Donald Sutherland: Hillary's Popular Vote Notion only 'Popular' with the Punditocracy

[marmar]

from HuffPost:




Donald Sutherland
Hillary's Popular Vote Notion only 'Popular' with the Punditocracy
Posted May 29, 2008 | 03:39 PM (EST)




It is incomprehensible to me that Mrs. Clinton can seriously be touting the notion, with the support of the punditocracy of CNN and Fox, that she is leading in the popular vote and should therefore be seriously considered as the most electable candidate in the November election. She's including those who voted for her in Florida and Michigan's name recognition ballot saying that to exclude them would be to disenfranchise them. What about the Democrats in Alaska, American Samoa, Colorado, Idaho, Kansas, Minnesota, New Mexico, North Dakota, Nebraska, Washington, Hawaii and Wyoming who did not cast ballots because they were playing by the pledged delegates playbook and voted by caucus. What about them? Certainly if the rules are going to be changed and judgment is based on the 'popular' vote those voters in the eleven caucus states and Samoa will be disenfranchised. What about them?

And what about us? What about the American people? Haven't we had enough of Mrs. Clinton's mad antics in her pursuit of the realization of venal personal ambition; her 'say anything, do anything, no matter what' effort to manipulate our all too willing media to gull this country's populace into believing that her wretched illegitimacy is indeed legitimate. How much mendacity do we have to suffer, how much brazenness do we have to swallow before someone, anyone, has the decency, the common sense, to relieve us of this terrible trifle, this pathetic madness?


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/donald-sutherland/hillarys-popular-vote-not_b_104152.html

[redqueen]

1. And the warmongers in the GOP. And her supporters.

But yeah... other than that... the BS ain't sellin.

[Saturday]

2. Donald Sutherland? The Actor? ROTFLMAO nt

[ShortnFiery]

4. You know you're dating yourself?!?

:evilgrin:

[Saturday]

8. Seriously, is this the actor? nt

[JVS]

10. yes

[The Doctor.]

37. Well, a famous and successful person like yourself can certainly afford

to insinuate that a 'mere actor' hasn't the right to a substantive opinion.

Soooo... just who the fuck are you?


While you're contemplating just how much you make Clinton people look like transparent, insubstantial, two-dimensional fools, could you please tell us what he said in the piece that is wrong?

[habitual]

5. and you are? n/t

[sellitman]

13. Why is your opinion worth more than Donald Sutherlands?

Your opinion of others makes me think you are the arrogant Hillary supporter that most here on DU have ignore.

[rinsd]

15. His profession is immaterial. That he doesn't know those caucus states have pop vote totals is not.

[Window]

20. ??? Actors aren't American, can't vote and voice an opinion???

[SwampG8r]

33. beside the point but

Donald sutherlin is a canadian

[PoliticalAmazon]

42. Pay attetion. Only when they are pro-Hillary. It used to be only when....

they are pro-Bush Jr, but Hillary has become the new Bush Jr in America.

[TheDebbieDee]

22. Couldn't you hear his phony British accent in his penmanship?

:7

[The Doctor.]

38. Fran Drescher?!? Is that YOU?!?!?

;)

[roguevalley]

23. you don't know much about donald and his efforts for this country.

too bad. you don't seem to know much about anything but your candidate. you should read more.

[sniffa]

25. Well

the person you're talking to is, who he is

[Hissyspit]

29. Right-wing talking point.

Why are you still here?

[HCE SuiGeneris]

31. Pathetic display to try to circumvent the truth. I have a link for you.

http://www.wdv.com/Writings/Fallacies/index.html

Which fallacy is your favorite? Or, do I need to help you out here?

[The Doctor.]

36. What's your point? Oh... right... 'attack the messenger' for, uh...

being a rich, successful, Golden Globe winning actor.

Well, I'm sure a successful and famous expert like yourself can disparage the man rather than his words because obviously when someone is as famous and well-regarded as you are they can simply forego substance and insinuate that a 'mere actor' can't possibly have anything intelligent to say on the issue.

Silly us for listening to him.


Oh, and ummm... just who the fuck are you again?

[PoliticalAmazon]

41. I'm surprised he spoke out. n/t

[glowing]

3. Its really not.. the pundits spent too much time telling us about delegates and super delegates.

We don't like people shoving things down our throats.. Bush has been enough.. WE want people elected who will listen to the people and who will stand up and fight for us. How many states at this point, if they could re-vote, would actually vote for Obama? Kinda knowing what I know now if I knew then... I bet California might look differently.

[ShortnFiery]

7. Many MORE people in CA would vote for Obama, that's why the arrogance of MI and FL moving

up their primaries was not only an AFFRONT (broke the DNC rules) to the voters, but also to the candidates who were not "Hillary."

HRC had *all the advantages* of states breaking the DNC rules to vote early and the fact that there was no campaigning.

I can't believe the VILE nature of HRC's campaign. It's indistinguishable from that from a GOP candidate. No wonder HRC and her surrogates view FOX news at their best source. :crazy:

[Carolina]

6. Wow, go Donald Sutherland

so true relieve us of pathetic madness!

[JVS]

9. You're illegitimate, Hillary

[high density]

27. This thread would not be complete without that picture

lol

[high density]

28. This thread would not be complete without that picture

lol

[goldcanyonaz]

11. Well, Clint Eastwood does not want Hillary to quit, SO THERE!!

:rofl:

[sellitman]

16. That did not make my day.

Just saying.

;)

[Ichingcarpenter]

12. More people have voted against Hillary in the History of US Primaries

That's right, more people have voted against her than any other candidate
in the history of the US.


It also goes the other way too. The popular vote is meaningless.
Its delegates.

[rinsd]

14. Donald Sutherland apparently does not know that the 11 caucus states he mentioned have pop vote.

Only IA, ME, NV & WA do not hard popular vote counts, only estimates.

[CoffeeCat]

46. Do you know which caucus states Hillary...

...included in her popular-vote metric...and which ones she left out?

Did she only leave out IA, ME, NV and WA...or did she also leave out the other caucus states?

[rinsd]

47. It could be both.

Here's every scenario possible with pop vote counts done by RCP

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/democratic_vote_count.html

She leads if you include MI and give Obama 0 votes.

Otherwise (even including FL as a straw poll), Obama leads in the popular vote.

[nxylas]

17. "We the American people"?

I thought he was Canadian?

[Lautremont]

26. His son kills Muslims on an action show. Therefore: complementary citizenship.

[K Gardner]

18. Wow.. Donald is pissed ! "How much mendacity do we have to suffer... relieve us of this TERRIBLE

trifle.. this pathetic madness!" K&R !!

[uberblonde]

19. What's this "us"?

Isn't Donald Sutherland a Canadian citizen?

And seriously, he shouldn't write his own material. It's a tad too histrionic.

[newmajority]

40. One of the Hillbots posted links to a "pro-Hillary" site here last week

Something about "Tennessee Gorilla Women for Hillary" or whatever......

Traced the origins of the website. Turned out it was setup by a woman named Darlene in Calgary. Which happens to be the home turf of Stephen Harper.

So Hillary is getting assistance from Canadian citizens, and possibly right wing Canadian citizens.

[arikara]

44. Not all Canadians prefer Hillary by a long shot

Most in this area want Obama to win. Someone even paid for a billboard on the highway to Victoria, and those don't come cheap.

I think your assessment of right wingers liking HIllary is dead on.

[Window]

21. And there it is. That's the long and the short of it. Period.

:thumbsup:

[Cha]

24. Hey, Donald Sutherland and marmar..Thanks!

Always good to hear from people who are so tired of the way she's treating our Democratic process that they feel compelled to write a publication to register their very much needed complaint.

'Cause that bilary will run right over ya if given a centimeter of an inch.

[CreekDog]

30. Ruh Roh! Does Judas have a brother?

:rofl: :eyes:

[joeybee12]

32. Yup, I'm gonna listen to what The Donald has to say...

especially since I haven't seen his affirmation that CNN and Fox agree with Hilary on this...just another case of Huffpost nutjobs making things up to make their case.

[Major Hogwash]

34. Wow, this must be karma. I was just thinking of him today for no apparent reason.

About how great an actor he really is, and how we'll all miss him after he is gone.

So many actors have died lately, and comedians, that I realized that we're losing some really decent, good people at such a young age.
There was Sydney Pollack, then Dick Martin and then today Harvey Korman.

And then for no damn reason whatsoever, I was thinking of Donald Sutherland today.

I hope he knows just how much he is loved and admired before he passes away.
So many people wait so long to tell others how we feel about them and then it is too late.

[AtomicKitten]

35. We are watching the Clintons implode by their own hand.

And after the way they've run this campaign, I'm fine with holding their coats.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

39. For the jackasses here who have zero idea...

about the depth of Sutherland's political cred, he was a very prominent anti-war activist during Vietnam, and was a member of a political threatre troop that did shows across the US. I will research it and bring back links.

He is the real deal and I respect his opinion.

Here is info on FTA, the theatre troop that included Donald Sutherland, Jane Fonda, Peter Boyle, Paul Mooney, Hilly Near, and others:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/news/820716/

"During 1971 and 1972, Jane Fonda and Donald Sutherland led a quasi-USO tour
that played in towns outside of U.S. military bases along the West Coast and
throughout the Pacific. Fonda referred to the tour as "political vaudeville"
and the show itself was called "FTA" (the acronym standing for "Free the
Army" and "**** the Army"). The audiences were primarily the men and women
of the U.S. armed services, and during the tour Fonda and her company
interviewed the various soldiers, sailors and marines regarding their
thoughts on the Indochina slaughterhouse.

Viewing "FTA" today is like opening a long-forgotten time capsule. The
film's true power comes in the frank, often rude comments from the servicemen
and women who openly question the purpose and planning of the American
involvement in Vietnam. Most memorable here are the members of the U.S.S.
Coral Sea, who presented a petition to their superiors demanding a halt to
the bombing in Vietnam; African-American soldiers and marines who angrily
decried racist attitudes among the white commanding officers at the U.S.
military installations, usually with an upraised fist of the Black Power
movement; women serving in the U.S. Air Force who talk unhappily about sexual
harassment from their male counterparts; and soldiers who pointedly refer to
the dictatorial government in South Vietnam which was being presented as the
democracy which they were supposedly defending. The extraordinary air of
dissent that rises out of "FTA" provides a rare glimpse into a unhappy and
demoralized fighting force stuck in a war which they did not believe in."


The tour was made into a film released briefly in 1972:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068562/fullcredits

[ozone_man]

49. Thanks.

I always liked him as an actor, partly his quirky personality, but he tends to play off-beat roles that I like, thrillers, political, conspiracy, ...

You probably mean Holly Near. :)

[Imagevision]

43. I'm very greatful to Bill, Hillary would never have wound up in this shape without him...

[guruoo]

45. A quite versatile actor, indeed.

[azmouse]

48. woohoo!

:applause:

[symbolman]

50. I'd pay attention if I were you..

his Son can torture, Kill you, even Nuke yer ass if he wanted to, so you better listen up to "Hawkeye" baby...

:)