"..curious support...done by - of all people - Karl Rove, saying that I was the stronger candidate,”

[Skip Intro]

“There has been a lot of analysis about which of us is stronger to win against Sen. McCain, and I believe I am the stronger candidate,” said Clinton, repeating a line from her stump speech.

Then she veered from her usual argument.

“Just today I found some curious support for that position when one of the TV networks released an analysis done by - of all people - Karl Rove, saying that I was the stronger candidate,” said Clinton. “Somebody go a hold of his analysis and there it is.”

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/05/19/clinton-cites-karl-rove-as-reason-to-stay-in/

-------------------------------------------------

Now Olberman is saying she endorsed rove. That's not what she said. She mentioned his name and the fact that he had reached the same conclusion as she - that she is the stronger candidate in the fall. No endorsement.

Yet the bullshit attacks from the frenzied O crowd, wiping their keyborads of drool as they type, come down like an avalanche.

And they wonder why so many want nothing to do with their little O club.

[GarbagemanLB]

1. I'm sure Karl has no ulterior motives. None at all.

[Honeycombe8]

5. Of course not. His reputation for integrity and "straight talk" is insurpassed. nt

[anigbrowl]

28. Kerl Rove responds to Hillary citation

[GarbagemanLB]

2. Also, link to Obama criticizing Hillary for this?

[BlooInBloo]

3. Yes, Clinton. Everybody knows that republicans want you to win the nomination. Next.

[AllentownJake]

4. Sorry

This was stupid on her part on two levels.

1) Rove was way off in 2006. He projected a net gain for the GOP.

2) Karl Rove is the most disgusting vile pig on the planet. Using his "research" as being in your favor as reason for your nomination is endorsing his work and his legacy.

[Kittycat]

6. I don't know what's more frightening... The fact that

Karl Rove's fucked up lying math matches hers - or that her's matches his.

KKKarl is a criminal. No legitimate democrat would speak of him as a mechanism of support for their cause.

[wileedog]

7. You are accepting Karl Rove at face value and accusing us of a lack of objectivity

Interesting

[AllentownJake]

11. Why should this be surprising?

O'Reilley good Olbermann bad
Foxnews good CNN and MSNBC bad
McGovern, Gore, Kerry, Edwards, Carter are all giant losers.

The transformation is almost complete.

[Skip Intro]

13. Where did I say that? Screw Rove. I'm sure HIllary feels the same.

that's why she used the words "curious" and "of all people."

this is at a fourth grade comprehension level - you are twisting my words like countless others have twisted hers today

intersting

[wileedog]

19. Whoa whoa whoa

Your girl held up Karl Rove as a credible source. Saying "of all people" doesn't change her argument, that she was using Karl's assessment of her chances as a support to her own assertion that she is the "strongest" candidate.

So you tell me, is Karl full of shit and trying to twist the outcome to the best possible outcome for Republicans, as is his MO? Or is your girl full of shit grasping for any tiny shred of evidence that her fantasy is real, even using arguments from someone who is the anti-thesis of everything we value to prop up her argument?

I'm interested to hear your response.

[Skip Intro]

22. No problem.

Had she said, "even this moron rove has reached the same conclusion," would that have been ok with you?

Another snippet from the CNN piece:

"Clinton was referring to electoral maps drawn up by Karl Rove’s consulting firm that were obtained by ABC and forecast her currently leading McCain in the electoral college by 53 votes (259-206), while Obama trails McCain by 17 (238-221)"

She said learned of it from one of the networks. Did rove release it, or did ABC "obtain" it? Who knows? But just because he reached that conclusion, no matter how, it does not make the conclusion invalid.

Taking your argument to its logical conclusion, we should listen to rove and do the opposite of what he says because he is trying to screw with us. Does that argument not in itself lend rove credibility?


And you tell me, did you have the same reaction when Obama said the repukes had been the party of ideas for the last two decades, even during the Clinton administration? Did you wonder, wow, is this guy really even a Democrat?

[AllentownJake]

26. They were the party of ideas

bad ideas. However they sold it as new in 1994 and thanks to your Girl's healthcare fiasco they took congress away from us for 12 years.

He wasn't a bad President but he was a piss poor party leader.

Bill Clinton did nothing for building the party in the 90s too much triangulation.

[wileedog]

34. Except no one ever said Rove was a moron

He's dishonest and manipulative, but he wouldn't get where he is if he was stupid.

I give him all the credit in the world, he got someone barely qualified to sell ice cream elected TWICE.

But he didn't do it by uttering honest opinions or "analysis".

Karl Rove's consultant firm came up with an electoral map that showed she was stronger. No data, no reasoning, just that conclusion happened to be "obtained"

Again, I give him a ton of credibility in understanding politics. I also don't believe a word out of his mouth, and I am utterly appalled that she would or you would.

And your comparison to what Obama said is way off the mark. He said Reagan changed the country - hey guess what, he did. He never praised that change or supported its ideals, and is apples and oranges to this discussion.

[anigbrowl]

37. Let me explain with a pictorial metaphor

The CUTE KITTEN represents democratic voters. The SNAPPING BRIEFCASE represents the Republican political strategy. The CONTENTS of the SNAPPING BRIEFCASE represent Kerl Rove's analysis of the electoral map in November.

[Mooney]

21. Why would she mention him at all?

Karl Rove's name is kryptonite to any rational Democrat. Can you imagine John Edwards at a rally, citing Karl Rove's assessment of his electability? Or Al Gore?

[anigbrowl]

29. But his ANALYSIS must be correct. After all, he's a genius.

[thunder rising]

8. Hillaryland ... it's an amazing place to live!

[stray cat]

9. Karl has always been unbiased and trustworthy -

I'm sure he has the democrats best interests at heart and simply wants them to succeed in destroying the GOP monarchy he created. Bush has certainly been a great asset to the world. I think Rove has a new book coming out to offer more excellent guidance for Americans.

[Thrill]

10. Now Rove is credible???? This is a disgrace to any Democrat. wow

[DearAbby]

12. If Rove says it...

Its the next best thing to an inspired gospel from God!
:sarcasm:

[Ichingcarpenter]

14. She endorsed his opinion as fact

He has also given her accolades when she was on Faux News and she thanked him.

[K Gardner]

15. Do you people remember who BUSHs BRAIN is? Or who was one of the Election 2000

masterminds.. god help us all that you condone this SHIT !

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

16. are you saying Clinton and Criminal Rove are alot alike?

if so, then

:puke:

[Skip Intro]

20. Wait...stop. Please, please show me the part of what I wrote that caused you to think that.

Please, quote me and then tell me how you could jump to that conclusion.

[ErinBerin84]

17. even if she is mentioning it because it's

"curious", I still don't think that invoking Karl Rove in this way really does anything but amuse superdelegates, who she needs to be impressing at this point as well.

[Skip Intro]

18. Wow, I show that Hillary DID NOT endorse rove, and I get accused of saying he is credible

amazing...

Just because he reached the same conclusion as Hillary, and most of her supporters, including myself, it does not invalidate that conclusion.

Bullshit attacks on Hillary are met with bullshit attacks on the person proving the former.

Man, am I glad I never drank that koolaid.

[AllentownJake]

24. Lets say Rove and I both like Puppies

However I wouldn't use him to endorse my pro-puppy position.

Suggesting Rove is a credible source for anything is wrong. The man is pure evil and I would question my love of puppies if he liked them.

[DanTex]

23. ...and then the captain of the Titanic told me it will be smooth sailing...nt

[sfam]

25. So you think his analysis is on the up and up?

Really? What led you to believe that? More importantly, why would anyone in the democratic party care what Karl Rove thinks about our Primary? Isn't this a bit like taking advice or insider speak from Robert Novak?

[Skip Intro]

32. If I remember correctly, Obama was punked by Novak into blaming Hillary for something non-existent.

What was that, oh yeah, Novak wrote a column saying he had second hand knowledge from someone who had second hand knowledge that the Hillary campaign had some secret video, or piece of devestating info, that would sink the Obama campaign. What did Obama do? Immediately challenged Hillary to come clean. It was a bullshit attack on her, a trick, and Obama fell for it hook, line, and sinker.

Now what were you saying again?

[anigbrowl]

42. So do you think Rove's analysis is on the up and up?

[slinkerwink]

43. link to him saying that?

[Skip Intro]

49. You? C'mon, you have followed this primary, yes? You don't remember that???

are you playing some kinda game here?

[Skip Intro]

56. Here - Here's a link

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2007/11/17/162416/73

There's nothing that Republicans would like more than to see than some down and dirty infighting among Democrats.

Robert Novak is stirring the pot.

Agents of Sen. Hillary Clinton are spreading the word in Democratic circles that she has scandalous information about her principal opponent for the party's presidential nomination, Sen. Barack Obama, but has decided not to use it. The nature of the alleged scandal was not disclosed.

Sen. Obama is striking back, not at Novak, but at Hillary, whose campaign has said they have no idea what Novak's talking about.

Obama accused Clinton of "Swift boat' politics" and vowed he will not be intimidated.

[MercutioATC]

27. Rove's opinion has nothing to do with Clinton.

Clinton's enthusiastic acceptance of Rove's opinion has everything to do with Clinton.


Since when is "I believe I'm the stronger Democratic candidate and the chief puppetmaster of the Republican Party agrees with me" a wise thing to say when competing in a Democratic primary?

[wileedog]

38. Bingo

Why is this so fucking hard to understand?

[Forkboy]

59. It's not that hard to understand, and most of them know it.

They just can't accept it. I know it's just human nature, and that's why I never get emotionally invested in politicians. Logic goes out the window when emotion takes over to that extent.

This applies to sports teams as well.

GO CELTICS!

[wileedog]

45. Delete Dupe

[Exultant Democracy]

30. She cited Rove as authority in an argument about the direction of the democratic party

fucking bad enough.

[Basement Beat]

31. Clinton is using Rove's analysis as argument that she's the stronger candidate?

Ew.

Clinton...have you no shame?

[stratomagi]

33. Like I said in a previous post

Obama got the Edwards nod and Clinton counters with Karl Rove...why isn't she the democratic nominee again?!

[Basement Beat]

35. Good Point. (n/t)

[Arugula Latte]

36. I don't know which is more pathetic ... That Hillary cited Rove ...

or that you cited Hillary citing Rove, as if he's a credible source with only the best interests of Democrats at heart.

Wow. No wonder she's failing miserably.

[stratomagi]

40. I was thinking it, but I didn't know how to say it...

Thanks for encapsulating that thought so perfectly.

[Arugula Latte]

51. Aw, shucks!

:pals:

I'm a bitter atheist for Obama, too.

[stratomagi]

53. And you're from Portland, OR

Where I am seriously planning to move after the events of this year.

:pals:

[Arugula Latte]

55. Come on out! I think you'll like it!

They say Portland and Pittsburgh have some similarities ... Similar size, both have hills, are river towns, etc. We don't have a major league football team, though.

[stratomagi]

57. Yeah cept here the republicans are closer and scarier.

But we do have lots of bridges. I figure though I can still be a Steelers fan anywhere I go since there are so many of us everywhere.

[Skip Intro]

47. That is rediculous. I quoted her to show that she did not endorse rove, as KO said.

But you have your agenda. I understand.

[slinkerwink]

48. she's accepting his analysis, and lending credibility on that fat fuck!

[Occam Bandage]

39. That's an endorsement of his work, yes. She's presenting it as valid.

[slinkerwink]

41. WHY IN THE FUCK IS SHE LISTENING TO THE MAN THAT OUTED A SPY?

And serves as Bush's consigliere?

Hillary believes she's the stronger candidate "because all her Republican friends and allies (Rush, O'Reilly, Hannity, Murdoch, Richard Mellon Scaife, Bill Kristol) tell her she is". Oh, well that cinches it then. If the Republicans say it, in DLC "Triangulation" world it has to be true.

[Skip Intro]

44. She made a metion of a report from ABC today.

It was a two sentence mention in a long speech. It is being twisted, not surprisingly to me, by people blinded with hatred.

Something to see, for sure, but sad.

[slinkerwink]

46. WE HATE KARL ROVE!!!!!!

He is not fucking credible at all--why is Hillary touting the 'study' from the Republican puppetmaster of the party?

[Skip Intro]

50. She wasn't touting it, she said it in a way that paid rove no compliments, as if she was saying

look, even this fucking moron can see it

[wileedog]

58. Except no one at all, especially Clinton, considers him a "moron"

The guy got a complete dipshit elected twice. There is no one here, or anyone else in politics, who thinks Karl Rove is stupid.

A dishonest, a-moral asshole who only occasionally has any truck with the actual truth, but certainly not stupid.

[ErinBerin84]

60. eh

I give his less legitimacy after his 2006 projections. Even if he is effective in some areas, I NEVER bought the "boy genius" spin that the media tries to give him. One thing that cracked me up about the Hillary Clinton quote..she referred to it as "Karl Rove's projections that 'someone got a hold of'" Like we have access to super-secret projections of Karl Rove that prove, see, they really really are scared of her!

[slinkerwink]

61. That fucking fat pig said the Repubs would win the House in 2006 due to the "math"

but he turned out to be wrong.

[wileedog]

62. What was he going to say?

We're going to get creamed, so don't bother even come out to vote?

What is on his little stat sheet and what he says has nothing to do with one another. That's the point.

[Avalux]

52. She's officially insane for giving Rove cred. INSANE.

After all the shit that man has done to Democrats and you have the nerve to defend what she said? Ugh. :banghead:

[berni_mccoy]

54. I Bet Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame are having a MAJOR WTF MOMENT.

[Tatiana]

63. I hope Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame heard that. n/t

[PassingFair]

64. The enemy of her enemy is her....

nevermind.

[hendo]

65. by stronger he means the easiest for McCain to win against.

Do you honestly think Rove would want the best democrat candidate to run against McCain?

[scheming daemons]

66. Message to Hillbots: If Karl Rove is agreeing with your conclusions, THEN YOUR CONCLUSIONS ARE WRONG