Joe Biden is a pre-Reagan liberal.

[saltpoint]

Obama's choice of Biden, in addition to the uplift Biden brings to the ticket, the campaign, and the governing afterwords, also is a signal by Obama that he envisions 'government' as a pre-Reagan, pre-Poppy, pre-Dubya entity of, for, and by the people.

IMO it reasserts that image of the country as a nation of communities from many walks of life from which the impulse to govern of, for, and by the people emerged and which was on the ascent from John Kennedy's administration forward until Reagan began to heartlessly dismantle it.

I think Barack Obama and Joe Biden is a Sunday fastball of a ticket and I think John McCain is likely spending his weekend kicking furniture and dogs.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

1. To be a fly on the wall....

[LSparkle]

2. Not to mention all the history Biden has experienced in the Senate

When he went to the Senate in 1972, NIXXXXXXON was still
president! Biden has gone through the Watergate hearings,
the Ford interregnum, Carter's presidency (when the Dems
were in full bloom majority), diplomacy during the Cold
War, the fall of the Soviet Union, Reaganomics, the Dems'
loss of Congress, governing in the minority, the Clinton
era, and the Dumbya years. This man has been through a
hell of a lot, and is hopefully prepared for ANY events
that may arise.

[saltpoint]

5. Yes. Biden's got a vivid living memory of the history of our

nation since Eisenhower, having lived it live and in person.

I am wowed by Obama's choice.

[babylonsister]

3. That raises another question. Does he know how many

dogs he has? :shrug:

No one has answered my query about his amount of cars, so thought I'd throw it out there.

A government run FOR the people? How novel! Sounds fab to me! :hi:

[LSparkle]

6. I'm proud that we've selected the "poorest" man in the Senate as our VP

Biden is a man of the people -- he still rides the train
into D.C. every day, takes his own tree stumps to the
dump, and teaches law on the weekends. This guy is
the REAL DEAL.

Let Bomb Bomb pick Mittens, Mr. "$200 Million Net Worth".
That will only make the choice clearer: Do the people
want the Country Club ticket, or the Working Men ticket?

[saltpoint]

9. Agree. Joe Biden could walk into a corner tavern and have a long,

authentic, bone-deep talk with anybody in the place and leave, having listened respectfully and having introduced insight and humor over a cold beer,

and then in the same afternoon head over to any university in the country and do a 2-hour teaching stint on constitutional law.

By god I like that in a vice president!

[saltpoint]

8. Good morning! Obama had a strong pool of picks and

now that we know it's Biden, I guess McCain is under the gun to come up with a kind of Hail Mary choice, to steal a couple of other DUers' phrase.

But it's such a perfect way to describe the hole McCain's in.

[UncleTomsEvilBrother]

4. Good post,.....

....but I actually don't think McCain has the political mental competence to understand the power of the Democratic ticket. Up to this point, and until the end of this election, I think McCain is being handled by surrogates who dictate his every word to him.

It's 10amEST, and I wouldn't be surprised if McCain is just waking up and asking his handlers, "So what did you guys come up with?"

[saltpoint]

7. I like that image of McCain turning to his handlers for updates and

insights.

I wonder if they feed him and tie his shoes for him as well.

There's a sense I have of McCain as a fiercely ordinary man who thinks he's presidential timber because he's been on a lot of news talk programs on Sunday mornings.

[Orsino]

10. Biden is a corporate conservative.

I think I'm okay with this ticket, but let's not kid ourselves. They're not liberals.

We're just trying to defeat McCain and whatever other fascist he picks.

[saltpoint]

11. I respectfully disagree.

IMO the model of government they both represent is geuninely progressive and pre-Reagan liberal.

[onehandle]

12. This is the least liberal ticket we've had in decades.

But a great improvement over the criminals we have now.

I don't know if I would call Biden a Conservative, but he is a creature of the political machine.

McBush will lose.

[MH1]

18. Liberal tickets haven't been winning.

Either because the populace isn't liberal enough, or because they fall for the media spin.

Either way it sucks; I would rather have a less liberal ticket that can win and stop the worst of the bleeding, than continue to have great idealistic tickets that can't win.

[onehandle]

25. I totally agree. nt

[Orsino]

27. Yes.

The plutocrats have been training us for decades into the conservative nation we've become. We should never forget this or succumb to their framing of what liberal and conservative mean.

There have been little victories along the way; civil rights are equalizing on paper, at least, but while we've slept in front of our televisions, our wallets have been cleaned out and the environment has been horrifically damaged. And we now accept their wars for profit. secrecy and fascism as normal. The neocons have won.

I'm hoping for some sunshine, but I don't see our ticket as a solution.

[Skwmom]

13. I can see that the defining of Biden by the PR people has begun.

His great personal story, regular guy, etc.

Now I'm not one of those smart Washington Consultants but I think at the end of the day when our financial system tanks and drags us into a downturn that makes the Great Depression seem like a picnic, the GOP are going to love to have someone on the Democratic side that they can point the finger at.

I think the anger directed at the the oil companies is going to be like a love fest compared to the anger that is going to be directed at the financial corporations.

But what do I know. I'm not one of those smart Washington consultants.

I really hope I'm wrong but I don't think so.

[saltpoint]

14. McCain shares much of the calendar of Biden's service in the Congress,

and both men are Senators. It's possible we'll have 4 Senators on the two major parties' tickets.

So any record is a potential target.

But the choice of Biden puts McCain in a very difficult spot. McCain enjoys a kind of Sunday talk program "Mr. Security Issues" profile which Joe Biden can call into question, using actual facts, at any time.

McCain does well currently among older voters. But it's my prediction that Biden will prompt a discernible shift in their support away from McCain and his angry, terse presentation to Biden, a seasoned veteran with white hair like theirs, who also knows his domestic policy many times better than McCain knows how many houses he has.

Actually it's almost a miracle that McCain even won nomination. It was an incredibly weak field. But there he is and the GOP is stuck with him.

[Skwmom]

15. I'm looking at the damage that can be done to the Democratic Party

in the long term.

Did you ever think maybe the GOP doesn't want to win in November, especially if they can get away with blaming the pending crisis on the Democrats?

Do you know how McCain voted on repeal of Glass-Seagall? I hope he voted for it.

[saltpoint]

16. The economy is in dire strats but in the long-term

landscape, I like an interactive liberal pre-Reagan model a lot, which this ticket reinforces.

McCain is Desert Southwest Archconservative. As old and cantakerous as Barry Goldwater, for example, but with none of the class and brains. Goldwater evolved in his later years. I think McCain is regressing, and at blazingly fast speeds.

The week ended with McCain telling the media his staff would have to count up all his houses and report in on the actual sum, and now with a blue collar pick for veep by Obama who has the brains and brawn to force McCain into an even more desperate veep pick than he already had.

[polichick]

17. Good points - I'm very happy with this ticket...

Speaking of pre-Reagan, I'd like to see Dems give Jimmy Carter the credit he deserves! Heck, even Joe Scarborough (puke that he is) has credited Carter for his 1977 take on the energy situation.

[saltpoint]

20. Agree. Carter was way out in front on this issue. I can picture

Jimmy Carter and Bill Richardson having an extremely good talk on this. I'd pay money to hear them, too.

A lot of Democrats are down on Carter for sport, and of course the Republicans can't stand him, but if I was a bit underwhelmed by that Cabinet and his firing of Bella Abzug, I have admired the man's mind.

When you lift someone like Carter out of Georgia he becomes a world-class thinker. He was no longer a governor from Georgia.

[mmonk]

19. Yes, he's old school.

[Triana]

21. ...and beating his wife

(McCain). I still wonder how she got that cast on her wrist...and I ain't believing the handshake story.

[saltpoint]

24. There may have been a manicure malfunction somewhere...

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

22. and probably kicking his wife.

[salonghorn70]

23. With All Due Respect

I think that trying to label our candidates is one thing that has gotten Democrats into trouble. I think that Obama wants to move beyond that. Sometimes that has been what has gotten Obama into trouble on DU. DU'ers want to label Obama or fit him into a certain ideological box. They are finding out that he doesn't fit. Biden doesn't fit either. Most Americans don't fit into an ideological box. I think that if you sat down and had a beer with Obama, he would say that he wants to move to a post Reagan, Clinton, Bush era of politics.
Nevertheless, good post, because it certainly promotes thought.

[saltpoint]

26. Agree -- and the label is just the turnlatch to the door.

What I was going for is the notion that Reagan, Bush and Bush have been loosening the bolts on Noah's Art and that a liberal / progressive alignment seeks to tighten them and save the critters.

I liked the ascent of liberalism in the years leading up to what is called "the Reagan Revolution," and haven't much cared for any Republican very much since.

For one thing, we ARE the government. Reagan established "government" as an adversary to "American values." it was Machiavellian and ingeniuous and it was also debasing and unethical and untrue.

Biden goes back to the years of the ascent and has weathered the storm. Obama represents a restoration of the commimtnet to the of, for, and by the people model.