Talk of LEGALIZING WEED has finally hit the airwaves in a big way...

[polichick]

I'm disappointed that it didn't come as a result of people seeing how hypocritical it's been to outlaw marijuana, how it's a vestige of the culture wars that we now understand to be unjust ~ but at least it's being discussed.

This week there have been guests on Rachel Maddow's show, Morning Joe and others who believe that we need to legalize weed in order to quell the violence that's moving up from Mexico, and also to help raise much-needed revenue for states.

Whatever the reason, do you think I'll be able to grow some nice organic plants on my windowsill soon??

[TBF]

1. It's about time. n/t

[tridim]

2. Please don't call it weed

"weed" has an instantly negative connotation, just like "pot", "dope" and even "marijuana"

Call it what it is, Cannabis.

That said, legalization is indeed becoming a populist movement for the first time in my life. Something I always hoped for, but realistically never expected.

Change!

[polichick]

5. Really? I don't think of "weed" as negative. I also can't wait until we can grow hemp again!

[Tyler Generation]

7. "Weed" is insulting to quality herb!

I don't like calling kind bud weed, because weed makes me think of the nasty things I pull up in the summer time.

:smoke:

[polichick]

9. Lol - I've never met anyone who had a problem with the term. To each his own I guess.

[tridim]

30. I really didn't have a problem with the word until we started talking seriously about legalization.

We have to be very careful that we don't allow the opposition to use slang terms as ammunition against progress.

[polichick]

32. I don't believe in giving them that much power.

[Tyler Generation]

33. Cannabis legalization involves two things:

State rights and the feds staying out of your personal life.

Yet Conservatives are the ones against legalization.

It might have something to do with the fact that they're hypocritical asshats.

[polichick]

37. It's part of the culture war mentality imo - they have their patriotic booze but....

...marijuana is for dirty hippies.

[tridim]

11. It's just that it's a street name for a plant that already has a proper name

Cannabis is such a nice word IMO, let's use it!

"Weed" reminds me (and I assume others) of a dude on the street corner selling zips for $100 a pop.

[polichick]

12. I don't care what it's called, just so I can grow my own. :)

[Why Syzygy]

19. I like all the names for it.

But, I edited my first post to meet your standard.

[polichick]

21. I can see how "dope" might be negative, but the others seem fine to me.

[tridim]

24. The word "Marijuana" was coined by W.R. Hearst as a racist and derogatory term..

to make Cannabis sound "Mexican".

[polichick]

27. "Marijuana" is a nice word...

I like it even better knowing the history. Thanks!

[tridim]

29. Really? I find it hard to believe that you enjoy racist terms.

Hearst was an evil SOB.

Edit: I guess I can see how some might view it as taking back the word from Hearst. It's probably futile on my part anyway since the word marijuana will never be retired, it's burned into the lexicon now.

[polichick]

31. Why let someone like that decide what's a racist word??

[tridim]

34. See my edit above..

:)

He didn't adopt the word, he coined it.

[polichick]

35. I say use it proudly - just to spite the man and his sick intentions...

Yes, it's been used too long now.

[Why Syzygy]

39. I don't think that's accurate.

He was a racist, and did accuse all Mexicans of being smokers, it doesn't appear that he actually coined the term.

Do you have any sources for that theory?

One theory behind the illegalization of marijuana has to do with the Dupont Company and many other industries in the 1930’s when the term “marijuana” was coined to blacken the name of the hemp plant. Hemp was the largest cash crop in America until the 20th Century. Until the 1820s with the introduction of the cotton gin, 80% of all textiles, fabrics, clothes, linen, drapes, bed sheets, etc. were made from hemp. In 1916, the U.S. Government predicted “by the 1940s all paper would come from hemp and that no more trees need to be cut down.” Government studies report that 1-acre of hemp equals 4.1 acres of trees. In 1937, the Dupont Company patented the processes to make many plastics from oil and coal. Synthetics such as plastics, cellophane, celluloid, methanol, nylon, rayon, and Dacron could now be made from oil. Natural hemp industrialization would have ruined over 80% of Dupont's business.
http://www.medicinalmarijuanaeducation.com/MME/History.html

It seems more likely that Mexicans coined the term, originally referring to cheap tobacco, and Hearst just embedded the link.

See pg. 413
http://books.google.com/books?id=h1AnD8ePW9MC&pg=PA83&lpg=PA83&dq=%22Marijuana%22+was+coined&source=bl&ots=kg88Ey5P3f&sig=Phhu6QsiL9zsbr19whihV5jkSLQ&hl=en&ei=37G6SdzKI5jAtgfKo7XiDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=9&ct=result#PPA413,M1

[polichick]

40. Interesting - and disturbing to know how many ways American corporations...

...have screwed us over the years!

[Why Syzygy]

42. Isn't it. Hemp was actually the common usage word.

It wasn't routinely referred to by its botanical name. So, evidently, the captains of industry took a common word from Mexican slang for cheap tobacco, and applied it to hemp. ;)

[polichick]

45. I was so hoping that the Michael Phelps bong issue would bring up the culture war...

...aspect of this ~ the idea that good American kids drink liquor but dirty hippies smoke pot. But it looks like Phelps has to worry about legal problems and can't talk about the double standard. Somebody needs to talk about this ~ maybe the president.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

56. In Texas we have the towns of Hempstead and Hemphill.

From the days of farming hemp.

[GiveMeFreedom]

47. ...have screwed us over the years!

and are still screwing us, this very day.

[polichick]

49. Oh yes, definitely today! Didn't know how far back it went though. Crazy.

[jkirch]

41. Can I call it "reefer" or "muggles"? nt

[Why Syzygy]

43. I met a group

in another part of Texas who call it, "Bob". :wtf:

"Reefer" is the one I like a lot.

[cooolandrew]

58. Well I don't think anyone minds the name of it, if it can help states out of their woes really.

[cliffordu]

60. I want the reefer madness!!!!!

just to drive the law 'n order extremists absolutely dogshit crazy.

[Why Syzygy]

3. Depends on the law.

You can ferment your own wine. But taxes on cigarettes just went up $1.00 per pack, and I have bought my last. Forced to quit. I wouldn't want the same thing to happen to Cannabis.

Decriminalization is the better strategy, imo.

ETA: Yuppers. Exactly like this >

Proof that insanity isn't just for Republicans (Medical Marijuana) Updated at 12:48 PM

First, this article appeared at Raw Story about a bill here in Oregon which would have the state take over growing Medical Marijuana...and adding a $98 per Ounce tax.
...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5247475

[polichick]

15. I want it to be legal. We can grow our own and avoid the taxes...

My grandfather grew and rolled his own tobacco ~ that's how I learned to roll joints. lol

[Why Syzygy]

16. It will depend on the Laws. How about both.

Decriminalization Vs. Legalization

Decriminalization:

A system that punishes offenses by means other than prison. Fines for most traffic violations are an example. In relation to drugs, it is normally limited to possession (and sometimes growth) of small amounts (often around one ounce) and somtimes to sale of equally small amounts to adults. It is also often limited to marijuana among the illegal drugs.

There is another distinction possible between de jure decriminalization, which entails an amendment to criminal legislation, and de facto decriminalization, which involves an administrative decision not to prosecute acts that nonetheless remain subject to arrest and imprisonment under the law. Some cities have simply decided de facto to specify that enforcement of some marijuana laws is the "lowest priority" for their police forces.

Legalization:

A system that allows the use and sale of drugs to adults under a system of regulation such as pertains to alcohol or perhaps involving licenses. Many suggest there would be a ban on advertising and public use. If the alcohol model prevailed, different states might vary the regulatory structure and legality might also be limited by local option to specific areas within a state.

Marijuana decriminalization - US history

Oregon decriminalized marijuana in 1973 and about 10 other states followed. The only U.S. federal study ever to compare marijuana use patterns, among decriminalized states and those that have not, found:

"Decriminalization has had virtually no effect on either marijuana use or on related attitudes about marijuana use among young people."

-- "Marijuana Decriminalization: The Impact on Youth 1975-1980," Monitoring the Future, Institute for Social Research, University of Michigan, 1981.

Similarly, various states in Australia have decriminalized while others did not. No variance in use patterns has been found between those which do and do not decriminalize according to a two year study released in 1998 by the Drug and Alcohol Council of South Australia.

It is common for commissions which have studied the problem to recommend decriminalization rather than "legalization." We think that some may sincerely think this best but we suspect that most were going only as far as they believed the social and political landscape would allow.

President Nixon's 1972 commission opted for decriminalization but made it clear that legalization was rejected because:

" ... marihuana use may be a fad which, if not institutionalized, will recede substantially in time.

"If marihuana smoking were an already ingrained part of our culture, this objection would be dispelled.

" ... we strongly recommend that our successor policy planners, at an appropriate time in the future, review the following factors to determine whether an altered social policy is in order: the state of public opinion, the extent to which members of the society continue to use the drug, the developing scientific knowledge about the effects and social impact of use of the drug ... "

Conditions are indeed different and the 1972 reservations are being resolved in the direction of legalization. This is an obvious subject for another commission to study.

See: Petition

Decriminalization : Major problems

* It leaves the illegal supplier in place.

This means more availability to the young, makes use more dangerous, activates the "gateway," and many of the other woes described in Drug War Damage and Children.

* It still entails law enforcement costs.

Some indications from decriminalization trials in England are that many police are more willing to make stops when they know the offender won't go to prison. There is no indication that this has decreased use. It's a small source of revenue, but one unlikely to compensate for wasted police time and inconsequential when compared to potential sales taxes.

* It deprives the state of tax revenues.

Potential revenue could be used for tax relief, education or treatment.

* It cannot make much difference in use.

Above we saw that where decriminalization took place, the removal of what many thought was a deterrent had no apparent effect on use or attitudes. It is a shorter step in terms of theoretical deterrence to move to legalization. We stress that if some 75% have tried marijuana by age 22, there's very little room for an increase of any consequence.

* It sustains the hypocrisy inherent in the double standard for alcohol.

http://www.dpft.org/policy.htm
*emphasis added

Did you know that some states already require "tax stamps" for possession?

Marijuana Tax Stamp Laws And Penalties

State Tax
Stamp Data
“No taxation without representation” was the rally cry of advocates of American independence in the eighteenth century. Today, tens of thousands of cannabis consumers utter a similar cry over the selective and inappropriate enforcement of illicit drug taxes.

In twenty US states, those who possess cannabis or other illegal drugs are legally required to purchase and affix state-issued stamps onto his or her contraband. The total cost of the tax is generally determined by the quantity of contraband possessed. Unlike typical criminal statutes prohibiting the possession and sale of controlled substances, drug tax stamp laws primarily assess financial penalties on the defendant for noncompliance. On occasion, criminal sanctions may also be imposed.
...
http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=6670

[polichick]

17. As a parent who doesn't want to model illegal activity for my kids...

I really want to be able to grow plants legally. Decriminalization is a step in the right direction though.

[Why Syzygy]

18. I just want to ensure Monsanto doesn't get the seed patent. nt

[polichick]

20. Yikes! What a horrible thought - but I see what you mean.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

22. To get a seed patent, Monsanto would need to invent a new variety.

Now if Monsanto would invent a variety that expressed delta-11 THC, I'd forgive them for all there past sins.

[Why Syzygy]

26. You're so easy.

;)

[cooolandrew]

59. Some will always prefer the legal option really. I'd encourage legal use to put >

gang crime out of biz, but hey if it pays the rent. Long as the states make it price the gangsters can't make profit on no longer.

[alwysdrunk]

52. Yeah decriminalization for me too

Paying a tax on growing a plant from seed is just as wrong as getting arrested for it. The arrest is really a tax too.

Also, we don't need more potheads than we already have. Legalization will encourage that I think. Let it stay in a grey market situation.

[FreakinDJ]

4. No one ever died from a Marijuana over dose

can't say that about alcohol

[polichick]

6. So true - the hypocrisy surround the issue drives me crazy.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

8. I think we're watching decriminalization in the process.

It's not going to be some big, widely publicized campaign.

It's going to be quiet.

It's going to involve a president who's sympathetic to the decriminalization movement, although he's not going to talk about it publically, except in old videos from when he was a small time politician.

It's going to involve an attorney general promising not to prosecute medical marijuana.

It's going to involve the appointment of a progressive drug czar, and removal of the position from the cabinet.

And that's what's going on now, and it's only been fifty days.

[polichick]

10. That's what I've been thinking - but I wish it was a big bold announcement...

In any case, how long before we can grow it??

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. You can grow it now.

Oh, you mean how long before you can do it legally? I suspect never.

But depending on what state you're in you may be looking at a near future where if police do bust your grow op they'll write you a ticket.

[tridim]

14. Good question. That's all I want out of this

The ability to grow one or two plants strictly for personal use. It doesn't get more reasonable than that.

I will probably never buy a pack of Marlboro Greens because I'm guessing they'll take a good thing and screw it up with additives and carcinogens.

[rurallib]

23. it is still pert near impossible for a politician to say legalize cannibis

When we hear senar=tors and reps discussing it as a possibility, then I will have hope.

[polichick]

25. Look at this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x283014

[tridim]

28. We're already hearing it from some state and local politicians.

It's a start! It should really be a state issue anyway.

The federal scheduling is obviously a lingering problem because the definition of Schedule I doesn't jibe with the reality of medical Cannabis. It should be rescheduled immediately just based on the fact that it has a current medical use.

[Ikonoklast]

36. I'm buying stock in Frito-Lay and Interstate Bakeries Corp. just in case.

I figure that the sale of Doritos and Twinkies will go through the roof if they decriminalize, and I'll be rich, rich I tell you!

[polichick]

38. Lol - Peter Lynch (an old-school Wall Street guru) used to say...

...invest in those things you see being used by people you know. Your stock picks make sense!

[olkaz]

44. Companies will still do pre-employment urine tests.

So, there you go. Freeeeeedom.

[polichick]

48. At least until somebody with a powerful bully pulpit successfully...

...makes the point that this country has been using a double standard in its acceptance (even embrace) of alcohol consumption and demonization of those who choose marijuana as their drug of choice.

I really want to see this country officially correct that wrong.

[cbc5g]

46. a necessary k&r

[polichick]

50. Check out the marijuana pharmacy:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/29617264#29617264

[polichick]

51. Al Roker has a special on msnbc Sun 10 pm east. - "MARIJUANA INC."

[cbc5g]

53. The legalization question is on tonight on Larry King (Friday 9 est)

[polichick]

54. Thanks! :)

[smoochpooch]

55. I'm for all the arguments to legalizing/decriminalizing; less drug-related violence, medicine

for the sick, potential tax revenue etc. But beyond that, I truly believe the world would be a better place if everyone just smoked a joint every once in a while.:hippie:

[polichick]

64. I agree - I'd like to see everyone give up the angst of religion and enjoy an occasional joint!

[cooolandrew]

57. Hey it's a green economy why not? lol. nt

[harun]

61. Depends what state you live in. I think a few of the deeper blue states will go green.

[SeattleGirl]

62. That's cool, but I'd like to ask you weed smokers to refrain when

you are around me.

Can't stand the smell, and don't want a contact high.

Still, I have to say that criminalizing it is just fucking STOOPID.

[polichick]

63. No problem. I don't like to be around drinkers - their behavior creeps me out.

[ecstatic]

65. I think it should be legal, but I want the next president to do it in 2017

Not Obama. He should quietly decriminalize it, but stop short of legalization. Too much potential for lame jokes if Obama does it.