Hillary Needs To Stop Dividing the Party. Now.

[berni_mccoy]

Hillary needs to publicly come out and state that she will abide by the Rules and Bylaws Committee. Now.
Hillary needs to publicly state that she will not take this to the Convention. Now.
Hillary needs to publicly tell aggressive supporters to stop attacking the DNC and the RBC. Now.
Hillary needs to publicly admit that unless the Super Delegates start turning in her favor, Obama will be the nominee. Now.

Anything less than this, and she is dividing the party. This is nothing new. She's been dividing the party since she started losing in the early primaries and then her big loss on Super Tuesday and the 14 contests that followed.

She needs to stop blaming Obama for her loss. She needs to stop blaming the DNC for her loss. She needs to admit that her campaign was a failure and accept the consequences of this. If she can not, it just shows that she would never be able to accept the consequences of being President.

She needs to put an end to the rhetoric that she will take this to the convention. If she does take this to the convention, the Democrats will surely lose. She will retain enough support to throw the election to McCain (think Nader on steroids).

If she does not put an end to this and gracefully allow the rules to be judged by the DNC RBC and then gracefully abide by their decision and await the conclusion of this primary, she will not only ruin herself, but the Democratic Party's chances at taking back the White House this year.

And I'm sorry to her staunch supporters here. I realize this is a difficult thing for them to accept. But accept it they must, lest they allow themselves to aid and abet the Republicans in continuing to ruin this country.

[mdmc]

1. meh

let her do her thing.

[berni_mccoy]

2. What's that? Take it to the convention? No.

[mdmc]

12. I think it would be kinda neat to have more political parties

We can have the Libertarians, Neo-conservatives, GOP/DLC, Progressives, and Radical leftist.
The GOP/DLC would be the ruling class, and the "third" parties could partner with the corporate parties to meet their single issue needs.

[berni_mccoy]

16. And you are here at Democratic Underground because why?

[mdmc]

27. I really love this place, mostly lbn and gd, but the lounge too

I also like the mental health support group and some of the other smaller DU groups, like the humor group.

While I appreciate being part of the "lesser of two evils" crowd, I would prefer to see a true liberal progressive movement take place in America.

I believe that America will get what it deserves. We have allowed the corporations to gain too much power. The corporations own both ruling political parties. Both parties answer to the same wealthy donors.

So I am here to make sure that we understand that being better then the republicans cannot be a platform to build a ruling party with. We need to be better then that. We need to stand for something. We need to stand for education, health, and peace (plus, the eradication of poverty). We can't just be a little better then the GOP on these important issues.

That is why I am here.
I am curious, why are you here? What does posting "Hillary get out now" OP's solve or further? Do you think Chelsea will read your post and call her mom up and request she drop out?
With all due respect, why are you here?

[berni_mccoy]

42. I'm not saying she should drop out now. I'm saying she should allow things to play out

While not encouraging (and in fact discouraging) talk of taking this to the convention.

I ask you why you are here because you are saying GOP and DLC should be ruling class parties.

[mdmc]

59. The GOP and the DLC (or DNC) ARE the ruling class parties

Everything Bush has done was done with the support of the democratic party and the republican party. We (the Dems) and the GOP are the ruling parties in the USA. The greens and the libertarians are completely out of power and unable to effect change.

I guess that is why I am here. I would rather be inside pissing outside the tent then outside pissing in.

But get ready. Obama will have competition on the left and on the right.

Perhaps it is time for one of the parties to die off and allow another party to take its place. I think it would be pretty easy to take the liberal GOP into the Dem fold. Ditto to the GOP taking our Dinos.

Anyway, peace and low stress. And God Bless.

[mdmc]

30. I'll even give you your 5th R

perhaps that is what you are after:shrug:

Anyway, Peace and low stress. FYI - Although I am a Kucinich kind of dude, I did vote and donate to your boy Obama.

[mdmc]

32. someone beat me to it

6th R

[NJSecularist]

3. The only thing that is ruining and dividing this party is Obama's unelectability.

It pains many Democrats to watch their own party nominate an unelectable candidate.

[berni_mccoy]

4. The only thing that is runing and dividing this country is your belief in this false idea.

[NJSecularist]

11. It's not a false idea. It's the truth. It's one of the reasons why I switched support.

[berni_mccoy]

13. Truth by Hillary's standards is no truth at all.

[Lerkfish]

18. and when Obama is the nominee, will you switch back?

McCain will need the help.

[Mike L]

19. Obama will lose a 'gimmie' election. em

[VotesForWomen]

65. yep. it is unbelieveable that democrats can be so stupid as to blow this election with an Obama nomi

nomination. democrats are suckers for punishment, it seems.

[Lerkfish]

14. I believe you are being intentionally inaccurate.

[Mme. Defarge]

29. Democratic elections are a b*tch, are't they?

[VotesForWomen]

63. yep, and it's going to damage the country as well. nt

[NightWatcher]

5. even if she doesnt like what happens Saturday, I dont think she'll have a choice

Pelosi has said that this will effectively be over after this Tuesday. If Hillary tries to fight it or wants to take this to the convention, she will be left by many in the party who will throw support behind the winner of teh majority of the delegates. Hillary and Bill will be all alone in the Democratic Party. The Party will fall behind Obama and the vast majority of the remaining supers will endorse him. He will be the presumptive nominee and Hillary will appear even more desperate and bitter if she continues to fight it.

[LisaM]

6. Funny. I see Obama as the divisive one.

In all my time following politics, I have never seen such a divided party, and I think he's caused the rift.

Either way, whatever happens, there are going to be millions of pissed off voters.

[Cronus Protagonist]

9. True dat - prior to Obama there was no rift n/t

[VotesForWomen]

66. so true. nt

[berni_mccoy]

10. You believe that because that is what you've been told in the Hillary echo-chamber.

[Selatius]

15. So it's Obama's fault that Hillary didn't wrap it up on Super Tuesday??? nt

[Mike L]

24. Actually, it's the fault of Obama's supporters.

They should have known that he is unelectable. They had the best opportunity to research him.

[Selatius]

28. See, unelectability is an issue of opinion. Opinions aren't facts. nt

[LaurenG]

21. I see it the opposite from you

I think the rift/split is coming from those of us who want to move onto a different path vs trying to correct the one we're on.

We can't fix anything by staying with the same type of thinking, it doesn't work. It's time for new thinkers and dedicated democrats, not those addicted/dedicated to wars and obliteration, I loved that Kucinich and Edwards saw things this way as well.

[CakeGrrl]

33. How has Obama caused the rift...apart from winning primaries and leading Hillary?

What has he said or done to divide this party?

Hillary's words have been quoted so often they can come from memory.

Can you provide quotes or links to Obama's divisive statements or evidence of anything his campaign has done, other than out-strategizing and outsmarting the Clinton campaign to the nomination, to cause problems with the party?

[LisaM]

46. I have posted this link many times, and I'll post it again

It refers to an internal passed around by the Obama camp on how to portray the Clintons as racists.

I think that calling Bill and Hillary racist is one of the saddest, most divisive things to come out of this whole campaign. It's utter nonsense. I will not forget the sight of Hillary Clinton, when she attended the State of the Black Union, bravely, for there had been speech after speech made exhorting the participants to vote for Obama (who did not attend), in front of a crowd that had been coached for the last several weeks to think that she was racist. She comported herself beautifully, but I thought that was when the tone changed.



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/12/obama-camps-memo-on-clin_n_81205.html

[berni_mccoy]

47. The memo covers the pattern of racially divisiveness of the Clinton Campaign.

It's a well documented fact that Clinton's campaign has used racially divisive tactics. Your slamming Obama's campaign for pointing out the truth?

[LisaM]

49. No, it points out how to FRAME it as racist.

Again, I think it is extremely sad that the Clintons are being painted as racist. I think it was intentionally divisive, and it's succeeded well. Whether that will move us forward as a party or country is unlikely.

However, we are not going to agree on this. There's almost no point in having the discussion. There is an entrenched split in the party that I've never seen before. It's awful.

There was another thread here today on how Obama cleared away all his competition in 1996 in Chicago, leaving some bad blood behind there, too. I don't find him unifying and I think that "Hope and Change" are just a slogan.

[berni_mccoy]

50. Fail. Wrong. Go Back to the drawing board. The memo never uses the word "racist"

[LisaM]

53. So what? It doesn't need to.

The unfortunate fact is that there is now a large faction of people who believe that the Clintons are racist. I don't personally think so. Perhaps you do. Perhaps you didn't, but now do, which proves that the framing worked. In any event, for those who pay more attentions to campaigns than to candidates, this kind of divide and conquer tactic will generally be successful. I happen to think the same about the Clintons as I did eight years ago - there's a lot I like about them and a few things I don't. I do, however, think that Hillary would make a far better president than the other candidates running now. I initially supported Edwards, but looking back, I think Hillary would have been a better choice (for me) all along. I agree with the progressive ideas he put forth, but I thought he quit too soon.

[berni_mccoy]

55. It doesn't frame the Clinton campaign as racists as you said it did.

[LisaM]

56. Yes, it does.

Maybe you didn't read the whole article, but there was a whole list of phrases that they sought to play up in the media to put the campaign into terms of race (the LBJ remarks for one, but most notably the fairy tale remarks). Donna Brazile fell for the "fairy tale" part of it hook, line, and sinker.

I think we have a very gullible electorate.

[VotesForWomen]

68. look in the mirror. O supporters are some of the nastiest democrats i've ever come across. "bitch"

"bitch" this, "racist" that, sit down and shut up and vote for our man.... sound familiar?

[Raineyb]

36. Clinton pisses off large portions of the base...

but it's Obama's fault that the party is divided?

Damn that man for running and taking Senator Clintons turn away!
:sarcasm:

This is not reasonable. How are we as a part supposed to deal with this unhelpful attitude?

Regards

[Beacool]

71. Yep, and we won't forget it in November.

:shrug:

[Cronus Protagonist]

7. Oh yeah, a candidate campaigning will help "ruin this country"

Hyperbolate much?

[berni_mccoy]

8. You can't read can you? Taking it to the convention floor will.

I never said she should stop campaigning.

[NJSecularist]

17. Why shouldn't Hillary take this to the convention floor?

Obama hasn't receieved 2025 pledged delegates. It is well within her rights to take this to the convention. If he didn't want this to go to the convention, he should have stopped her from winning large and important states.

[berni_mccoy]

22. Because she can't win. She will only ruin the chances of the party to Win the Presidency.

And if you can't see that, then you are blinding yourself to reality.

[Selatius]

26. Obama could likely reach 2025 by Tuesday. Currently, he has 1981 delegates.

If he reaches 2025, why should she stay in?

[NJSecularist]

31. Because most of those delegates were a result of backroom deals.

When you remove superdelegates from the equation, and you only use pledged delegates that each candidate has receieved from actual voting, neither candidate will have enough delegates to win the nomination.

[Swamp Rat]

34. "Because most of those delegates were a result of backroom deals." - Prove it.

Prove that statement with facts, not opinions.

[NJSecularist]

35. What do you think superdelegates are?

They are actual people. Many of which commit their support due to arm twisting and backroom deals.

[berni_mccoy]

37. You slamming Hillary's ONLY CHANCE at a win (SDs)? Now that's RICH!

You guys have totally lost your freaking minds.

[NJSecularist]

40. Superdelegates are Obama's only chance to win too.

How soon we forget.

If it wasn't for superdelegates, this process would be 100% likely to go to the convention and the second ballot.

[berni_mccoy]

43. I'm not slamming a win by SDs as you are.

[Selatius]

38. As far as I know, the Super Delegates aren't overturning the primary results. nt

[Swamp Rat]

41. Red Herring

You did not prove your statement.

[VotesForWomen]

69. losing an election wouldn't do the dems any good either. nt

[samplegirl]

20. R&K

You are absolutely right!

[grantcart]

23. We should just settle down and wait until Wednesday by friend

[berni_mccoy]

39. I wish it were that simple. But more and more Hillary surrogates and supporters are talking about

Taking it to the convention. This needs to stop or the Dems lose.

[Phx_Dem]

44. Don't worry

Pelosi, Reid and many other Dems will not allow that to happen. If Hillary decides to take it the convention, it could seriously damage our chances in November -- not only for Obama, but for Democratic candidate on the ballot. Pelosi, as the Convention Chair, can and will stop her. Elected Superdelegates are not going to sit around while Clinton helps them lose their seats and our majority in Congress.

There will be no successful popular vote argument because

1. The popular vote doesn't count in Presidential elections. Never has. Ask Al Gore.
2. She isn't winning the popular vote now and she won't be winning the popular vote after all the voting is done.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG1LLTYkn4I&eurl=http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com


(Mrs. Phx_Dem)

[Mme. Defarge]

25. Big K&R!

[Skip Intro]

45. Oh the drama. CAN the party survive its own system? Or will Hillary Clinton extinguish the sun and

doom us all???


Tune in tomorrow for as the O spins...

[berni_mccoy]

48. She's ruined her own campaign. Let's keep it isolated to that.

Let's not have her virus of failure spread to the entire party, shall we?

BTW, if she concedes, you're voting for Obama right?

[Skip Intro]

52. Oh, those poor infected 17+ million. Btw, to your question - one that seems to come up frequently

I will say that I will vote my conscience.

After months of seeing what living in the land of hope and change can do to people - the arrogance, the viciousness, the chilling hero-worship, I really have little inclination to climb aboard the O-train and sip mugs of koolaid.

[Mike L]

51. In February, Obama said she could continue......

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/29/us/politics/29dems.html?ref=us

Mrs. Clinton pressed her case Wednesday on multiple fronts: on the campaign trail, in a written fund-raising appeal and in the letter to superdelegates.

Accompanying that letter was a fact sheet citing a quotation from Mr. Obama that suggested there might be some injustice if the nomination was not given to the candidate with the most popular votes.

“On February 8th,” it said, “Senator Obama said that if someone had the most pledged delegates and the most votes in the country, that ‘it would be problematic for political insiders to overturn the judgment of the voters.’ It appears that when all the votes are counted June 3rd, Hillary Clinton will be the candidate with the most votes.”

[berni_mccoy]

57. I'm not calling for her to quit. I'm asking her to gracefullly allow this to play out

Without dividing the party and to not take it to the convention floor.

[Milo_Bloom]

54. She can do what she wants... with each step she destroys her own chances...

for the future.

She is just a footnote to the 2008 campaign at this point.

I for one am very happy to see the end of the CLinton legacy.

[Robbins]

58. History

If she takes this to the convention we are probally looking at President Mccain In january.
No Party with a convention fight In recent history has won.After June 3 she needs to drop out so
Obama can work on uniting Democrats and taking on Mccain.Hillary supporters can site those who voted for her all they want but a lot voted for Obama(why else Is he ahead) and Obama Is jsut 45 delgates
away from 2025.

[Cronus Protagonist]

60. The past is not indicative of the future

Lots of things have changed lately, like us being in an illegal invasion for 8 years, just to name one off the top of my head. I could mention that a black man has never won the presidency before. Does that mean one can't win now? Of course not. And I think we can easily weather a brokered convention too. Don't be so pessimistic. :)

[PretzelWarrior]

61. kick

[VotesForWomen]

62. Back at you, honey. nt

[ruby slippers]

64. traffic signal for Hillary

[jillan]

67. I do believe this is up to Howard Dean and not some little poster at DU.

[Beacool]

70. Yawn...........

:boring: