She can't be Vice-President because she would crush the spirit of Obama volunteer nation

[jsmirman]

We are energized and passionate because we believe that Obama is about real "new politics," new ideas, and new approaches. Clinton represents everything about the decrepit and destructive politics the volunteer base and the nation have had enough of.

The other strength of the campaign and us volunteers is how much we believe in our candidate and believe that we are selling something honorable, accountable, and honest to the people we meet in the states we campaign in. I can't look someone in the eye and attempt to sell them a bill of goods that includes Hillary. I think she is dishonest, dishonorable, and one of the least accountable politicians of the last few decades. I suspect that the bulk of the volunteer base feels like I do. It would completely cut our message of hope and honor off at the knees.

It's not going to happen, anyway, because Obama knows she doesn't fit his campaign. But it can't happen for the reasons above.

[Kokonoe]

1. Obama shows he is a leader by not bending to the committee

the Clinton's are organizing for us to take her or else.

I wonder if the followers that only use the big stick against a democrat,
will pull their head out of the sand.

[Benhurst]

2. Whether he picks Clinton or not, I hope the majority of his volunteers

don't feel the way you do. A lot is going to come out during the general election which will make your unrealistic position untenable. And Obama would still make a better president than McCain, warts and all.

Google "Obama and Excelon," take off your rose-colored glasses, and brace yourself for what will probably be the dirtiest campaign in our nation's history.

[goclark]

27. And what ever the latest slime is it would come out with her

or without her on the ticket.

Do you really think that just because she is on the ticket all would be rosy! Hell no...she would still be undermining him and Bill would be telling her/Obama what to do all the time.

Clinton does not SPEAK for me. She has shocked and disappointed us time and time again.

If I was headed for battle I would not take my enemy with me.
And let me repeat, that would mean that HCBC would be out speaking for him, not THEM.

They would not be able to do that and they can not be trusted to "do the right thing."

In this case, "keeping your enemies close" does not work.

[Yael]

35. Assuming it happens, can you see him trying to keep her and Bill on message?

:rofl:

[Thrill]

3. Just as I figured the establishment. Is going to force him to put her on the ticket

And she's probably threatened to take it to the convention if she isn't given it

[high density]

4. Yes you are absolutely right

I do not understand why so many talking heads and the like think this is such a fabulous idea. She does not seem to hold the same values as Obama. Her campaign first did its fire and brimstone thing on him as a presidential candidate (e.g. "...and Senator Obama has a speech from 2002.") Now they are attempting to do the same thing on this choice for VP by laying out all of this garbage while trying to wedge her onto the ticket.

[JoFerret]

5. Aw!

Poor things.
Let them awake to reality later.
(NB - I don't think HC should be vp.)

Mind you - sounds like Obama has a volunteer problem on his hands if this poster represents anything but a small minority.
Whooosh! Going to happen. Always does.

[Captain Hilts]

6. I had no idea Obama Nation was so fragile and sensitive. I still don't think she should be VP.

[QC]

11. Such delicate flowers! n/t

[Kokonoe]

22. Flowers signify peace and prosperity.

And yes it is delicate.
Are you wanting to obliterate it.

[QC]

24. You mean the delicate flowers who do nothing here but post sputtering rage

and hate and division? Fuck this and fuck that and fuck you, all day long without ceasing?

Those delicate flowers?

Yes, I would like to crush them, or at least apply some Roundup.

[Kokonoe]

28. Ok, good,

Yeah those guys, that what I mean.

[highplainsdem]

7. Be careful not to learn too much about his Chicago background. That might really crush your spirit,

if you think he's about "real new politics."

[Benhurst]

9. Would you buy "New Chicago Politics"?

Or how about "New Politics, in the Daley Tradition"?

:rofl:

:hi:

[Arkansas Granny]

8. What? Obama volunteers have their own nation now?

[highplainsdem]

25. Yes, it's on Obamaworld in the Obamaverse.

[C_U_L8R]

10. Keep your enemies close.

As much as I think it would be a lousy idea to have the Clinton's
anywhere near the White House again, IF Hillary was VP she'd really
wouldn't be able to run in 2012 for President. If she is selected to be VP,
she and Bill will be on very short leashes. Very short.

[TexasObserver]

13. Unless he plans to keep them in the Tower of London, they're too dangerous.

the Hillbillys that is

[Kokonoe]

30. You are a valuable member TexasObserver nt

[sweetroxie]

42. He'd better get a food taster

If he keeps her that close, she'll be slipping poison in his orange juice.

[DemVet]

12. Obama is a typical politician...he has you all fooled.

[Benhurst]

14. No, Obama is not a typical politician.

He's fooled far too many people to be called typical.

[DemVet]

18. LOL. True...never thought of it that way.

[Evergreen Emerald]

17. Of course he is, and apparently everyone here is ignoring his

actions this campaign season or they would not be saying he is "new." Same old political spin.

[DemVet]

19. Indeed.

[CaptJasHook]

15. If Hillary on the ticket crushes your spirit, then you don't have much.

Think about it. We have had over 14 years, 28 if you count Raygun, of having to rage against the machine. Hillary is with us on many, many issues and she brings the strength of the older generations.

Yes, it will be slightly dispiriting to see her mendacity rewarded, but I trust most of her grass root supporters will be with the Progressive cause.

By the way, think of how dispirited Hillary supporters will be if she has to take second seat. Put the shoe on the other foot.

[msongs]

16. ummm Obama is a washington insider ESTABLIShMENT candidate, not some rebel leader nt

[Benhurst]

26. Shh!

If that's true, how can their be an Obama Revolution?

[Benhurst]

36. Shh!

IF that's true, how can there be an Obama Revolution?

edited :spank: to remove brain fart.

[polichick]

20. It would crush the movement itself - Obama knows that.

[TexasObserver]

21. You cannot build a movement around "reject everything the Clintons stand for" and then ditch it

We almost universally reject the DLClintons, their ME ME ME attitudes, the way they suck the party under in their wake, the way they whore themselves to special interests, the way they seem to lack any morals at all.

We are on a path, and Obama knows better than us he cannot take under his vest a snake.

[jsmirman]

32. Funny, I didn't forsee the utter hailstorm of poisionous bullshit this drew

all these jerks delighting in "oh, you'll find out dirt about Obama, just you wait!!! (awesome how excited they are to see the politics of destruction worked on the dem nominee- great dems!) don't get it.

It's not that we think Obama's perfect. Of course he isn't. Chicago politics - any politics - is going to require some compromises and some associations that can be questioned later.

It IS that we think that he is honest about what he stands for and that he legitimately has new ideas and is presenting a new vision for dealing with our ailing country. THAT is what it is. Not that we are gentle flowers or misguided into thinking our candidate is pure as the driven snow. And he's not a foul liar, like Hillary.

[GDAEx2]

23. Not to Mention Throw the Notion of

"Change" under the bus.

[madwivoter]

29. I'm an Obama supporter

And I would continue contributing and volunteering for his campaign EVEN IF Hillary Clinton is on the ticket (whether I agree with it or not, imagine that, some things are bigger than me).

[jsmirman]

31. Madwivoter, that is not fair

and you did not read all of what I wrote. I am a KICK ASS street volunteer. My sincerity carries my message. I don't lie and I'm not a bluffer. I cannot look someone in the eye and tell them to support something that I believe is laced with poison. If Hillary is on the ticket you must defend not only Hillary's past but the incredibly tortured logic she has used this primary season. People will ask you about this stuff on the campaign trail. I do not play sophist with them. I will not lie. This is not a simple "oh, are things bigger than you or not" this is a situation where I will be rendered ineffective by having to defend a liar. If you can't sell your story to the people you meet behind the doors you knock on, you can't be a good volunteer.

I'm sorry, but casting this as an inability to see beyond myself is complete bullshit. I am being honest with myself.

[madwivoter]

34. I did read what you wrote and responded to you, but

In a more general sense.

I am not saying that you cannot see beyond yourself. What I am saying is that the message that Obama supporters will bail if Hillary Clinton is on the ticket is very broad generalization.

I for one will not defend Hillary Clinton in any way shape or form. I will support Obama and his stance on the issues, which is the only thing my conscience will allow. That's where you nailed it, it will be hard on the campaign trail. Yet another challenge in this whole election season.

Sorry if I offended you, that was not my intention :)

Edited for clarification.

[jsmirman]

38. It's cool, I'm just saying I'm on record that if HRC was the nom, I'd even vote for her

I could do all the things one can do to support the victory of what, in this case, would be more good vs. more evil, but I couldn't do the campaign trail part. And that would be a loss for our party. I'm planning on giving up a significant chunk of my summer to campaigning and I suspect that there are many like me.

[Voice for Peace]

39. I think you make very good points & I'm in agreement with you.

I could not defend Hillary being on the ticket - she doesn't represent the change Obama talks about, and which I believe is possible.

[jsmirman]

41. I could crush all the bs'ers in this thread, too, but it's not worth it

I challenge any of them to read the post you responded to and then continue to spew their nonsense about how we think Obama is Jesus' twin and whatnot- of course, it wouldn't stop them with how far gone they are.

But we're under no illusions that he's not human- we are all human- except possibly Hillary and GWB. It's that cold-blooded liar politics and the cynicism to dismiss the idea of change that we are done with.

[JohnnyLib2]

33. I sure as hell hope his support is deeper and stronger than implied.

Goal: Democratic administration.

[paulk]

37. the spirit of the volunteer nation isn't going to be enough

to put Obama over the top this November. Despite outspending his opponent by 3 to 1, and even with the "passionate" efforts of his "nation", Obama still can't put her away. That should tell you something. He's going to need Hillary - and her supporters - to win the general election. If he's even the nominee, which is not the foregone conclusion the Obama camp and it's MSM allies would have you believe.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

40. And when President Obama makes his first compromise in the Oval Office....

...or breaks his first campaign promise, that "Obama volunteer nation" will scurry to find the "next big thing".

Don't get me wrong. He'll be a fine president. He'll do this nation good after the 8 years we've been through.

But he not some sort of messianic super hero. He is a human being. He is a politician. He is a mortal. (And he is a good human being. But he is a human being.)

To think otherwise, you are just setting yourself up for disappointment. This is the problem with "movement politics". It's an oxymoron.

I hate to be such a cynical realist, but when I hear phrases like the "Obama volunteer nation" and speaking in the royal we, I just cannot help it.

You'll do us all good by recognizing that Senator Obama is a human and politician. He ain't God. Arguing the latter is only going to set us up for failure.