Does the President HAVE to be the one to instigate torture investigations and

[cliffordu]

subsequent legal action??

Can the President actually order the halt to legal proceedings started by other entities???

I understand he is distancing himself from this, except the part where he is ordering the release of EVIDENCE that can be used against the perpetrators at the highest levels....

Remember that he is the master of message control...perhaps the photos of the rape of children and murder at Abu Grahib is the next set of documents that he will order released.

He is a constitutional lawyer. I think he's allowing the real case to be built. The case before the public.

The public has to howl for it.

[Bobbieo]

1. Obama knows exactly what he is doing and it is up to the public to see that it is done.

[Vincardog]

2. The torture memos were released by a court order. Thank the ACLU not Obama.i

[Cali_Democrat]

3. That's not what Google thinks...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=obama+releases+torture+memos&btnG=Search

Apparently Google thinks Obama released the torture memos.

[Bobbieo]

4. I have already signed ACLU's petition. That was my "thank you".

[FrenchieCat]

5. No, Obama released the memos....not a court.

[cliffordu]

6. And yet every report out there is about the conversations between Obama

and the ex-cia chiefs....

I believe he ordered them released instead of claiming national security, right?

or appealing the verdict?

Or just saying 'fuck you' and keepin' on keepin' on...

[Cali_Democrat]

7. Doesn't Congress have every right to open torture hearings?

Why does Obama have to do everything? He already released the torture memos? Why can't Congress step up and do SOMETHING????

I mean we've got huge majorities in both houses for cryin' out loud. At times it feels like this whole country, and the world for that matter, rests on Obama's shoulders.

It gets kind of annoying. Everyone wants a piece of Obama.

[cliffordu]

8. Bingo. Precisely the answer I wanted from the questions.

Congress has to do the work.

So he can do the heavy lifting with the economy and health care.

Uh, and the wars and infrastructure and the educational system, and the drug laws......

[Cali_Democrat]

9. Exactly

Obama has so much to focus on already. Having Congress open torture hearings would really take a load off.

Unfortunately backstabbers like Evan Bayh are just waiting with a pickaxe ready to strike Obama.

I really hate that dipshit.

[theboss]

16. Yes, but they cannot lead to indictments on "torture"

All Congress can do is hold hearings and possibly find someone in contempt of Congress.

[Spazito]

17. The evidence found through a hearing can then be used by Holder and the DOJ to....

indict those who broke the law. If you remember, it was, in part, the Senate Watergate Committee and the House Judiciary Committee investigations of Watergate that resulted in indictments of Nixon's cronies.

[chill_wind]

10. Congressman Nadler is calling for a SP & Congressional Investigation right now.

Congressman Jerrold Nadler has just publicly asked that the Attorney General appoint a special prosecutor. Please THANK HIM, and please ask him and ask your congress member to jointly send to Eric Holder the letter that Nadler and 55 other congress members sent to Michael Mukasey requesting a special prosecutor last summer, or an updated version thereof.

Here is a release from Nadler's office:

Nadler Applauds Obama Administration's Transparency on Torture
Memos Renews Call for Special Prosecutor and Congressional Investigation

Congressman Jerrold Nadler (NY-08), Chair of the House Judiciary Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights and Civil Liberties, praised President Obama and the Department of Justice for releasing four legal memos on the torture of detainees that had previously been concealed by the Bush administration. Rep. Nadler, however, called on the Obama administration to go further and appoint a special prosecutor to investigate and, if necessary, prosecute those responsible for authorizing the torture. He also said that a Congressional investigation is absolutely warranted. Rep Nadler released the following statement:

(see link):http://www.democrats.com/node/19420
updated letter: http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/node/41743

Send Nadler your support:

http://www.house.gov/nadler/contact.shtml

Direct petitions to AG Holder we can sign:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8356181#top

[FrenchieCat]

12. Thank God! For a moment I thought Obama was running the country

by himself....and there was no congress.

It is easy to forget that around here.

Glad I signed the petition you linked to http://action.firedoglake.com/page/s/Prosecutor

and I'm gonna write to Rep. Nagler for support...and my own Senators (Feinstein and Boxer) to open up their mouths.

[chill_wind]

18. Frenchie Cat...

Congress, in their slavish insistence on giving away the keys to the store both early and often (The Patriot Act, FISA, The MCA, the sometimes slobberingly effusively embracing rubberstamped appointments of key people who helped fortify the dirty BushCO regime) helped put us where we are and those not as comprimised as others have to play their role to help turn this nightmare around. We have to demand it. They too took oaths.

"In a democracy, the wheels of justice grind on—and the president, for good reason under the rule of law, does not have the power to stop them. " (Newsweek http://www.newsweek.com/id/194595/page/1 ) President Obama and his best people (Eric Holder, Marty Lederman & others-- and those yet to be confirmed-- ie Dawn Johnsen) know these last memos rip the last tide wall of torture secrecy apart. Unfortunately, thanks to the December manueverings of BushCo pushing these last FOIA memo deadlines back one last time, they didn't get to choose when this would happen, and I have no trouble believing they would have liked more than a matter or weeks before all of this might become unleashed, but they are the side of what is right and necessary. We got them with little redaction and they are incredibly damning. They could have semi-complied with a whole bunch more blacked out crap and bargained for yet more delays on the redactions. They didn't and that means something. Now the work of a whole country has to begin to fortify President Obama's and Eric Holder's first decisive step.

Senator Feinstein: not so transparant.

Senate Intel Committee Announces Broad Investigation of CIA Interrogations
By Elana Schor - March 5, 2009, 4:15PM


The Intelligence panel announced today that it would conduct a year-long inquiry into the scope and performance of the CIA's interrogation program, including "whether the CIA accurately described the detention and interrogation program to other parts of the U.S. government" and "whether the CIA implemented the program in compliance with official guidance."

(...)

This investigation has the potential to unearth much more detail about the conduct of Bush's "war on terror" than we already have, but it is likely to be conducted largely in private.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/03/senate-intel-committee-announces-broad-investigation-of-cia-interrogations.php

http://intelligence.senate.gov/press/record.cfm?id=309152

Senate Panel to Examine CIA Detainee Handling

By Joby Warrick
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, February 27, 2009; A04

(...)
The Senate intelligence committee is planning an unprecedented review of the CIA's handling of captured terrorist suspects, drawing back the curtain for the first time on the agency's use of waterboarding and other interrogation tactics inside secret CIA prisons, congressional sources said yesterday.

The review, which could be announced as early as today, will use official testimony and hundreds of classified documents to piece together an authoritative account of one of the most clandestine -- and, to some former and current agency officials, darkest -- chapters of the Bush administration's anti-terrorism war, the officials said.

Lawmakers will try to determine not only how detainees were interrogated, but also whether the CIA's controversial methods produced useful intelligence, according to three congressional officials briefed on the plans.

Former CIA leaders have said the use of waterboarding, which simulates drowning, and other harsh measures yielded information that helped prevent a wave of terrorist attacks after Sept. 11, 2001.

The officials described the planned inquiry as a "study" and stressed that it would not yield recommendations for possible legal proceedings. It was not yet clear how much of the panel's work would be conducted in public, nor what the end product would look like, said the officials, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, citing the sensitivity of the committee's internal discussions.


more:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/26/AR2009022603282_pf.html

We don't have a year for her to drag this out. This appears to be carefully designed gatekeeping, a "study" that in time may or may not even be declassified and made public.

I hope you will write to her and tell her what you think. ( I did.)

[Adelante]

23. Word!

"Thank God! For a moment I thought Obama was running the country by himself....and there was no congress."

[TheKentuckian]

11. It is unlikely that Congress is not a least somewhat complicit

or a least negligent in oversight so they probably won't be too vigorous either. The Courts turned a blind eye. All of which means that the job is beyond the scope of our own system.

[cliffordu]

14. I have had a stinking suspicion that this might be the case for some time -

too many democrats tainted with information they should have rasied hell over and didn't, making them appear to be complicit.

[stillcool]

13. It is becoming apparent that the ..

Executive is the only branch of government we have. It's no wonder Congress doesn't do anything.

[jewishlibrl]

15. He should at least not discourage investigations

And Rahm Emanuel's revelation yesterday amounted to discouragement.

[chill_wind]

19. kick

[grantcart]

20. "I am shocked shocked that there are prosecutions against torture here".

[mmonk]

21. Someone has to. Both the executive branch and the legislative

branch are required to uphold the Constitution and laws of this country. Who in the hell else is going to do it?

[FrenchieCat]

22. Of course, The president's job is not to "do something" about the last administration

as that is not part of his job description to render justice, it is the job of the Justice Department, which once Obama appointed Holder as its head, is supposed to work independently from the President.

Breaking on Rachel - Holder considering torture investigation
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5500285

And as Holder said he would do.....

Holder will make the case that the Justice Department needs to be above reproach in terms of being politicized, a nod to the era of Gonzales, who resigned after accusations that the department had improperly fired at least nine U.S. attorneys for political reasons, as well as allowed politically biased hiring practices to take hold within the department.

Holder noted in his testimony that he will work to restore the credibility of the Justice Department…http://sweetness-light.com/archive/holder-waterboarding-is-torture


Three Bush administration lawyers who signed memos, John C. Yoo, Jay S. Bybee and Steven G. Bradbury, are the subjects of a coming report by the Justice Department’s ethics office that officials say is sharply critical of their work. The ethics office has the power to recommend disbarment or other professional penalties or, less likely, to refer cases for criminal prosecution.

The administration has also not ruled out prosecuting anyone who exceeded the legal guidelines, and officials have discussed appointing a special prosecutor. One option might be giving the job to John H. Durham, a federal prosecutor who has spent 15 months investigating the C.I.A.’s destruction of videotapes of harsh interrogations.
snip
Other investigations promise to keep the issue alive. The Senate Armed Services Committee plans to release its own report after two years of looking at the military’s use of harsh interrogation methods. And the Democratic chairmen of the Senate and House Judiciary Committees are pushing for a commission to look into the matter. At the same time, the administration faces pressure from abroad. Manfred Nowak, the United Nations’ chief official on torture, told an Austrian newspaper that as a party to the international Convention against Torture, the United States was required to investigate credible accusations of torture.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/21/us/politics/21intel.html?_r=2&hp