TYT: Was Obama Sexist Against Clinton? Did Hillary Lose Because of Sexism?

[ihavenobias]

Was Obama Sexist Against Clinton? Did Hillary Lose Because of Sexism?
By Cenk Uygur

Many Clinton supporters, including Geraldine Ferraro, are now saying that Obama ran a sexist campaign and that Senator Clinton might have lost because of sexism http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/19/us/politics/19women.html?_r=1&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss&pagewanted=all&oref=slogin.

In the video below, we have their quotes and their charges, and we also discuss whether that idea has any merit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpM_byZniwQ

What do you think? Did Hillary Clinton lose because of sexism? Did her gender help her or hurt her? And was Obama in any way sexist against Clinton?
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Also check out Cenk's Take On The Insane Dunkin Donuts Story here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=3365695&mesg_id=3365695

PS---Keep in mind that you can download the first hour of The Young Turks free every day through Itunes. Also, the show loops 24 hours a day at www.theyoungturks.com

[gateley]

1. No. That's absurd. nt.

[Thrill]

2. This is nonsense. She lost because he ran a better campaign

How people say this man is sexist is beyond me. He could of attacked Hillary several times, but he chose not to.

[polichick]

3. No and No...

Hillary lost because she played politics with war, didn't have a plan to campaign after Super Tuesday, misjudged the mood of the people, and rolled in the gutter like a Republican.

[CherylK]

4. This woman says no!

My favorite part is the video you linked to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpM_byZniwQ Cenk is completely and totally right on this issue!

[papau]

5. Obama's race "help" him if you're referring to delegates won per vote (AA areas get more) -and

Likewise the structure of the party meant once Obama played his race card in SC to get 80% plus AA support, all those states where AA's are a major percentage of the vote became an advantage for him.

Clinton was treated poorly by Obama as all those who watched the good guy Obama/smear and lie guy David show know. I hate cheap cons like that which assume folks are too stupid to attribute was was done by the chief campaign adviser David to the orders of Obama.

Meanwhile Obama directly authored post a round of my opponent is a a good person/candidate - "and you Hillary are good enough"

plus his "Sweetie" to a reporter

plus his many speeches that used various words to say "she's only a women whose council would nor have been sought or followed - so she has no experience".

[democrattotheend]

45. Do AA districts get more everywhere? I thought that was just in Texas.

I thought it was just Texas that apportioned delegates based on previous primary turnout. I don't think that's the case nationwide. I think the delegates are apportioned based on past presidential vote in some states, so heavily minority districts probably get more delegates because there are presumed to be more Democrats in those districts. But other states do it by registered Democrats, which would actually help Clinton, since they get credit for Reagan Democrats who probably didn't vote Democratic in at least the last 2 presidential elections.

[Demobrat]

6. If not for sexism

Hillary would never have made it this far. Subtract all the women who want Hillary for president just because she's a woman and what have you got? A few southern white racists and Bill. Oh, in answer to the question, her gender helped her. A lot.

[Perry Logan]

7. I still think she's gonna beat Obama. Obama is like a terminal patient now.

[ihavenobias]

8. 2 Things

1)-Huh? Your response has nothing to do with the original post.

2)-Believing in the first sentence of your response is nonsensical, and that second sentence flat-out IS nonsensical.

[RoseMead]

17. Please put the bong down. n/t

[ihavenobias]

19. I guess that was a more concise way to put it

;)

[Douglas Carpenter]

21. I do believe in fairies - I do believe in fairies , I do, I do, I do believe in fairies

[lxlxlxl]

9. I do not want a monarchy/oligarchy...it's simple...

I know most progressives/liberals are down on the idea of a democracy, but to me, if you openly allow power to pass from family to family you are entrenching every value that is antagonistic to progressive values. It's also the "top down" mentality that she represents. That is a very real idea to me.

I'm sorry. I love women, and I would do anything to get a woman in the Oval Office. I just think that after how horrible the past eight years has been. We need serious social change and some good leadership at the top will help us get there eventually...cheers.

[Vinca]

10. No. She lost because Obama had all the advantages.

He was a black man in America with a name that rhymes with a terrorist. Pure gold right from the start.:sarcasm:

[AtomicKitten]

11. She ran an atrociously crappy campaign punctuated with a lot of whining.

No "isms" involved. Well, except that she used race against her opponent.

[LittleClarkie]

12. In my opinion, going easier on her than on other presidential candidates would be sexist

Presidential candidates go through the meat grinder. To expect to be treated better than others, and then call sexism when you are not, is asking for special treatment due to her sex, which be sexism in my eyes.

[quickesst]

13. It wasn't the sexism....

that put her in this position. She's been handling that from the disgusting right for years. What she hasn't been attacked with are accusations of being a racist. Funny how all these years, no republicans, or Democrats that I can recall, ever used that line of attack against her or her husband. Until Obama decided to run. It was not long after that Obama and his supporters realized he could not win as long as the Clintons had such a good relationship with black America. They had to become racists, and given the sensitivity of the issue(see the holocaust), it was not difficult to spark a movement toward that goal with a few statements taken out of context. It grew on it's own after that. This is what put her in her present situation, and no amount of twisted ideology born of self-flagellating guilt can change this fact. The msm, who suddenly became righteous in the eyes of Obama fans(see Matthews) tipped it for him with those who's only political input is the msm. This is the truth, these are the facts, and once again, a large segment of the Democratic party prove they have learned nothing in eight years. Thanks.
quickesst

[Raineyb]

23. Actually, it has been

There were plenty of people who saw Bill Clinton's execution of a black man as problematic because it looked like he was making his law and order bona fides by taking time out of his campaigning schedule to execute a black man who didn't even understand the concept that he was going to die.

In addition, people also thought the whole Sista Souljah incident was Bill Clinton's way of showing the "bubbas" that he wasn't afraid to put black people in their place by cutting down a black woman whose politics he didn't agree with.

What happened this year was just more reminders of that kind of behavior. Why would you expect black people to put up with that kind of fuckery when there's an alternative?

Regards

[Cha]

28. Your post is full of so many hilary talking points ..who

just happens to be a documented liar.

[QC]

41. Oh goody! A cartoon thread!

[Cha]

42. Kick for the TYT's righteous

rant on hilary's so-called "sexist" whine and dumbfuck hypocricy.

[NashVegas]

14. Young Turks Don't Impress Me

I stopped watching as soon as I saw where it was from.

What I consider the *visible* sexist campaign Obama run was in how he encouraged women to share their "I'm a woman and I'm not voting for Hillary, I'm voting for Barack" stories. This line of soft attack wasn't so much on HC, but on female voters who were undecided or weak in their support for HC. It was use of marketing to divide the female vote. At its most benevolent it was simply, "I'm a woman and I'm voting for Obama." At its worst, "I'm not voting with my vagina!"

I would not say that Clinton lost because of sexism, necessarily, but sexist attacks opened up a weakness to be exploited. Anything could be thrown at her, no matter how low, and the press would run with it.

[CherylK]

15. You are missing out

The turks are so smart and funny! I am guessing you do not like them because you a Hillary a supporter and they have been critical of her, but the thing is they are critical about everyone.

[NashVegas]

27. I'm Sure

But #1 - They're guys, and while that doesn't necessarily mean they don't get it, #2 the fact they diss Hillary tells everyone they don't want and have no intention of trying to get it.

[Raineyb]

30. Get what?

A losing candidate?

What is this "it" of which you speak?

I want a Democratic president. What do you want?

Regards

[ihavenobias]

33. Actually

one of them is a female (Ana).

But of course the gender of the commentators if completely irrelevant to begin with in this case.

[billyoc]

16. She lost because her campaigning skills are in her ass.

She SUCKS at this. Period.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

18. No, I don't think so

I have never heard anyone around here in Arkansas say that they wouldn't vote for Clinton because she was a woman. I've heard some that say they will vote for her because they liked her policies, and some that said there was no way in h*ll they'd vote for her because of her actions towards them, personally, while she lived here. I heard only one person, a co-worker, express the opinion that she wouldn't win the White House "because she's a woman". However, that same co-worker said that Obama wouldn't win either, "because he's black". I have heard more people say they wouldn't vote for Obama because of his race than I've heard say they wouldn't vote for Clinton because of her gender.

[Window]

20. Thanks ihavenobias. As usual, Cenk in right on target. K/R.

:kick:



Peace:thumbsup:

[OhioChick]

22. No and No.

:kick:

[Occam Bandage]

24. No. She lost because she ran a terrible campaign.

[Cha]

25. A more pertinent question would be..

Did hilary run a whiney campaign and if so ..why?

Personally, I am ashamed of all these women who are acting like petulant children..and, so proud of the women who are for Obama with their strong, thoughtful endorsements.

"Feminist Leaders oppose hilary and endorse Obama"

"More than 100 New York feminist leaders released a joint statement Sunday afternoon criticizing Hillary Clinton and supporting Obama for president - evidence that Clinton's support among women activists has declined significantly in the days before the super-Tuesday primary."

<snip>

"Clinton's support for the war in Iraq was the leading reason she lost the support of the group, which calls itself "New York Feminists for Peace and Barack Obama!" "We urgently need a presidential candidate whose first priority is to address domestic needs," the group added."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jon-wiener/feminist-leaders-oppose-h_b_84715.html


That's what real women do..they oppose gratuitious, politically expedient WARS.

[Raine]

26. THIS woman says BULL SHIT!

this is a bunch of CRAP!

[Marrah_G]

29. She lost because she was unfairly accused of racism.

If Edwards had been in her place the same would have been said about him.

[Raineyb]

32. Edwards never used race like the Clintons did

And Edwards is miles beyond Clinton as far as being a good candidate. He was my first choice. Clinton is no Edwards.

BTW, if Obama were Edwards, Clinton would have dropped out already.

And the accusations of racism were not unfair. There are a lot of people in NY who are unbelievably disappointed in Senator Clinton and may never vote for her again.

Regards

[ihavenobias]

35. Nonsense n/t

[NotThisTime]

31. She lost because she ran a crappy campaign & I'm a woman & realize that

[CherylK]

34. Bump!

[JustAnotherGen]

36. No

Not sexism.

I have faith in Democrats. She losing because more people in our party have voted their conscience and gone Obama.

Oh - BTW - another Edwards supporter here . . . and I agree with the poster that said if it were Edwards right now, and not Obama - then she would have dropped out.

[Quixote1818]

37. Yet Hillary claims she is the most electable? Which is it?

Is she more likely to win the election or is the country sexist? She is arguing against herself here.

[papapi]

38. Hogwash. Hillary R. Clinton lost because she lost.

[fascisthunter]

39. I Honestly Only Have Heard Sexist Remarks from the Right Wing

There may have been low count posters here saying sexist crap, but I really haven't seen it come from Obama, his campaign or any of his vocal supporters here.

[Arugula Latte]

40. I just posted this on another thread:

Yes, there has been plenty of sexism, just as there has been plenty of racism(works both ways).

However, the fact that there has been sexism does not mean that Hillary would have been nominated if sexism could be magically erased. She was a weak candidate from the start. Consider the IWR vote, her horrible speaking style, her schizophrenic campaign (from "honored to be with Barack" to "SHAME on you" to "not a muslim as far as I know" to aligning with McCain on experience), her arrogance ("I WILL be the nominee") and overt sense of entitlement to the nomination (that would have turned me off if she had been a man, as well), her baggage (yes, some of that baggage is not her fault, but, still, it is there and would have hindered her in the general), etc. Plus, she claims to be ready to go on day one, but she can't even run a decent campaign and manage her campaign money ... how can she run the country? Also, her so-called experience is largely second-hand and received via osmosis by being the First Lady. These factors are not sexism-based. They are Hillary-based.

[The Wielding Truth]

43. No. but he ran the sexiest campaign.

[Imagevision]

44. Obama ran an obviously better campaign...