with more than half the U.S. population, now have such a requirement. We need your help to make sure the voters in the remaining 22 states are protected, through Federal or state legislation.

But we need to do even more to ensure that the results of elections are verifiable. Voter-verified paper records are most effective when used as the basis for mandatory manual audits in randomly selected precincts. Step 2 of our strategy is to encourage states to adopt laws or regulations requiring such mandatory manual audits of the VVPRs. As the map below shows, 13 states have such a requirement now. We need your help to pass laws in the remaining 37 states to require such audits.
http://www.verifiedvoting.org/index.php

"We the People" have to lobby our state government's to ensure our vote is tabulated accurately. The link above provides information about the voting equipment used in every state.

[mahina]

35. Thank God...will that law pertain to the 08 election?

[stillcool]

36. these are individual states...

enacting their own laws to ensure their voters voices are heard. It is up to the people in their own states to get their state governments to count their votes. The link above gives email addy's for the Secretary of State in each state, as well as the voting systems used in each county in each state.

[RamboLiberal]

25. I wasn't sure at all - I had no faith in the voters

In 2000 the Repukes were the ones who raised the big bucks. The media was busy smearing Gore as a serial liar, then Gore helps them along by beating Bushie in the debates but screwing it up with the audible sighs (yes Al, we know you couldn't believe either how this clown could win), and remember when Al walked up on Bush in one debate and looked like he wanted to slug him?

Then with the Nader factor. Sorry, I had no confidence back then.

[progressoid]

26. Well, part of the problem is...

a good portion of Americans are just plain stupid. While we try to help the mentally challenged, the Repubes exploit them. Many of these poor souls became ditto-heads or Hannity's Great Americans. And since they are told that every sperm is sacred, they breed and make more ditto-heads.

It's an uphill battle against stupid.

[Imagevision]

29. In 2000 I remember the supreme court stopping the count in HUGE Dade county when Bush was ahead

[SoCalDem]

30. We DID "win".. Gore just was bamboozled out of taking office

and BTW.. I watched that shit 24-7 and saw VERY FEW vocal dems on TV SUPPORTING Gore.. I DID see a steady stream of republicans lined up at microphones hollering for Bush and trashing Gore.... day in and day out..

Noticeably absent from Gore support were the Clintons..and many of her supporters..

Gore was on his own little island for most of that terrible month..having to defend himself..

a little of that FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT that HRC boasts about now, might have been helpful back then..:(